Let's Talk Older Teens and Helping around the House

[Stephanie/MO]

I have basically given up on my 3 older boys (21, 19, 17) and helping around the house. They just became too frustrating to follow-up on by the time they were 17 or so. They all have jobs and college is expected to be paid by them. We do provide everything else including transportation back and forth to school.

 

I just had to keep the peace:glare:

 

My original idea was to have them live at home, even AFTER college, and save money. Dh's cousins did this....BUT they helped out at home, mowed the lawn, cooked once a week, and paid for some groceries.

 

My oldest will graduate this year and I KNOW this arrangement will not work. He has to move out and realize that people do go to a job, pay the bills, and keep house.

 

 

Now my real question......I have 8 kids. The older 3 boys are followed by 4 girls and another boy. My oldest daughter (14) was once decent help, but this year, she is nearly totally brain-dead. I WANT to chalk it up to hormones. But I have this nagging feeling that she sees her older brothers doing NOTHING and now she is going to cash in on the lazy attitude. (She does occasionally complain about their lack of involvement).

 

This is causing a lot of friction between us, because basically I NEED THE HELP. Example, yesterday she sat and read while I put supper on the table. Her next youngest sibling was watching the baby, but she SAT in the living room with a book and only helped when I asked SPECIFICALLY carry this over or stir this, etc. She made it plain that she didn't want to be helping me.

 

REALLY....what do these kids think mothers are???? The energizer bunny??

 

I was the oldest of 9 and really helped Mom out. Now...I didn't LIKE it all the time, but I did take pride in what I did. I was VERY glad to leave home for college though, because a LOAD of responsibility was lifted from my shoulders. I swore to myself that I wouldn't overload my kids like that. BUT....I feel as though my kids nearly want a free ride.

 

How can I keep the peace....but stay sane and teach the kid's responsibility. Seriously though NOTHING is going to change the older 2 boys specifically. #3 does have concentration issues, but tries at times. (But really is not reliable help....however, he doesn't have a problem (it seems) with his job outside the home. Ummmm. (Maybe I should just be really happy about that!

 

Blessings,

Stephanie

Edited June 14, 2009 by Stephanie/MO

[Renee in NC]

I would have the 3 oldest boys pay for a cleaning lady for you. That's how real life is - if you don't want to do something yourself that needs to be done, then they have to pay someone else to do it.

 

Do they clean up after themselves at least? Are they eating meals at home?

 

If they are acting like boarders, then charge them!:D

[Nestof3]

Being the meanie that I am, it's contribute to the family or you receive no benefits of the family.

 

I do take into consideration how much free time our eldest has and ask accordingly. I think everyone (including Mom) needs some downtime.

 

But, he was working practically full-time while homeschooling himself through high school. Now that he is in college, he will do anything I ask, helps with the lawn and does the dishwasher, etc. But, He has day and night classes, a night martial arts course, and still helps my husband work on weekends.

 

If there's no outside of the home work, I would expect a lot to be done around the house. So I vote: enforce their help or they lose the benefits.

 

BTW -- An adult child would have to leave our home if I felt he or she were being a sluggard, and I have told our eldest this.

[mom4him]

I would have the 3 oldest boys pay for a cleaning lady for you. That's how real life is - if you don't want to do something yourself that needs to be done, then they have to pay someone else to do it.

 

Do they clean up after themselves at least? Are they eating meals at home?

 

If they are acting like boarders, then charge them!:D

:iagree:I totally agree. I would not allow them to continue to live at home and have that free ride. Someone once told me that the way your boys treat you is the way they will treat their wife. They would be given a time to either be moved our or start with specific things now.

I did this with our middle son. He was about 20, moved our and got a taste of the real live.

If they do not comply with the responsibilities and want to continue living at home there should be a 'charge' to what is left undone and the person that does those things should be compensated by them.

Where is your dh in all of this? Do you have backing from him?

You are not doing yourself, them nor the younger children a favor by continuing like it is.

[Peela]

You are not doing your older sons' future wives any favours by letting them get away with treating you like that. Obviously the consequences just aren't painful enough for them :)

 

As for the girls- my 13 and 15yo teens have assigned chores. They alternate weeks. One does ALL the dishes one week, and the other does the pets (chickens, rabbit, doggy do pick up). Additionally, they do their own washing, and dd15 does the pool- she checks the filters and skims the leaves off, checks the creepy crawly is working, backwashes- every single morning. Ds13 does all the bins in the house. Once a week they vacuum half the house each, and help tidy. Pocket money is dependent on weekly room check- it must be tidy before pocket money is distributed. Both are additionally paid for helping me with my cooking job weekly.

