JanetC Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 But then, to me, I realized, you know what? No. Stepping back, just being in my little Stoicism Susan bubble, if what people know you for is bringing light to an issue about bad behavior, about bad stuff going on and laws not being followed and people being treated inappropriately, why wouldn’t I want that? That’s a badge of honor. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/21/style/susan-fowler-uber.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 (edited) I read it differently. More like a neglected homeschooler who managed to rise above despite her abysmal educational upbringing, not because of it. Glad she found classics to read. A great lady though. Such determination and hard work is not as common as should be. Edited October 24, 2017 by Roadrunner 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted October 24, 2017 Author Share Posted October 24, 2017 Indeed, she's more of a classically-oriented unschooler, pursuing her own passions. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nansk Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 More like a neglected homeschooler who managed to rise above despite her abysmal educational upbringing, not because of it. Yes, this is what is described in the article. Glad she got out of it, which she wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) I read it as hyperbolic rhetoric. So neglected that she was awarded a full scholarship to AZ where she did so poorly that she transferred to UPenn.(She is 26. So these 2012 transfer stats are probably 1 yr off, but they are probably not that discrepant. Acceptance rate--9.40%, number of applicants--2,096, number accepted--197. http://transferweb.com/stats/transfer-acceptance-rates/#.WfB0kJ8pDqA ) It is hard to qualify those outcomes as neglected. Her math and science background might have been weak, but she obviously knew how to read and write and must have done well enough on the SAT or ACT (or most likely the PSAT due to the high scholarship) to be admitted and qualify for a full scholarship. And accepted to UPenn as a transfer student?? Educational philosophy match mine? No. Neglect? Seriously a stretch of the definition of neglect. Edited October 25, 2017 by 8FillTheHeart 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 She probably has a high IQ. She seems to be naturally driven to learn. I think born intelligence coupled with strong drive can help overcome lots of shortcomings in education. I give credit to her and to her likely above average ability. Her parents? Not so much. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 She probably has a high IQ. She seems to be naturally driven to learn. I think born intelligence coupled with strong drive can help overcome lots of shortcomings in education. I give credit to her and to her likely above average ability. Her parents? Not so much. Yeah, I am not willing to judge her parents based on Dowd's perspective on what a young adult who might resent her upbringing says. I have some family members (not my kids) who have some choice things to say about having been homeschooled (and only through middle school). I roll my eyes at a lot of their comments bc I was was there and around them, and I know what they say is their fictionalized version that suits their current narrative. One-sided stories are simply that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Yeah, I am not willing to judge her parents based on Dowd's perspective on what a young adult who might resent her upbringing says. I have some family members (not my kids) who have some choice things to say about having been homeschooled (and only through middle school). I roll my eyes at a lot of their comments bc I was was there and around them, and I know what they say is their fictionalized version that suits their current narrative. One-sided stories are simply that. In her own words from her blog at https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2016/8/15/20-unconventional-books-that-changed-my-life, she says that "I was homeschooled by my mother until I was around 12 or 13, and then, when she had to return to work and enrolled my younger siblings in public school, I began working full-time instead of going to school." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 In her own words from her blog at https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2016/8/15/20-unconventional-books-that-changed-my-life, she says that "I was homeschooled by my mother until I was around 12 or 13, and then, when she had to return to work and enrolled my younger siblings in public school, I began working full-time instead of going to school." I wonder why she didn't go to school as well? Did she need to help support the family financially? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) Wow. Yeah. She's definitely a go-getter. Oh, my. We've found the unicorn unschooler that apparently learned no math beyond what she picked up cooking and going shopping with mom, but when she realized she wanted to be an astrophysicist, she just learned all the math from 6th grade through calculus and beyond in a semester on her own, and is now studying Physics at an Ivy League school. What have I been doing killing myself teaching my kids math systematically all these years? The stories are real! Here is proof! :rolleyes: When I think of all the bon bons I could have been eating instead... Edited October 25, 2017 by Matryoshka 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Oh, my. We've found the unicorn unschooler that apparently learned no math beyond what she picked up cooking and going shopping with mom, but when she realized she wanted to be an astrophysicist, she just learned all the math from 6th grade through calculus and beyond in a semester on her own, and is now studying Physics at an Ivy League school. What have I been doing killing myself teaching my kids math systematically all these years? The stories are real! Here is proof! :rolleyes: When I think of all the bon bons I could have been eating instead... Sure, if you have an IQ of a highly gifted human being. I think what those stories are missing, is for "normal" people, such success without a good foundation won't be possible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) Sure, if you have an IQ of a highly gifted human being. I think what those