Consistend b/d confusion

[Mommie_Jen]

My new k'er is having constant, as in every. single. time. he sees a "b" or "d" confusion. We've been working on it for months. We paint them on the sidewalk, we look for them in real life, we practice their sounds, we write them, we use a salt tray...over and over and over. He can't tell them apart. Explaining it as a bed, with your head at the b, hasn't helped. Making them with our hands hasn't helped.

 

I am out of ideas. He's frustrated and it's hampering reading. Phonics is a struggle for him anyway, but he gets so upset when he constantly and consistently gets them confused. He shows no other signs of learning problems. It's been since early spring since we've been working diligently on it, and I am at a loss as to how to help him. Any other ideas?

Edited July 2, 2012 by Mommie_Jen
silly Title typo, wish I could edit it!

[Ellie]

I would expect a 5yo to have problems confusing b and d. I know it's frustrating, but it isn't unusual.

 

Spalding and its spin-offs are particularly good at teaching b and d in such a way that children are far less likely to confuse them.

 

d is a short letter with a tall part. It begins with a circle (the short part) and ends with a line (the tall part). When you say /d/, your lips make sort of a circle. d is taught with other letters that begin with circles (a, d, c, f, g, o, qu, s).

 

b is a tall letter with a short part. It begins with a line (the tall part) and ends with a circle (the short part). When you say /b/, your lips make sort of a line. b is taught with other letters that begin with lines (all the rest).

 

When you're working with his handwriting, you could emphasize the way b and d are written (although you don't teach them at the same time), that one begins with a line and one with a circle, and the sounds each makes. Then when he reads and is unsure about b or d, you can ask him "line or circle?" Writing the letter while saying it aloud helps children connect the shape with the sound.

[Hoot]

That is pretty common for his age. I would tell him to take a good look at the letter and really think before naming it. Some kids just need a little more processing time.

 

When I taught spec. ed. I taught my kids that the "b" has a belly. If this were an older child still struggling I might tell them that the "d" has a derriere, but at your ds's age I wouldn't bother.

 

On a slightly inappropriate note, one of my older kids shot back one day, "yeah and the "B" is like sideways boobs. :eek:

[SailorMom]

Totally normal - and I'd quit beating your head against it. That's a developmental thing. He'll either grow out of it by 7, or you'd start kinda wondering about a problem after that. But if it is only b and d, I wouldn't worry at all.

[Mom in High Heels]

That's pretty common, especially at that age. Indy is almost 10 and because of his dyslexia still sometimes have issues with it. I taught him to hold his in front of him, palms facing each other and circle his thumb and forefinger (making a b and d) and put them together so the "loops" touch each other. This bakes a "bed" with the b at the beginning and the d at the end.

[5LittleMonkeys]

Just echoing that that is completely normal for a 5yo. My 6yo still confuses them occasionally, and dd13 confused them consistently until she was 7 and then almost overnight something clicked and she never confused them again. I would just correct gently each time without making an issue out of it. :001_smile:

[sixpence1978]

Another echo of it being completely normal. I know it's frustrating, but just give him constant gentle reminders. Don't harp on it or it will shake his confidence.

 

Sometimes it takes kids a lot longer to learn something than we expect. I find that time and again when I feel like I can't teach the same thing one more time, I quit. Then it clicks shortly after that.

 

But, yes, completely normal up through around age 7. Keep a picture of the b/d bed around while reading, or go the belly route and draw a funny picture. Keeping a visual reference on hand close by during reading lessons might help.

[FO4UR]

I will be the lone voice of dissent.

 

 

If you have worked and worked and worked on this and the typical little tricks don't work to jog his memory, you might be seeing some first signs of a bigger problem.

 

 

If you teach handwriting carefully (Spalding is a great method.) and it doesn't help, you might be seeing signs of a bigger problem. (I know. I've got one who can spout off the handwriting cues and USE them and still write and see b/d backwards...at age 9.)

 

Get his eyes checked by a developmental optometrist.

