Algebra 1 in 7th for non-math loving student

[Connections]

I am interested in what other mom/guidance counselors suggest in this situation:

 

I have a rising 7th grade DS who is embarking on Algebra 1 because that is where he is at. He does NOT LIKE math but he wants to be competitive at highly selective schools. (Right now. This, of course, may change over the next few years.) He knows that, if he takes Algebra 1 in 7th grade, he still will have to complete math each year of high school. That would mean he would end up with higher level math (not sure WHAT he would take each year yet). He understands this, but (of course) he does not know what higher level math will really entail. I did not have much higher level math- we started high school with Algebra 1 back in my day- so I feel limited in advising him.

 

I plan to allow him to take 7th and 8th to complete Algebra 1 if he needs it, but it is likely that he will complete Algebra 1 in 7th.

 

I am wondering if his ability in math will carry the day even if he is not interested in higher level math. I know motivation will be a part of the equation and you cannot really speak to that. But I am wondering if those who take higher level math are always ones who LOVE math. Does it make sense for a kid who does not love math, but is good at it, to continue on this path?

 

If you have any experience with a child who is naturally good at math but does not enjoy math, I would appreciate your input.

 

Also, if anyone has any cautions (whether you have direct experience or not) about following this course, please share those as well.

 

And if we do not move into Algebra 1 this year, then what do we do? I tried AoPS with him in the past and he just HATED it. He just wants to know what he needs to do with a math problem and then he wants to do it and move on. I have had some success in the past supplementing with math competition problems from sources I have, but usually only if he "gets" it intuitively (which is often the case). He does not have the desire to tackle a really difficult problem and then experience the satisfaction of figuring it out.

 

Thanks in advance for your recommendations.

[retiredHSmom]

My middle child was very good at math and didn't enjoy it in fact she claimed to hate it. She completed algebra 1 in the last half of 6th grade and he first half of 7th grade.

 

She is now a math major in college. Somewhere along the way it occurred to her that she was GOOD at it and that she liked the "neatness" of it and that there was usually only 1 right answer and she began to really enjoy it.

 

I would have him continue on, slow down when (and if) he needs it but not until then.

[Connections]

My middle child was very good at math and didn't enjoy it in fact she claimed to hate it. She completed algebra 1 in the last half of 6th grade and he first half of 7th grade.

 

She is now a math major in college. Somewhere along the way it occurred to her that she was GOOD at it and that she liked the "neatness" of it and that there was usually only 1 right answer and she began to really enjoy it.

 

I would have him continue on, slow down when (and if) he needs it but not until then.

 

 

I LOVE that story! Thank you for sharing! I think that perspective is exactly what I needed!

[NittanyJen]

You could also take a middle school year (perhaps 8th grade) to do the AoPS courses Introduction to Counting and Probability and Introduction to Number Theory. The time would be well-spent, not wasted, and would give a respite from charging onward and upward, and just might spark an interest in math.

[Connections]

You could also take a middle school year (perhaps 8th grade) to do the AoPS courses Introduction to Counting and Probability and Introduction to Number Theory. The time would be well-spent, not wasted, and would give a respite from charging onward and upward, and just might spark an interest in math.

 

Thank you for the suggestion. I will look into those.

[Jann in TX]

I would hold off on Algebra 1. There are so many other concepts that he can explore and the extra year of maturity will make a huge difference... if he sluggs through half of Algebra 1 at a turtle's pace in 7th and then again in 8th he may loose interest and confidence. Success in Algebra is more of a mental maturity issue-- it takes more that just knowing your basic arithemetic skills...

 

I'd second the AOPS Number Theory class. I'd also look into mental math materials (it would help to build up confidence and numeracy skills)-- there are several books that you can get online or through your library.

 

What did he use for Pre-Algebra? There are several 'bridge' texts out there that keep the student progressing who may have some algebra readiness skills--but lacks the maturity (logic not social) to tackle the abstract and multi-step problems in a full Algebra 1 course (Lial's Pre-Algebra is one I suggest).

[nansk]

I agree with the other suggestions.

Also, there are books you can get that will help him see the beauty of Maths, and the practical applications of it - make him appreciate learning Maths again. Something like Ed Zaccaro's books, or the free Cryptography workbook recommended on the forums, or one of the Make It Real Learning books sold through mathmammoth.com.

[Parrothead]

Dd is slightly advanced and attempted algebra 1 as a 12/13 year old. It didn't work too well for her. I believe it was a maturity issue. So in order to not undermine her self confidence we dropped it at about chapter 10 (MUS).

 

She did finish the year with a math (geometry), and will go back and finish both the algebra book and the geometry book in the coming school year.

 

All this to say, while he may get it and be fine, sometimes the brain isn't quite ready for algebra. Try it, but if he struggles too much consider something else.

[dereksurfs]

Isn't it awesome to come on here and ask your question, then have someone like Tania post her experience? Wow, what a story that pretty much sums it up. The rest are just details. :D It confirms what I think most of us as parents already know from our own experiences growing up. Kids change so much as they mature into young adults. We really can't say they won't grow to love math later or at least come to appreciate it much more once they realize their goals are connected to it.

 

Of course exploring current options are good also. Honestly, there are so many great resources available at this level even for younger students. ds11 'disliked' AoPS at first as well. So we used TabletClass for Pre-Algebra which contains a lot of algebraic concepts and problems in it similar to AoPS's scope and sequence. But it is more direct instruction which is something he asked for and needed at the time. During this time we also supplemented with AoPS video lessons and some the of text just to provide a different perspective on the concepts. In addition we used Khan Academy which I can't speak highly enough about. Sal Khan is a very gifted instructor at breaking down complex concepts into ways that really connect with kids. You could do something similar using these as a bridge to Algebra next year. Then follow up with Algebra 1 in 8th grade.