stories are missing, is for "normal" people, such success without a good foundation won't be possible. Exactly. Which is why I decided to forgo the bonbons... ;) What she's not seeing is that her whole "anyone can learn physics, it's easy, look what I did" is the exact same argument used by the people (apparently like her parents) who argue: why teach higher level math, because anyone can learn it when they decide they need it. So she's actually offering the apocryphal proof for what she thinks she's arguing against. They are both predicated on the same fallacy, that 'anyone can do this because one person did.' She obviously is very highly gifted AND is also driven. For the vast majority of people, this is not how things turn out with those same inputs. Edited October 25, 2017 by Matryoshka 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3andme Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 "I was homeschooled by my mother until I was around 12 or 13, and then, when she had to return to work and enrolled my younger siblings in public school, I began working full-time instead of going to school." Hmmm. I'm not sure how she was legally working full-time from 13/14 unless she was doing so under the table or through some online job. Not to take away from her accomplishments, but I do think there may be some revisionist history/hyperbole going on in her background. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I wonder why she didn't go to school as well? Did she need to help support the family financially? In the NYT article, it says she worked as a nanny and stable hand to support the family. I don't know her at all, but I have no reason to doubt what she says. It would be really interesting to see what happened to her other siblings. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Hmmm. I'm not sure how she was legally working full-time from 13/14 unless she was doing so under the table or through some online job. Not to take away from her accomplishments, but I do think there may be some revisionist history/hyperbole going on in her background. In California there are these exclusions permitting a minor to work without a work permit “Minors who are self-employed do not require permits. Minors irregularly employed in odd jobs in private homes, such as baby-sitting, lawn mowing, and leaf raking, do not need to obtain a Permit to Employ and Work. [18 Ops. Cal. Atty. Gen. 114, August 31, 1951] Minors engaged in the sale and distribution of newspapers or magazines are often self-employed, and thus do not require permits. Minors who are at least 14 years of age and employed to deliver newspapers to consumers do not require permits, whether or not they are self-employed. [EC 49112 (d)]†https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/ChildLaborLawPamphlet.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) She is also the lady in the Uber scandal that is going to be made into a movie. Susan Fowler’s Uber harassment story is being made into a movie https://www.engadget.com/2017/10/23/susan-fowler-s-terrible-experience-at-uber-is-being-made-into-a/ “Earlier this year, Susan Fowler wrote a blog post describing her sexual harassment at Uber and revealed disturbing details about the company's sexist environment. That post would lead to an independent investigation of Uber's practices, the firing of over 20 employees and, eventually, to former CEO Travis Kalanick's resignation. For many women in Silicon Valley, Fowler's blog post was the shot heard around the world; a catalyst for change in a toxic culture. And now, Fowler's story will be a movie. That tidbit was first revealed in a New York Times profile on Fowler this past weekend, but Deadline Hollywood has more details on the film. The production company that landed the story is called Good Universe, and Fowler is said to be involved in the making of the movie. †Her blog post on her year at Uber https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber Edited October 25, 2017 by Arcadia 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Not to take away from her accomplishments, but I do think there may be some revisionist history/hyperbole going on in her background. From one of the links: "Up until a year and a half ago, I had never studied physics. Ever. In addition, I had learned nothing beyond sixth grade math: no algebra, no trig, no geometry, no calculus – nothing.....It wasn’t until a year ago today that I realized I actually wanted to study physics for the rest of my life. Six months in, I decided to take a course on quantum field theory. " The lowest quantum field theory class I can find at Penn is 601. file:///C:/Users/HS%20Boss/Downloads/PHYS%20(3).pdf Maybe I am completely wrong, but wouldn't quantum 1 and 2 be pre-reqs for a 600 level physics class? Quantum 2 would require quantum 1, quantum 1 would require physics 2, physics 2 would require physics 1 which at UPenn requires a pre-req of cal 1. That is one accelerated pace of courses for someone who a yr and a half prior had no math beyond 6th grade. Maybe 601 is just a special topics type of class that any non-major in any dept can take. I am not used to those types of courses being grad level classes, so I have no idea. Or maybe she was referencing quantum in general? That would be more along the lines of cal a yr and a half ago. Physics 1 a yr ago. Physics 2 6 months ago. Quantum now. Even that would be an accelerate achievement for her to jump directly into cal 1. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 Whoa. This thread went into all sorts of different tangents.... I posted this because I admired her story of moving from unconventional (shall we say?) education to college to having multifaceted interests and expertise plus a moral center. I probably should have titled the post differently, though. Yes, she's clearly brilliant, but I think wide-ranging curiosity and "can do" attitude towards learning are benefits of homeschooling at any IQ level, assuming the kids aren't in a rigidly-controlled cult or something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daijobu Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I was mostly impressed that she approached the president of Penn. I admire people who can do something like that, and good for her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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