Thanks everyone! I appreciate the input- I hear not all of you think it is a good intro to Philosophy, but it may be the only one we actually get to, so it may have to do! I myself am very much enjoying the book and learning a lot, although I hear some of you feel it's not necessarily all accurate, either. I love the overview of religions etc The audio sounds like a good idea, too. We may do this book rather informally, I will see how I feel when we start.

Do you have the time/inclination to sit and watch hours of lectures? I tried, and tried, and tried...but I couldn't do it :) So the DVDs have been a waste for me. I may pick up the book, but I feel that having read TWEM and the Socratic questioning in TWTM and understanding more about CM's approach of letting the child engage with books without too much interference- although discussion is encouraged, not imposing your ideas onto the child- I am feeling it is enough. I think it depends how academic you want to get about it. It is yet another curriculum, and probably a very good one, but it is by no means essential.

Rather than meal planning, I have a meal timetable up on the fridge- it was a one off thing i did last holidays to help me get through the term. it just says things like Monday night- mexican- nachos/ enchilados/ tacos/ taco soup. Tuesday Lunch- meat dish with kids. Tuesday Night- Pizza/Pasta. Friday Night- Fish/ potatoes. Basically, i just give myself some memory joggers, so that when I am standing in the kitchen at 5.30pm wondering what's for dinner, I can look at the fridge and get some instant inspiration. Its not rigid though, I give myself permission to cook something different if i want :) Also, I have a shopping list pre-designed by myself on Word which has all the groceries we normally buy or have in the pantry, arranged according to aisles. It took me an hour one day, but its been so worth it. Then i pull out a highlighter and mark off items we are low on, before I go shopping. It helps a lot, and it doesnt mean I need to menu plan, it just means I have a perpetual pantry/ freezer of food we eat regularly. I am no good at regular meal planning, and I always change my mind anyway because my energy levels and enthusiasm for cooking fluctuates so wildly, one night its frozen pizza or cereal and the next it's gourmet food.

I am reading Sophie's World at the moment and it is definitely something I want my kids to read. And I am very aware (even slightly panicky when i think about it!) that I dont have many more years to be guiding their education, so I have this feeling to have my dd14 read this next year, when she will be turning 15 mid year. That is the age of the girl in the book, after all. But then I was telling a friend, who does Classical, and she was very adamant that that book should be left for at least a further year and she wouldn't dream of expecting her daughters, the oldest of whom is 6 months older than mine, to appreciate/understand it yet. But perhaps we are just different families because I suspect my dd would be ok with it. Perhaps she would get more out of it if I left it another year or two, but the further we go, the less time we seem to have, so I dont want to put off anything I really want to do, too long, IYKWIM, because we may not get to it. So, my Classical friend has put doubt into my mind, and I thought I would come here and see what ages other people's kids read/ appreciated Sophie's World- we would at least be discussing it weekly. The other possibility is to do it as a read aloud with both my kids- my younger will be 13 by then- and have even more discussion. I think my younger might be more "philosophically inclined" actually. What do you think?

I didn't mean to completely put down the remedial outlining books- I just dont think they are needed for most kids, and I seem to remember in TWTM they were recommended for children who have difficulty, not for everyone. That was more my point- if your child actually does have distinct difficulty, then they may be good, but you don't need to anticipate difficulty. I do think that years of oral and written narrations help with outlining, because they help a child put the main essence of the narrative in their own words. I would have them do oral narrations at least if they haven't, before starting with outlining. But I taught my son outlining simply by going over passages of writing, paragraph by paragraph, with him, and asking him to tell me what the main point or essence of the paragraph is about. (That is not the same as trying to summarise the whole paragraph into one sentence, by the way). Now, he might get a different answer to what I would give, but overall, he was pretty good. So then I would help him write that in a full sentence. After several sessions of us doing it together, he was fine at doing it himself. I think it might be inherently satisfying for a reluctant writer to put something wordy into a succinct sentence, so he has never complained about outlining, while he does complain about other writing. I think, Colleen, I just kept helping until my son got the gist. There is no magic formula and yes some paragraphs are harder than others. Sometimes I would find it hard myself. That can be more about what you are outlining than the process out outlining. Somewhere SWB (maybe on that online conference months ago? ) mentioned using library books for outlining. She never said use SOTW that I have seen, and I tried SOTW and didn't like it much for outlining. I have used books that have lots of subheadings and clear paragraphs without too much information in them. I actually used a book for Australian history, rather than our World history, to teach outlining, because this particular book seemed ideal, and it was. I also moved pretty quickly to 2 level outlining because this book seemed ideal to do that with, as have subsequent books I have used. I tend to do parallel history streams, and my son outlines for Australian history and writes narrations, reports etc for World history. Not sure if that helps.

