At 2 different scholarship interview weekends, dd's courses were specifically mentioned. One they asked her all kinds of questions about bc they were intrigued. So I know at least 2 read them.

My dyslexic loved AoPS. By the time he was using AoPS, he didn't have difficulty reading. He just read very slowly. (He still does.) He also has never had comprehension issues. None of my 3 dyslexics have. (Spelling, otoh, yikes!)

Can you point out where I said there was an attack on homeschooling? Being concerned that there could be a shift in the future is not "alarmist." From my POV, the attitude that homeschooling laws will never change toward greater restrictions is presumptuous. Being aware of issues currently being discussed is prudent. That article is an example. Fwiw, your POV is very different from mine. We are not going to find any point of agreement. I find the author of that article's comparison of homeschool transcripts to the equivalent of a cat applying to college a direct attempt to raise questions about homeschooling, especially when the focus of the article was about homeschool applicants and not fraud. (There was never any issue about the qualifications of homeschool applicants, yet that is what ended up being discussed. The real issue was fraud committed by a non-homeschooler.) Fwiw, in terms of the bolded, again a difference in perspective bc by my definition not many more is more. Obviously, we do not agree. At this point there is nothing else to discuss bc you think there is not an issue and I do.

I would get the SM over the TE.

I do not believe the motivation behind the article was to encourage admissions to continue doing what they have already been doing. Fwiw, the quote was not from an admissions officer at UR. From my perspective, I consider requesting or expecting any additional info not required from all applicants as hoop jumping. If LOR or subject tests are required from all applicants, I have no problem with them being requested. When additional requirements are placed on homeschoolers that aren't required by all applicants, I do have a problem with it. (And there are schools that already do that. URichmond is one of them.) That is what I don't want to see an increase in.

What external validation? SAT or ACT scores required by almost all students? That is all that is required by the vast majority of schools. Subject tests? Most don't require subject tests. The ones that do are typically competitive top schools and even then they typically request 2 (and often ask for them from ps students as well.) In terms of the linked article, the article demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of homeschooling and homeschool transcripts. I print my kids' transcripts on my home printer. The big deal they are raising the alarm about is nothing more than someone inputting data and generating a print out via a company transcript maker, nothing more. There is no validation from transcript companies. It is no different than if I printed a transcript for a cat off of my home printer. It is this point that is concerning, "What Is the Risk? So if Rochester received a fake transcript, and one can easily create one, is that a major risk with regard to homeschooled applicants? The issue matters as the number of children being homeschooled has been going up. An Education Department report in 2012 found that the number of homeschooled students was about 1.8 million and increasing." You may not find the rest of the article as concerning, but as someone who had a Dd accepted to UR last yr, I know that everything stated in the rest of the article is already required by UR. The issue was not simply the transcript maker's fake transcript. The issue was an entirely created false persona. Admissions officers know that those "extras" (course descriptions, textbook lists, etc) are already being submitted. So what are they asking themselves if this happened with those already being required? (My concern.) Fwiw, this wasn't some blog piece. It was published in Inside Higher Ed which focuses on college and university issues and those at those institutions are their target audience. Fwiw, my Dd submitted the following to UR: the transcript printed off my home computer, my course descriptions which included resources used, my counselor letter, my school profile, 2 letters of recommendation, an SAT score, math and Latin subject test scores and a cal CLEP score (she didn't take any APs and only had the cal CLEP score when she applied) and a list of outside honors and achievements. All of her grades were assigned by me with the exception of Russian(her only real outside course when she applied.) Those 2 subject tests were simple to take and were not required by any other school she applied to. (UR does not recognize CLEP. ) In termsof her applications in general, she was invited to numerous competitive scholarship competitions, was awarded scholarships from every school she applied to, and was one of 20 students awarded her current university's top scholarship. They didn't reject what was done in our home or ask for other proof that what I said we did was actually done. I suspect when you read outside validation you interpret what that means differently than I do.

