To the hive: help me with the pros and cons of 2 schools

[distancia]

Well, the school I have been worrying about has called and indicated a preliminary acceptance, pending one last bit of paperwork (sigh)....

 

Hubby and I are so torn about this. Can those of you who have been there, done that, see something we are overlooking between 2 schools? Something we can impart to dd that might make a difference with her decision either way?

 

School A

Small LAC student body 1200

Close to home and dd is familiar with the area, no adjustment needed

Higher caliber of student

Impressive acceptance rates at grad school

Very intellectual ambiance (pretentiously so among the students!)

Intellectual stimulation and cultural exposure

National reputation and recognition

Final year devoted to Senior Thesis work

Status about attending (let's be honest, dd would like this)

Extremely heavy workload: 16 or > credit hours required / semester

Emphasis on academia and intellectual growth; physical is secondary

dd would be just another overachiever among overachievers

dd would end up with an impressive B. A. and the minimum of science courses she requires for an M.S.

 

School B

Uni with 4000 undergrads, addl 8,000 grad students, 2/3 commuters

Urban environment 1 hr away & unfamiliar (but best friend's family is there)

Medium caliber of student

Branch campus of state university; better access to facilities; new funding and growing

More "average" students who are not intellectuals nor pretentious

No reputation to speak of but up-and-coming due to scenic location and intimate campus atmosphere

Distinction of being in the Honors Program, only 90 of the entire 4000

Small classes and perks of being one of the select few Honors Students; close-knit group

Final year devoted to Senior Thesis work

Courseload could be tailored to dd's needs each semester to work around particularly hard courses (Organic Chem)

dd would stand out among peers (status)

More emphasis on normalcy, i.e. working out at the gym, sailing, movies, escaping from the studying grind

dd would end up with a lower-quality B.A. and higher number of science courses that interest her

 

BOTH schools are literally on the water and have access to sailboats, etc which dd enjoys

 

BOTH schools are offering the same amount in scholarships

 

BOTH schools are in upscale areas which have cute, walkable downtowns with access to stores dd likes (Whole Foods, artsy-funky places, coffee shops, etc.)

Edited February 4, 2011 by distancia

[Brenda in MA]

Sounds like a tough choice. Do either of the schools have a program where accepted students can stay overnight? If so, maybe that would help her to experience each campus a little better.

 

Also, can she sit in on a class or two at each place?

 

Best wishes to all of you on a hard decision,

Brenda

[Jane in NC]

Same amount in scholarships but are they the same in overall cost?

 

My son was torn between two LACs which in many respects were equal on paper. I had him take a careful look at the faculty in his fields of study. It was clear that while all were qualified, one school had faculty which were far more appealing in that they mirrored his interests.

[Shifra]

Does your daughter intend to go to graduate school, particularly medical or law school? If she does, will she do well in the more competitive school, enough to be competitive for grad school admissions? Will your daughter be overwhelmed by the competition in the more competitive undergraduate school? Or will she be goaded into working harder and/or be stimulated by the intellectual peers? If the second school is a "party school," will she feel peer pressure to join in? Or will she be the pariah for not joining in? These are the questions that I would have your daughter consider before making a decision. Brenda's advice of having her spend an overnight visit in the dorms and checking out classes is really the only way to tell for sure.

[memphispeg]

This Mom votes for school #1. Mainly based on the commuter percentage of the 2nd school. Could you "see" her at one more than the other (a Mother's intuition question)? Also, she might enjoy being with people on her intellectual par, especially in Jr. and Sr. year. If she needs physical activity, she would probably be able to find it.

[Kareni]

A couple of thoughts about the second school --

 

Does the high number of graduate students mean that many/most of the classes are taught by graduate students rather than professors?

 

With 2/3 of the students commuting, will the campus lack vibrancy in the evenings and weekends?

 

I strongly agree with the suggestion that your daughter attend classes at both campuses. I also recommend that she stay overnight in the dorm if at all possible.

