:lol: Please add your thoughts. I always learn something from your posts!

YEs Dr. Cotter doesn't like rods but I think I agree with her. Her whole premise is visualizing quantities and developing a math sense. FOr the rods, once you get beyond 5, it's harder to differentiate between 6,7,8,9 etc except for the colors. With the abacus, as in SM, you're seeing quantities based on 5s and 10s. So kids quickly use stratgies initially for 5+7 as 5+5+2. This comes in handy later for things such as 57+35 as some might see it as 55+35+2 and other strategies such as seeing 8s,9s as 2 and 1 away from 10 etc. The big difference between SM and RS is the use the abacus but SM accomplishes the same thing w/ it's visual workbooks and thought bubbles. The problem above in RS (57+35) would be presented in several different ways in several lessons 50+30+7+5, 57+30+5 (this is all for mental math, not written algorithms). You'd visualize this on the abacus putting the 10s on top of the abacus and the 1s on teh bottom, then adding teh 3 tens (30) to the top, then adding the 5 ones at the bottom. In SM, you'd see a kid w/ a thought bubble thinking (57, 67, 77, 87 plus 5 more), another kid w/ another though bubble (50+30+12). In that sense, I think SM moves master than RS and I've doubled up on lessons quite a bit for my mathy kids. Anyone, feel free to correct me if I'm in error! :001_smile: HTH

Actually, RS and SM have very similar methodologies except for the initial visualizing quantities from what I can tell. They work well together if child needs a slightly different approach to a topic. I've seen several who use RS as a spine and SM as a supplement and it works well. Many when they finish RS, and want a breather before jumping into Algebra, will go right into SM 5A or 6A with no problems at all. My 5yr old is finishing RS B. I'm having him do some of SM Primary 1A/1B just to slow him down a bit and give him a different representation of concepts. He is a bit slow w/ 2-digit addition over a 100 (89+56) so I wanted him to have time for that gel before moving on. I haven't done SM 3A+ but I don't know of any huge differences between the two in strategies for add/sub/multi/div. If there are some, I'd love to read about them. I chose RS over SM b/c initially the SM way of doing things was foreign to me, as I was taught the rote way and since RS had similar methods but more hand-holding, I went that route. The visuals in SM appeal to me so I have those workbooks as well, for when DC needs a different representation - which, they've never needed lol. I wanted to add, that I think RS and SM Earlybird differ in that EB emphasizes counting. SM Primary series however, emphasizes seeing groups of 5 and 10, similar to RS ie 7 is 5 and 2, 8 is 5 and 3 etc.

HHmm if I remember correctly, SM EB teaches a lot of counting. RS discourages counting but rather emphasizes seeing the quantities. If your son is very mathy, you might consider starting with RS B. It was the entry level for RS, RS A was written later for those wanting to start earlier. RS B has more worksheets in it. The scope and sequence for RS and SM primary series is different. It would be easier I think to use RS as a spine, and jump around in SM as you need to. For instance, subtraction is taught later in RS than in SM and division is taught later in RS as well. But by the time the child gets there, he's already been there b/c of the way RS teaches addition and multiplication. Believe me, by the time you get to RS C, there is plenty of worksheets! And I had a 5yr old who loved nothing more than filling out worksheet after worksheet after worksheet....they soon get over it, or at least mine did.

abbeyej: Can you please provide a direct link to the cards you are using along w/ Hakim books? thanks!

Investigations gets a lot of poor reviews. I think if it were my DD, I would supplement at home since she is having math issues. You could do SM but I wouldn't do Earlybird. I'd go into the Primary Series. You can do the placement test at http://www.singaporemath.com. Another path I've seen recommended for supplementing is Rightstart Alabacus book and card games set. That would give you the abacus which is great for seeing quantities and later doing mental math. First, you need to try and determine what the problem. Is it that she doesn't know her facts? Is it that she has trouble holding numbers in her head? Does she just not have a good method for solving problems? Some districts are big on letting kids figure it out for themselves, even if it's inefficient. She is close to a RS algorithm. For 26+35=26+30=56, 56+5=61. She may need only some fun games to beef up her skills. We play Chutes and Ladders. You can't count the spaces, you have to do it by adding. We also play w/ 2 dice and you can add or subtract them, whichever puts you in the best position. So if you're on 56 and roll two sixes, it's 56+12 or 56-12, whichever is a better move.