When more homeschoolers are willing to accept that accreditation is no big deal and simply accept it as a premise when it is not required, the more likely that eventually that is a real possibility and will be seen as the norm and be expected by colleges. Who will protest otherwise if the vast majority already accept it? At this point, there is not a call to require being overseen by an accrediting body, but that does not mean it will always remain that way. Believe it or not, there are those who want to control homeschoolers and limit their access and revoke many of the freedoms that have been gained over the past 3-4 decades. When people willing give them up without question or without even seeing it as a relinquishing of freedoms, that is where I wonder how long things will take to shift toward more regulation. Here is a simple example of a call to regulate homeschoolers due to fraud committed by a non-homeschooler. The fact the fraud was not associated with a homeschooler but the call is to regulate homeschoolers is troubling. https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2017/09/11/revoked-admissions-offer-rochester-raises-questions-about#.WbnxzIdikVw.Facebook Long and short of it is that when homeschoolers accept unnecessary regulation as expected and required when it isn't (already the case in terms of believing the necessity of outsourcing to co-ops and online courses), I agree with the pt Hood was making that it is concerning. Why does my concern bother you so much? From what I understand based on these posts, more regulation and requiring accreditation would not significantly impact the way you are teaching your kids since you want to be aligned with public schools. For our family, control would significantly impact in a negative way how we approach education. I don't want my freedom to educate in a manner not at all similar to B&M schools jeopardized. You don't see an issue. I do. Only the future will reveal whether or not my concerns are valid or not. I will be thrilled to be proven wrong. I hope you are right.

These are questions we asked about in general, not hammering out specific details. Some of the medicine options that dd has been given include injections that are mailed on dry ice. After living in Brazil and knowing how long things can take to clear customs, you don't want medicine that costs a lot of money going bad b/c it hasn't been received in a timely manner. (Not to mention not receiving bc it is needed!) We haven't investigated in depth, but we were assured by SA offices that they are used to helping students arrange access to their medications. So I agree with suggestion above that the first place to start is the SA office.

E-check.

And from my perspective, that statement pretty much sums up the entire issue.

Can you please explain what you mean? Acceptable how? I am trying to understand your posts, but I am having a hard time following them. In your first post you stated that it wasn't concern about the quality of their home courses, but in the first part I bolded it does seem to be a concern about the home equivalent course. In terms of the italicized, can you please point out where I said I had a problem with people personalizing their children's educations? What I said and what I firmly believe is that outsourcing because it is what is wanted is not the equivalent of outsourcing out of fear that what is done at home is not going to be accepted by colleges. It is a backward step in viewing homeschooling as a legally valid option. Homeschooling transcripts are accepted at the vast majority of colleges. Homeschool "schools" marketing has sold a false sense of security that without them, classes are not validated and that outsourcing to them brings "credibility" to your homeschool. As noted in Evanthe's post below, outsourcing and accreditation really doesn't make that much of a difference. All non-traditional school applications are thrown into the same category. In terms of the last bolded statement, I have been homeschooling since the early 90s and in multiple different states. The way things have worked in the vast majority of the locations we have lived in is that entering into ps before high school has typically been a matter of entering in at the age appropriate grade level. What was used at home, outsourced classes, online classes, etc....it is really moot from the school's perspective. The kids usually enter in on grade level. Entering ps during high school is all about the credits and what they don't accept as accredited credits aren't accepted. It doesn't matter what you used or where you outsourced unless they are accepted accredited credits. If parents want to outsource classes bc that is what fits their academic needs more, then they should. But, parents should make informed decisions based on fact and know that they can teach classes at home and have successful outcomes. My focus these days is primarily on high school. I give homeschool to college workshops and I talk to parents all the time who think that their kids' co-op or Classical Conversation courses are going to be more "valid" on their students' transcripts than if they had "just" completed courses at home. That premise is just false. That is the mentality I am discussing. They have heard that those classes look better on a transcript and that they will make their students look stronger. My question for them is look better compared to what and stronger than who? Homeschoolers are not a single unit. Every homeschool applicant is assessed individually based on what they individually achieved. For some people, what is done at a co-op or Classical Conversations may be stronger than what they would do at home, but that does not make the statement a general truth. Many parents have a hard time believing that courses done completely at home with no outside teacher could ever be viewed as academically advanced courses better than a co-op or Classical Conversations. It is a foreign concept to them. Exactly. The irony of today's homeschooling reality is that public high schools, some trade programs like cosmetology schools, and some direct entry low level jobs have way more problems with homeschool transcripts/diplomas than the vast majority of colleges and universities, even tippy top competive universities. My kids have all pursued post-high school education. If I had a student wanting to attend cosmetology school, I honestly don't know what my answer would be bc you are correct, there are a few situations where a homeschool diploma will limit options. But, my kids have all been college bound. My teaching them at home, even when we haven't done much outsourcing at all, has not negatively impacted their college applications and has not limited their options. When my current college freshman applied to colleges, she had only outsourced Russian since 9th and worked with a Francophone 1 day/wk during 11th and the beginning of 12th. Every other subject was completed at home, no co-ops, no online schools, etc. She was accepted to every school she applied to and was awarded competitve scholarships from several. That is what parents I talk to find hard to believe. They have been repeatedly told by others that kids cannot get into college with transcripts like my dd's. Yes, they can. Not only can they, but they can be accepted into competitive schools with scholarships. (While the entire college application process is far more complicated than that synopsis, the take away is that just bc a course is outsourced, it is not automatically viewed as superior.) Equally, I have outsourced plenty of courses for my kids over the yrs. I am not against outsourcing and that is not my point. (My other current college student outsourced almost all math and science during high school.) The key is that parents should make sure they are educated on their own state's laws and educate themselves on college admissions in their state. Some state public university admissions are more complicated than others; NY and CA, for instance, do have more obstacles to college admissions than most other states.