I love that idea. I am reading Joan of Ark by Mark Twain at the moment- I don't know if she would be a mystic, but I guess she qualifies since she was sainted! Apparently it was Twain's work he considered his masterpiece- it's very readable and my 12 and 14yos will be reading it next year. I was playing some gothic chants by Hildergard just yesterday!

Some of Charlotte Mason's ideas are good for this. Keeping lessons short so that you train the child to focus, then you change teh subject to something completely different so that the mind is refreshed. Keep the school day short so that there is plenty of time ofr fun. 5 is awfully young- they wouldn't be in school here.

I am reading my kids' books for next year and getting to read lots of great books! I am reading Joan of Ark by Mark Twain at the moment, as well as Sophie's World, and the Sword and the Stone. Another place to look for classics and good books is the Ambleside highschool list, HEO (which is on the Ambleside site). They use a lot of Classics.

Well, I obviously have way too much time and money because I have tried just about everything I have wanted to :) I am curious about Teaching Textbooks though. And I have wondered if I could make Apologia books work for me, but as I am secular and they are not cheap, I have never bought them to try. The packages don't appeal to me at all- I am way too much of a do-it-yourself, mix and match gal.

Well, just to put in my 2 cents, I bought those two books expecting to have trouble with my reluctant writer when he started outlining, but I did find the books fluff. In the end, it seemed like a waste of time, and teaching outlining in 5th grade straight from a book was not difficult at all, it turned out. However, I wouldn't recommend outlining from Kingfisher, and I believe SWB no longer recommend that either (I read it somewhere!). The paragraphs are already very condensed, it is not easy to outline from. Many people on these boards have found alternatives over the years I have been here, after having difficulties with KHE.

I buy and own a lot of stuff, but it's not so bad I don't know what I have! If it got that much, I would sell some of it.

I have read SWB saying somewhere that all modern interpretations of Classical are neo-Classical. Whether she would include Drew's approach in that, I am not sure. It's all debatable, although I know the Latin Centred approach that Drew has designed is "traditional classical", its still "neo" in the sense that it uses modern books and is another approach which is another "new" approach, although it tries to be more truly "classical" in the traditional sense. As for the OP, I am not sure I would call it classical- more traditional or eclectic. Classical is a lot more than a booklist, though, so a mere booklist doesnt really show enough to say whether it is a classical approach or rules it out. I do tend to think Latin and/or Greek are fairly important to a Classical education of any sort, but for how long? Does doing 2 years of Latin mean that you are still doing "Classical" the rest of the time? Gee, I am certainly not one to say. And, although it is interesting to me, I stopped caring a while back and am happy to be following my heart, whatever its called.

I did think that not having toy guns etc would make my boy less violent and a peaceful thing. I was resolute about that before I had kids. Before he could even walk, literally, he would crawl on the back lawn and pick up sticks and shoot with them. It's got to be in the genes! I didn't account for that! Also, until I had my 2nd child, I had no idea just how incredibly unique each child is- and how little that has to do with upbringing. If i had only had one child, I would never have had the compassion I do for other parents- my first was a happy, easy baby who would go to everyone and everyone told me what I wonderful, natural mother I was. Then came number 2! Whoa, there went that theory! Crying from birth, wouldnt go to anyone, clingy, highly emotional- but this child made me soooo patient and tested me so much, and made me so much more empathic for other parents with difficult kids- and I wouldn't swap him or the whole experience of being his parent for anything :)

Pretty similar I think, although I love that here I can take my time to articulate a response rather than just kick myself for what I could have said, which is more as it is IRL.

I get plenty of social time, adult time and alone time, so those aren't issues for me. This week, my main issue is that my husband, on his non working days, wants to be with and around us, but it's not working and it's causing problems. He doesn't teach the kids, and is not involved much in the education side of things. For weeks now he has been doing jigsaw puzzles in the schoolroom,(the same 3 over and over and over- and he wont let the kids help) but its right where we do our read alouds, and he refuses to make space for us, for the kids to sit on the sofa, so I called him on it, and now he feels rejected. The truth is, it's easier when he is not around, while we are trying to get our work done. And I don't know how to deal with the fact that he wants to be around but is annoying to have around. In the past I have been very clear and direct about it, but even that doesn't seem to be working. So, that is my issue this week.

