Glucose Intolerance....(Pre-diabetic) Have questions!!

[Holly IN]

Hello

 

I know I asked this on the OLD board but now have no access to it because of the NEW board.

 

FIL and I had an arguement tonight over this. My ds has glucose intolerance. My fil is a diabetic. FIL doesn't go to a diabetic dr but my son does.

 

Here is what the dr said of my son: NO white sugar or sugar sub., no white flour...eat meat and veggies and very little carbs. Carbs needs to be complex only.

 

However fil doesn't agree with that. He said that is Atkins diet and it will kill a diabetic. He said you can eat anything but just have to take pills. I told him that we are trying to prevent that. He also said that white flour has nothing to do with sugar. ggrr!! He said that our diabetic dr is wrong and his is correct. His dr is General Practitioner. (he used to be my dr until I found out he is a crack)

 

I am at my wits end here.

 

I would like those of that take a more holistic approach to tell me who is correct here.

 

Why is protein bad for a diabetic? I have read that people have been able to reverse their problem by eating limited complex carbs, more meat and veggies.

 

HELP!

 

Holly

[Carol in Cal.]

"Reversing Diabetes" by Whitaker.

 

It covers all the good stuff--diet, exercise, vitamins, latest research, etc.

 

By the time he finishes reading it, he will know more than the GP. Then he will teach it to you, giving him great satisfaction, and giving you secret amusement. It's all good!

[Holly IN]

Thanks! I will pick it up at the library. He doesn't think he can teach himself as I have mentioned it to him many times. He said his dr knows best. :glare:

I will have my dh read it!! He told me that I need to research again to make sure I am right and fil is wrong.

 

I don't care who is right because I only want to help my son stay away from diabetes!!

 

Thanks for the book title! I can't wait to ILL and pick it up!

Holly

[Kris]

Hello

 

I know I asked this on the OLD board but now have no access to it because of the NEW board.

 

FIL and I had an arguement tonight over this. My ds has glucose intolerance. My fil is a diabetic. FIL doesn't go to a diabetic dr but my son does.

 

Here is what the dr said of my son: NO white sugar or sugar sub., no white flour...eat meat and veggies and very little carbs. Carbs needs to be complex only.

 

However fil doesn't agree with that. He said that is Atkins diet and it will kill a diabetic. He said you can eat anything but just have to take pills. I told him that we are trying to prevent that. He also said that white flour has nothing to do with sugar. ggrr!! He said that our diabetic dr is wrong and his is correct. His dr is General Practitioner. (he used to be my dr until I found out he is a crack)

 

I am at my wits end here.

 

I would like those of that take a more holistic approach to tell me who is correct here.

 

Why is protein bad for a diabetic? I have read that people have been able to reverse their problem by eating limited complex carbs, more meat and veggies.

 

HELP!

 

Holly

 

I'm sorry, but your FIL is DEAD wrong.

 

Protein is NOT bad for a diabetic. White flour has everything to do with sugar because carbohydrates -- ALL carbohydrates -- are metabolized as glucose, which is sugar. You do *not* have to follow the Atkins diet to keep carbs low enough to prevent damage. What you *do* have to do is determine what the carb limit for your son is, and what foods will work for him, by testing.

 

I just don't even know where to start.

 

If your son is insulin resistant, the best way to make sure it develops into a full-blown case of T2 diabetes is to follow your FIL's advice and killing off his pancreatic beta cells.

 

It is MORE than possible to manage this with diet alone by limiting carbs. Get him a meter, if you haven't already, and test. I've posted this link before and I'm an NOT joking when I say I think following this procedure has literally saved my FEET!

 

It is information for people who are newly diagnosed with T2 from the alt.support.diabetes newsgroup. The procedure outlined gives information that you can use to plan your son's meals. Randomly stabbing him to get a reading will tell you nothing.

