Kim in SouthGa Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I am driving myself crazy trying to decide between Lightning Lit, LLfLOTR, etc or just doing lit as described in the WTM. Can you tell me why you have made the choices you have (program or not), if you regretted your decision, what helped, etc? I'm mainly talking about 8th grade, logic stage. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I had never used a lit program before high school until LLfLOTRs. I am so glad I bought it b/c it now lists up there in my best homeschooling purchases over our 15 yrs. I bought it b/c my ds wasn't that much of a reader. (hard for me to believe b/c now he is a complete bookworm!) Anyway, she does an amazing job of bringing in other wonderful pieces of literature to show how Tolkein was influenced. My ds even loved the linguistic studies and now writes his own version of Elven poetry. I could never have put anything together that weaves together the info the way LL does. Great product. Lightning Lit.....I bought one set for next yr......I could have easily done something similar on my own (I know b/c I have repeatedly!) What I have done is spent time on the internet doing author research and visiting school/university websites reading their sources and cliffnotes/sparknotes (many are available online for free), etc and then put together my own discussion questions. The biggest drawback is that that takes time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbjmeyer Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I've been researching various Lit programs for 7th grade, and appreciate this thread...I don't know exactly what a middle schooler need to learn about literature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I've been researching various Lit programs for 7th grade, and appreciate this thread...I don't know exactly what a middle schooler need to learn about literature. Literary Lessons from Lord of the Rings. I used it over 2 yrs with my 6th/7th and 8th/9th graders. We took it a nice easy pace and spent a long time on the units (Iliad/Odyssey, Beowulf, Shakespeare, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, and others). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Dominion Heather Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I think I will stick with the WTM lit recommendations because they are the main reason I was attracted to WTM in the first place. I knew anyone who recommended Dorothy Sayers and Agatha Christie for eighth grade lit had to be absolutely brilliant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy in ME Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 We have been using the literature questions and worksheets that go along with TOG because I don't have to think about it. All the planning is done for me. I have recently re-read TWTM and it made really think long and hard about whether I really needed TOG. I really like all of TWTM recs but I have 4 children and a full time job and a house and a husband and .... For me, having a "program" helps us get it all done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom31257 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 (edited) We are going to try CLE's 7th grade reading program next year. I think it includes a lot of topics that I might miss on my own. I have used BJU's program a few years with her, along with lots of novels. I had to pick and choose what I wanted to do in order to include the time for novels. I like that this is just 5 units and around 80 lessons (also much cheaper), which allows plenty of time for reading whole books the way WTM recommends. We will alternate Light Unit/Novel/Light Unit, etc. Here's a link to their entire scope and sequence. Their reading program begins on page 23. http://www.clp.org/documents/2354/original/2008_Scope_Sequence_grades_1-8.pdf Edited June 4, 2009 by mom31257 add a link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoggirl Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 We used CLE Reading 7 least year, and I loved it. Ds liked the reader but not the workbook stuff. He felt it was all stuff he had previously had. This is probably true. However, had I not made a conscious effort on some things he would NOT have previously had them. That is really convoluted! Ack! Anyway, I think doing reading a la' WTM is super. I would just supplement with Figuratively Speaking of Walch Toolbox Prose & Poetry. These are both workbooks that cover literary terms in isolated ways. To me this makes them easier to find in larger works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori D. Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 (edited) I am driving myself crazy trying to decide between Lightning Lit, LLfLOTR, etc or just doing lit as described in the WTM. Can you tell me why you have made the choices you have (program or not), if you regretted your decision, what helped, etc? I'm mainly talking about 8th grade, logic stage.Thanks! Guess I don't see WTM method and lit. programs as incompatible. The WTM suggests programs for all the school subjects; and many people on this board use other programs not mentioned in WTM (because there are too many good programs for TWTM to mention ALL programs), AND they use them in a way that is compatible with the WTM's general structure. Similarly, the WTM also suggests resources for teaching lit. (such as "How To Read a Book"). Many people on this board use other lit. programs and resources, and they use them in a way that is compatible with the WTM method of teaching lit. I'm guessing that literature is an area Susan Wise-Bauer doesn't go into a lot of detail or list a lot of programs is NOT because programs are incompatible -- but rather, because that is HER natural forte -- she teaches English and Literature in a University, and she probably hasn't needed to look at a lot of lit. programs to use them, review them, recommend them. I come out of a heavy literature analysis and film analysis background from college -- I really "get" how to read a book or watch a film and see how elements are working: I pretty easily see themes and meanings -- yet I find it extremely helpful to use a wide variety of programs and resources to not only help me teach literature at home, but to also help me "see more": Literature Programs - Lightning Literature & Composition 7 - Lightning Literature & Composition 8 Wonderful, very gentle middle school programs for first exposure to "real" classical literature. We found the worksheets helpful for putting into practice the literary element learned in each unit. - Literary Lessons from the Lord of the Rings Wonderfully in-depth, gentle literature program for helping students see many themes in a single long work. Fantastic additional units help students see the many literary (and other) influences on an author as he/she writes a work of literature. Also, the units were wonderful in showing students that one great piece of literature can be a springboard into other works, or even into delving into fascinating related topics. Literary Analysis Resources - Figuratively Speaking - Walch Toolbook: Prose & Poetry - Story Elements (gr. 5-6) (gr. 7-8) - Christian Light Education (CLE) units Wonderfully helpful resources for describing literary elements, showing them used in classic literature, and exercises for seeing them / putting them into practice. Literary elements are the "tools" used when you do literary analysis (aka, "WTM method") -- and you really need to know what your tools are and how they work before you can start doing literary analysis. Literature Guides - Glencoe - Sparknotes - Cliff's