need suggestions with my dad's strict health diet

[ProudGrandma]

My elderly dad is on a strict diet because his doctors have told us so.  He can't have gluten, dairy and needs low potassium and sodium.  At first glance this might not seem difficult, but it actually is.  In many cases when sodium is removed from foods, more potassium is added or vice versa.  There are many fruits and veggies that are naturally high in potassium as are meats.  Basically his diet needs to mostly consist of certain fish (Cod, Flounder, Perch and tuna are the ones he will eat) and poultry.  He can have an occasional meal with beef and basically no pork.  The veggie options are: peas, cherry tomatoes, broccoli, cabbage, celery, cucumbers, green beans, lettuce and raw spinach.  Being a meat and potato guy, it has been hard to limit potatoes and veggies like squash. 

What makes it even more difficult is that when looking at books that are meant to help with this, they seem to contradict each other.  AND, when books or lists say no to something you look at the nutritional labels and they say low or no potassium or sodium.  For example: dried cranberries...how can one brand contain high amounts of S & P and another one say zero on both of those?  One books says zucchini is on the low list and another one says it's on the high list.  The doctors aren't much help nor is the nutritionist that they have met with. 

I am trying to help my mom come up with recipes that she can fix that are safe for him and yet taste good.  He doesn't like strong or hot spices, but bland isn't fun either.  

Has anybody here dealt with anything similar to this?  Any suggestions on recipes or sources of recipes?  THANKS in advance for any and all help. 

[Katy]

I think this is the kind of thing you need a nutritionist for. 

Edited March 3, 2022 by Katy

[Jean in Newcastle]

A friend on a low potassium/ low salt diet used Mrs. Dash spice blends. 
 

I have found broccoli to be a good “base” for stir fries etc. 

Cauliflower rice?  
 

Ask the doctor or nutritionist for a number for daily potassium or sodium intake. Or perhaps a number to shoot for per meal. I have found that that’s easier to work with. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

Also. I have found that searching for “low salt, low potassium recipes “ on Pinterest is helpful. Also search for “renal diet” recipes. 

[Carol in Cal.]

I have a friend whose father is like this.  She does all the cooking for her parents now.  She actually somehow rinses the potassium out of some foods.  It’s an extremely difficult diet.  

[ProudGrandma]

17 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

A friend on a low potassium/ low salt diet used Mrs. Dash spice blends. 
 

I have found broccoli to be a good “base” for stir fries etc. 

Cauliflower rice?  
 

Ask the doctor or nutritionist for a number for daily potassium or sodium intake. Or perhaps a number to shoot for per meal. I have found that that’s easier to work with. 

my dad doesn't seem to like the Mrs dash's blends.  Cauliflower rice is a good idea.  We have a general number to shoot for each day...it's just so hard for my mom to keep track of it all. But we are working on it. What's super hard is that I am about 1000 miles away and trying to help her from afar adds an extra issue.  But we are trying to make it work. 

[ProudGrandma]

16 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Also. I have found that searching for “low salt, low potassium recipes “ on Pinterest is helpful. Also search for “renal diet” recipes. 

that's a good idea....why didn't I think of that...

[ProudGrandma]

3 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I have a friend whose father is like this.  She does all the cooking for her parents now.  She actually somehow rinses the potassium out of some foods.  It’s an extremely difficult diet.  

you can do that and it helps...but it doesn't completely remove all of the potassium...but it does help.

[prairiewindmomma]

It is very difficult to have things not taste bland, as no salt and no potassium take away that traditional flavoring.

When you mean no salt, what are the parameters? Are we talking DASH diet limitations of like 1500mg or what? 
 

Fwiw, we have found that some things help—citrus as a brightener (squeeze of lime), or cilantro. Cooking technique matters more—searing before cooking, then properly resting the meat. Adding texture helps—plain sunflower seeds, or crushed roasted but unsalted peanuts. Finally, adding umami helps with the no salt thing. 

[ProudGrandma]

4 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

It is very difficult to have things not taste bland, as no salt and no potassium take away that traditional flavoring.