 

I too get moans and attitude when I ask for extra jobs at times, but its just life. I give a lot. I give up my free time to drive them to classes- well, even to homeschool them. I am generous. If I allow them to get away with not giving back, now that they are old enough, I feel I train them to be spoilt, and I don't want to spoil them.

 

However, I do find it hard, and it takes my dh to really back me up and help me stand firm with them. I would give up way too easily if it werent for him. I am so glad that I have persevered though and that they do as many chores as they do. You have lots of kids- a few jobs each and after the training period....lucky you, you will have lots of help!

[Mom0012]

Well, I would not expect your daughter to help if you don't require it of your sons. My mother always expected my sister and I to help while my brother did nothing because of his gender and it created quite a bit of resentment. To this day, when we get together as a family, it doesn't occur to my brother that he should contribute anything. My sister will contribute to the preparation, but not the cleanup. I'm assuming this is because of her resentment about my brother. I do help because there's no way I'm going to let my mother do everything.

 

I do like the idea of having your sons pay for a cleaning lady. That's really thinking outside of the box.

 

Lisa

[Danestress]

Is that it's easy for you to not insist your older children help and follow up to make sure that they do.

 

I would imagine that your daughter is thinking, "Okay, so it's too much trouble to make them do it, so she expects me to do it instead, probably because I am a girl."

 

 

Now the truth may be that you see them doing worthwhile things (like college and jobs) so you feel okay about releasing them from housework. Which I can understand because they are really busy. But I doubt your daughter will see it that way, and frankly it's hard for me to see it that way. I have a 21 year old son (not living at home, but off in college). It's hard for me to imagine letting him live here but not contribute to housework. Even when he comes home for breaks I ask him to do this and that - nothing onerous because he really can be a bit lazy and I do like to keep the peace. I really do understand where you are coming from there.

 

 

Still, I think you have to decide that it IS worth it to make them do some work, even small things, and I think you need to think of the reasons. Reasons like your DILs are going to resent you forever if you don't, your younger children are going to resent it and see that example, you are teaching them to disrespect you as a woman, you are teaching them that laziness has these great rewards, you are making it easy for them to never grow up and move out. You say that nothing will change with the boys. I think that is unfair to you and your other children.

 

What I did with my son as he got older was to ask him to do things that had to be done right then and were either done or not done - so there wasn't a lot of room to argue over "how" it was done. Jobs that worked that way were things like mowing the law, emptying the dishwasher, taking the garbage out. Depending on how picky you are, you could add more to that list. If I ask my son to haul the vacuum upstairs and vacuum up there, I am okay with it not being the very most perfect job. But I agree that with boys this age it might requirement too much follow up to say, "Okay, from now on you are responsible for keeping the hall bathroom clean" because their ideas of when are different form yours.

 

These are things I suggested can be done in less that half an hour. I do think that if your sons are working and in school, you should keep their chores pretty small. If they are keeping their own rooms clean and doing their own laundry (please, please tell me they are) then small things that contribute to the whole house is enough. Are they putting their dishes away and basically respecting the space? I would start with that.

 

Is your DH the kind of guy who will get on top of this? If he is, it might be effective to have all of this come from him. But if he's not, you just have to decide that you are stronger willed than your sons are and that you WILL get them to change or move.

[Spetzi]

I'm going to throw some things out there...I dont' have older teens so I might be way off.....

 

 

Could you sit down w/them and work out chores that each would be responsible for. I think the best bet would be something that he could do on his schedule, like mowing the lawn vs. helping w/dinner. Maybe you could give them things that are more palatable like running errands vs. doing dishes. All the chores would need deadlines & consquences, of course, just like a job. Could they take one of your other kids to activities, take the dog to the vet, wash the windows, etc? Maybe they could do things you dont' have time to do. Even if it doesn't lighten your daily load, your hedges would be trimmed and the garage would look neater.

 

I'm already finding w/my pre-teen that she doesnt' like to be told to help NOW. She wants to run her own life (at 12!) I'm trying to come up w/ways she can help w/o me depending on her at that moment by planning her daily chores and trying not to ask her to put her book down.

 

I'm not suggesting letting them rule the roost, but giving them some autonomy.

[Chris in VA]

I think they should do their own laundry and take out the trash when they see it beginning to need to go out! I also think everyone should help get dinner on the table--I don't let anyone sit at the table until it's completely set. I hate seeing people come to dinner expecting to be served when it's obvious something is still missing from the table, like the milk (we put it on the table) or the napkins.

 

ITA about training the boys to serve their wives by requiring them to serve their mom (it's actually mutual). And, I totally know how uncomfortable it is to enforce what you want, so you have to grow a backbone and become comfortable with their discomfort.