 

Or you could go with another source like Real World Algebra by Zaccaro. It also falls between Pre-A and Algebra, showing algebra's use in practical ways.

 

Another cool supplement he'll like you could start him with right away is DragonBox. All our kids have fun with this and don't even realize they are learning Algebra. I just got ds11 the 12+ game and he's enjoying it in his free time. ;)

 

Your DS is young enough now that I think you could simply encourage his continued learning through evaluating several products with him and finding out which he likes. Of course you would have the final say. But getting his input also helps him gain a sense of ownership and may diminish his distaste for math as well. There is no reason he could not work on algebra over the next two years. During that time you could also interweave in some geometry such as Patty Paper Geometry or Understanding Geometry as precursors to formal high school geometry.

[lewelma]

I would suggest you delay algebra by 1 year, and use Mathematics: A human Endeavour by Jacobs. It teaches students how to think mathematically using a wide variety of topics and lots of investigations. It is designed to help students fall in love with math by making it more meaningful (it is not applied math, though). It does not require algebra, but is not a "prealgebra" book either with the standard negative number and exponent practice. It is just different, and I think it is really an excellent book. Others on this board have used it and I am sure they will give you their opinions if asked.

 

Ruth in NZ

[Gwen in VA]

My kids are "math-y" though not mathematically brilliant -- currently two are in engineering and two have or are planning to double-major in math.

 

Of my four kids, the ones who attempted algebra 1 in 7th grade all had to repeat it in 8th. The ones who started it in 8th sailed through. I am NOT saying you shouldn't do algebra 1 in 7th grade! I am merely saying that there is a maturity factor, and if your kid ends up dropping it in 7th and restarting it in 8th it's okay! He may still have a mathematical future!

 

Do make sure that your pre-algebra text was rigorous. If you want to try a challenging pre-algebra book instead of having him do algebra 1, you might look at Dolciani's pre-algebra text. It is SOLID and RIGOROUS.

 

The odd thing about algebra 1 is how much the texts vary in difficulty. Some algebra texts are little more than glorified pre-algebra texts, and some are really challenging and cover parts of algebra 2! Having him repeat prealebra so he can take off solidly in algebra 1 can be wise!

 

All of my kids were "good" at math, but none of them really liked it until they hit trig. Keep encouraging your son to do the math; the "liking" of math may come later.

[8filltheheart]

I don't have an answer for you, but I can share our experience. Our dd completed MUS's alg/geo book in 6th grade w/zero problems (basically a 100 on every assignment.) I tried her in AoPS the end of 6th b/c she finished MUS around the end of March: she hated it. She did not want to try AoPS again at the beginning of 7th, so she did Foersters. Again, she had zero problems with Foersters and finished it sometime around Feb/Mar. She said she was willing to try AoPS for the end of the yr. She took the online class had no problems, but she still hated the way AoPS teaches (even though she already knew how to do everything they were teaching, she just does not like anything about the text.)

 

This yr she completed geometry w/o any problems (though she really doesn't like geo.)

 

She is a strong math student that does not enjoy math. I wouldn't say she dislikes math (though maybe with geo you could say that b/c she really didn't like it!) She just doesn't enjoy math. She loves literature and languages.

 

Does she regret starting math early? No. She was more than ready to start and is more than capable for moving forward. I don't think the "when" would have made any difference any more than the what. She would rather be challenged by what she doesn't like than being bored. ;) She is sitting beside me and those are her words. ;)

[Cathy in MA]

:bigear:

 

Curious about this as well. My 6th grader is halfway through pre-algebra right now (Dolciani). I was planning on starting him in Algebra 1 (Jacobs) after that but now I will look at other options mentioned here. He is strong in math but not a big fan of it!

[EKS]

I think a lot of times when kids who are good at math say they don't like it what they really mean is that they don't like *arithmetic*. Doing another year of arithmetic isn't going to help this situation.

 

One thing you could do is use the Jacobs book Mathematics: A Human Endeavor. In it, Jacobs attempts to share the beauty of math with "those who think they don't like the subject" (taken from the cover page).

[HSDCY]

Your ds sounds just like mine when he was around that age. Although I don't have answers for you, I will share our experience and hopefully be of some help in your decision making process.

 

I started ds with algebra 1 in 6th grade not because he loved math but because that was where he was at. He has always been good with math because he has a strong math intuition and flew through Singapore Math because the curriculum fits the way his brain works. I was concerned with his maturity when we began algebra but decided to go ahead and try because I didn't think going on a math exploration tour for a year or two was what he needed. Like your son, he did not like math, he just wanted to do what he needed to do and have it done. The ability was there but the proper attitude was not.

 

It turned out that my decision was a good one for him. He thrived with algebra 1 and his dislike of math lessened. He actually said what EKS stated above, "I don't think I dislike math, I think I dislike arithmetic." He did geometry the next year without a hitch and declared geometry the best math he'd had, and "Why can't all math be like this?" We just completed algebra 2 this year and he has done well. He still does not love math, but he does not dislike it as much as he did when he was younger. Over the past couple of years, he also realizes that although he is strong in math he wants to use it as a tool in his work (like statistics, business, economics) and not live and breathe it (like math majors) in the future.

 

One pitfall I find with him is that he solves problems with intuition first, principle/concept second. That may work for lower level math and science, but it will not work when he has to deal with more complex or abstract concepts. So if you see your child being frustrated with some problems he can't solve intuitively, you want to make sure he truly gets the principle/concept. Allow him time and grace to mature, but keep that weakness in check.

 

Whatever decision you make, know that the beauty of homeschooling is the freedom to try different things and to figure out what suits our child/ren best. Wishing you the best!