What to do with a kid who doesn't retain grammar????

[GinaPagnato]

I need help. Well, my 7th grader needs help.

 

I've done grammar study with this child year after year, every year, ad nauseam. We did FLL, Rod and Staff, dabbled in Analytical Grammar, went back to Rod and Staff, etc.

 

He seriously can't tell me the parts of speech. Now, if I ask him to list the prepositions, he can recite them from memory. He can recite from memory the definition of an adjective and an adverb. But he can't identify them in a sentence.

 

example: "Johnny lost his hat."

me: "What part of speech is 'his'?"

dc: "Possession?"

me: "Well, yes, 'his' is showing possession. But what part of speech is it?"

dc: "Verb? Subject? Adverb? Adjective? I have no idea."

me: "What's the definition of a pronoun?"

dc: "A pronoun is a word that takes the place of a noun."

<<crickets>>

me: :banghead:

dc: :huh:

 

I need a short, thorough something-or-other to drill this into my kid's brain. He doesn't have this issue in other subjects, so it's not a learning disability or anything. But clearly the grammar study we've done hasn't taken root.

 

Suggestions? He's got so much logic stage work and classes that I can't see spending oodles of time on a separate grammar curriculum, considering the fact that grammar is being covered in his English class (albeit lightly--but that's because in 7th grade kids are SUPPOSED to be able to identify PRONOUNS, for cripes' sake!!)

:glare:

 

So, what should we try? And do you know of a cheap (FREE?) website or workbook that gets the job done?

 

TIA!

[Kristie in Florida]

Oh gosh. I wish I could help and I will be lurking here for your replies! I was banging my head yesterday because my daughter kept writing pronouns down thinking they were nouns. Her assignment was to write down the words that were acting as nouns so she got confused. (Like gerunds.)

Edited December 7, 2015 by Kristie in Florida

[almondbutterandjelly]

Well, I can understand his confusion.  It's a pronoun that is behaving like an adjective.  I think he may know more than you're giving him credit for.  It's just these tricky nuances of grammar that actually don't make a ton of sense.  It's diagrammed like an adjective, so personally I think it's more adjective than pronoun.

 

I like Seton for Grammar, but you also might consider a quick run through of MCT's Grammar Island.

 

 

 

 

[sbgrace]

MCT's grammar, particularly the Practice Island and Practice Town books, seemed to help my weak grammar retention child. I think it was the day in and out repetition of marking up those sentences. CLE LA with all the spiral it has seems to be sticking. It includes lots of practical sentence editing/punctuation type work too.

 

Another angle, though, is to think about what's really important. Does he really need to be able to label the parts of speech?  I would focus on sentence combining type grammar as that has been shown to improve writing.  I linked an inexpensive program that does that in my sig/the only one I've found. It does teach diagramming and parts of speech too. I'd do some kind of editing type work--maybe Evan Moore Paragraph Editing books or MCT Fix It beginning with book 3 perhaps--I think books 1 and 2 are too easy.

Edited December 8, 2015 by sbgrace

[maize]

Does he speak and write grammatically?

 

If so, I personally would let it go. There's more to life--and English studies--than analyzing parts of speech.

[dollhouse]

Does he speak and write grammatically?

 

If so, I personally would let it go. There's more to life--and English studies--than analyzing parts of speech.

 

Agreed--and I worked as an editor before I had kids. It's more important to be able to write and speak well than to be able to label parts of speech or diagram a sentence. The only time I ever needed to do that professionally was when a sentence needed rewriting and the writer *really* needed to be persuaded. As long as your child is at the point where he or she can tell if something doesn't sound write and fix it, I wouldn't sweat it.

[kbutton]

I would try MCT Town for a conceptual overview.

 

You might also like Winston Grammar cards--they have kind of a procedure to them with hints. 

[GinaPagnato]

Agreed--and I worked as an editor before I had kids. It's more important to be able to write and speak well than to be able to label parts of speech or diagram a sentence. The only time I ever needed to do that professionally was when a sentence needed rewriting and the writer *really* needed to be persuaded. As long as your child is at the point where he or she can tell if something doesn't sound write and fix it, I wouldn't sweat it.

 

Yes, he can speak and write grammatically except for those dang comma splices. That's another concept that he just doesn't seem to get. That one's a trickier concept, however, and I think it'll come over time.

 

I generally agree with the above, except that I do feel being able to identify a basic part of speech is an indication of a degree of education. I have older kids and haven't had this issue come up; they weren't grammar nuts, but they could at least identify the important parts of speech in a sentence.

 

I'm going to look into the resources you guys have suggested. Thanks!

[EKS]

MCT.  I'd start with Grammar Island.  And use the practice book.

[hollyhock]

Does he speak and write grammatically?

 

If so, I personally would let it go. There's more to life--and English studies--than analyzing parts of speech.

 

This is what I did with my son when we got to this point.

[Mrs. Y]

Awwww.  I have a  25 year old son who could never get grammar terms either.  He spoke well and read a bunch.  He never wrote that great.   He survived.  He turns wrenches and fixes trucks....actually runs his own business.  I'm not saying ignore the problem (I didn't either) but I didn't let it consume us.  

[MerryAtHope]

Does he speak and write grammatically?

 

If so, I personally would let it go. There's more to life--and English studies--than analyzing parts of speech.

 

This. This is what he'll need for testing, writing papers in college etc...

[Heathermomster]

Winston Grammar...

[...................]

I gave up on the hope that anything will stick. However, we do continue to do grammar and diagramming since I think it'll help with foreign language.

 

She writes beautifully.

 

Next year she will start either Latin or Spanish and drop grammar :)

Edited December 14, 2015 by Calming Tea

[hollyhock]

You know, I came back and read this again, and it occurred to me that Easy Grammar might work for him, because those exercises begin by crossing out all the prepositional phrases. If he has the prepositions memorized, that should work for him. Then the rest of the sentence elements are isolated and can be identified. Just a thought. I'm trying this next year with my next-grammar-phobic son (I got two in a row).