Please bear with me. I found this so fascinating. (I've never read the book (never heard of) the book Tina quoted from) Could you explain more about this? How do you use the Great Books as a tool to teach "wisdom and virtue" rather than just teaching the books because they are an important part of our collective culture? I understand from the little amount of literature study we have done since we started hs'ing that we naturally analyze characters - their motivations, their actions, their philosophies - against our own beliefs. Maybe I'm wrong but this sounds like a huge step beyond that. Thanks! Rhonda

I can see why those of us who really like WTM but struggle to implement all aspects of it stay here. After all, WTM ruined our lives! We know too much to go back to the other way and we know too little to do it the way we really want to!!! So we hang out here and keep trying to do a better job than we did last year. Yes, I do in some ways feel like WTM has ruined my life!!! ;) How awful to realize how completely inadequate my own education was. And yet, I still struggle to feel like I'm making good educational choices for my kids when the "Abeka" kids call mine at 10:00 am every morning FINISHED WITH SCHOOL!!! And, I have to admit, they'll probably support themselves and their families just fine. It is hard to remember that vision I have glimpsed here from certain posters that education isn't about financial success, but about building a life. I guess that's why I come *here*, because this is the only place that feeds that vision. You just expressed it so well! :)

There are review problems in the tm for each lesson, and three suggested tracks - telling you which problems to assign, so there's no guess work. And, there are "skill check" problems to do together before assigning the work. I usually go over the lesson with my ds, but there have been times when he's had to read the lesson himself, and he hasn't had trouble understanding it. Oh, there's also a suggested schedule (number of class periods per chapter) in the tm to help you stay on track time-wise. I know others use Lial's Basic College Math, but when it got here, I knew the format would not suit my son. I like bju because it keeps the same style of lesson as what we've been using. but, you can get the bcm very cheaply on amazon ($8-12), so you might want to get just for a look-see! hth, Rhonda

since R&S 8 is the equivalent of pre-algebra, why not use it next year? Then, perhaps with a bit more time and maturity behind her, she'll be more receptive to a more video or computer-interactive program for algebra. I do realize it would be nice to get her "used to it" before you hit algebra, when you kind of feel like you better have your ducks in a row. But, I would choose a solid foundation for now, with a transition later at algebra. Best wishes! Rhonda

You could use the lists in WTM for read-alouds. Just pick from both the grammar and logic sections. That's what we did (in addition to the SL read-alouds). It really was the best of both worlds! the coville shakespeare books are beautiful!!!!! I would think you could just use whatever your library happens to have for the other recs, skipping whatever isn't there. But search amazon for coville's books to see what all is available. sorry my shift key has decided not to work! Rhonda

I don't know how your math is set up. But, if you have "sets" of problems that go together, you could start by doing all but one problem of each set together, then have him finish the page on his own (either then, or later - I like later because then my ds can start "fresh" rather than bored). Gradually increase the number of "undone" problems until you are confident that you've reached that magic balance of knowing that he is getting the support he needs to learn, but is capable of working independently toward complete mastery. This is similar to what I've done with Grammar. (Oh, I also usually do the writing for the first one or two of each set, then let him do the rest of the writing while we work together.) hth, Rhonda

nt

Core 6 was *perfect* for my 6th grader, and I may have my younger ds go through it in 6th grade as well. However, just from my own experience.... I was told I would be able to combine my 6th grader and 3rd grader last year, and this just did not work, even with the 3rd grader using different readers. It simply moved too quickly (though I guess if you were going to slow it down, then that's not a concern), and the Read-alouds were overwhelming to him. The readers (and Read-alouds) contain quite a bit violence, some s*x (tho' not explicitly narrated), and dark themes (children making their way through un-child-friendly places alone). My 3rd grader cried and cried after one book (which was *really* a good book), so I bought core 1+2 for him. But, I wouldn't recommend 1+2 because it just goes so quickly at the end, it was confusing to *me*, and we ended up just not doing the last 4 weeks at all. Using two cores was *not* difficult, because I didn't tweak them in any way, except that I expected my 6th grader to do written narrations or outlines rather than just discussing his history reading. and, I really liked core 6, so I hope you understand, I'm not bashing it. It just has it's place. It really gives you lots of topics to discuss with your middle-schooler that they happen to be contemplating, and helped bring us closer together in addition to being a fun trek through history. hth, Rhonda

