Tess in the Burbs Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 today, after 2 weeks off, we start back. he knew we were starting back. yet he sits and starts the whining. his whining can add a few hours to the day. I try to ignore it and move on but what gives? I promised he can dump the handwriting as soon as he finished the HWT cursive book. I don't care what he uses to write, but the headaches he gives me about it!!! he's 7. he's a boy who would rather do anything right now than school. and I hate that he hates it! he used to love school. he says he likes latin, history and science. okay, but I can't ignore math. or reading. or writing. I agree math is boring right now. we use Horizons and he's in a weird place...lots of review of facts. tomorrow he finally applies the borrowing he's been introduced to. multiplication(other than skip counting) is finally on the page. so I hope the change up will help. but it may hurt....it will be something HARD. I dont' want to push at this age but we really don't do all that much. my daughter did all her work and our group work in less than 2 hours today. my son hit 3 hours and we did lunch and now it's reading time. will pick up later to finish with him. what gives? he does one page of handwriting a day. 2 pages of ETC. one grammar page(usually 4 or 5 sentences with choices to choose from). not hard stuff. he can do all language arts in 10 minutes when he wants. how do you get them past this? ignore it? smile more? actually do less? he used to love school. :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Well, there was a thread on this ages ago that I found in my searching. Can't remember the terms, but you might search dawddling. ;) I think it's just built into some kids, honestly. I've been doing math and LA in the morning because I thought that's what I was "supposed" to do, and all it really seems to do is suck the life out. I'm going to do math first then a huge chunk of history for the rest of the morning. Dd rejoiced when she heard this, so I think I'm finally on track. We don't mind doing academics (LA, etc.) in the afternoon, so I think it will be ok for us. Oh, the other thing I'm doing is more physical fitness with her. I have her running laps every morning before school starts, and I tell her to come back happy and ready to work. If she doesn't come back happy and ready to work, she runs more laps. THAT has been a fabulous tool. Partly she was too inactive, and partly she just needed to get everything going. She wakes up slow and pokey, so the laps around the backyard perk her up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 We're having a little of that the last two days as well. I think some of it is just getting back into a routine after a long break. I always look on these times as an opportunity for character development. :D It's one thing if you think there are things that need to be changed or it you need to pare down subjects and build back to a work level. At age 7 I might do that and have a nice chat about work ethic and responsibility. At 11 I think he's pushing the boundaries to see what he can get out of and I'm not buying it today. We may be doing school until late today. :001_huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plucky Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 His work load seems fine. I think a lot of boys that age just don't like sitting down and doing schoolwork. You could try to bring in some more fun stuff, take more breaks, add some read alouds, etc. Mainly you just have to sit it out and not let him push your buttons (as long as the workload is not too much for him). You could add a reward system for completing work in a timely fashion without complaining. So many stickers can equal something fun like bowling or a fun computer gamer or something else you choose. This might help and then after awhile you can phase out the reward system. Both my boys went through this at that age. I think it's pretty common. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tree House Academy Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I have one of those! It is my youngest ds. He told me yesterday that he didn't care if I had to go to jail (asked me how long I'd be gone) if he didn't do school...he just didn't want to do school anywhere...ever. However, with much coersion, he does do it. He is the total opposite of my older who loves school and loves to learn! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tess in the Burbs Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 I was super nice today but I kept at it. He eventually finished his work and his attitude changed by the end.....it was almost 4 hours later(lunch included). I have a bible study for "honorable boys" that I started with him today. I also threw out the idea of him doing 'work' with Daddy...making some gardening boxes....and he was thrilled! so I guess I need to really find that "thing" that will get him motivated and want to get to when he's done with school. I was patient and it paid off today. but it was so hard. he even said he was slow :-( but then again he's always the last to get ready, last to finish eating....and last to finish his work. so I need to really focus on today and how patient I was able to be. not to rush. to realize the chores may happen in the afternoon..... thanks for the encouragement. it's always good to hear about other kids who also dwaddle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 :confused: Have you kidnapped my son? Wait, he's right here... are you me? OMG, we spent three hours, THREE HOURS, on math, yesterday. Let me write that again, THREE bleepitybleepin HOURS! on math. One worksheet, twelve review problems, THREE HOURS!!!!!! I will say, Drew does like handwriting to a point, he's proud of his new cursive skills, but there's enough whine included in that part of the day to make me worry about driving later. I told him, next