Dd14 works from 8.30 (8 if you could music practice) till sometime in the early afternoon. Altogether she works about 23 hours a week, I worked out. Some days it kind of drags into the mid afternoon, but today we finished by 12 and were all amazed.

1. The kids are up at 7am, either voluntarily or because I wake them. Dd14 showers in the morning, ds12 showers in the evening. This week: ds12 is taking care of the rabbits, all bins, own washing. dd14 is doing the chickens, all dishes, and own washing. Some of these chores rotate. 2.&3. School starts with music practice at 8am, and then sit down work at 8.30. We work till we finish, with short breaks for snacks, usually around 1pm- sometimes they finish later with their independent reading, in their rooms after lunch, or in the evening. No time for lunch unless the day is particularly dragging- lunch is usually after school finishes. If we do have lunch before school has finished, it is short, just enough time to eat usually. This way, we finish earlier and they have more free time. I didn't used to do it this way, but I think we all prefer it now. 4. Mondays, 12-3pm is our coop- drama and sport. Fridays there are two science classes, one for each child- unfortunately this takes all day as one is from 9.30 till 11, the other from 12-1.30. Annoying, but the classes are very good and the kids get a really good social time in a park, and sometimes catch up on schoolwork, while they wait for their class. 5. I prefer a 5 day week but with our science on Fridays, and losing part of Monday, it ends up being more like a 4 day. However, I make sure we do 5 days of Maths at a minimum. I seem to be able to manage 4 days with everything but maths.

You are right- no, they don't. However, I still use them, and I add grammar to them, and separate writing. I like them, for this season, because they cover things I find it hard to consistently get to or plan, (copywork, dictation, some grammar, art appreciation, some creative writing, this morning my son wrote a business letter etc), all of which my ds12 still benefits from, and yet they are very light, don't take much time, so they are easy to add to. I must say I am impressed with the creative course that basically makes up the Queen's Highschool book. It has editing in it too, which I don't care for, and dictation passages which I substitute, but the creative writing course has been very inspiring for my creative writer, dd14. It has taken her places no other course has (it's not often she raves about a curriculum!).

I hadn't thought of this before but I think it is very valid. Some of grammar is memory work, and it is easy to do it in the younger years- and it does make it less of a chore, and less time consuming, when they are older and needing that foundation to write. I do think the more advanced grammar is very abstract and harder to understand until later- but the basic stuff can be taught easily when younger. In the end, I am not sure its an issue I would die on. People do it both ways, you just have to follow what works for your family.

I sympathise! You will get there! We haven't really implemented the "all the dishes alternate weeks" thing until this year, although they have been doing plenty before then. Of course your kids are too little! I do recommend somehow doing dishes straight after meals as a habit. I mean, you have to do them some time- postponing doesn't get rid of them, and it is nice to wake up to a clean kitchen. But, you have younger kids than me- sometimes you just do what you have to do to get through. It does get easier. :)

10pm is my bedtime. Last night it was 9.30pm because the previous few nights I had been waking up unreasonably early- 4am, 5am- and I was short on sleep. Early nights are the best way to catch up for me, since I dont naturally sleep in, and this morning I slept in till 6am! I do love the early morning quiet, and when I went to school I had to be up very early so i sort of got into the habit. But I have plenty of time to myself during the day, even while the kids are doing school- the kids are older now. When they were little, I would get sleep whenever I could. Since I don't lack "me" time, I don't feel the need to stay up late. In fact I love going to bed after the kids have gone to bed, and curling up with a book till i am too tired to read anymore. My kids go to bed at 8pm and read. Husband works evenings.

My kids do the kitchen in the evenings. We don't go to bed on a messy kitchen. I get up before everyone, but I don't set an alarm- yuk. I just go to bed early enough that I have had enough sleep and I wake up naturally. For me, thats about 10pm-6am. I get the kids up at 7am. I also have an afternoon rest/nap.

I am kind of envious. Both mine detest textbooks with a passion, and much prefer the literature approach. Some days it seems it would be so much easier to hand over the textbooks and tell them to get on with it. Grass is always greener :)

I think my son was later than normal but I cant remember the specific age. He is 12 now and still likes me to dress him sometimes :) And he won't do up buttons even now- I walk over to him every night and do up the buttons on his PJs which he would otherwise not do himself. Some kids find it harder than others, i think, and I am pretty sure ds did, and does, for that matter.

yep, I am do the next thing, pretty much, even though I am with Flylady. I have some good routines in the kitchen, and I do get to everything, but its not as regular or scheduled as many people seem to manage. I do try and vacuum on Saturdays, but there are no other days I try and do specific things.