Sanity check - what would you let your 17yo daughter do?

[Frances]

Personally, with a 17 year old senior who is going to college next year, I wouldn’t be using school related performance benchmarks as a way to “earn” a trip to see an out of town boyfriend, unless she is in danger of flunking out. Unless there are extenuating circumstances such as mental health issues, EF issues, etc., she needs to be taking ownership of her schoolwork and grades. And if those issues are present, all the more reason to not help facilitate a young romance, but instead encourage her to focus on herself and her own goals. I obviously wouldn’t forbid the relationship, just not help or encourage it.

[elegantlion]

1 hour ago, Terabith said:

So, two issues:  1) is “do I feel like this is a good/ safe relationship” and am I okay with the overnight visit at his home?  I could see that going either way, but honestly it sounds like you’re fine with that.  My youngest (age 18) has male friends that she’s definitely not in a relationship with but I would be okay with overnights at house with family.  
 

2) Issue is the driving/ situational awareness. Neither of my kids have driven enough that I would be okay with that long distance driving, and my oldest is almost 20.  But it sounds like your daughter has driven a ton more than my kid.  And they have to do it sometime.  I like the idea of the trip being made at least once with me as a passenger, but I think with cell phones, her doing it alone is honestly not that big a deal.  
 

I am going to offer a counter argument to the petite and young making her more vulnerable.  I think in any likely scenario, her size and appearance is likely to be an asset. People are way more likely to stop and help her if she gets a flat tire than they probably would a boy of the same age.  And yes, of course anyone is vulnerable but I think most people who see a young girl are going to feel protective and helpful towards her.  

Adding to this, which you probably already have dealt with. Anyone driving those distances, needs to make sure they have roadside assistance on their insurance or AAA and KNOW HOW TO USE IT if necessary. AAA is worth the cost for me and I've had to use it when I'm miles away from home. The second level of AAA pays for a tow up to 100 or 200 miles (can't remember which). That can save a huge expense and worse. An acquaintance was in another city and her car broke down - sounds like her car had issues and she probably shouldn't have been driving long distances, but.... She did not have roadside assistance, waited all night in the car because no one could come get her and she couldn't afford a tow, then the car was stolen before she could get back to it. 

[annandatje]

I have read only the original post.  I would allow her to go.

[Sneezyone]

3 hours ago, elegantlion said:

Adding to this, which you probably already have dealt with. Anyone driving those distances, needs to make sure they have roadside assistance on their insurance or AAA and KNOW HOW TO USE IT if necessary. AAA is worth the cost for me and I've had to use it when I'm miles away from home. The second level of AAA pays for a tow up to 100 or 200 miles (can't remember which). That can save a huge expense and worse. An acquaintance was in another city and her car broke down - sounds like her car had issues and she probably shouldn't have been driving long distances, but.... She did not have roadside assistance, waited all night in the car because no one could come get her and she couldn't afford a tow, then the car was stolen before she could get back to it. 

Yes. DD had a few occasions to test her skills in this area as a 1st year driver (blown tires, every time). First offense, fail. Second, failed less hard. Third, success. We also did a four hour road trip where she drove half in her junior year so I could observe her driving. By the end of her senior year, we drove side by side so she could take her car to college and she was perfectly fine. That was 9 hrs.

Edited October 19, 2023 by Sneezyone

[Katy]

9 hours ago, Hannah said:

Is there no option for a bus or shuttle to the other city?

(I'm probably showing a lot of ignorance as to what is available given that everyone can drive from age 16 and cars are reasonably affordable in the USA).

I don’t know what city OP is near. Medium or larger cities generally have greyhound bus service, as well as smaller towns with military bases and/or airports. But depending on the city that might be a terrible idea because bus stations are often in a terrible side of town. 

I took a greyhound bus halfway across the country home from University 25 years ago because a blizzard meant planes were going to be grounded for days. It was scary on several occasions. Crime has gotten worse in the years since. In many larger cities police no longer respond to crime calls for things like gunshots unless someone was injured. I wish this was an exaggeration. 

[catz]

24 minutes ago, Katy said:

I don’t know what city OP is near. Medium or larger cities generally have greyhound bus service, as well as smaller towns with military bases and/or airports. But depending on the city that might be a terrible idea because bus stations are often in a terrible side of town. 

Obviously this depends on a lot of things.  In our city a lot of people send their young college students 1-6 hours away without cars.  Buses are easy, accessible and running many times a day.  My kid that just graduated was 4 hours from us.  He never had a car as a student, he was a dense midsize city.  Parking within 2 miles of campus was ridiculous.  It averaged probably about $150 a month for parking.  So many young people (students, young professionals) in this city didn't bother to have a vehicle.  I don't even know how many coach buses in several varieties he took over the years.  That college was a couple hours from Chicago.  I think there were probably 8 buses a day running into O'Hare and Chicago Union Station from where he was.  College students took them constantly.  My other student is in Chicago and will be busing out.  Parents were recommending them and chatting about them constantly on their college boards, I've not heard about students having issues on those regularly running buses.

Taking buses across country is a whole other things with lay overs, random stops, switching buses and drivers etc than taking a single daytime bus with limited stops.  Seems really odd to be bringing up gunshots and police response in this context?  You could potentially run into a crime no matter what your mode of transportation in theory.  But with someone with some urban smarts during daytime hours with some planning that is very, very unlikely.  

Obviously check the drop off/pick ups on both ends.  My kid did use one pick up occassionally on our end that we would make sure to be in place before he arrived.  Just because it was at a gas station in not the best area.   But if these are decent sized cities where people may not have vehicles and there may be college campuses, I don't have particular concerns for short runs for a kid that is on track to be heading to college in a year.   In particular for a ride under 4-6 hours on a daytime bus.  On a lot of buses, you can reserve a seat up front if  you want. 