 

So, I'd call a family meeting (AFTER you talk with your husband, and get him to back you up or co-present), and say what you are feeling, how things are going to change, and what you expect. I'd say, again, laundry and keeping their own spaces clean is the minimum, and the dinner thing. I'd also rotate dish washing--Monday/Weds/Fri, it's X's turn to clear the table, Y's turn to load the dishwasher/wash the dishes, and Z's turn to put them away. T/TH/Fri, the other 3 are on duty. One day a week, the littles help you. Or something like that. Make a schedule and post it. If someone is absent for dinner, they have to find someone to cover their job. Dishes are easy to enforce, because you run out if they don't get done--same with laundry.

 

Now, I do occasionally offer grace, and catch the boys up with their laundry, or fold clothes for dd while she's at school. But don't rescue them often, or they will expect you to. Let the siblings pressure each other, and don't nag.

 

What do you think?

[Nestof3]

Well, I would not expect your daughter to help if you don't require it of your sons. My mother always expected my sister and I to help while my brother did nothing because of his gender and it created quite a bit of resentment. To this day, when we get together as a family, it doesn't occur to my brother that he should contribute anything. My sister will contribute to the preparation, but not the cleanup. I'm assuming this is because of her resentment about my brother. I do help because there's no way I'm going to let my mother do everything.

 

I do like the idea of having your sons pay for a cleaning lady. That's really thinking outside of the box.

 

Lisa

 

:iagree: I experienced this with my brother.

[Nestof3]

You are not doing your older sons' future wives any favours by letting them get away with treating you like that. Obviously the consequences just aren't painful enough for them :)

 

 

I totally agree. :iagree:

 

Your sons' wives will appreciate their domestic help. There's nothing worse than watching a couple in their 80's -- the man in the recliner, the woman still slaving away.

[Renee in NC]

I totally agree. :iagree:

 

Your sons' wives will appreciate their domestic help. There's nothing worse than watching a couple in their 80's -- the man in the recliner, the woman still slaving away.

 

Like my mother.:glare:

[SonshineLearner]

Family Meeting time, eh?? Chore distribution time, and Dad does the whole meeting. Can you imagine your daughter in law? Can you imagine her not sleeping well, nursing one or two babies at a time? getting dinner? Guy comes home, says "What's for dinner?" Pops open the Pepsi, and says..."I need some down time" Tell me when dinner's ready? Now imagine, girl getting ticked....going back to HER home, where everyone knew how to help? Explain this to your sons, read "The Red Hen" and tell your boys it's time to pull themselves up by their bootstraps....get the mowing done, the flowers planted, the table set....and your daughter needs the respect! (as well as you!) You can do it!

Carrie:-)

[dirty ethel rackham]

Or you could do what my mom did ...

 

When one of my brothers (post college) stopped helping around the house, he came home from work to find all of his belongings tossed onto the front yard. Db had to sleep on a friends' couch until he found another place to live. It really was time for him to flee the nest. What an example for the rest of us!

 

After that incident, my parents had a wakeup call. We had to help around the house. Period. We got to choose the chores we were responsible for, but helping was not optional. No help, no eat. We got one year rent free post college (if we followed the rules), but after that, we paid room and board (enough to pay for a cleaning lady and a few other conveniences.) We all co-existed much more peacefully after that. However, there was a bit of that self-centered early adult stuff going on - not intentionally taking advantage of the folks, but just very focused on building our own lives. That, too, was a sign that we needed to move on.

[katilac]

I'm guessing all of your sons, including your oldest one, would change in a hurry if you stopped providing things that they need and value: a ride to school or work, clean clothes, FOOD.

 

Honestly, I see no way to turn five of the kids into willing helpers when the other three are taking a free ride.

 

You shouldn't have to 'stay on top of them' and ensure that the work is done. The oldest two are grown men and the third nearly so. You can try giving them jobs that allow for some wiggle room in their schedule, like mowing the lawn (must be done each week, but can be done Thursday if you miss it on Wednesday).

 

Or, claim a specified block of time each week. Schedule it just like their job schedules their work hours - - for two hours every Friday, after school and before work, I own you. Of course, I'd be peeved if I had to resort to this, and they'd get the nastiest jobs, like scrubbing out trash cans, weeding the very back of the garden, and so forth.

 

It won't be easy, because they've learned that they can escape work if they turn it into a lot of trouble and headaches for you. But it will work if you stick to your guns. If they don't do their part, don't welcome them to your table. Don't drive them to school, test or no test. Don't drive them to work. Let them deal with the consequences.

[Loupelou]

Being the meanie that I am, it's contribute to the family or you receive no benefits of the family.

 

I do take into consideration how much free time our eldest has and ask accordingly. I think everyone (including Mom) needs some downtime.

 

But, he was working practically full-time while homeschooling himself through high school. Now that he is in college, he will do anything I ask, helps with the lawn and does the dishwasher, etc. But, He has day and night classes, a night martial arts course, and still helps my husband work on weekends.