time, one week vacation is all he gets. Today, we managed to get through the work by two :( I'm hoping that by next week we'll be back to having the afternoons free. I feel your pain. today, after 2 weeks off, we start back. he knew we were starting back. yet he sits and starts the whining. his whining can add a few hours to the day. I try to ignore it and move on but what gives? I promised he can dump the handwriting as soon as he finished the HWT cursive book. I don't care what he uses to write, but the headaches he gives me about it!!! he's 7. he's a boy who would rather do anything right now than school. and I hate that he hates it! he used to love school. he says he likes latin, history and science. okay, but I can't ignore math. or reading. or writing. I agree math is boring right now. we use Horizons and he's in a weird place...lots of review of facts. tomorrow he finally applies the borrowing he's been introduced to. multiplication(other than skip counting) is finally on the page. so I hope the change up will help. but it may hurt....it will be something HARD. I dont' want to push at this age but we really don't do all that much. my daughter did all her work and our group work in less than 2 hours today. my son hit 3 hours and we did lunch and now it's reading time. will pick up later to finish with him. what gives? he does one page of handwriting a day. 2 pages of ETC. one grammar page(usually 4 or 5 sentences with choices to choose from). not hard stuff. he can do all language arts in 10 minutes when he wants. how do you get them past this? ignore it? smile more? actually do less? he used to love school. :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 We went through a phase of this. I have countered it with having something good for him that he'll love at the end ("when you are done, Papa will take you swimming" [NB, clear this with Papa first!]). These aren't "treat" things, these are things he'd do anyway, and I just put them *right* after school work. If we are reading an exciting chapter book, I sometimes do a chapter between reading and math. On days when this isn't working I check into whether I'd moving ahead too fast, he's hungry, or sick. If the answer is no, I tell him firmly that he is wasting my time and he'll have to do some of my chores if he keeps this up. That usually works. I try not to feed into this misery. I don't want him to think he has my goat or that he deserves special treatment because he whines. I am rather bland about it. Not an excited "when you are done", but a flat-voiced announcement of what we will do after school work. Thankfully this is mostly past-tense. Now we are working on the "stop humming and sit still" gambit. I think he hopes it will be over sooner if he is so active I give up. Not a chance. Today he tried the "if you rub my back I'll work better" routine (he loves backrubs). He keeps pitching them, and I keep dodging them, I hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Sigh. I just told ds that I missed school and he said, "Not me. Couldn't we just have school.. never?" :001_huh: Oh well. So much for my enthusiasm :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I went through this phase with each of my older sons. (That doesn't necessarily make it a "boy thing", as I only have boys I can't compare.) I tried being nice, cajoling, bribing. . .what have you. What worked? More work. I got mean and nasty. I gave the children an assignment, and a timer. And I set that timer for PLENTY of time. If the child got their work done neatly, correctly, and without grumbling within that time, then they were free to go play until the timer went off. If even one of those things were not achieved I started assigning extra work. (On that specific subject.) i.e. one grumble = 1 extra worksheet; one messy turn-in = 1 extra worksheet; one math sheet not corrected = 1 extra worksheet. Took about 2 weeks. . .(Actually, it only took about 2 days to figure out the punishment, but to get the extra work done, and then to learn the reward took a bit longer.) And now, MANY years later, if I see dawdling, etc. I mention getting the timer. It straightens up rather quickly. I really don't like being a mean Mom / teacher, honest. But, when I figured out how much of MY time they were wasting because I was being nice. . .that did me in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in VA Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 If my child were taking 3 hours to do math, I think I'd get so irritated I might just pop! I don't know how to stay that patient. I think I'd take away 3 hours of screen time (or whatever is extra-fun), and I'd probably go to him at half an hour and yell threateningly. I just wanted to say I appreciate those parents who have figured out how to go beyond threats and punishment, and find something else that works--not that punishment isn't appropriate sometimes, but too often, when my boys were younger, punishment was first on the list of "parental strategies." Y'all are teaching me. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'd probably go to him at half an hour and yell threateningly. I just wanted to say I appreciate those parents who have figured out how to go beyond threats and punishment, and find something else that works--not that punishment isn't appropriate sometimes, but too often, when my boys were younger, punishment was first on the list of "parental strategies." Y'all are teaching me. Thanks. Oh, I do want to clarify this. When I heard a grumble, or what have you, I would say something along the lines of, "Oh, I'm sorry, I think I just heard a grumble, and I know we discussed how you should do your work. Here's your extra sheet (with a smile)." There was a period of screaming before I came up with the above tactic, and I really didn't like seeing that in myself. Also, I wanted them to see that they were doing this to themselves. (I was just following through.