When you mean no salt, what are the parameters? Are we talking DASH diet limitations of like 1500mg or what? 
 

Fwiw, we have found that some things help—citrus as a brightener (squeeze of lime), or cilantro. Cooking technique matters more—searing before cooking, then properly resting the meat. Adding texture helps—plain sunflower seeds, or crushed roasted but unsalted peanuts. Finally, adding umami helps with the no salt thing. 

what is umami?  and yes, I think the DASH diet is what they said. 

[Spy Car]

2 minutes ago, kfeusse said:

what is umami?  and yes, I think the DASH diet is what they said. 

"Savoy" taste. Usually umami bombs are loaded with sodium.

Bill

[Jean in Newcastle]

26 minutes ago, kfeusse said:

my dad doesn't seem to like the Mrs dash's blends.  Cauliflower rice is a good idea.  We have a general number to shoot for each day...it's just so hard for my mom to keep track of it all. But we are working on it. What's super hard is that I am about 1000 miles away and trying to help her from afar adds an extra issue.  But we are trying to make it work. 

If you (or your Mom) have an app like MyFitness Pal (I actually use Fitbit) you can set them to count things like sodium and potassium.  Then pre-enter some day's foods to get an idea if you are within range.  I have found that finding one breakfast (or perhaps two for variety) and one or two lunches that work and sticking to those is helpful.  Then you just have dinner to figure out.  And if you figure out 7 or 8 dinners for a "season" and slowly add to it, it's doable. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Umami is a flavor receptor profile—we taste sweet, sour, salty, bitter, and umami. Mushrooms are umami. Kombu is umami. People tend to think of it as msg only—but really anything that hits those glutamate receptors is umami

[kbutton]

One tiny suggestion I have is that for some of the foods that are maybe borderline on something like potassium, keep portion size in mind. If berries are out as a full serving, for instance, then he could still possibly have a couple of berries on top of something for taste. Just because a serving size puts a food over the limit doesn't mean you have to eat a full serving, KWIM? I know you'd still have to account for it in the totals, but it might give just a bit of flex here and there.

I realize that could make some things more difficult, such as not wasting food when you use a tiny amount of something, but I thought I'd mention it if it helps with some kinds of recipes where really small quantities could make a big difference in taste.

I would experiment with different way to cook or not cook cabbage. I eat a lot of it and find it very satisfying. I especially love it roasted or shredded to be sauteed. The flavor caramelizes really nicely. I use it in place of rice sometimes. A lot of veggies taste really good (and different) when roasted. 

Once some options are found that he likes predictably, I would try to maybe list which foods are equivalent for sodium, etc. so that they can be swapped into the menu like Lego pieces, and/or I would try to make menus for the whole day. For instance, every day that he has x for dinner, he also has y for breakfast and z for lunch, so that some part of this could be put on autopilot. 

[Clemsondana]

I had a relative on the kidney diet, which is low in sodium and potassium.  One thing that we learned in researching it is that for some foods potassium could be leached out through soaking.  So, if we were making potato salad we would put some raw cut potatoes in a bowl of water to soak over night - we'd change the water a few times, and the prepare as usual.  I don't know if this would work for your needs or for other foods on your list, but I thought I'd mention it.  She found that after a bit her taste buds adapted and if she ate a bite of our usual food it tasted too salty.  

[prairiewindmomma]

Fwiw, if your dad hasn’t been GFCF before this, that is a shock in and of itself.

We played “taste test” games every Friday evening for months on end where I would try different products to see what I like—4 different dairy free cheeses, or ice creams or yogurts or whatever. Making it game-like and an event to look forward to helped emotionally to make the transition. 

I relied on a few foods that I knew were safe and that I really liked and that gave me space to try new things.

 

[HS Mom in NC]

Assuming your father is elderly (60+) I would run this through the lens of quality of life first and weigh it against his specific plans for how he wants the end of his life to look. What's the pay off for this diet and is it worth it to him in the overall scheme of things? You can refer to the discussion on this current thread on that: https://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/716873-how-did-elder-care-used-to-work/

 

[happi duck]

Since their nutritionist wasn't helpful perhaps you could do an online nutritionist and then share a plan with your folks.

