The Silver Branch. Is this book going to get better??

[BatmansWife]

We are doing BookShark level 6 (similar to Sonlight G) and right now the read aloud is The Silver Branch.  Oh.my.goodness.  I don't know how much longer I can take it  We are half way through.  I have 10 more chapters to go.  I don't know that I can take 10 more nights of reading this book.  It's not that I don't like the story...it's ok.  There have even been a couple of times when we've laughed at funny comments Flavius makes.  But this author has such a strange style of writing.  It seems to take her so long to get to the point of what she's trying to say (which is starting to feel like this post of mine, LOL!), and she makes it so complicated to get there.  We aren't used to this style at all.  I consider myself a very good reader.  But I often am tripping up on the sentences.  They do not flow easy for me at all.  The chapters are very long too...so when I finish reading I am exhausted. I have to stop a lot and reword what I just read so that my daughter can understand it.  I'm just a bit mind boggled as to why this book is even included.  It is sooo not an easy read...at least for me.

 

Is this book going to be worth finishing??  Does it ever get good? And I know those questions are a matter of opinion.  I'm considering reading the rest to myself (which is easier and faster for me than reading out loud) and seeing if it's worth finishing out loud.  Like I said, we are half way through and my daughter really hasn't gotten much of anything out of it....other than that Justin and Flavius are cousins who tried to warn the emperor who wouldn't listen to them and now he's been killed and they are off to find Ceasar Constantius and I don't know why.  LOL!  If anyone wonders what the style of writing is like that I'm trying to explain, here's an example:

 

"As the days went by, Justin got used to the great fortress that was the heart and headquarters of Carausius's defense against the Saxons. Under the tall grey pharos that had once been triumphant with bronze and gleaming marble, the galleys and the merchantmen came and went; and all day behind the noises of the fortress, behind the parade-ground voices and the trumpets of the tramp of marching feet sounded the ring and rasp of adze and hammer from the dockyard below he rampart walls. And behind the hum of the busy dockyard sounded always the sea."  

 

So I read that paragraph and immediately my daughter is like, "What??"  So I have to try to paraphrase something like, "Justin is beginning to get used to the area where he was sent to work, even though it's very noisy with all the people and the sound of the sea".  

 

But when the entire book is written like this...it feels time consuming, difficult, and not at all very enjoyable.  I'm wondering if anyone else has felt this way about this book.  If I would do a poll, I'd ask:

 

Did you stick it out and were glad you did?

Did you stick it out and regretted it...thought it was a waste of time?

Did you just quit reading it and moved on to the next book?  

Is this an awesome book and I'm just clueless?  

Edited December 22, 2016 by BatmansWife

[Momto6inIN]

I very much enjoyed the whole series ... but I read them all to myself and definitely would not have liked to read them aloud. Rosemary Sutcliff writes beautifully but she can be hard to follow, especially aloud.

 

I don't know what grade level Bookshark 6/Sonlight G are and/or what grade level your DS is, but my kids read the series in high school as a fun historical fiction component of their ancient world history/lit.

 

Maybe shelve it til she's older?

[Butter]

It was the best of the Roman Britain trilogy IMO.  I still didn't love it.  I just really, really disliked the other two.

[BatmansWife]

I very much enjoyed the whole series ... but I read them all to myself and definitely would not have liked to read them aloud. Rosemary Sutcliff writes beautifully but she can be hard to follow, especially aloud.

 

I don't know what grade level Bookshark 6/Sonlight G are and/or what grade level your DS is, but my kids read the series in high school as a fun historical fiction component of their ancient world history/lit.

 

Maybe shelve it til she's older?

This level of BkSk is for ages 11 - 13.  My daughter just turned 13.  

 

I was on the BkSk FB page and someone using this level is having her daughter read this book on her own; as a reader.  I can't imagine.  

 

It was the best of the Roman Britain trilogy IMO.  I still didn't love it.  I just really, really disliked the other two.

Wow...you read all three?   :001_smile:   Being the best of a trilogy when you really, really disliked the other two doesn't seem like it would be a very high rating after all.  LOL!    

[kiwik]

I loved all Rosemary Sutcliffe but not sure I would read them aloud to a 13 year old. I read them at about 11 I think and found them relatively easy. At 13 a book not being her thing shouldn't prevent her reading it for school - although I never did finish The Call of the Wild now that is a painful book.

Edited December 21, 2016 by kiwik

[BatmansWife]

I loved all Rosemary Sutcliffe but not sure I would read them aloud to a 13 year old. I read them at about 11 I think and found them relatively easy. At 13 a book not being her thing shouldn't prevent her reading it for school - although I never did finish The Call of the Wild now that is a painful book.

Do you think 13 is too old to be read aloud to (just not sure what you were saying)?  Next year is the last level for read-alouds.  My daughter doesn't know that yet...she'll really miss that.  