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friederike in Persia Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'll get out a timer for tomorrow and stop getting angry with my dd for all the above mentioned reasons! :auto: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tess in the Burbs Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 I don't know why/what/how, but today he did his work. when he didn't know something he nicely asked for my help. apparently he put his frustrations in his sister overnight so today she bawled the entire time b/c she forgot most of her math facts! :D so tonight I hope the frustration finds its way to another household. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 If my child were taking 3 hours to do math, I think I'd get so irritated I might just pop! I don't know how to stay that patient. I think I'd take away 3 hours of screen time (or whatever is extra-fun), and I'd probably go to him at half an hour and yell threateningly. I just wanted to say I appreciate those parents who have figured out how to go beyond threats and punishment, and find something else that works--not that punishment isn't appropriate sometimes, but too often, when my boys were younger, punishment was first on the list of "parental strategies." Y'all are teaching me. Thanks. I thought plenty of things. Oh, I thought about stapling his pants to the chair and glueing his eyes to the paper. I thought about screaming at the top of my lungs. I thought about systematically destroying his toys until he got the work done. Trust me... I thought about it. In reality, I fussed some, but just kept him there, no lunch, no potty breaks, no nothing. Thankfully, today, we were nearly done by lunch (he's dawdling over a history project, but that is a-okay with me). I think it was just the return from a break. Oh, but we did discuss no more two week vacations. I don't think we'll see one of those for a very long time to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristamaranatha Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'm new to this, but I hope you don't mind if I put in my 2 cents on something that might help based on the reading I've been doing. One great thing about the classical method of homeschooling is that it incorporates everything into a cohesive whole, as opposed to divided up the "subjects" as separate entities. You said that your son enjoys Latin, History and Science. Great! The areas he doesn't seem to like right now, Math Reading and Writing can be incorporated into those areas. I think the two main reasons for boredom with school are either not finding the work challenging enough, or not understanding the work in the first place. It sounds like your son may be in the first category, considering the repetition. To incorporate the subjects, try talking to him about how math is indispensable to science and let him work on science projects that incorporate math. For reading and history are wonderful together too because there are so many great books to read about historical figures. Some prefer the Charlotte Mason books for this. Latin and writing make likewise go together, having him write out his Latin vocab and phrases to memorize. Writing also incorporates into all other areas because of the work of writing down his science experiments and historical findings. If you mix it up a bit like this you may find a new zeal in him to do the work. (I also remember hating subjects I found irrelevant - I constantly asked my high school math teacher when I would ever need the information he was trying to teach us and I wasn't getting). I hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FO4UR Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I went through this phase with each of my older sons. (That doesn't necessarily make it a "boy thing", as I only have boys I can't compare.) I tried being nice, cajoling, bribing. . .what have you. What worked? More work. I got mean and nasty. I gave the children an assignment, and a timer. And I set that timer for PLENTY of time. If the child got their work done neatly, correctly, and without grumbling within that time, then they were free to go play until the timer went off. If even one of those things were not achieved I started assigning extra work. (On that specific subject.) i.e. one grumble = 1 extra worksheet; one messy turn-in = 1 extra worksheet; one math sheet not corrected = 1 extra worksheet. Took about 2 weeks. . .(Actually, it only took about 2 days to figure out the punishment, but to get the extra work done, and then to learn the reward took a bit longer.) And now, MANY years later, if I see dawdling, etc. I mention getting the timer. It straightens up rather quickly. I really don't like being a mean Mom / teacher, honest. But, when I figured out how much of MY time they were wasting because I was being nice. . .that did me in. You are my hero! I'm getting a timer!;):001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tess in the Burbs Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 Some of our children will simply require more patience and time to raise and teach, it's just who they are. My 8 y/o and oldest is a grumbler when it comes to anything he finds work. His love tank is also impossible to fill. I can relate to your frustration. He will grumble about anything he has decided to do or isn't leading. He needs constant praise and feedback, if you say nothing or wait to long to comment, he takes it as negative feedback. It's quite a fine line to keep him from setting the mood in the house or melting into a puddle. Somethings that have helped is to try to make wise use of his time. Are their materials you can combine? If he's writing fine, must you "finish the book" or could you combine handwriting with another subject such as spelling dictation sentences? If the HWOT book is boring, how about something like Draw Write Now for handwriting practice? For