Notes - Wikipedia articles - Garlic Press Publisher - Progeny Press - The Great Books - Portals to Literature[/i] Lit. guides are so helpful in analyzing literature, providing background information on the author and works; discussion questions, bringing up themes and making connections that we might not have seen for ourselves. Literature "Technique" Resources - Teaching the Classics - Reading Strands - How to Read A Book - Deconstructing Penguins - How to Read Like a Professor - The Well Educated Mind - Socratic Method Questions for Literature - Invitation to the Classics All helpful resources for teaching you how to read and analyze literature, kinds of questions to ask/answer, lists of classic works with background and basic analysis. After overwhelming you with all that (LOL), I'd suggest doing what we did in 8th grade -- go with a Literature Program, such as Literary Lessons from the Lord of the Rings. Alongside it, learn the literary terms from a resource such as Figuratively Speaking. And begin practicing the "WTM method" with additional classic literature, using a lit. guide and/or Socratic questions or ideas from The Well Educated Mind / How To Read A Book / Teaching the Classics or list of literary analysis questions. Do it together with your student. And enjoy! BEST of luck, whatever you go with. Warmest regards, Lori D. Edited June 4, 2009 by Lori D. fixed typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bee Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 WTM methods. First reason, I have to do standardized testing and using a textbook like Mosdos allows me to introduce terms and concepts that my children won't hear about by reading, writing about, and discussing books. Second, in the upper grades, using a literature program saves me time and money. This also allows the children to read some classics from TWTM lists just for fun, without feeling they have to analyze and write about every thing they read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peela Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Its been a question I have been asking myself a lot lately, too! We did LLfLOTR over a year and really loved it. Lots of parts we skipped. I dont like comprehension questions that ask for recall- I prefer narration for that. I don't mind questions that ask for deeper thinking. I used online resources to help us spend 6 months on the Iliad. At the moment...no resources, although I have some up my sleeve. I like the look of the Glencoe online ones http://www.glencoe.com/sec/literature/litlibrary/ and think I will use the Canterbury Tales one next term when we study that. A shame they dont have more. I really like SWB's comments around not spoiling a good book with too much analysis. I have taken that to heart, and i think it has been good for us. However every now and then I get drawn to picking one book to analyse and I do need help. Its not that SWB doesnt recommend getting help- she says there's nothing wrong with using Sparks notes etc. Lightning Literature and Composition 7 and 8 unfortunately for us uses books we have already read, otherwise I might have bought it. But I am kind of glad, because it would have pushed something else off the schedule. I may use one of their guides for Shakespeare next year though. Literature for us still tends to be a family thing, with discussions and telling each other our favourite bits and read alouds. I am careful not to spoil that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginevra Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I am driving myself crazy trying to decide between Lightning Lit, LLfLOTR, etc or just doing lit as described in the WTM. Can you tell me why you have made the choices you have (program or not), if you regretted your decision, what helped, etc? I'm mainly talking about 8th grade, logic stage. I have not done a "program" for literature in the past. This upcoming year, I plan to use Glencoe Literature Guides for my rising 7th grader. (They are FREE!) The reason I am doing this is mainly because I intend to send her to school for high school and I want her to have experience in "official" literature analysis. However, I have not regretted our almost free-form "literature" of the past. My dd is an avid reader and I was fine with her reading any "quality" literature she wished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elizabeth Conley Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I am not an English Major, nor do I play one on TV. For this reason I do like to use a Literature program, as well as encouraging my children to read many, many good books. We use Mosdos Literature. http://www.mosdospress.com/try_before_buy.html I appreciate the way the Teacher's manual helps me see the material from the perspective of an expert. It gives me excellent points to discuss with my children. So I like the fact that it's a program, because it helps me to do a better job of teaching the kids to appreciate and understand Literature. We don't confine our studies in Literature to Mosdos, but we do like it. Mosdos reading selections are excellent. There are frequently tie-ins to Social Studies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlockOfSillies Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 Another entry in the Top 25 Best Curriculum Board Posts Ever. Saving this one to the hard drive. Thanks, Lori! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanaTron Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 I wanted all the planning, questions, etc. done for me. I don't really have time to put that together myself. I also wanted something with writing assignments already laid out--even if there aren't a lot. But...now that I'm thinking about it, I may go back and look at the WTM recs for 8th grade. I may change my mind and go the WTM route, if it looks simple enough for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 Since you're looking at 8th grade, you might want to look a bit ahead and start thinking through how you want to approach a Great Books study in high school. I'm doing the BJU Reading 6 now with my dd to increase her written load and cover some basics in preparation for Omnibus in a couple years. I'm doing the Omnibus readings myself and using WTM techniques, which are fine. I sure appreciate the guidance of a curriculum rather than trying to pull all that together myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veritaserum Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 I'm currently working on a literature program for my 4th grader this fall. I'm using the WTM reading list and creating assignment sheets with independent activities and questions. I'm also looking ahead and doing a more difficult book (using the Logic WTM list) and a corresponding family read aloud. I love having open-and-go, scripted lessons in our other subjects and decided that I wanted that with our literature studies, too. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TN Mama Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 I'm currently working on a literature program for my 4th grader this fall. I'm using the WTM reading list and creating assignment sheets with independent activities and questions. I'm also looking ahead and doing a more difficult book (using the Logic WTM list) and a corresponding family read aloud. I love having open-and-go, scripted lessons in our other subjects and decided that I wanted that with our literature studies, too. :) Wow - your samples look wonderful! I'd love to see more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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