 

 

 

It *is* normal for kids up to age 7yo or so to have reversals, but if this is something that you've consistently worked on and it's getting in the way of his learning and it's frustrating him...I'd dig deeper. Better to rule out a vision issue now than catch one years down the road after waiting for him to mature.

 

 

That said, when reading and you come to a b or d just give him the sound so he can move along. Reduce frustration. Break up the skills he's learning.

[Mommie_Jen]

Thanks, all. I have been just gently reminding him of the letter/sound. And we are just working on writing the letters, still learning the strokes. He does wear glasses and is under the care of an optometrist, although not a dev. one. He has an eye exam next month. I will mention it then and see what they say.

[mommy5]

My 5 year old struggles with this ... and my 7 year old still struggles with this sometimes (it is improving) but I know your frustration!

[lillehei]

I like this resource: http://www.allaboutlearningpress.com/how-to-solve-b-d-reversal-problems/

[FO4UR]

Thanks, all. I have been just gently reminding him of the letter/sound. And we are just working on writing the letters, still learning the strokes. He does wear glasses and is under the care of an optometrist, although not a dev. one. He has an eye exam next month. I will mention it then and see what they say.

 

 

 

Ah, take special care in teaching how to properly form b and d. That will probably clear things up for the most part.

[sleeplessnights]

All three of my readers were confused for a while. If they paused while reading, I immediately told them the letter so that it didn't slow down their fluency. While writing, I made sure they formed the letters correctly: a 'd' is a tall 'a' and a 'b' starts with a line and comes back up and around.

 

Over time there were fewer pauses and they started to get it right. I wouldn't worry at 5; at 7 or 8 I might get it checked out.

[MerryAtHope]

Here are some more things for you to use to work with him on this (and it's ok to give him a break from trying to read them, work on handwriting etc... for a time and then try again.)

 

One, make some 3-D letters (cut out of cardstock, or use the textile ones described below). Talk about how a car is a car whether you see a picture of it forwards, backwards or even upside down! But letters and words do not work this way. The reason this is difficult for kids this age is because up until now, their brains have been trained to recognize objects regardless of orientation. For some students, explicit instruction and a demonstration can help them realize this.

 

Have a variety of textile surfaces for your student to choose from. Possibilities include flannel fabric, corrugated cardboard, very fine sandpaper, fluffy fur fabric, a carpet square, and so on. Ask him which surface reminds him of the letter b (or whatever letter you are working on).

 

Then cut a large lowercase letter out of the chosen tactile surface.

 

Work with just one letter at a time. Have the child write the letter with the pointer finger of his dominant hand right on the tactile surface.

 

Then get the large muscles of the arm involved. Stand next to him to demonstrate how we make the letter b (or any letter or number you would like to work on). Get your whole arm involved, and pretend that your pointer finger is a pen. Write lowercase b in the air, using big motions. Start at the top of the first line of the b, pulling the line straight down. As you do this, say “/b/ – bat.†After you hit the bottom of the b, trace part of the way back up and then form the circle part. Keep it all one fluid motion. After you’ve done this several times, explain that the first line down is like a bat used in baseball, and then we hit the ball. Be sure that the child uses the dominant hand to do this activity.

 

The large movements of the arm combined with saying the sound at the same time will help link these two concepts together in his brain. Brain research shows that two ideas practiced at the same time can permanently bond the ideas together. Not only that, this multisensory activity takes advantage of the fact that the muscles in the shoulder and in the jaw have “muscle memory,†and this makes it easier for your child to recall the shape and sound of the letter b.

 

Repeat this several times a day. In each session, practice with the textile surface and the large arm movements.

Try making one letter or number a focus of the week, and work on that one every day, a few times a day. Put a poster of the letter or number up, label things around the house, practice making it in different mediums, and so on. Master one trouble letter or number at a time.

 

It’s ok if you don’t have a cue word for every letter. That’s a helpful strategy but you can still work on pairing the sound with the letter formation. Sound-to-letter practice helps to diminish reversals.

