Anyone know about cats and possible worms?

[lwilliams1922]

 

Early in the summer a cat showed up at our door step and looked extremely friendly and extremely hungry.

He just sat outside our door and every time we went in or out he was there. We initially thought he was someone’s pet and they would eventually find him. DD put up signs but there was no word of an owner.

A week later we did get some food and put out a dish for him on the porch where he spent most of his time. Over the weeks the kids and the cat got really close. The 12 year old fell in love, he tolerated the 3 yr old and he seemed to have a special bond with the one year old.

After a month or so he started slipping inside and would hang out in our kitchen for a couple hours at a time. Now it’s turned cold and he wants to stay inside.

We got a litter box but noticed his stools seem very odd. They are very loose and smell like something is not right.

I don’t know much about cats so I called my mom who said it sounds as if he might have worms.

Now here is our dilemma. The kids love this cat and we simply can’t afford to take him to the vet. I tried to explain to my 12 yr old that he is very sweet but we just can’t afford any additional expenses right now. She immediately asked if she could contact a local vet and offer to volunteer to work in exchange for checking and treating the cat.

I told her I didn’t think that was possible or else half of the people in town would be asking the same question.

So I have to decide… should we take him to the pound? I’m not sure how that process works, if the animals get treated by a vet or if they are just destroyed? Is there anything we can do at home to help him?

I looked on line and an article suggested that over the counter worm treatments just aren’t strong enough to work.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

thanks

[klmama]

I think your dd's idea is a good one, actually! Especially if she makes the call! You won't know until you ask!

 

Worms are often visible in the stool, so if you don't see white things in the stool or find dried up things on the floor that look like flat noodles, worms may not be a problem at all. The odd smell and texture could just be a reaction to the food you are giving him. Some foods just don't agree with cats, especially the less-known grocery store brands. It might be worth trying another food.

[lwilliams1922]

I think your dd's idea is a good one, actually! Especially if she makes the call! You won't know until you ask!

 

Worms are often visible in the stool, so if you don't see white things in the stool or find dried up things on the floor that look like flat noodles, worms may not be a problem at all. The odd smell and texture could just be a reaction to the food you are giving him. Some foods just don't agree with cats, especially the less-known grocery store brands. It might be worth trying another food.

 

We can see that he catches small animals as well. Would eating chimunks, rabbits,... cause worms?

 

We tried to put a collar with a bell on him to give the other animals some warning but he seems to get it off while he's out.

[hornblower]

I'd call around & see if anyone has a low cost clinic. Try to contact a local cat rescue and ask them. If you explain the situation, they may have some ideas.

 

Cats can wander very far too so it could be that there is someone looking for him. Does he have a tattoo? If he goes in to a vet, they can scan for a microchip which would id him.

 

Pounds vary from city to city. I'm in a no-kill area but most of the US is not 'no-kill' so after a short time at pounds, the animals are euthanized, except for the lucky few who get adopted.

 

With animals, I always say, it's not the getting, it's the keeping. Animals can be expensive. The cat needs to have a check up, be spayed/neutered, be de wormed, vaccinations up to date, and be de-flead. Depending where you live, you may need to keep up the deflea treatment monthly throughout the year, or just the summers. Then there's food & litter. It all adds up, sadly.

 

If you want to keep the cat, I'd put away $20/month each month so that when you need to go to the vet, there'll be some money saved up. That would be on top of food/litter/and monthly flea treatment. Can your kids get a paper route or some other job to help pay for the costs?

 

I do OTC worm my dog but I know what's around here & she sees a vet regularly. I don't OTC worm my cat - she's got a chronic illness & I can't mess with it.

[swellmomma]

around here, if you take a stray pet to the pound you can request that you receive the animal back if no owner is found, and often they have a vet check the pet out for free before giving it to you. I would have your dd call the vet and see, you may be pleasantly surprised. Or if you attend church, put out a call for someone who is a vet or has a family member that is a vet that could do a check up in return for volunteer hours.

