Which science classes are high school level and which order?

[Janeway]

I thought I saw a post on this already, but I did a few searches and could not find them.

 

 

What classes would you consider being okay to be a high school level course and what sequences do you prefer and such?

 

Also, would physical science be a normal high school level course? Here, where I live, it is only allowed when the student is in special education or something. But, I have noticed that the chemistry and physics classes are not exactly that heavy hitter anyway. I have seen the books and assignments for those subjects at the public schools and I can honestly say, it is more like what a middle schooler would do, only spread across the entire year.

[charlotteb]

Typically, Physical Science is covered in 8th grade, but can also be 9th.  Both of my older children did it in 8th, but my younger will do it in 9th because she needs a slower pace.  After Physical science, the normal course of study is Biology, Chemistry, and Physics. 

[need2read]

A lot of high schools are doing physical science in 9th grade. We did it in 8th and ds is doing Earth Science this year for 9th, which I also took in 9th grade. I really think that 9th is a transition year; some kids are ready for higher level classes, many are not so even a 7th or 8th grade level class may be more appropriate than a high school one. The ones I consider to really be high school level are Biology, Chemistry, and Physics, in that order (10-12). You really need more math skills for these subjects than most 9th graders have.

 

 

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[Amateur Actress]

At the PS here, Earth Science is the 9th grade science class. At the Christian school we took our son out of at the semester, Physical Science is the 9th grade science class. Either is a fine high school class. The PS here requires EITHER Chemistry OR Physics to graduate, but not both. For her 4th year science at the PS next year, dd is taking Physiology. So my dd's high school science sequence is:

9th-Earth Science; 10th-Biology; 11th-Physics; 12th-Physiology.

Edited March 21, 2016 by Amateur Actress

[Crimson Wife]

Physical science is typical for the gen ed track but not usually taken on the college prep track.

 

Some high schools in my area have switched to a "physics first" sequence using Hewitt's Conceptual Physics. The local Catholic girls' school has this. Students then take bio in 10th, chem in 11th, and then either no science or an AP course in 12th. This school does not offer a general ed track.

 

Our zoned high school has its college prep track students take bio in 9th, chem in 10th, algebra-based physics in 11th, and then either no science or an AP course in 12th. I haven't looked into the general ed track since both of my oldest 2 kids are college material.

[Dicentra]

From my perspective, any science course could be considered high school level - as long as the content it covered and the rigour of the coverage are at high school level.  On the flip side, any science course could also NOT be considered high school level if the content and rigour aren't enough.  One could have a middle school chemistry course, for example, and still call it chemistry - it just wouldn't cover what a typical high school chemistry course would cover and you couldn't use it to list as "Chemistry" on a high school transcript.  If you're unsure if a curriculum that you're considering is high school level or not and you don't see it listed in the pinned threads, you can post here and I'd be happy to help figure it out. :)

 

The sequence of high school science courses is math dependent - there's no right or wrong sequence.  If a student needs a few more years to develop solid algebra skills, then biology in 9th is a good choice followed by chem and then physics (or however many sciences your student requires/wants).  If a student's algebra skills are solid by Grade 9, then physics in 9th can be a good choice.  Conceptual physics in 9th can also work if a student's math skills are weaker but I think (and folks should definitely correct me if I'm wrong!) that even a conceptual physics course will require some math.

 

I think the physical science question is probably dependent on where you live and what your student's post-secondary goals are.

[OneStepAtATime]

I agree with above (and am having to determine the same things).  It is more determined by the level of the content than the topic.  There are High School level Astronomy courses that are quite rigorous.  There are High School level courses in Oceanography that are quite rigorous.  You could also do those same subjects at Middle School or Elementary level.  There are a lot of kids who can do chemistry in middle school but if the material is middle school level then it isn't High School material.  If they do that same material in High School it is still not High School level material.  Of course, the level of rigor even for some materials labeled High School can vary widely, from what I have seen.

