I really need help on how to approach this - tutoring student

[zoobie]

I actually really do NOT want to babysit. I set out to tutor, not provide childcare. The only real need this fills is my desire to teach an older child again... but maybe that IS it and the void I'm trying to fill. I sincerely miss teaching older children since Red went to school.

But really, this was primarily just to help with tuition.

 

I think the bigger issue is that I have become attached to the family, emotionally. Especially mom. I feel so badly for what she's going through and she seems to need someone to talk to - she always sits with me for a while after she comes to pick up the child.

You're providing free therapy too! Do you see yourself being friends with this person in the long run? If you needed help, where would she be? Right now she's using you.

[AimeeM]

Gently - You are not required to save this child.  You are not her parent.  She will be fine without you.

 

It seems to fill some need in you to take care of her, and that is fine, but it really doesn't sound like it is working for anyone in your family other than you.  

 

It is time to do a lot of introspection.  Either you need to make it work for everyone, or you need to let it go.

 

The money seems to be only one of many problems in this situation.

 

I don't *think* that I want to save the child. I know she'll be fine ultimately, but she WASN'T fine academically with the previous arrangement - being thrown on t4l with minimal supervision. I do think she would do fine in brick and mortar school, honestly. She is a social little girl who would do well with some interaction with age peers (she has none right now); she takes direct instruction beautifully - online, not so much.

Beyond telling Mom that she needs to find someone else, or that my rates are going up (way up), I also need to let her know that if she does leave, her current idea of educating the child isn't working; nothing more than we advise people on THIS site every day ("hey, that's generally used to supplement, not for core" - things like that). Perhaps that would be overstepping, given what I would be saying to her, but I'm not sure.

[AimeeM]

You're providing free therapy too! Do you see yourself being friends with this person in the long run? If you needed help, where would she be? Right now she's using you.

 

No, she wouldn't. I know that. I just can't help it. She seems to be hurting. If I never saw her again, I would be cool with that (I don't want that to sound mean - I just mean that I don't know her outside of what she's told me), but while she's here and hurting, I feel compelled to talk to her... or just to listen (my preferred approach).

[Dandelion]

It's hard when you truly care about someone's wellbeing, and you want to help them solve their problems, yet you realize you can't be a part of the solution. 

 

As so many have already said, you sound like a really sweet, caring person who is being seriously taken advantage of. 

 

To bring this to closure, you'll really need to separate yourself from the emotional aspect of this and treat it purely as a business arrangement.  Because that's what it is.  I would not give the mom advice on how to educate her child moving forward unless she asks.  Again, that is outside the scope of this business arrangement.

 

When you talk to her, have your DH there and keep it short and sweet.   "DH and I have discussed this and decided that I will not be able to continue with this arrangement.  The last day that I can have your child in my home is X."  You don't have to give any reasons why.  "We gave it a try, but it's not going to work out for us" is totally sufficient.  

[idnib]

I would not be surprised if the mom is semi-waiting for the other shoe to drop. She must know on some level that someone won't continue to do this for this price. I doubt she'll be surprised when you tell her. She's probably surprised it's gone on this long.

 

Here a two other ideas. I know people might think of them as cop-outs and maybe they are sub-optimal, but perhaps you would find them more doable than a face-to-face confrontation.

 

1) Put it in writing. I don't mean all the emotional stuff, just the end-date and that you'll continue to provide care until that date, or a new fee that's fair market value if you want to continue. Then just tell her you wrote this for her and hand it to her. She can read the part that's most difficult for you to say.

 

2) Be there with DH and have him tell her. Will she think it's weird and he's a meanie? Possibly, but who cares? Compared to the situation in which you and your family now find yourselves, this action would be preferable.

[AimeeM]

What are some reasons (pure curiosity) that a parent would pay a tutor or sitter the same amount that they would pay for a private school education? I just realized that she's had the child in Catholic school before, Catholic school costs no more than my original quote (yes, that was too low to begin with too; even before the "temporary adjustment") and they are generally more than willing to defer a month or two of payments if necessary (as they are non-profit).

I'm certainly not questioning any parent's reasons for homeschooling, it's just that... well, she isn't homeschooling. I'm sure there must be some reason. I just know that she has no problem with Catholic education (as I made sure she knows I use primarily Catholic materials and that the child would at least overhear Nico's catechism, etc).

 

This is pure curiosity and has nothing to do with the issue at hand. I'm going to talk to Mom - now I need to figure out a way to do it without the children around.

[Guest submarines]

From your OP I sensed that you were enjoying the child, enjoying teaching the child, and the child fits well into your family. What you were not happy about is the pay, but you also stated that that pay would be great to have, but it is not absolutely necessary. 