I agree with Jean that fine-tuning a couple breakfasts and lunches plus eight to ten dinners could be helpful.

[ProudGrandma]

1 minute ago, happi duck said:

Since their nutritionist wasn't helpful perhaps you could do an online nutritionist and then share a plan with your folks.

I agree with Jean that fine-tuning a couple breakfasts and lunches plus eight to ten dinners could be helpful.

this is actually what we are trying to do....and then slowly add new things as recipes are found or whatever.   

how does one go about finding an online nutritionist?  Just a google search?  That seems sort of risky.

 

[ProudGrandma]

9 minutes ago, HS Mom in NC said:

Assuming your father is elderly (60+) I would run this through the lens of quality of life first and weigh it against his specific plans for how he wants the end of his life to look. What's the pay off for this diet and is it worth it to him in the overall scheme of things? You can refer to the discussion on this current thread on that: https://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/716873-how-did-elder-care-used-to-work/

 

yeah...we are starting to have this discussion too....my dad is 87 and has cancer...so....

[ProudGrandma]

18 minutes ago, Clemsondana said:

I had a relative on the kidney diet, which is low in sodium and potassium.  One thing that we learned in researching it is that for some foods potassium could be leached out through soaking.  So, if we were making potato salad we would put some raw cut potatoes in a bowl of water to soak over night - we'd change the water a few times, and the prepare as usual.  I don't know if this would work for your needs or for other foods on your list, but I thought I'd mention it.  She found that after a bit her taste buds adapted and if she ate a bite of our usual food it tasted too salty.  

my mom knows about that....I just don't know how much potassium is actually removed...so it is hard to make other decisions....

[Jean in Newcastle]

Does he have kidney disease?  https://www.kidney.org/nutrition

[ProudGrandma]

2 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Does he have kidney disease?  https://www.kidney.org/nutrition

yes.  I believe he does. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

1 minute ago, kfeusse said:

yes.  I believe he does. 

Ask the doctor if he has a referral to a renal nutritionist. 

[kbutton]

15 minutes ago, HS Mom in NC said:

What's the pay off for this diet and is it worth it to him in the overall scheme of things?

I would want to know if he feels better on the diet when making this decision, and I would want to know what he'll feel like and act like off of the diet. Not everything is about prolonging life in a futile march towards death. Some things make you feel better, make you more clearheaded, etc. 

How much to stress over the diet is a quality of life issue, but you have to know what the trade-offs are. 

[Spy Car]

The new version of the USDA nutritional database (now called FoodData Central) is a lot less user-friendly than the old version, but if you dig a little (looking at the various subcategories) the nutrient information (including things like sodium and potassium) levels in fresh and frozen foodstuffs is there.

https://fdc.nal.usda.gov/fdc-app.html#/

Bill

[Clemsondana]

3 hours ago, kfeusse said:

my mom knows about that....I just don't know how much potassium is actually removed...so it is hard to make other decisions....

If it's a kidney problem, for many people the soaking is enough.  There are cookbooks and websites that have recipes and preparation methods for people on a renal diet.  I can't speak for your dad's particulars, but for my relative they were able to eat reasonable portions of soaked potatoes without it causing problems (they were on dialysis, and would swell up if they ate too much of the prohibited foods).  For relative, we went through our regular recipes to see which were OK or could be modified most easily (they were relieved that chicken salad, a favorite, was fine), and then we used the renal diet cookbooks to get recipes or ideas for changes that we could make (like soaking potatoes, or subbing rice for pasta, or whatever fit their food preferences).  He might also consider grilling, which adds a lot of flavor without needing a lot of seasoning, and using flavorful fruits like pineapple (either alone, or the juice as a marinade for chicken).  Also try preparing the veggies a new way - if he normally has traditional boiled green beans, try sauteeing time in olive oil with some garlic, for instance.  Maybe he'd like a hearty stir-fry - not with the salty sauces, but you can put a lot of veggies and some chicken in it with rice or cauliflower rice.