K12 schools are not going to accept an online homeschool provider course or co-op class any more than one completed at home except possibly (and even then there is no guarantee) if the course is accredited by specific accrediting agencies. Fwiw, community colleges and colleges are far more likely not to care about the source of high school courses than public high schools. I do not think colleges see any difference between a co-op class, an online homeschool provider class,and a home-brewed class. Colleges want to see test scores. They want to see course descriptions/resource lists. They want recommenders. If someone is unsure about homeschooling through high school, they need an alternative plan than homeschooling part of high school and then entering the public high school unless they have confirmed ahead of time that the public school will allow students to enter at the appropriate level if they used "provider x,y,z." I'd want that confirmation in writing.

I agree that the article is poorly written and lacks focus. I do, however, have concerns about the trend today for homeschoolers to believe that they need to have their homeschool "validated" by outsourced classes. It has nothing to do with Christianity (and I totally do not understand her argument there and I am a Christian). My perspective has everything to do with homeschooling being a legally valid option. If it is legally valid, then high school classes taught at home are legally valid. The growing belief within the homeschooling community that colleges need proof that your classes are worth something undermines the validity of the homeschooling premise. Outsourcing bc you want to is different from outsourcing bc you believe you have to. It is a fine line, but the perspective is very different. I outsource when it is the best choice for my kids. I do not, however, believe I need to outsource for college admissions. Believing the premise that colleges must perceive that what you are doing at home must automatically be inferior to outsourced classes is a huge step backward in my opinion. I homeschool precisely bc what I am doing at home is a better fit for my kids. And typically that "fit" is academically superior. I refuse to submit to any premise that my classes are lacking bc I am the primary teacher. That attitude used to be the dominant one I encountered in the homeschool community. Now it is definitely in the minority.

Foerster's text includes tests at the end of the chapters. I am currently using it with my 10th grader and all we use is the textbook and I have a solutions manual.

I am completely unfamiliar with BYL, so I have no idea its depth or level. I personally would want an actual math textbook and would use Khan as a supplement vs core, but I admit to being a math snob and am very selective about what I am willing to use for math. As Lori pointed out, as long as writing is being covered somewhere, what Lori has posted looks adequate. Fwiw, if a ps teacher or a parent only familiar with ps asked me what I used for school, they would probably stick their nose on the air and smirk and be 100% convinced that my kids were not being well-educated bc my approach to education is not easily quantified by a list of resources. For example, my 2nd grader's primary educational instruction comes from me just sitting with her and directly teaching her without a guide. I have taught 2nd grade so many times by now and this particular child is quite gifted that I just teach. So, no textbooks other than math. That would be my "list." But, she knows subjects, verbs, nouns, adjs, and advs from playing games and interacting with words and sentences. Her spelling for a 2nd grader is excellent. She loves to read, etc. From an outsider's brick and mortar school perspective via a list, they would think she must not be learning anything. My insider's knowledge of what is actually happening knows that she is functioning significantly beyond a 2nd grade level. All that to say, I never compare what we are doing to a ps. We take an approach to education that doesn't resemble what they are doing in a classroom. What may appear as inadequate to an outsider bc it isn't quantified by textbooks and worksheets, I know is actually learning at a much higher cognitive level. If you are confident that your Dd is learning and mastering appropriate material, then I wouldn't worry about. The important issues are mastering content and learning how to think. There are innumerable ways to achieve those goals. Fwiw, my family originally disagreed deeply with my decision to homeschool. That insisted at was destroying their futures, etc. I have adult children now who have graduated from college or are in college. They all entered college more than prepared aand all of them have been top students with very high GPAs. My different approach obviously did not hurt their educations. Evaluate what you are doing compared to what you want her to accomplish. Keep your goals clearly in mind. Make sure she is progressing toward your end goals.