[VaKim]

We can see that he catches small animals as well. Would eating chimunks, rabbits,... cause worms?

 

 

Yep. We do use the otc wormer, and it has always worked fine for us. I hate looking at the litter boxes after using it, but that is what kids are for. :D

[lwilliams1922]

Yep. We do use the otc wormer, and it has always worked fine for us. I hate looking at the litter boxes after using it, but that is what kids are for. :D

 

 

can you tell me what brand you use?

I think I may try that till we figure out the vet issue.

[motherofjoy]

I disagree that OTC wormers won't work for simple infestations. The vet will likely give you the same thing: Piperazine. Get any liquid wormer and use as directed. Reworm in 7 - 10 days, then again in another 7 - 10 days. If he continues to have runny stool, change to a lower ash cat food, one designed for indoor kitties.

[Jann in TX]

It would not hurt to call a local vet (or 2) and explain your situation. The actual 'de-worming' medicine is very inexpensive. A 'fecal' test should be around $20. I've rescued a few pets and sometimes I've been able to convince the vet to run the fecal test if I brought in a fresh sample (you can refrigerate if it is left the night before--just keep in zip-lock bag--spoonful size sample). Last summer the kitty I helped cost under $40--vet waived the office visit fee and did NOT do a complete physical.

 

There is a great natural product that you can purchase called Parazap. I've used this with our lizards (also known to get parasites/worms) and with other rescued cats and dogs. For cats I just mix in a small amount into a spoon of wet food. Even the vet said this stuff was great--and easier on the tummies of the pets too. It will cost around $25 but will last a long time.

 

Most vets around here will run the fecal (poo) sample for you--should be under $20. If the vet will not give you meds without an office visit you might be able to take the results to a shelter and they may help you out by getting the meds to you.

 

While you are talking to the vet/shelter ask about low-cost or no-cost vaccination/spay/neuter clinics. Around here you get a cat neutered and also vaccinated for rabies for under $40 through these clinics. Once a year a local group hosts a no-cost day for the first ____ many pets.

[VaKim]

can you tell me what brand you use?

I think I may try that till we figure out the vet issue.

 

Not sure which brand it is, but I know it isn't Hartz. I don't use any Hartz products. It is another brand that Walmart here carries. They actually have a couple others, and both work well for those regular worms that outside cats get often. You just squirt it into a little canned food or tuna. Preferably when they are hungry so that they get it all.

[Soph the vet]

There are a number of intestinal parasites that could be causing a problem. A fecal exam, which would not cost much, would reveal most of them. At our clinic we will run a fecal and not insist on seeing the pet for dispensing dewormer or other meds if we have a valid client relationship. Most vets are reasonable and if you explain it is a stray they may do this too even if you have not been to their clinic.

Roundworms are visible often in the stool and look like spaghetti. OTC pyrantel pamoate works fine. Stay away from Hartz products in cats, too toxic, IMO.

Eating dead animals can result in a Giardia infection, a protozoa that causes runny stools, sometimes bloody, very common in strays, only seen half the time in a fecal exam. For this you need metronidazole, not OTC, but still cheap and worth the effort.

Tapeworms look like rice and the fecal is usually negative as the eggs don't show easily in the stool.

Coccidia, hookworms, and others are possibilities but less common.

If you are planning on adopting this cat, have the fecal done and go from there.

Soph

[lwilliams1922]

There are a number of intestinal parasites that could be causing a problem. A fecal exam, which would not cost much, would reveal most of them. At our clinic we will run a fecal and not insist on seeing the pet for dispensing dewormer or other meds if we have a valid client relationship. Most vets are reasonable and if you explain it is a stray they may do this too even if you have not been to their clinic.

Roundworms are visible often in the stool and look like spaghetti. OTC pyrantel pamoate works fine. Stay away from Hartz products in cats, too toxic, IMO.

Eating dead animals can result in a Giardia infection, a protozoa that causes runny stools, sometimes bloody, very common in strays, only seen half the time in a fecal exam. For this you need metronidazole, not OTC, but still cheap and worth the effort.