 

I'm going to say something crazy, and I bet many won't agree with me, but I'd try to separate those two issues entirely. If there was a child that fit well into my family, and enhanced my children's homeschooling in some ways, and I *and* my children enjoyed having that child around, I'd home school for free. Sure, I'm describing an ideal situation, and I pretty sure there won't be a child that would fit my family as smoothly and wonderfully for me to actually to consider this  seriously, but your OP painted quite a positive picture of the dynamics, except the big "but" of not being paid enough for the services. 

 

Your subsequent posts seem to imply that having this child around is not so great for your family. In this case, you shouldn't be homeschooling or baby sitting that child even if the pay is increased. I wouldn't take a child, not in a million years, if it was detrimental to my family. 

 

 

 

 

[AimeeM]

From your OP I sensed that you were enjoying the child, enjoying teaching the child, and the child fits well into your family. What you were not happy about is the pay, but you also stated that that pay would be great to have, but it is not absolutely necessary. 

 

I'm going to say something crazy, and I bet many won't agree with me, but I'd try to separate those two issues entirely. If there was a child that fit well into my family, and enhanced my children's homeschooling in some ways, and I *and* my children enjoyed having that child around, I'd home school for free. Sure, I'm describing an ideal situation, and I pretty sure there won't be a child that would fit my family as smoothly and wonderfully for me to actually to consider this  seriously, but your OP painted quite a positive picture of the dynamics, except the big "but" of not being paid enough for the services. 

 

Your subsequent posts seem to imply that having this child around is not so great for your family. In this case, you shouldn't be homeschooling or baby sitting that child even if the pay is increased. I wouldn't take a child, not in a million years, if it was detrimental to my family. 

 

This is rough for me. I think she is getting better and she seems to be playing better, the last couple of days, with my middle child. I do enjoy teaching her - but the days are very, very, very long. I'm not sure if I mentioned it in my OP or my replies, but she is unable to do anything independently; if I'm doing work with my middle child, she wants in, if I'm cleaning, she wants in... she's been known to follow me to the bathroom door when I pee :P

 

If the pay were right, would I put up with it and just keep working on it? Probably. The issues that we have had, thus far, have proven to be "fixable" - she doesn't share because she never had to, she didn't play well with others because she isn't around other children, etc; she is making progress in those areas. I feel lied to, in part, and that is leading to some resentment of the situation - lied to about how much the child eats (more than half the fee being paid), lied to about the child's ability to do some thing independently, lied to about mom's ability to pay the originally quoted price.

 

I honestly wouldn't do it for free. I hope that doesn't sound cold. Homeschool for free? Perhaps. Provide 10-12 hours of child care in addition to tutoring/homeschooling, for free? Not so much. This is very literally ALL day. From the time I wake up (actually, I wake up about an hour earlier than normal to let her in), until about dinner time. While my middle child seems to enjoy her company, my eldest is not fond (there's about an hour where both are here, before child's mom comes to pick her up).

 

The pay isn't absolutely necessary, but it DOES (or would, if I were receiving the correct amount) help very much with dd's tuition. I wouldn't do this otherwise. I'm pretty sure my husband would be against the entire situation if I weren't being paid (and he already thinks I'm selling the service short with even my original quote). He would put his foot down at "free", lol.

[dirty ethel rackham]

You are allowing this woman to tie up time that you could be getting paid for. There are other people with child care needs that will pay a fair rate. You'd earn more per week for less work doing before/after care for local school students. Write it all down and SHOW her the numbers. I teach a class in my home. If I don't earn $45 for the hour due to under-enrollment, that class doesn't happen. I won't work for $30 an hour and that's just a dance class for hobbyists. What you're doing is imminently more valuable and important.

 

HAVE the conversation. It may be uncomfortable, but not as uncomfortable as working for nearly nothing.

 

I disagree with showing her the finances.  This will invite argument and discussion.  This mom is a manipulator and this will give her more fuel to keep up her games.  She needs to say "it is not working for us" and repeat as often as necessary. 

 

[zoobie]

What are some reasons (pure curiosity) that a parent would pay a tutor or sitter the same amount that they would pay for a private school education? I just realized that she's had the child in Catholic school before, Catholic school costs no more than my original quote (yes, that was too low to begin with too; even before the "temporary adjustment") and they are generally more than willing to defer a month or two of payments if necessary (as they are non-profit).

I'm certainly not questioning any parent's reasons for homeschooling, it's just that... well, she isn't homeschooling. I'm sure there must be some reason. I just know that she has no problem with Catholic education (as I made sure she knows I use primarily Catholic materials and that the child would at least overhear Nico's catechism, etc).

 

This is pure curiosity and has nothing to do with the issue at hand. I'm going to talk to Mom - now I need to figure out a way to do it without the children around.