 

By the way, make sure you are using a handwriting program that makes b's this way (and d's start with the circle or donut, and go up and down to make the stick--again, one fluid motion). If he's learning a ball and stick type of printing, it won't help to prevent reversals. HWT is a good program to use.

 

Now, when he misreads a b as a d (or another letter/number), you can refer back to the activities you did together. After the misreading, point to the misread letter and say, “If you wrote this letter, what would this letter say?†If your child can’t answer easily, have him draw the letter or number using air writing. The sound of the letter should come more easily this way. Then have your child read the word/number again.

 

If you decide you want to check into a developmental optometrist, you'll want to look on www.covd.org. I've not found regular optometrists to be helpful or knowledgeable in this area (one knew a little, one said it didn't work, one said my child didn't have issues! but vision therapy made a huge impact on my son's reading--we were not able to start therapy until he was twelve unfortunately.) Anyway, it might be a bit premature, but it's worth knowing about it.

 

Hang in there, Merry :-)

[Clear Creek]

I think it takes some children a while longer to learn how differentiate between the two letters. My oldest child never had trouble with them; my second child still struggled with them in second grade. I spent most of the year asking her if it could be made into a capital "B," and if she said yes then she knew it was a lowercase "b" and not a "d." When she finished up second grade this past May (and turned eight, as well) she was no longer pausing when she encountered a "b" or a "d" when reading aloud and did not have to ask me which it was.

 

Based on my own limited experience, I would not be concerned about a child who was having trouble distinguishing between "b" and "d" at the age of five. That is not to say that I would not be working on learning the difference (daily!), but I would not be worried about it.

[duckens]

My new k'er is having constant, as in every. single. time. he sees a "b" or "d" confusion.

Reassure your son that LOTS of kids have this as an issue. And, yes, it IS confusing. They look alike but one is forwards and one is backwards!!!!

 

Two ways I have taught this:

1) This will sound a lot more confusing that it really is:

 

1a) Teach child the spelling of the word bed: b-e-d. They need to do this orally before they write it.

 

1b) Now make two fists, thumbs inside.

 

1c) Bring the two fists together so the heel of your hands is touching and the upper part of your fingers is touching. Your hands are NOT clasped; they are just two fists touching.

 

1d) With fists still touching, raise both pointer fingers in the air. This is a "bed." Notice that the b is on the left, and the d is on the right.

 

1e) If child is confused about which letter is which, remind him to "Make your bed!" He has a reference he can take everywhere he goes.

 

 

 

 

2) This method is easier for me:

 

2a) Write b and d on the whiteboard/chalkboard/paper.

 

2b) Ask child which is which....and if they don't know, that is just fine.

 

2c) Using a different color (or writing implement), add an upper hump to the b to make it a B. You couldn't do that to the d and have it look right.

 

 

 

 

I hope you find what works for you and your boy. Hang in there! I've taught many, many, many 5yos that outgrow this.

[Mommie_Jen]

I've tried the b-e-d trick and it just didn't sink in with him. Yesterday afternoon, however, I did try the trick from the All About Learning site (b is a bat and ball, d is doorknob and door) and we spent time working with pipe cleaner letters making b and d and figuring out if they were bat and ball or doorknob and door. I think perhaps I saw a small amount of progress yesterday. That's a new trick for me, and one that I think may stick. Glad to know we just need t keep pressing on with it!

[3peasinapod]

Definitely not unusual. Somewhere in the 2nd grade was when both of my DDs didn't do it anymore. I wouldn't worry until at least 3rd grade.

[sixpence1978]

You should also have him make them with clay. Sometimes that 3D representation helps.

 

I still wouldn't start worrying until after you have worked on writing the letters for a while.

[ElizabethB]

Work on a whiteboard in all uppercase for a few months.

 

Here are more ideas:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/dbdb.html

 

:grouphug:

[MrSmith]

How does he form the 'd'? Does he do the straight line first then the curve?

 

I noticed my son writes d's that way and he confuses d with b sometimes (in print only). I have been trying to convince him that d's should be made curve first (as in cursive format, which he has no trouble doing ?!) to disitinguish from b's being stem first.