try this: http://wtmboards.com/HSboardOct242007/messages/1239.html Her daughter received college credit for completing Alpha-Omega's SOS Spanish. On another thread from the old board, someone suggested that you could use 1/2 of SOS Year 1 as your "Spanish 1" and then the second half as "Spanish 2". But, because it seems so meaty, I'm hoping we can do a year of Rosetta Stone (it can't be any less rigorous than *my* Spanish 1 in high school - LOL!). Then, after mastering some of the vocabulary and having a "feel" for it, we'll switch over to the SOS Spanish and I'll use their "Year 1" as my "Spanish 2". (clear as mud?) But, all that's tentative and untested! Rhondabee

nt

Beth, I'm beginning to think maybe I should just generate an automatic "Me, too!" after all your posts - :p! Rhonda

4th gr and 7th gr ds's like to draw, but they haven't really had any real training. (We tried the Thomas Kinkade LifePac, and didn't get very far.) I was looking at the 5th grade level. Would this be an okay level for a beginning student without being "too young" for my older son (who'll be 8th grade next year)? I did like that it seemed to have both drawing and painting. (I also liked that it seemed easy-to-do for mom!) Thanks! Rhonda

nt

nt

my 10yo son has "fast" days and "slow" days, and it doesn't seem to be influenced by diet, amount of sleep, amount of exercise, or any particular method of mine, or where I let him do his work (or, "think" about his work - LOL!). Sometimes we have a few fast days in a row, and I'm tempted to think, "Oh, I'm such a good teacher!" But, then we have a week of slow days, and my theory is confirmed: he is a 10yo boy! I do expect him to finish his work. However long it takes is up to him. One caveat: If I *know* he didn't sleep well or if I'm *sure* he's not feeling well, I may just sit and do all of his work with him. Takes more time from me, but that way I don't feel like a total crab of a mom! :)

IOW, I admit I may "seem" smarter than the average bear (just thinking back to school and now as I try to find a group of women I "fit with", which is another post all together :rolleyes:). But, I'm *not* really exceptionally or gifted-ly smart. I simply care about learning. And I *want* to be smart. I *wanted* to be an A+ student (without cheating I may add). And I was willing to work REALLY hard to be so. My kids.......oh......not so much. Phlegmatic to the core, baby!!! Any grade is "good enough" as long as they don't have to work too hard to get it - LOL! I push and I cajole and I pull to get out of my oldest what I get out of him. I wonder how I will find the energy to continue pushing him when he seems to be getting stronger and I seem to be getting weaker every day. I worry about our relationship as mother and son being overshadowed by our relationship of teacher and pupil. OTOH, I worry that if I *don't* push, then academically I might as well have put him in public school for high school, so why should I continue homeschooling ..... and round and round it goes....:) So, I have these books ordered as a start. I'm hoping they're more engaging than the Norton Anthology versions I looked at briefly last night! But at least if I read the books, whatever we do will be decided from a place of knowledge and not from fear. I really detest making my decisions based on fear! Off to tackle our "good books" for the rest of the year! Rhonda