Tapeworms look like rice and the fecal is usually negative as the eggs don't show easily in the stool.

Coccidia, hookworms, and others are possibilities but less common.

If you are planning on adopting this cat, have the fecal done and go from there.

Soph

 

 

thank you sooooo much.

I never thought we could ask to just do a stool test.

 

my 12 yr old has always been an animal lover. She would bring home any and every animal she came across.

 

There was one time I caved in and took a cat to a vet for her to get checked. The bill was well over $100 for the visit and all the tests. At the time I was working so I just moaned and paid the bill. Now that i'm not working I need to know up front what's involved.

 

Cat doesnt look ill at all but he is thin. and DH has had to remove a few ticks.

 

I will call today and see what the local vet's office says.

thanks!

 

life lesson:

don't let your kids name animals you can't keep. :(

Edited October 22, 2008 by lwilliams1922

[Soph the vet]

Make it clear to them that this is a stray and you would like to just bring in the fecal for exam and would they be willing to treat based on that.

Hope he does ok. And make sure the kids are washing their hands well after playing with him.:D

[lwilliams1922]

Make it clear to them that this is a stray and you would like to just bring in the fecal for exam and would they be willing to treat based on that.

Hope he does ok. And make sure the kids are washing their hands well after playing with him.:D

 

I just called the vet in town.

The receptionist said stray or not, they would not do anything without an exam. :( Her tone gave me the impression she was not open to hearing DD's offer to voulenteer.

 

I also asked her about the shelters in the area. She said they try to find homes but they are not no kill. :(

 

I'm looking at plan B

 

either http://parazap.com/

 

or OTC dewormer?

 

I did give him some probiotics (kefir) this morning. He eats almost anything.

Edited October 22, 2008 by lwilliams1922
added

[dawn of ns]

I think your dd's idea is a good one, actually! Especially if she makes the call! You won't know until you ask!

 

I'll second this. What a delight for a vet to get a call from a responsible kid wanting to do the right thing by both the animal and him/her. I bet this would work.

[hornblower]

I can't find the post now but the vet blog www.dolittler.com talked about this a while back & she said the liability for vets is waaay too high to allow children to volunteer.

 

She was sad about that because she had done it herself when she was young....

 

But perhaps they could offer to barter some other services - wash car, rake leaves etc?

[Soph the vet]

I can't find the post now but the vet blog www.dolittler.com talked about this a while back & she said the liability for vets is waaay too high to allow children to volunteer.

 

She was sad about that because she had done it herself when she was young....

 

But perhaps they could offer to barter some other services - wash car, rake leaves etc?

It really depends on the age of the child and what the clinic is allowing them to do. We have high schoolers that will "shadow" but they are not allowed much hands on stuff. I have taken a couple of high schoolers with me to work from our co-op and let them do a bit.

If an owner comes in with a pet and kids in tow, the kids are NOT allowed to restrain the animal while I am looking at it, they must be over 18.

Often there are opportunities for older kids to clean cages, walk dogs, etc. but they need to be at least 16 and an employee of the practice to do much beyond that.

[Soph the vet]

:D

I just called the vet in town.

The receptionist said stray or not, they would not do anything without an exam. :( Her tone gave me the impression she was not open to hearing DD's offer to voulenteer.

 

I also asked her about the shelters in the area. She said they try to find homes but they are not no kill. :(

 

I'm looking at plan B

 

either http://parazap.com/

 

or OTC dewormer?

 

I did give him some probiotics (kefir) this morning. He eats almost anything.

That's a bummer. Want to come to Minnesota?;) I would try the OTC dewormer, like pyrantel (Strongid or Nemex) if you can find it. I am concerned that if the cat has Giardia you can't treat that without Metronidazole or Panacur. You may find that you end up bringing in the cat for an exam. Or try calling a few other vets:D.