 

Regards,

Kareni

[Hoggirl]

I have NO experience as my ds is only 13. However, when we attended the Grand Recognition Ceremony for Duke TIP last May (on Duke's campus) there was a session on college admissions. The head admissions guy at Duke said that students should look for a place where they will be "comfortable, yet challenged." Maybe that's overly simplistic, but I have filed this tidbit away for future reference. You have listed a lot of detail about both schools, but if you used this as your filter, which would she choose? Maybe you are looking at too much detail???? Let me repeat, I have NO experience, and I am not trying to be trite. Does she have a visceral feeling that one is "better" (for her) than the other?

[creekland]

A couple of thoughts about the second school --

 

Does the high number of graduate students mean that many/most of the classes are taught by graduate students rather than professors?

 

With 2/3 of the students commuting, will the campus lack vibrancy in the evenings and weekends?

 

I strongly agree with the suggestion that your daughter attend classes at both campuses. I also recommend that she stay overnight in the dorm if at all possible.

 

Regards,

Kareni

 

 

:iagree: I fully echo these thoughts.

[newbie]

A, give her a challenge.

[distancia]

Excellent points. Same cost for each. Both schools are so close that dd wouldn't have to stay over; we/she can take a drive on a weekday night and see how campus feels "after 5".

 

Our biggest concern is dd feeling stressed by the more challenging college. She is a very modest girl who has a tendency to feel inferior (and stressed) when surrounded by people who she perceives to be brighter and more accomplished than she. It's all in her imagination, but if someone else exudes self-confidence (even if it's nothing more than a blustering pretense) dd tends to shrivel up and lose sight of who she is and her own value.

 

Can I ask a small favor of any of you? Would it be possible to send you a link to each college in a PM? Sometimes a few pictures tell a thousand words that I would prefer not to post on this thread.

Edited February 4, 2011 by distancia

[Starr]

Another thing to consider is that she may feel modest either place but the school with lower expectations will have her back off farther. If she's easily overwhelmed I would vote for the smaller school. I would be happy to take a look at the schools. I have a junior and we are starting this as well. :)

[Jane in NC]

Both schools are so close that dd wouldn't have to stay over; we/she can take a drive on a weekday night and see how campus feels "after 5".

 

 

 

Consider the overnight...Dorm life is revealing about the character of the students.

[Hannah C.]

As a recent college graduate, I think your dd should absolutely spend a night at each college. That was the thing that helped me the most in deciding which college to attend!! Dorm life is a big deal. Staying on campus on a Friday night will give the more "party" atmosphere, staying on, say, a Tuesday will give the weekday vibe.

 

It sounds to me like the first school will probably be more challenging academically and will be much more likely to have professors teaching all the classes. However, the second school will have more resources. Depending on the actual students your dd encounters at the first school, it may or may not be all intellectual all the time. I went to a school which is very intellectual, but there were very few students who talked nothing but books all the time, for example. :) The second school definitely sounds to me like it would be less pressure though, and from what you posted it sounds like your dd may do better in that environment. Again, I think visiting the colleges, attending classes, talking to students, and staying overnight would be one of the best ways to assess the general school environment and "feel."

 

Also, depending on the schools, the first one may carry more weight degree wise. That is something you'll be able to determine much better, however, knowing the actual schools and the status of the bigger public one. :)

 

I'd be interested in the PM on more info if you're willing. :)

[FaithManor]

I went through a real struggle to choose my final school because it came down to two wonderful choices and no clear winner. So, I spent three days one each campus staying in the dorms. I set in on music classes which would be in my major, classes in my minor, and gen-ed history. I asked for a meeting with the head of the music department and the head of the piano department.

 

It was after this that a clear winner emerged. The polished campus had a persnickety, full of themselves, wouldn't dare come off their pedestal to help you with anything, assigned everything they possibly could to their teaching assistants, etc.

 

The other campus, less polished, had the most amazing faculty who truly lived that they loved teaching. The gen-ed history prof was mezmorizing. The piano professor, though a real slave driver, still loved every single one of her students, the head of the piano department was an internationally hailed composer who routinely had his students to his home for hot chocolate and snacks, games, and just...."you guys need to let your hair down and relax because this major will eat you alive if you don't learn how to let go once in a while". There was a sense of family that helped take the edge off the competition. It was an excellent fit for me.

 

When the decision is this tight, the student needs to experience the campus life, get a feel for the faculty, spend enough time to know how they would fit or not fit into the environment. Every college has it's quirks. Your dd needs to find out if those quirks fit her.