She couldn't drop her daughter off at 6 am and pick her up whenever. She couldn't take her there sick. She'd have homework, which mom would have to do with her. Activities, concerts, teacher conferences... The situation she has set up with you right now is far, far easier!

 

And you say you wouldn't work for "free"--she's with you, requiring hands on assistance 10-12 hours a day, 5 days a week. After food, that's $30 for 50-60 hours of work, so 50 to 60 cents an hour.

[AimeeM]

She couldn't drop her daughter off at 6 am and pick her up whenever. She couldn't take her there sick. She'd have homework, which mom would have to do with her. Activities, concerts, teacher conferences... The situation she has set up with you right now is far, far easier!

 

And you say you wouldn't work for "free"--she's with you, requiring hands on assistance 10-12 hours a day, 5 days a week. After food, that's $30 for 50-60 hours of work, so 50 to 60 cents an hour.

 

I know. I am essentially working for free. This hasn't given the budget any leeway since incurring the tuition payment.

 

So.... when I do discuss it with her, knowing that she will not be able to pay, how do I deal with the aftermath? If I give her notice, her daughter is going to know what's going on and that's going to carry over for the remainder of time she's here. <--- Just tell her that this is between Mom and myself?

[freesia]

You asked about why it should be more than Catholic school. Well, there is the fact that you are working longer hours than a Catholic school. You are providing one on one instruction which is more valuable than group oriented instruction. You are providing after care and before care in a small group environment (not group daycare). Also, Catholic education is subsidized by the Catholic Church. The education you are providing her is not subsidized by anyone (except your family).

 

At one one point I nannied 3 children (whose mother was home) and helped homeschool one of them. I made $15 an hour and was fed lunch.

[KungFuPanda]

I disagree with showing her the finances.  This will invite argument and discussion.  This mom is a manipulator and this will give her more fuel to keep up her games.  She needs to say "it is not working for us" and repeat as often as necessary.

 

 

What are some reasons (pure curiosity) that a parent would pay a tutor or sitter the same amount that they would pay for a private school education? I just realized that she's had the child in Catholic school before, Catholic school costs no more than my original quote (yes, that was too low to begin with too; even before the "temporary adjustment") and they are generally more than willing to defer a month or two of payments if necessary (as they are non-profit).

I'm certainly not questioning any parent's reasons for homeschooling, it's just that... well, she isn't homeschooling. I'm sure there must be some reason. I just know that she has no problem with Catholic education (as I made sure she knows I use primarily Catholic materials and that the child would at least overhear Nico's catechism, etc).

 

This is pure curiosity and has nothing to do with the issue at hand. I'm going to talk to Mom - now I need to figure out a way to do it without the children around.

I think it's a lot harder to argue with numbers. It's reasonable to explain "After this trial period, I've realized that I'm only making $30 after expenses. I need to make $X after expenses to make the extra work worth my while." Make sure x equals a number that REALLY IS worth your while because she MAY come up with the funds. Be sure to be VERY clear about the date the current rate will end. If she agrees to the new rate, collect it up front so that she can't just SAY she'll pay it to buy extra time and leave you unpaid in the end.

 

This mom never had a child in Catholic school for $30 a week. The food expenses you are incurring now are expenses she had to cover before.

[dirty ethel rackham]

 

I think it's a lot harder to argue with numbers. It's reasonable to explain "After this trial period, I've realized that I'm only making $30 after expenses. I need to make $X after expenses to make the extra work worth my while." Make sure x equals a number that REALLY IS worth your while because she MAY come up with the funds. Be sure to be VERY clear about the date the current rate will end. If she agrees to the new rate, collect it up front so that she can't just SAY she'll pay it to buy extra time and leave you unpaid in the end.

 

This mom never had a child in Catholic school for $30 a week. The food expenses you are incurring now are expenses she had to cover before.

 

I think that would only work if she wants to argue for more money and be willing to confront her regularly about late payments and non-payment.  If she is dealing with difficulty in getting paid now, she certainly will have to fight for more.  If she wants to end the relationship, short and sweet is best. 

 

[readwithem]

I know. I am essentially working for free. This hasn't given the budget any leeway since incurring the tuition payment.

 

So.... when I do discuss it with her, knowing that she will not be able to pay, how do I deal with the aftermath? If I give her notice, her daughter is going to know what's going on and that's going to carry over for the remainder of time she's here. <--- Just tell her that this is between Mom and myself?

I'm so glad that you are thinking beyond the point of giving her notice!!

 

YES tell the dd this is between her mom and you.  If she brings it up more than once, tell the mom you aren't discussing it.  Her options are for the girl to leave NOW or stay the two weeks, but you aren't discussing the matter, with mom OR daughter.  Your decision is final.

 

HUGS to you!!  I know how difficult this is.  Glad your dh is supportive!!