[Annie Laurie]

I second what someone mentioned about finding a low cost clinic and enquiring with a rescue group about where to find one if you need help. I had a stray cat come around a lot and then show up at my door pregnant so I couldn't leave her outside. She had 5 kittens so at one point I was paying for 6 cats to be examined and for their deworming meds and such. I found a rescue group and they gave me the deworming meds free and told me how to dose them (in exhange for me being the foster home for them until they could place them). Then I found a low cost clinic in our area for their vaccinations and another one who spayed and neutered all the cats for something really low that I can't remember exactly- $30 or so. I had to search and call around a lot.

 

If you find you can't keep the cat, I would look into placing it with a rescue group before taking it to a shelter. You can go here http://www.pgaa.com/rescues.html and scroll down to find a link for each state, then you'll find lists of groups in your area. Or go to www.petfinder.com and click on "animal shelters" and you can enter your location and get a list of rescue groups, as well as shelters, but most shelters are not no-kill. I had a huge list and called and emailed for awhile before I got a response from someone.

[hornblower]

:D I would try the OTC dewormer, like pyrantel (Strongid or Nemex) if you can find it. I am concerned that if the cat has Giardia you can't treat that without Metronidazole or Panacur.

 

But Panacur is OTC isn't it? I use it OTC on my ***** but maybe that's just in Canada? I didn't know it works on giardia - that's good to know though giardia incidence is fairly low where I am.

 

oh sorry about the asterix - I used the proper name for my female dog; forgot that word is verboten here :tongue_smilie:

[StephanieZ]

It is illegal and unethical for a vet to dispense any prescription medication (as most dewormers they dispense are) or to even *provide medical advice* without a valid veterinary-client-patient-relationship (VCPR) which is generally minimally considered an exam within the past year. Asking a vet to disregard this principle is asking them to risk their licenses and their livelihood. . . Not a nice thing to ask someone!

 

If I came into your house or business and asked you to risk your family's home, your $200k education you're still paying for, and the livelihoods of all the people who work for you. . . all to save me $100-$500 or even $5000. . . well, anyway, no matter the reason, I don't think you'd take it kindly! People don't understand that asking a professional to violate ethical/legal standards is such a big deal, but it is huge. . . it isn't all within the vet's control and the consequences can be dire.

 

That said, your kitty needs a vet exam, some vaccines, and some parasite control. I'd budget $80-150 to get these basics in hand. Call a couple reputable vets, describe the situation, and get an estimate for "basic wellness including exam, core vaccines, and parasite control". Then schedule to exam for a time when you can afford it. If the kids really want the cat, help them have a garage sale or do odd jobs for neighbors to pitch in. Or contribute birthday $ or whatever. . .

 

In most areas, your cat would be euthanasized quite quickly at the shelter, if not the same day. Sad, sad, sad reality and one of the reasons my dh's vet practice does adoptions to the extent we are able (one momma cat and 6 kittens looking for homes right now). . . We know that virtually every cat taken to the shelter is euthanisized same day in our community. . . Also a reason why spaying/neutering is essential.

 

In our state (WV), as in many, you OWN a cat as soon as you feed it. Same day. . .!!! Thus, you are also legally obligated to provide rabies vaccine (up to 60 days in jail if not!), and also appropriate medical care, etc. . . Don't know about your state, but something to consider. "Strays" are not stray any longer once you let them in your house and/or start feeding them (in some states anyhow).

 

Your local humane society may offer some $ assistance. Or your local shelter. Call them and ask! Some communities are much richer in those resources than others, and it never hurts to ask.

 

I don't think it is fair to ask your vet to do it for free or to subsidize you. There are too many animals in too much need. You don't ask your grocer for free groceries. . . Or McD for free food, or the gas station for free gas. . . Most vets do TONS of charity work and there is simply not enough to go around. It IS OK to be upfront about your $ limitations and your need to budget. This is a common issue and there is no shame in having limits! Many practices off forms of delayed payment such as CareCredit and any reasonable practice with good staff will be perfectly happy to help you get a good estimate and plan for expenses in a way to keep your costs as low as possible while providing the care needed in a safe way.