Thank's BLossom Girl!!!! Do you find that after having done RS, you don't need the Home Instructor's Guides for SM? I know many here have said they needed the HIGs for levels 5-6 of SM. CaptUhura

Susie in Tx: Do you know which level of SM you will go into after RS E?

I recall a thread about going into SM 5 or 6 after RS E but a search didn't pull it up in the first 7-8 pages I checked. Where do you all go after RS E? I'll also ask over at the RS yahoogroup. I'd like to keep my eyes out for used SM, if indeed that is where I will go. Thanks! CaptUhura

I'm doing Living Math cycle 1 w/ SOTW I with my 3rd whom I just started HSing. I'm going to aim for Living Math books/activities for Fridays and weekends. DS8 is in RS level D. DS enjoys math and history so this will be a good fit for us.

I've found that the subtraction is already understood by the end of B, because of the way RS teaches addition. The OP didn't mention the age/grade of the child. If the achievement test is just for your knowledge, I wouldn't worry about it. You know your DD will learn subtraction in the beginning of level C.

It is my understanding that you play to the last card played OR any CORNER, not just any card. From the Card Games book "Play is either to the last card played or to a "Corner." A Corner is a space where a card could fit by joining the edges with at least two other cards." There is a sample game shown. On that illustration, the 3rd card played has a 10 which could have matched to the 5 on the 1st card played, but that isn't allowed, so the 10 isn't used, the 3rd card played uses the 4 to match w/ 1 on the 2nd card played. Similarly, the 4th card played could have been played on the 1st card, but again, it can't so it is played on the 3rd card laid down. It helps if you can actually see the diagram lol. IT's page 25 of Card Games book. HTH

Hmm here is another one for book 1. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0195153510/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance I wonder what the difference is from the one AVAcademy posted? SO it seems the one I link to is for middle school to highschool. THe one AAAcademy linked to is for elementary aged kids and uses the 3rd edition. WHEW! You saved me buying the wrong book!

For science, I'd look at Building Foundations in Scientific Understanding by Dr. Nebel. It's great for 1st grade.

After spending 30min reading through DS's books to find something suitable for copywork, I gave up and opened up the WWE workbook. Something has to give sometimes .... and the kids aren't threatening to mutiny so we'll continue w/ the workbooks for now. And the passages do spark our interest in those books!

We're in RS D right now and I think I have to agree with your assessment of RS D...enough already! I absolutely love RS but it seems RS D is a bit repetitive for my DS8. I need to sit down and see what lessons DS needs and quickly move ahead. He's complaining of math being too easy and he's sick of multiplication although he needs more time tables drill w/ games etc.

No, but it looks great!

THanks Ali in Or.

I haven't used it yet but you can get a free one at Julie's website so you can see what it's all about.

I've asked this before so forgive me if you're one of the ones that answered but you seem knowledgeable about the dvds...can you do this effectively with only the syllabus? Are the books you've listed, discussed in the syllabus?

I also think the spacing is too large in WWE2. We're only using the bottom 2 lines.

Well thank you! Most do not know what it means lol so obviously you must be a Trekkie!

Also, for Chutes and Ladder, you add a twist. You can also allow subtraction! That way, if subtracting gets you to a ladder, then great! If not, add unless it gets you to a chute! We also graduated to allowing negative numbers which allow you to go backwards! As far as RS games, Corners is a favorite here for adding. You can also play subtraction Corners as well by starting at say 100, 500 etc. Also play War but use only cards 5-9 which uses the 2 fives strategy, and make 10 for 8s and 9s strategy. Also, roll two dice each to play war. Play War with dominoes (2 each for each player). There is a dominoes game where the ends have to add up to a certain number....I'm sure you can it by googling "domino games." Some swear by this electronic game....it's not Math shark but another one. It's about $50 but keeps track of what DC needs to work on. Also, in the back of level C are worksheets to work on certain strategies like 2 fives, 9s, 8s strategy etc.

http://www.vdps.net/special/test.html#Wechsler%20Intelligence%20Scale%20for%20Children%20%96%20Fourth%20Edition

I loved RS A! I would give it more time and be sure to play the games w/ tally cards, tally sticks, fingers, finger cards etc. I do think some of these things are developmental. I haven't looked at A in awhile but I do think you can move forward but still work on this concept. just my 0.02