 

Faith

[Chris in VA]

Imo, stay far away from all branch campuses. They often float along on the rep of the main school campus but lack the strong academics and the school identity--they are considered "second best" by those on the main campus. My experience is with two state schools, and may not apply at all to your situation.

I'd also stay away from commuter campuses, again, based solely on my direct experience.

 

Is there no third alternative?

 

Oh, lastly--expect there to be plenty of adjustment--it's a different stage of life, and just because you are familiar with the area doesn't mean you are familiar with the people, lifestyle, expectations, scheduling, etc.

[distancia]

Is there no third alternative?

 

I wish there were! Unfortunately, here in Florida the public schools tend to be HUGE--UCF at 37,000, UF at 30,000, FAU at 24,000; USF 25,000...same with FIU, FAU...only the newer colleges or those in remote corners (FGCU, UWF, UNF) are smaller, and unfortunately don't have the academic reputation nor a redeeming location.

 

Other than UF and FSU, the large Florida schools--like USF and FAU--have reputations as being commuter schools. It has been only in the past 2 or 3 years that the commuter schools have began a push for more on-campus housing. When that happens (it is happening now) the schools reputations increase. Also, with the bad economy the state schools have been receiving record numbers of applications from well-qualified students, so the schools are becoming more selective.

 

Does your daughter intend to go to graduate school, particularly medical or law school? If she does, will she do well in the more competitive school, enough to be competitive for grad school admissions? These are the questions that I would have your daughter consider before making a decision.

 

Shifra has a good point. Florida has an extremely generous merit scholarship program called Bright Futures (pays almost 100% of tuition) which encourages the brightest students to stay in-state. My DD has friends who have graduated with IB diplomas who are attending "okay" public schools because they have received some very lucrative scholarships. The okay schools can (and do) lure with multiple stackable merit scholarships and it's hard to say "no". Also, if you are pre-med one of your concerns is GPA, and if you need a high GPA and you can learn the same material at 2 schools, one being a bit less competitive, then why not go for the place where you can shine?

Edited February 4, 2011 by distancia

[K-FL]

I have to agree w/Chris.

 

If the branch campus is USF-St pete, it is a dead campus on the weekend. Most folks don't even know it exist. It seemed to us to be mainly the marine bio & ed. campus--along with the sailing team.

 

If the LAC is Eckerd, be very sure the political nature of the school meets your values. I know we're more conservative than you guys, but it's a VERY liberal campus.

 

Have you looked at New College or FGCU? New is all honors, but GC is the smallest of the state schools.

[rhrice3]

I agree with the ladies recommending a weekend visit. I know that really can change your attitude about a school, especially if one of the schools has a large amount of computer students.

 

You mentioned pre-med - if she is interested in pre-med, I would seriously recommend that she talk to someone in med dept that can give her stats about graduates in their program in the last 5 years or more - where they were accepted to med schools, MCAT scores, % of those accepted to med school, etc. GPA will play a role in med school selection but other things, especially MCAT scores, research, volunteer work, will also. Different schools will look differently at things, but you want to know the program is producing med school graduates.

 

Good luck

ReneeR

[creekland]

I agree with the ladies recommending a weekend visit. I know that really can change your attitude about a school, especially if one of the schools has a large amount of computer students.

 

You mentioned pre-med - if she is interested in pre-med, I would seriously recommend that she talk to someone in med dept that can give her stats about graduates in their program in the last 5 years or more - where they were accepted to med schools, MCAT scores, % of those accepted to med school, etc. GPA will play a role in med school selection but other things, especially MCAT scores, research, volunteer work, will also. Different schools will look differently at things, but you want to know the program is producing med school graduates.

 

Good luck

ReneeR

 

:iagree: Especially with the pre-med part. Not all schools are created equal when it comes to getting students into med school. I'd go with the best school for that if that's her intended goal.

[distancia]

I have to agree w/Chris.

 

K-FL, I sent you a PM.

[memphispeg]

Kimanjo - Is my dd living with you? I have wondered where she goes sometimes??????? LOL I would definitely go for the SLAC, if she is as similar to my dd as she appears. Mostly to avoid getting lost in the shuffle....