[lwilliams1922]

Stephanie,

 

It was not my intent to ask anyone to treat, dispense meds or give illegal advice. I apologize if my questions have offened anyone.

 

I was simply looking to hear from cat owners about how to help a stray cat without a huge expense.

 

No, I don't know the laws about feeding strays in this state, but If there were such a law here, my children would have owned more animals than I can count.

 

It's probably not the best idea but my kids have a strong love for animals and I'm sure they could have far more harmful traits.

 

I mentioned in an earlier post I did not think it was a good idea to negotiate with the vet. It was DD's idea and she may get such terrible notions from her parents unfortunately. :(

 

Many times we encounter people that ask for or need help. When ever possible we try to do so. We don't have a lot to give right now but I'm a firm believer of playing it forward.

[Soph the vet]

It is illegal and unethical for a vet to dispense any prescription medication (as most dewormers they dispense are) or to even *provide medical advice* without a valid veterinary-client-patient-relationship (VCPR) which is generally minimally considered an exam within the past year. Asking a vet to disregard this principle is asking them to risk their licenses and their livelihood. . . Not a nice thing to ask someone!

 

If I came into your house or business and asked you to risk your family's home, your $200k education you're still paying for, and the livelihoods of all the people who work for you. . . all to save me $100-$500 or even $5000. . . well, anyway, no matter the reason, I don't think you'd take it kindly! People don't understand that asking a professional to violate ethical/legal standards is such a big deal, but it is huge. . . it isn't all within the vet's control and the consequences can be dire.

 

That said, your kitty needs a vet exam, some vaccines, and some parasite control. I'd budget $80-150 to get these basics in hand. Call a couple reputable vets, describe the situation, and get an estimate for "basic wellness including exam, core vaccines, and parasite control". Then schedule to exam for a time when you can afford it. If the kids really want the cat, help them have a garage sale or do odd jobs for neighbors to pitch in. Or contribute birthday $ or whatever. . .

 

In most areas, your cat would be euthanasized quite quickly at the shelter, if not the same day. Sad, sad, sad reality and one of the reasons my dh's vet practice does adoptions to the extent we are able (one momma cat and 6 kittens looking for homes right now). . . We know that virtually every cat taken to the shelter is euthanisized same day in our community. . . Also a reason why spaying/neutering is essential.

 

In our state (WV), as in many, you OWN a cat as soon as you feed it. Same day. . .!!! Thus, you are also legally obligated to provide rabies vaccine (up to 60 days in jail if not!), and also appropriate medical care, etc. . . Don't know about your state, but something to consider. "Strays" are not stray any longer once you let them in your house and/or start feeding them (in some states anyhow).

 

Your local humane society may offer some $ assistance. Or your local shelter. Call them and ask! Some communities are much richer in those resources than others, and it never hurts to ask.

 

I don't think it is fair to ask your vet to do it for free or to subsidize you. There are too many animals in too much need. You don't ask your grocer for free groceries. . . Or McD for free food, or the gas station for free gas. . . Most vets do TONS of charity work and there is simply not enough to go around. It IS OK to be upfront about your $ limitations and your need to budget. This is a common issue and there is no shame in having limits! Many practices off forms of delayed payment such as CareCredit and any reasonable practice with good staff will be perfectly happy to help you get a good estimate and plan for expenses in a way to keep your costs as low as possible while providing the care needed in a safe way.

The valid vet-client-patient relationship was mentioned in my posts. The bottom line is this is a stray cat and I am a realist. If I knew this client and we had a valid relationship I would do a fecal for them cat unseen and dispense appropriate meds. I was hoping that her vet knew her and would do the same given that the alternative would most likely result in a cat getting euthanized. I appreciate you sticking up for the veterinary profession but I don't think you needed to be that hard on the OP. This kind of thing happens quite often and given a valid relationship I have no legal problem handling it as I said.