 

If there's no outside of the home work, I would expect a lot to be done around the house. So I vote: enforce their help or they lose the benefits.

 

BTW -- An adult child would have to leave our home if I felt he or she were being a sluggard, and I have told our eldest this.

 

:iagree: With Dawn here. I can see how your oldest dd would feel a little ripped off in this situation. Sounds like time for a family meeting about expectations and responsibilities. If you can squeeze the time out in your busy schedule then so can everyone else. Sorry if that sounds a little hard- nosed.:D

[Stephanie/MO]

Thank you for all your thoughts.

 

Realistically, the food is not much of an issue. The oldest 2 rarely eat here. They are either sleeping (oldest works shift work at the hospital). He does occasiontally offer to do something if he is around for suppper IF it is quick and he is in a good mood.

 

I think I haven't been a very good manager. Dh is VERY laid back....which can be problematic. So, I am going to have to set some rules down and follow through.

 

Heck, I thought I would get a break after the toddler/early grade school years on all this "follow-up", rules vs. punishment stuff.

 

Oh, well:001_smile: I guess I have not been realistic with the situation. Thank again for all the input!!!!

 

Blessings,

Stephanie

[HeatherInWI]

I think you've already gotten the message, but I'd agree with those who are saying to lay down the law. They do their part, or they move out, on their own money.

 

My goal has always been to have a child ready so that s/he could do almost any household chore by the age of 13. The only real exception has been lawn mowing, as we have a very steep yard and they need to wait until they have the body strength and size to manage the mower for that type of job.

 

It's great to have children (male and female) who can cook, clean, sew, do laundry, etc.! Dh and I work hard, but the dc do their part, too. Of course, my dh knows how to do housework, too -- and does!

[Dirtroad]

My kids do several chores at 3 years old... THREE. The difficulty and amount of responsibility increase with their age.

 

I agree with nestof3 (I hope I got her name right).... if they do not help the family maintain the home... they do not benefit from the perks.

 

PERKS are tough too.... NO COOKED MEALS... NO CLEAN LAUNDRY.... No access to family car or family money (if older)....

 

Life is tough. We all have to work & share the load. We have no maid and that wouldn't help them learn responsibility anyway.

 

Oh, and if they whine... I add to the list.:scared:

 

I would not blame the younger ones for not doing the work if the older ones do not. The older ones arent' sharing the burden but reaping the benefits. Boys also tend to get away with more too b/c Dads aren't noticing. Can you get DH involved here?

 

As for staying at home after school days (college or high).. .NO WAY. Out the door! They can get roommates to share the expenses. They will stay until they are 40!

[Mandy in TN]

My big boys detail my vehicle (vacuum, polish the hub caps- the works) every Sunday afternoon. It's just one of their chores. Oldest ds was about 10yo when he started helping dh. The oldest would vacuum the inside while dh did the outside. Then about a year later middle ds at around 8yo began vacuuming while oldest did the hub caps and tires after dh washed the outside. Now oldest takes care of the outside and middle ds takes care of the inside. Middle ds also vacuums the garage while he has the shop vac down.

 

They also all work in the yard. Middle ds picks up dog poop and gets everything out of the yard. Oldest mows. Dh weed eats and edges.

 

Middle ds also does all the dishes and oldest does all the garbage. When oldest ds goes to college in fall 2010, middle ds will take over his chores and the little man will take over middle ds chores. Little ds is shadowing and "helping" some now and he will be turn 8yo in the fall of 2010, so it will be time.

 

Recently oldest ds turned 18yo, middle ds turned 15 late last fall, and the little man turned 6yo in early fall. This spring we all went to tutorial on Monday. Oldest ds took two classes at community college, so he was there twice a week in addition to the Monday tutorial. He did not work outside the home, but it would not matter.

 

In addition to homeschooling my boys, I taught at the tutorial on Mondays. I also worked Thursday afternoons and Saturday mornings in the junior room at the Kumon center. Dh works 6 days a week. We still work around the house.

 

There is no discussion. It is just done. This was instilled as a habit when they were little and now they know no other way of being.

 

I vote that if the older boys won't help charge them rent and begin habit training the others now. You can always give them the option of paying when they get older just like their brothers.

 

Oh, I wanted to add that I do all the laundry, but only because I am too picky about sorting. :o OTOH, dh does all the grocery shopping, but mostly because he is better about being a tight-wad than I am. :rolleyes:

 

HTH-

Mandy

[Mandy in TN]

My kids do several chores at 3 years old... THREE. The difficulty and amount of responsibility increase with their age.

:iagree: And at 3yo they think it's fun to wash baseboards! :001_huh: Go figure.