 

There are recent studies which I interpret to suggest that eating whatever you want and taking meds to compensate is just as bad as not doing anything at all. The studies state that keeping blood glucose levels within normal range is DANGEROUS. What they did NOT take into account is that they used medication and insulin to compensation for the much touted -- and ineffective-- low-fat, high carb diet. I believe -- and I am not alone here -- that it was the medication that caused the problem, NOT the fact that BG was maintained at normal levels. If THAT were the case, then "normies" would be in serious trouble.

 

It doesn't make sense that the body maintains these levels in healthy people -- but in diabetics it doesn't matter? There's a *reason* why the BG in a healthy body is as low as it is.

 

I'm sorry, but this kind of misinformation just lights a fire under my butt.

[Whisperlily]

I was having problems with my glucose levels, and ended up going to the doctor about 3 years ago. He told me I was pre-diabetic and needed to severely limit my carb intake. He said that the Atkins approach wasn't balanced enough for long term guidelines, but to look instead at the glycemic index. He suggested looking at the South Beach Diet book for information on how the body uses sugars and carbs, and because it has a glycemic index in the back. I didn't follow the diet as written, but it was well written information about blood sugar issues.

 

I still ate carbs, but they were complex carbs. The less processed the better. I also learned how to pair the carbs with protein to keep my blood sugar from crashing. It was the most helpful learning experience of my life. I see food completely differently. It's not counting calories, it's not any sort of diet... I make food choices based on how they affect my blood sugar and energy levels without even having to think about it.

 

Now, your son may be drastically different than I am, but I'm at a place where I don't have to watch what I eat... because I am so accustomed to eating a certain way that I crave the foods that I can eat. I also don't get tossed off track by sweets, because the portion size and craving for more that I used to feel is gone. Usually a half-portion or sometimes even a bite is enough for me to feel satisfied with simple carbs. And even then, it's rare that I even have the desire to do that.

 

A bonus... for me... I ended up losing over 50 lbs in 5 months without even knowing I was doing it. I had been the same weight for 10 years, and now it's like my body has reset at the new lower weight, and I am not officially or mentally watching my weight, and it's been within the same 5lb range for about 4 months now.

 

Knowing how and why foods affect your body can change the way you look at food for a lifetime.

Edited December 27, 2008 by Whisperlily

[Kris]

I have read that people have been able to reverse their problem by eating limited complex carbs, more meat and veggies.

 

If your son is overweight, insulin resistance can be improved by weight loss, as well as diet. If he isn't, then yes, absolutely, it can be controlled by diet.

[Bilby]

contained in this blog:

 

http://ginews.blogspot.com/

 

It is relevant to both diabetes and pre-diabetes. Read through previous months as well. The glycemic index is the same for both white and wholemeal flour, so bread should be wholegrain. Both diabetes and prediabetes are too risky to leave to an argument between what just two doctors say.

 

Good luck,

Pam.

[AnnetteB]

You are getting lots of good advice here. I only want to say that sadly, many diabetics of type 1 or 2 don't take good care of themselves and take the easy route. Our dd was diagnosed with type 1 in August of 2007 and we are fortunate to have a wonderful endocrinologist and I purchased several excellent books for us to study in addition to the diabetes education provided by the endocrinologist's staff. It is our hope that her diabetes will not define her. We are working to maintain normal bg by choosing a good diet balancing protein, carbs, etc. I like the Mediterranean Diet because of the emphasis on fruit, veggies, and fish. I am so glad that none of our extended family has tried to argue with us about her treatment plan! There have been a few who think her future is dim because of people they know who have "blown the whole thing" and neglected themselves. I want to think that our girl will make it all a matter of good habits and thrive despite it.

[Rosie_0801]

I was reading a book called "The China Study" by two chaps surnamed Campbell. They cited studies that showed insulin dependent people coming off their insulin in 26 days by eating a whole grain vegan diet. Very interesting stuff.