 

Ask yourself the following:

1.  Where are your student's math skills at?  High School level science material frequently requires higher math skills.

2.  What materials are you considering using?  Are they actually High School level?  

3.  What are the requirements for graduation in your area?

4.  What is your student's expectations for beyond High School?

5.  Is a 4 year college something in the future?  Possible STEM major?  Those two questions would definitely affect what to use and which topics should be covered, as far as I can tell.  

 

Typical progression for High School, as far as I have seen, is Biology, Chemistry, Physics and sometimes a 4th science, either in 9th or 12th.  Some places do an integrated Physics/Chemistry for 9th that is less rigorous, with less math required then Chemistry and Physics are revisited with more advanced materials and math requirements later on.

[Penelope]

It seems like it varies. I'm thinking, though, that more selective schools would not like to see physical science in high school, but that there are plenty of less selective schools for which it would not matter as much, as long as the student went on to take bio, chem, physics.

 

I feel like the term "college prep" depends a lot on what sort of college you are talking about.

[Crimson Wife]

  Conceptual physics in 9th can also work if a student's math skills are weaker but I think (and folks should definitely correct me if I'm wrong!) that even a conceptual physics course will require some math.

 

Hewitt's Conceptual Physics requires pre-algebra.

[Crimson Wife]

 

I feel like the term "college prep" depends a lot on what sort of college you are talking about.

 

"College prep" would be starting at a 4 year school rather than the CC + transfer route.

 

[OneStepAtATime]

"College prep" would be starting at a 4 year school rather than the CC + transfer route.

 

...which still leaves some ambiguity since 4 year university admissions requirements/expectations can vary between schools with regard to what science they want taken in High School.

[Penelope]

"College prep" would be starting at a 4 year school rather than the CC + transfer route.

 

Right, but there are four year schools that take very average students. Pretty much the only requirement is an average SAT score and a reasonable GPA. In that case, it probably depends on the state graduation requirements and if physical science counts as a science, then that wouldn't matter. Also, there are colleges that only require three sciences in high school, anyway.

 

So I wouldn't consider that class college prep for my own children, but standards vary.

 

What is probably more limiting to your potential college pool than taking physical science in ninth grade, though, is to consider physical science AS one of only three lab sciences to check off the science boxes.

Edited March 21, 2016 by Penelope

[LisaKinVA]

Standard sequence in most high schools (areas I've lived in) is:

 

Physical/Earth in 9th with Algebra 1

Biology in 10th with Geometry

Chemistry in 11th -- stopping here is fine for many or most colleges (not usually tippy-top) would be fine for science (taken with Algebra 2, but you'd need more math, usually)

Physics or an AP science in 12th  -- this is still a college-prep sequence. With Precalculus

 

Standard "Accelerated" progression would be:

 

Biology in 9th with Geometry

Chemistry in 10th with Algebra 2

Physics or AP in 11th with Precalculus 

Physics or AP in 12th with Calculus

 

What is at issue is the math required -- not the science.  The science simply usually needs to fit within the parameters of Physical (Earth/Space/Environmental, Chemistry, Physics) or Biological (Biology,Marine Biology, Forensic Science?, Anatomy and Physiology, Veterinary Science, Equine Science, Botany...).  College prep is usually at least two lab sciences, and usually at least 3 sciences total (but many are fine with just two lab science).

 

My oldest son will have completed Physics, Chemistry, AP Physics and AP Biology in high school (he had IPC and Biology prior to high school, and he'll get credit for those, too).

My oldest daughter will complete: AP Physics, AP Biology, Marine Biology with Oceanography, Organic Chemistry, and probably another biological science or possibly AP Environmental, it depends what we have available to us at that point.

 

All of this is to say there isn't one set course one has to go to be "on track" for college prep.  There are also courses that aren't traditional courses that will fit within the general parameters. 

 

Edited March 22, 2016 by LisaK in VA is in IT

[TN Mama]

I think what is most important is not what everyone here thinks is a high school science class, but instead what the college/university your dc would likely be attending considers college prep. 

I have looked at various 4 year institutions (private, public, large, small, selective, not-so-much) and made note of what they are looking for from freshman applicants. From that I have made our high school plan.

Now, I have no earthly idea exactly where my daughter will go to college, but I feel like I have a good grasp of what the schools (or the types of schools) she's most likely to apply to are looking for. 