What I mean is this: I have been looking at program after program after program for high school because the fact is other than the bible, some stories from the Odyssey in high school (in a lit book), maybe a touch of Oedipus (same lit book), and our logic study of literature (abridged Gilgamesh, Iliad, Odyssey, Aeneid), I have NO CLUE about any of the other "classics" on the Ninth Grade list. So, it seems really ludicrous for me to just blindly go about picking which books will supposedly make up a well-rounded classical ancient lit course. Do you think the ones who "pioneered" with the first version of WTM actually had some knowledge of these books? I always imagine that people *really* doing WTM must either be genius-y smart, have kids who are genius-y smart, or who somehow just received a much, much better education than I did. It's hard to imagine a normal mom with average kids pulling this off. BUT, as I was about to post earlier, I caught myself thinking, "I just don't have TIME to read all those books." But, yeah, I do. Really. (Well, at least I'd rather *read* than *clean*!!!) So, I've ordered the Gilgamesh, Iliad and Oedipus from amazon. Thank you for the kick I needed to *do* something about solving my ignorance problem rather than just looking for some miracle-curriculum to do that for me. :)

I have to admit I had to stare for a minute at your "reasoning" behind 17-8. :o Then I paniced and thought, "OK, what *is* 17-8?!?!?!" (What a day! First it's seeing all the homeschoolers at the library with kids who actually browse for their own books and sit quietly at tables and make notes ~ then it's come to the K-8 boards to find that I've completely lost all sense of subtraction. I think I'm going to bed. :rolleyes:) :)

And, the more I push for speed, the slower he goes....so I just quit worrying about it. I don't know if that's the most sage advice, but I just know in my heart that if I push this child past a certain point, it is counterproductive. So, I strive for accuracy and know that with daily practice the speed will surely come. Occasionally, we do time a facts sheet just as a "Wow - do you think you could do this whole page in 3 minutes?" special challenge activity that is only rewarded for how much is accomplished, not "graded" as "not good enough yet". I don't want to make it a point of daily contension. (I'm not sure how Calculadders works) Best wishes! Rhonda

Is it true that Catholics see the Pope as "Christ incarnate" on earth - that this is why he is "infallible"? I am assuming now that this is just yet another myth, since no one here has mentioned this. (Please know that momof7 is my dear friend, and I know that Christ lives in her. Since I know these threads upset her, and she may not be back, I decided to ask you instead - but my question is sincerely an effort to remove my own ignorance.) Thanks! Rhonda

I have the 20th Century book here already, and I've used it. But, I much prefer to get the "real" books from the library. You are probably right, though, about the pure convenience of it all. (Not to mention the library somehow didn't "get" two books I'm sure I returned two weeks ago.) I have a lot of the books here already, too. But, I'm definitely interested in getting the non-book items with the IG. Were you able to get any of those? Thanks! Rhonda

I'm excited! :)

how your oldest is doing with Core 6 this year? Specifically, since he had already read (or listened) to SOTW-1, is he put off by going through it again? (I really doubt my younger ds would remember it, anyway. He just figured out *today* ~ while studying the Industrial Revolution ~ that we've been going through history "from the beginning". He felt it was important I know this - LOL!) Thanks! Rhonda

DD will be 3yo in June. I'd like to have a little bit more for her next year. I know this isn't scheduled out like a regular SL IG, but I admit it looks like fun! Of course, next thing you know I'll be wanting to combine SL with BFIAR ~ which I've been looking forward to for 2 1/2 years :p. Ugh - it never gets easier, does it? :)

So, I am no real help. It looks like all of Chapter 9 is dealing with adjective phrases and clauses vs. adverb phrases and clauses. And then Chapter 10 is going to use that info to teach comma usage. So, I think I would consider doing the writing lessons only for a while, or maybe Chapter 11. (Just get away from phrases and clauses for a bit somehow.) Then, after some "fresh air", head back to Chapter 9. You might even look at using the R&S English Handbook. Read through the pages dealing with phrases and clauses, and let him keep the book handy for when he has a question. Our problem area was tenses and not changing tenses when switching between passive and active voice. I just kept going in the book, and then when we reviewed it, looked back at the original lessons, made (some more) charts, and prayed. (I think we took a whole day to do the Oral Review and the Written Reviews.) Somehow we got it that second time through. I'm sure your guy will get it eventually, too! Best wishes! Rhonda