Refined carbs and sugar are no good for anybody (though I'll accept there is probably someone, somewhere with some odd disorder who'd make a liar out of me!) Every diabetic is different, so the amount of each carb containing food they can eat will vary. I have gestational diabetes, and kept my sugar levels controlled with a normal diabetic diet until 27 weeks. After that, I had to give up virtually all grains, and get my carbs from beans instead. "Eat what you like and just take the pills" is obviously stupid. I'm thinking your your doctor's advice doesn't sound quite right either. Have you been given any information on how to tell if your son is getting enough carbs? "Eat few carbs" doesn't really tell you much. I have urine test strips to measure the amount of ketones, which tells me if I'm breaking down fat stores. If I am, it means I'm not eating enough carbs. Being pregnant, I don't really want to be losing weight!

The Aitkins diet isn't good for anyone in the long term, so you ought to be checking out better ways to manage your son's diet. If it was the perfect diet, Mr Aitkins would have been a healthy man.

After reading "The China Study" I am convinced a whole grains, vegan diet is the best thing way to go, but while I'm gestational diabetic I have to leave the grains and eat only low GI fruit and veg in limited doses. I'm quite sick of beans, but they really are good for me! Carbs I can handle and the protein I no longer want to get from animal products. I'm agreeing with Annette that the Mediterranean style of eating seems particularly suited to diabetics and have a Vegan Mediterranean cookbook on my amazon list, just waiting to be bought!

So much misinformation around, and so much trial and error to find what does work for you. It really is a drag, isn't it?!

:)

Rosie

 

Edit: One of the really important things I've found is to keep meal times roughly the same time each day, and to be sure to have supper.

[Peela]

I know several pre-diabetic people, including my father and two friends, who manage their blood sugar with diet, staying away from sugar, white flour etc and eating a diet with good protein and complex carbs- to different extents, depending on how high their blood sugar actually is (my dad is a bit of sugar addict and I know he cheats, but he is fighting off cancer and isn't concerned with the diabetes, though he probably should be. One friend is pretty loose with it all, because her levels are not high but all her close family are diabetic. Another friend is very strict with his diet. Another friend, our music teacher, is very diabetic already and with diet, manages to limit how much insulin she needs daily.

Your FIL is just being a stubborn old fool and he should know better before spouting off mis information that can have such a dramatic affect on your son's wellbeing.

[TraceyS/FL]

There are recent studies which I interpret to suggest that eating whatever you want and taking meds to compensate is just as bad as not doing anything at all. The studies state that keeping blood glucose levels within normal range is DANGEROUS. What they did NOT take into account is that they used medication and insulin to compensation for the much touted -- and ineffective-- low-fat, high carb diet. I believe -- and I am not alone here -- that it was the medication that caused the problem, NOT the fact that BG was maintained at normal levels. If THAT were the case, then "normies" would be in serious trouble.

 

I've been stating this for years. In fact, my MIL about killed my FIL with her "no fat, no cholesterol" diet she insisted on going on. That was her way of losing weight and getting her cholesterol down.

 

She's now on pills for T2. AND, on CHristmas day admitted she knows NOTHING about carbs and what they do to you (hence her not grasping she was KILLING my FIL - he was admitted to the hospital with glucose levels he couldn't get under 400, most people would have died).

 

I have to disagree on all the Atkins stuff being bad (you can do the "way of eating" bad - but you aren't really doing it "right"). And, Atkins has GI info, it's very much a part of what carbs you add when. But we will all have to agree to disagree on that.

 

I will NOT have a "fat free" or "low fat" product in my house. No hidden sugar!

 

To the OP - yes, your FIL is wrong. Dead wrong.

[G5052]

DH has a lot of medical problems, and we have a relative who likes all the "fringe" treatments whether they apply to a particular situation or not (sigh, lasers are good for anything, don't you know?).

 

My standard reply, "Thanks for sharing that with me, and we'll take that into consideration along with what our doctors say."