I have a ds with a late August birthday who started K at 5. I have a Dd with a late July birthday who started K when she turned 6. My Dd was delayed in a lot of minor things, nothing major, but just enough for me to decide to not push it. She functions perfectly on grade level for the red-shirted yr. It was a good decision for her. All the rest are grade level by birthday but academic work is strictly based on ability. Some have been multiple grade levels ahead by high school graduation.

William and Mary "We typically meet 100% of demonstrated financial need for in-state students, and through the William & Mary Promise, implemented in 2013, we reduced loans and increased grants for entering Virginians." UVA meets need. Washington and Lee, URichmond, Patrick Henry are all VA colleges that use the CSS profile. I am not sure if they meet full need or not.

I agree with your entire post. I wanted to share something in my personal life that highlights the truth of your statement. When we moved to Brazil, I didn't know a single word of Portuguese. But I longed to go to Mass every single day. I couldn't understand a single word said, but it didn't matter. I just wanted to be there with Eucharist, with Christ in His body, blood, soul, and divinity. It was a physical and spiritual connection that was not based on any words or anything else. It was the actual physical experience of the Mass and Eucharist. Unless you actually experience the sacraments than discussion is limited to an intellectual exercise. It is hard to explain "the real-ness of the reality" of sacraments, but your post pointed out a vital part of sacramental life that cannot be understood through just words.

I am sure you didn't intend your post to come across this way, but to be sure, there are plenty of intellectual students at state u's. My dd called me this morning and told me that last night she went to the French club's dinner table and they were debating the Catalonia referendum (obviously in French.) She is surrounded by professors who know her by name. She was even approached by one of her professors whose dd has young kids and asked if she would be at all interested in babysitting. My older kids had very similar personal/intellectual experiences on their respective large public U campuses. I suspect the difference is that kids who want to be wallflowers and simply attend class and not get involved can do so more easily on a large campus. But kids who want to engage and seek out those opportunities can find them and find "intellectual peers."

We originally got dd the 16 meal plan, but she isn't using 1/2 the swipes, so she is dropping down to 10 next semester.

If you want working on pencil grip, you can reverse the highlighter suggestion and write out the copywork in highlighter and she uses a pencil for tracing. She can also make it disappear. If you write the copywork with permanent marker on foil, a dry erase board marker makes it disappear as traced over.

I would classify it as an EC if it is being used to show commitment to activity outside of academics. I have included PE on my kids' transcripts depending on the state we have lived in and the colleges being applied to. Fwiw, apparently in the state we live in, taking CPR training and getting certified can count as 1/2 of a PE credit. So can first aid. So, by my reading that means those 2 courses alone count as a full PE credit. (Bizarre considering how few hrs it takes to earn those certificates. My kids have taken both in the past month, but no way I would count those 2 classes alone as a full credit or even a 1/2 credit, not even a P/F course like PE. I have to live by my own standards. ;) )

Engineering and physics were sooooooo much easier in terms of college and envisioning their futures for themselves. My other kids have had more of a struggle envisioning their long-term career goals. I am so happy our oldest Dd loves her career so much. It is certainly not a path she considered early in high school.

I think is where personality comes in to play. I have had 1 that liked that approach, but most of my kids prefer to get up at 5 and work until 8-9 at night if that is what it takes to have a completely free weekend. My dd who was incredibly ill in high school spread her classes out longer over the summer rather than lose her weekends. No right or wrong answer. I do think it is a good thing if kids can figure out how to manage their own time to fit everything they want in.

That is outrageous. He sounds like an arm-chair psychiatrist. Fwiw, not a single one of our other 7 kids is on the spectrum. A couple suffer from some mild anxiety (anxiety is our ds's biggest hurdle as an adult), but none are on the spectrum. Dh and I are not, either. Dh and our oldest ds (a different son) are both engineers. They are both as far from possessing spectrum traits as a person can get!