[Targhee]

Lots of good answers here. I completely agree that content is essential, not just the title of the class. And I agree that math application within the course is also important.

 

So far I hear people mention Physical Science or Earth Science (as less college-prep oriented classes), Biology, Chemistry, and Physics, plus their respective AP classes. There are a number of additional courses you could add and still be college-prep. The key, I think, for the average college-prep track is to get the three biggies (Bio, Chem, Physics) done and at least 2 with labs. Additionally you could do Environmental Science (there is an AP option for this as well), Marine Bio, or a Bio-Medical class.

 

There are a few classes which may seem like science classes but generally are not considered science class - Psychology and Computer Science are two that come to mind. "Engineering" classes which consist mainly of drafting and shop/tech work are also not usually considered sciences for graduation Andy college admission purposes.

[AngieW in Texas]

The name of the course isn't what determines the difficulty level. I have taught biology and it was named just "biology" at a very low level for a modified biology student and at an honors level with the exact same name. Colleges could tell the difference between the two because of the way they were encoded on the transcript and students who take modified courses cannot go straight to university. They have to take classes at the community college first. But a layman would not be able to see the difference.

 

I am teaching IPC and IPC Studies right now. My IPC Studies students are in the same class as my IPC students. They all get the same input, but the modified students get their output modified and they get help when they are testing.

 

At the school where I taught last year the sequence for all students was:

9th - IPC

10th - Biology

11th - Chemistry

12th - Physics

Aquatic Science and Environmental Science were available as electives.

Last year was the first year that Texas public school students were allowed to take just 3 years of science instead of 4. I was at a dropout prevention school, so our kids were all older students and fell under the old graduation plans.

 

At the neighboring school, the sequence was:

9th - Environmental Science

10th - Biology

11th - Chemistry

12th - Physics

other sciences available as electives

 

Where I am teaching this year (only three years of science required), the kids who struggled with math or science in 8th grade take:

9th - IPC

10th - Biology

11th - Chemistry

other sciences available as electives

 

The kids who started with Biology, but struggled take:

9th - Biology

10th - IPC

11th - Chemistry

 

The rest of the students take:

9th - Biology

10th - Chemistry

11th - Physics

 

The two plans just above this are also used for another school where I interviewed.

 

My oldest did:

9th - Biology (Miller and Levine, way more difficult than I wanted for her, not into science at all)

10th - Chemistry ( used Spectrum Chemistry)

11th - started with Giancoli Physics and switched to Conceptual Physics midway

12th - took one semester each of General College Chemistry and General College Physics at the cc, both science classes were for nonmajors

 

My middle did:

9th - Holt Biology (really liked the text)

10th - Giancoli's Physics and the AP Physics B test

11th - Tro's Introductory Chemistry and the SAT-II test

12th - Chemistry I and Chemistry II for science majors at the cc

 

My youngest (struggles more with math and is both dyslexic and dysgraphic):

9th - Conceptual Physics

10th - Conceptual Chemistry

11th - Life on Earth (only biology course at cc she could take without placing into college algebra, no lab component)

12th - Geology (also at cc)

 

 

[AggieMama]

3 lab sciences with Biology and Chemistry or Physics is recommended where I come from. I would suggest Biology, Chemistry, and Physics for a typical student planning on going to college. If you have a STEM kiddo I would add at least one lab science in addition to Biology, Chemistry, and Physics.

[Ellie]

There was a time when only lab sciences were considered high school level. I don't know if that's still true or not.

[DebbS]

My daughter took Biology I, Biology II and Chemistry. Three lab sciences was all she needed.

 

Check the colleges that your student might be interested in and see what they require for admissions and then also what is required for programs that you might be interested in in terms of direct-admit with a declared major. Often times, a student is admitted without a declared major and then selects(or changes) their major in their sophomore or junior year. In this case, the high school courses won't even come into play because it's the college work that will matter.

 

BTW, I think physical science is fine for 9th grade. Especially if you plan on some kind of combination that includes something from Biology, Chemistry, Physics or Environmental for 10th through 12th.

Edited March 28, 2016 by DebbS