 

I'm a prediabetic, and your father-in-law is just plain wrong. I only see my internist, but he has a side specialty in diabetes and his advice matches everything I read, so I feel confident in how he's treating me. I eat a "smart carb" diet ala "Sugarbusters" and have for some five years with good results.

 

Your FIL also needs to know that children with prediabetes are handled slightly different than adults, so one way to silence him would be to say, "And is your doctor is specialist in juvenile diabetes?" My guess is no.

[Holly IN]

Are there any reading materials that you guys recommend? I know one of you recommended a book by Whitaker. I have that on ILL through the library. Any websites?

 

My dh said he would like to do some reading. I am enjoying the two websites already mentioned here so thank you for those.

 

THanks

 

Holly

Edited December 27, 2008 by Holly IN

[siloam]

I'm sorry, but your FIL is DEAD wrong.

 

Protein is NOT bad for a diabetic. White flour has everything to do with sugar because carbohydrates -- ALL carbohydrates -- are metabolized as glucose, which is sugar. You do *not* have to follow the Atkins diet to keep carbs low enough to prevent damage. What you *do* have to do is determine what the carb limit for your son is, and what foods will work for him, by testing.

 

I just don't even know where to start.

 

If your son is insulin resistant, the best way to make sure it develops into a full-blown case of T2 diabetes is to follow your FIL's advice and killing off his pancreatic beta cells.

 

It is MORE than possible to manage this with diet alone by limiting carbs. Get him a meter, if you haven't already, and test. I've posted this link before and I'm an NOT joking when I say I think following this procedure has literally saved my FEET!

 

It is information for people who are newly diagnosed with T2 from the alt.support.diabetes newsgroup. The procedure outlined gives information that you can use to plan your son's meals. Randomly stabbing him to get a reading will tell you nothing.

 

There are recent studies which I interpret to suggest that eating whatever you want and taking meds to compensate is just as bad as not doing anything at all. The studies state that keeping blood glucose levels within normal range is DANGEROUS. What they did NOT take into account is that they used medication and insulin to compensation for the much touted -- and ineffective-- low-fat, high carb diet. I believe -- and I am not alone here -- that it was the medication that caused the problem, NOT the fact that BG was maintained at normal levels. If THAT were the case, then "normies" would be in serious trouble.

 

It doesn't make sense that the body maintains these levels in healthy people -- but in diabetics it doesn't matter? There's a *reason* why the BG in a healthy body is as low as it is.

 

I'm sorry, but this kind of misinformation just lights a fire under my butt.

 

Agreeing 100%.

 

The other question I would have is your FIL seeing a Family Practitioner or an Endo? When DH was first diagnosed he just saw his FP, which was OK, but the guy also had him in some meds that were not proven. After a couple of years dh saw a Endo and what a difference! This guy obviously knew his stuff.

 

High fat protein is not the best idea for a diabetic because the fats do also turn into sugar eventually. Like complex carbs it does take longer so it has less of an effect on blood sugar levels. Eating low fat meats is not a problem at all, and high fat meats in small portions once in a while are just fine too. If you FIL associates eating bacon every day (which I know a lot of people do) with Atkins then that might be part of the problem.

 

Another big factor is exercise. Exercise makes a huge difference in dh being able to control his levels, and reduce his need for insulin. I would strongly encourage you to get your son on a regular exercise program. Even if it is just walking for 20 mins 3 times a week.

 

BTW the Endo has no problem with diet products either.

 

Heather

 

[Rosie_0801]

You know, stress raises blood sugar levels too. So it's very important your son doesn't listen to grandpas spouting ignorance.

;)

Rosie

[TraceyS/FL]

You know, stress raises blood sugar levels too. So it's very important your son doesn't listen to grandpas spouting ignorance.