 

 

 

 

[Katy]

5 minutes ago, catz said:

Obviously this depends on a lot of things.  In our city a lot of people send their young college students 1-6 hours away without cars.  Buses are easy, accessible and running many times a day.  My kid that just graduated was 4 hours from us.  He never had a car as a student, he was a dense midsize city.  Parking within 2 miles of campus was ridiculous.  It averaged probably about $150 a month for parking.  So many young people (students, young professionals) in this city didn't bother to have a vehicle.  I don't even know how many coach buses in several varieties he took over the years.  That college was a couple hours from Chicago.  I think there were probably 8 buses a day running into O'Hare and Chicago Union Station from where he was.  College students took them constantly.  My other student is in Chicago and will be busing out.  Parents were recommending them and chatting about them constantly on their college boards, I've not heard about students having issues on those regularly running buses.

Taking buses across country is a whole other things with lay overs, random stops, switching buses and drivers etc than taking a single daytime bus with limited stops.  Seems really odd to be bringing up gunshots and police response in this context?  You could potentially run into a crime no matter what your mode of transportation in theory.  But with someone with some urban smarts during daytime hours with some planning that is very, very unlikely.  

Obviously check the drop off/pick ups on both ends.  My kid did use one pick up occassionally on our end that we would make sure to be in place before he arrived.  Just because it was at a gas station in not the best area.   But if these are decent sized cities where people may not have vehicles and there may be college campuses, I don't have particular concerns for short runs for a kid that is on track to be heading to college in a year.   In particular for a ride under 4-6 hours on a daytime bus.  On a lot of buses, you can reserve a seat up front if  you want. 

 

 

 

 

I went there because I was raised in Florida and concerns about gun violence are the most frequent topic I heard from tourists from outside the US. It was so frequent that when people imply they might not understand something about why Americans don’t use public transportation it’s nearly always either not understanding guns, crime OR not understanding the scale of the country and how large & spread out everything is. I once got into a conversation on the beach with a handful of people from Europe who didn’t understand that public transportation often isn’t an option here. To larger places sure, but to most smaller places, no. And they didn’t understand not being able to walk to what you need or why most highways don’t have sidewalks. They heard that, but they didn’t understand it until they came to Florida. 

[Alice]

I let my 17 year old son drive all over the country for his gap year, with his 14 year old brother as a companion. At the time I kept asking myself if I was crazy.  Things that helped make me feel better about it...

*He had AAA. He didn't have to use it but used it twice last year when driving in college and it was great to have. 

*He had driven a lot on long trips so I knew he was a good driver and could do longer trips. I had driven with him in a lot of different conditions: night, rain, snow, ice, rain at night, highway, in cities, etc. He had driven on long trips as a family on vacation and had done what to us were longish trips alone (2-3 hours) before going on his massive road trip. 

*I realized that there really isn't anything inherently different from him driving in say South Dakota than around here (and it's probably safer in South Dakota than on the DC Beltway). It FEELS safer and like I have more control because he's close by...but really an accident can happen anywhere. Yes, close by I could get there quicker to help but in a true emergency I'm not really going to be all that helpful. And now with cell phones we could be accessible anywhere even if we couldn't get to him. 

*Ultimately I did look at the idea of him going to college the next year and think that I'd have no idea what he'd be doing then. And when he did go to college (and he has a 9 hour drive to get there) it did make me feel better to know he'd had the practice runs of freedom the year before. 

All that to say, only you know your daughter. I don't think you'd be crazy to let her drive but if you have reservations your compromise sounds reasonable. 

[catz]

I just also want to put out there violent crime is actually down in the US from 1990.  But we did get a bump up nationwide over covid that has declined generally in many cities the past year, 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/191219/reported-violent-crime-rate-in-the-usa-since-1990/

Upper middle class professionals and college students use long and short transit out of my neighborhood every day.  Yep, having some urban savvy and smarts is recommended.  But problems are rare.  I can't speak to transit or crime in Florida.  

Edited October 20, 2023 by catz

[Tree Frog]

5 hours ago, elegantlion said:

Adding to this, which you probably already have dealt with. Anyone driving those distances, needs to make sure they have roadside assistance on their insurance or AAA and KNOW HOW TO USE IT if necessary. AAA is worth the cost for me and I've had to use it when I'm miles away from home. The second level of AAA pays for a tow up to 100 or 200 miles (can't remember which). That can save a huge expense and worse. An acquaintance was in another city and her car broke down - sounds like her car had issues and she probably shouldn't have been driving long distances, but.... She did not have roadside assistance, waited all night in the car because no one could come get her and she couldn't afford a tow, then the car was stolen before she could get back to it. 

I totally agree with this. Sometimes your insurance will also have roadside assistance, but check to make sure it's as good as AAA. We have a family friend who was burned by USAA's roadside assistance wrt towing. I used AAA one time when ds and I were stuck overnight. They towed my van 100 miles to the place we wanted it serviced. Another time, ds was 13 hours away and struck some debris "falling from the sky" that caused his car to be undriveable. He called us panicked about what to do, but handled everything himself. AAA towed him home (he was 60 miles away), then towed it a couple more times to/from the auto body shop. Between those 2 events, AAA paid for itself several years over. We chose the second level of AAA because of all the rural driving our family does. 

Also, just FYI adult kids can stay on their parents' AAA policy until they turn 26. It's significantly less expensive to add them then for them to get their own policy. My dd gets a kick out of having an AAA card that says she's been a member for 30 years. She's been a member longer than she's been alive!😂