 

A reason I am hesitating just shelving the book is because I don't want to give her the idea that if a book isn't very good, or boring, or hard to read that it's ok to just quit it.  There have been a couple of read-alouds over the last few years that she strongly disliked but we kept going and she ended up just loving those books.  This one...I don't know.  

[HomeAgain]

My kids get more out of reading to themselves than me reading to them.  Certain books are read alouds, yes, but some we each get a copy as I read.  The Wizard of Oz series is very easy to follow when listening, for example, but the Jungle Books require more effort.  We each have a copy of those so he can read as he listens.  The Silver Branch might be one you should consider getting an extra copy of.

[kiwik]

Do you think 13 is too old to be read aloud to (just not sure what you were saying)? Next year is the last level for read-alouds. My daughter doesn't know that yet...she'll really miss that.

 

A reason I am hesitating just shelving the book is because I don't want to give her the idea that if a book isn't very good, or boring, or hard to read that it's ok to just quit it. There have been a couple of read-alouds over the last few years that she strongly disliked but we kept going and she ended up just loving those books. This one...I don't know.

No I don't think 13 is too old to be read to. I usually pick read aloud above my children's reading level and some books are just not meant to be read aloud. What I would do in this case if you want to read it aloud is read multiple chapters a day. It isn't that long a book and it would drag less if you read it more quickly. I admit though I never read one chapter a day as I find it too painful to read a book that way. I would read a chapter every time you eat and finish it in 2-3 days. Edited December 21, 2016 by kiwik

[MerryAtHope]

Next year is the last level for read-alouds.  My daughter doesn't know that yet...she'll really miss that.  

 

 

I used Sonlight and we didn't get to read this one (it wasn't scheduled). I don't love Rosemary Sutcliff's writing, but usually find the books do have value and are worthwhile reading. But I wanted to say that I read aloud to my kids throughout high school--you don't have to stop just because Sonlight or Bookshark don't schedule books as "read-alouds." I found Sonlight cores to be packed full, and it helped to pick and choose some of them to do as read-alouds. (I also was more eclectic in high school and sometimes chose books I just wanted to read to my kids, whether it was "on the list" or not.) Anyway--there's definitely value in reading aloud (we tackled some harder books this way, like Scarlet Letter and Huckleberry Finn). Since she enjoys this time with you, there's no need to drop it :-).

Edited December 21, 2016 by MerryAtHope

[Ausmumof3]

There are sentence inversions in that bit you posted. I think the extra descriptiveness adds historical value but some of the sentences could be arranged a bit more clearly. I really enjoyed the audio tapes we had of her books, but I've never tried reading them aloud.

[Bluegoat]

I've not read that book, but for some books I've found it's worthwhile to buy them recorded versions, because I know they will be tricky for me to read well. 

[BatmansWife]

Thanks everyone...I've gotten some very good suggestions!  I like the idea of having an extra copy...at least of some of the more difficult books to read...so she can have a copy and follow along as I read.  With this book, I think that would have really been a good thing to do.  Audio's of books was another good idea.  And I love the idea of not stopping the read-alouds, even if the program's read-alouds come to an end.  We both really enjoy the read-alouds (for the most part  ;) ).  

[Lori D.]

Previous posters have given you some great thoughts and ideas, so I'll just go off on a bit of a tangent here with a completely side thought that is NOT meant at all to give anyone guilt or frustration, but just as a different perspective. :)

 

With that disclaimer (lol), I just wanted to comment on the passage quoted from The Silver Branch:

 

"As the days went by, Justin got used to the great fortress that was the heart and headquarters of Carausius's defense against the Saxons. Under the tall grey pharos that had once been triumphant with bronze and gleaming marble, the galleys and the merchantmen came and went; and all day behind the noises of the fortress, behind the parade-ground voices and the trumpets of the tramp of marching feet sounded the ring and rasp of adze and hammer from the dockyard below the rampart walls. And behind the hum of the busy dockyard sounded always the sea."  

 

So many contemporary books are all about plot, and the author's use of language is just for the purpose of advancing plot. Classics, most older books (19th century), and a few more contemporary authors, are also using language in complex and subtle ways, so that language is doing more than just advancing plot.