;)

Rosie

 

:biggrinjester: ::spew::

 

:tongue_smilie:

[vettechmomof2]

Hello

 

FIL and I had an arguement tonight over this. My ds has glucose intolerance. My fil is a diabetic. FIL doesn't go to a diabetic dr but my son does.

 

Here is what the dr said of my son: NO white sugar or sugar sub., no white flour...eat meat and veggies and very little carbs. Carbs needs to be complex only.

 

However fil doesn't agree with that. He said that is Atkins diet and it will kill a diabetic. He said you can eat anything but just have to take pills. I told him that we are trying to prevent that. He also said that white flour has nothing to do with sugar. ggrr!! He said that our diabetic dr is wrong and his is correct. His dr is General Practitioner. (he used to be my dr until I found out he is a crack)

 

I am at my wits end here.

 

I would like those of that take a more holistic approach to tell me who is correct here.

 

Why is protein bad for a diabetic? I have read that people have been able to reverse their problem by eating limited complex carbs, more meat and veggies.

 

HELP!

 

Holly

I am assumming here that your FIL is a type 2 diabetic, what about your son? There is a HUGE difference between Type 1 and Type 2 on care of so it does make a difference.

My daughters endo DOES NOT want us to restrict carbs except for non healthy carbs. However we do have to carb count ALL carbs for the amount of insulin needed for the body. My daughters endo states that most children NEED carbs for brain growth. NOw, many docs just as many people have differening thoughts on this.

However it does make a difference for your son to know if he is pre Type 2 or pre type 1. Type 2, sometimes diet and exercise is the best way to control the disease.

Type 1, if he is in early stages(honeymoon) then sometimes you can stay in a honeymoon state for ages BUT eventually you must go on Insulin as your pancreas will shut down for insulin production.

A wonderful board for discussing things of this nature is childrenwithdiabetes forums. It is an online support group.

 

As for your fil, many people do not realize that the different types of Diabetes are COMPLETELY different diseases and should be/need to be treated differently.

 

Good luck,

Allene

[Holly IN]

About FIL dr:

 

Internal medicine. He used to be my dr. He is the kind that wants to do everything himself.

 

The dr I have now is a family dr and he send ds to an endocrinologist. FIL dr is not an endo but an adult GP.

 

Holly

[Carol in Cal.]

endocrinologist to help with this.

 

My sister drives 5 hours each way to take her son to the nearest pediatric endocrinologist. They are the specialists who stay up to date on the latest information about this family of illnesses. Research and discoveries are moving very quickly in this area, and I just wouldn't want to be depending on a GP to keep up.

[AnnetteB]

:iagree: We are so thankful that our pediatrician sent us straight to the Portland, Oregon hospital with the fully up-to-date children's endocrinologist's. She referred us directly to the endo that she would take her own children to if the need existed. I have noticed that there are families in the waiting room from far away. They only treat children and I am hoping that we will be so fortunate in finding excellent care when she "graduates" from their care. The Type 1 patient has to see their endo every 3 months throughout their lifetime for the best possible health. I think much of this is a form of accountability...knowing that you will have a "test" every 3 months and that every day's balancing of insulin/exercise/carbs matters. We want our girl to think of her family and her endo as partners in her good health and a bit like angels watching out for her. (Her honeymoon period seems to be winding down and we are gradually seeing higher numbers and are increasing her insulins. Low bg will become a greater concern when she is on insulin around the clock. I am not looking forward to a return to 2 a.m. checks.) I hope that your FIL and DH become better educated so that they can be part of the team.

[Rosie_0801]

I don't imagine it would help with type 1, but with gestational and type 2, chiropractic care helps regulate blood sugars. Life prevented me from attending my last scheduled appointment and my blood sugar readings have been getting wackier and wackier over the last week. All the relaxin in my system doesn't exactly promote vertabrae staying where I left them, but the chiro definitely helps. Cross your fingers I can get an appointment for today otherwise my obstetrician is going to start up about insulin again!

 

Rosie