reading, is the reading level right or is he still struggling with phonics? Select topics that interest him as well as those you feel he should read. My dc mentioned here is also using Horizons math. School does not come easy for this child, it is work for him. When a child thinks they can't do something, they are less eager to do it, he immediately puts up a wall. I have to keep him focused, which means I have to demonstrate my focus being solely on school until our day is done. If he's dawdling, I ask him to bring his work to the table and I'll model one, watch him do a couple, and send him back. I'm in the same room with him the entire time, or he's be searching for toe fuzz or something. His tenseness goes up when his younger siblings finish school before him. I ask that they be respectful and not in his sight while he's working as it's a distraction. My middle ds has the same workload as he does (because I've added subjects), but finishes at least an hour earlier, but they are different kids, it's not fair to compare them. Also consider his personality and learning style, find ways to tweak what you have, your approach with him, bring some of his personal interest, and fun into school. this is a good reminder. his personality is different from his sister. she's one to get at it and go. he holds back and does EVERYTHING slower. thanks for the reminder that he may just need more individual attention day to day . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Oh man Christine, you are the woman!!! That's DEFINITELY going in my reportoire. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajjkt Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 My kids both fought and fought about handwriting. We are very new to home schooling (just started in August). I found two things helped - one is that I tried copywork and a Beatrix Potter copybook (google it) worked really well with improving the attitude rather than what I had been doing. Then I tried saying to the kids that the timer was on for ten minutes and I didn't care how much they got done, I only cared that they tried their best during this time. That improved things a lot. They still hate it, but it's not a fight now. I've told them that once I see that their handwriting is just as neat in all their school work as in their handwriting practice then I'll stop requiring them to do it. That won't happen any time soon, but it helped a bit for them to know where they stood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajjkt Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I find that the timer works wonders around here! I use both the 'finish before the timer goes off' and the 'see how long it takes you as the time counts up' methods here. Could you get him to read a non fiction book or a book he enjoys to help with reading? DD and DS both read me two pages of a novel (at the moment it is Little House in the Big Wood) each day as a read aloud. They both enjoy this book, so its not an argument. At the end of each week I re-read what they have read to me. My kids don't like encorporating games into schooling (I don't know why, but we always end up with melt downs and temper tantrums if I try to make a game out of it). Does your son like or not like games? Maybe this could be something to try. I hate those days that everything seems to drag. I find that these days are usually the days that the dc are trying to work out if they can get away with things or see if they push hard enough if they can get out of it. I hate power struggles and I'm not a very authoritative parent, but I have to stand my ground or I'll never get anything done later unless they choose to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bookmomma Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 today, after 2 weeks off, we start back. he knew we were starting back. yet he sits and starts the whining. his whining can add a few hours to the day. I try to ignore it and move on but what gives? I promised he can dump the handwriting as soon as he finished the HWT cursive book. I don't care what he uses to write, but the headaches he gives me about it!!! he's 7. he's a boy who would rather do anything right now than school. and I hate that he hates it! he used to love school. he says he likes latin, history and science. okay, but I can't ignore math. or reading. or writing. I agree math is boring right now. we use Horizons and he's in a weird place...lots of review of facts. tomorrow he finally applies the borrowing he's been introduced to. multiplication(other than skip counting) is finally on the page. so I hope the change up will help. but it may hurt....it will be something HARD. I dont' want to push at this age but we really don't do all that much. my daughter did all her work and our group work in less than 2 hours today. my son hit 3 hours and we did lunch and now it's reading time. will pick up later to finish with him. what gives? he does one page of handwriting a day. 2 pages of ETC. one grammar page(usually 4 or 5 sentences with choices to choose from). not hard stuff. he can do all language arts in 10 minutes when he wants. how do you get them past this? ignore it? smile more? actually do less? he used to love school. :-( I'm still struggling with the same issues. Some things I have found that help: 1. timer to complete work 2. bribery--"after school work, you can...(fill in the blank)" 3. thin out your lessons for the day if it's just not a good day--by that I mean, skip anything today that you can do easily tomorrow (I had to do this one today) 4. give him a nice long time out in his room. maybe he needs rest? 5. let him choose which lessons to do first, second, etc. 6. make jokes. my sons love to laugh, so when they're grumpy, I try to make them laugh, then we get back to work (this one works best) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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