 

For example, in the passage from The Silver Branch, there are some lovely language things going on:

- use of sound devices* -- alliteration, assonance and rhythm -- so that in reading aloud, this passage has beautiful poetry to it

- sentence structure that forces you to slow down**, to subtly mirror the slow passage of days for Justin

- building up of the description of the place and the feel of the place, primary through sounds***

- capping of the passage of sound descriptions with a sentence that has an unusual word order so that the final words "always the sea" receives the emphasis, so that you feel the weight and permanence of the continual sound of the sea is what most defines this place and Justin's experience of this place****

 

* sound elements:

- alliteration:  Heart and Headquarters; TRumpets and TRamp; Ring and Rasp; beHind the hum

- assonance: nOISes/vOICes; rAsp/Adze/hAmmer; hEARt/CARausius; 

- consonance: CarauSiuS'S/defenSe/againSt/SaXonS

- rhythm (through patterns of stressed and unstressed syllables): came´ and went´; tramp´ of mar´ching feet´; the ring´ and rasp´ of adze´ and ham´mer; al´ways the sea´

 

** each sentence starts with a phrase and it becomes increasing longer into the sentence before you reach the subject and verb, which slows you down, and draws out the reading to mirror the drawing out of Justin's days

 

*** sensory descriptions (mostly sound/auditory):

- the noises of the fortress

- parade-ground voices

- trumpets

- tramp

- sounded the ring and rasp

- behind the hum

- sounded always the sea

 

**** unusual word order is used in the second clause of the previous sentence; this is actually a very clever language use, as the author kept gradually pushing back the subject/verb to later in the sentence, until that clause, where it's not only very late in the clause, but she's also inverting so it appears as verb/subject, which she then mirrors in the last sentence:

 

#1 = 5-word phrase, then subject/verb: Justin got used to

#2, clause #1 = 15 word phrase, then subject/verb: galleys and merchant came and went

#2, clause #2 = TWO phrases (9-word, then 14-word), finally verb/subject: sounded the ring and rasp

#3, 8-word phrase, then verb/adverb/subject: sounded always the sea

 

 

Of course, seeing/hearing/understanding all of that is not something most students naturally do, so you have to "train the ear" and practice the "reading eye" and adjust the pace and expectation of some books here and there to begin to see those types of things that are going on. One way to practice might be to introduce a weekly "poetry and tea" time into the schedule. Or sometimes instead of poetry, aloud-reading of short passages from older classics and what you see going on in the passage with the language use, to start getting used to and enjoy, more complex writing and language use. :) Just a thought! :)

 

Wishing you all an enjoy journey through Literature, and an ever-increasing enjoyment and appreciation of the fine-crafting of language. :) Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Lori D.

[KrissiK]

We didn't get to The Silver Branch. I read Eagle of the Ninth to DS when he was a sixth grader. He likes it, but not enough to go on to the other books. We do love Rosemary Suttcliffe's books, though. I'm reading Black Ships Before Troy to DD and she really enjoys it.

 

On another note, I don't believe there is any age limit on being read aloud to. I used to teach jr. High English and the only time my classroom was dead silent was when I read aloud to the kids. They loved it. My own 8th grade son who is in b&m school has conned me in to reading aloud to him every night now. He's an extremely difficult child, can't sit still, always causing trouble, but he would listen to me read to him for an hour if I could last that long. Usually it's about 25 minutes. Right now I'm reading SE Hinton's "The Outsiders", which I believe to be the quintessential 8th grade book. He can't get enough of it.

[BatmansWife]

Well, I decided not to give it up.  We've read two more chapters.  I can say at this point in the book....it's actually getting a little bit better.  I feel that the first half of the book really dragged and seemed to go nowhere.  The 2nd half has more to it, and I have high hopes that it will stay that way.  We'll finish it and then I'll give an update.  

[BatmansWife]

For example, in the passage from The Silver Branch, there are some lovely language 

 

Thanks for your post.  I do agree, actually.  While reading this book, I've often thought how this or that was an interesting way for her to word it....or how it really paints a picture.  It does get difficult reading this out loud though.  I'm still needing to explain nearly every page, or she would be lost.  

[BatmansWife]

I had forgotten that I said I'd do a quick update after we finished the book.  Well...what can I say??  My daughter is definitely not putting the book in her keeper pile.  Sorry.  I stuck to it and didn't give up (not sure that was the best decision though)...it seemed to get a little better...then went downhill again.  It was the hardest read-aloud I've read out loud so far...and it was the hardest book for my daughter to listen to.  I'm sooo glad that's over.  We are now reading A Single Shard and it's sooo good.  We are both really enjoying this book.  

Edited January 26, 2017 by BatmansWife

[Lori D.]

I had forgotten that I said I'd do a quick update after we finished the book.  Well...what can I say??  My daughter is definitely not putting the book in her keeper pile.  Sorry.  I stuck to it and didn't give up (not sure that was the best decision though)...it seemed to get a little better...then went downhill again.  It was the hardest read-aloud I've read out loud so far...and it was the hardest book for my daughter to listen to.  I'm sooo glad that's over.  We are now reading A Single Shard and it's sooo good.  We are both really enjoying this book.  

 

Thanks so much for the update. :)

 

I do understand from the reviews of others that of Sutcliff's Roman-Britain trilogy that Eagle of the Ninth is the most engaging of the three, while The Silver Branch and The Lantern Bearers frequently get the "meh" reaction. ;)

 

 

Enjoy A Single Shard! :)

Edited January 26, 2017 by Lori D.

[tmstranger]

Loved A Single Shard!