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How does middle and high school look for a SN's student?


rafiki
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I think that is a great question. I have no idea but I am glad you asked it.:) I am wondering the same thing. I have a 13 year old that is no where near middle school in capabilities. The best thing I could think to do to sort of ease my fears and concerns a bit is to look at what the best case scenario is for my dd (or the best I could hope for maybe is a better way to say it) and map that out to the end. What that did was help me see a possible path and how long that might take if it were possible to achieve and what we need to change now to make something like that seem possible.

 

I guess that is a complex I don't know but I am trying to find out.:lol:

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I am working for my (moderate/severe dyslexic/ dysgraphic) son to have independence in his learning, and allowing him to have all the opportunities typical learners have. In his case, we have employed a lot of assistive technology, which have now become a natural way of his work.

 

From our neuropsych consult, we know that ds will ALWAYS be a much slower than normal reader (no matter how remediated he is), so we have employed technologies (TTS, Kurzweil, electronic sources) to allow him to read just like a typical reader.

 

We have been warned he will have trouble with notetaking, we already are practicing in his Kurzweil texts. I have already investigated technologies that he can sync notes to lectures (LiveScribe, and now more recently the iPad) for when he is in a class that requires lectures.

 

We have also been told that writing will be a struggle....We continue to work on writing, but giving ds a lot of scaffolding and strategies to check his work (again TTS so that he can "hear" his mistakes). Two years ago we did a crash typing course to allow ds to type whenever he chooses (which helped his dysgraphia and gave him freedom with a dyslexic spellchecker). Now, I also supply DragonNaturally for essays but also so that ds can answer all questions at the end of the text, and I can evaluate the completeness of his responses.

 

For math, ds is capable of working as a typical student (albeit MUCH slower), so his work is a bit more truncated, and we have worked on strategies so that he checks his work to avoid traditional dyslexic glitches.

 

I am highly optimistic, if ds continues to have AT support, that ds will have success. Furthermore, his reliance on this may change over time, as I see ds continue to grow each year.

 

My expectations are that of a typical (albeit gifted) learner, but with accomodations in place.

Edited by RamonaQ
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My dd learned to read late at the end of 2nd grade. So, of course, I couldn't get regular 3rd grade curriculum. I just kept her going at her level. She caught up at 5th grade.

 

I have no idea what state requirements are, but if I had an older one that was SN, I would cover the subjects at his/her level. Still do the history, literature, and science that you want to, just simplify it. Get lower level books or read to them if necessary. Do math, grammar, spelling, etc. at the level and speed that they can do. You can still accomplish a lot with 180 days of a little of each subject!

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My ds will be in 9th next year and I am planning high school for the first time. I'm not sure that I am helpful to this thread because he is on a fairly traditional schedule at this point. He has been gradually catching up for years. The only way we are still off is recognizing that assignments take him longer - especially writing. I try to keep the expectations reasonable and we both realize his school day is going to be longer than is typical for homeschoolers.

 

I think the key for us through middle school has been recognizing where he is and continuing forward at his pace. In some areas, that is ahead or faster than a typical pace. In others, it is behind and we just move as fast as he can and don't really spend much time thinking about "typical". All I ask is his best each day.

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My 16yo dd has Asperger's and Anxiety. She started school early (at 4 almost 5) so she will graduate at 17. We've had many a discussion about taking an extra year of high school, but at this point (she's a junior) she is just not wanting to do that. So my first piece of advice would be to build in an extra year if needed, right away, when there is little opposition to an extra "5th year" of high school or repeating a grade ;) I would really, really like dd to wait and graduate at 18 but that's not happening. When dd entered high school, I started to panic about what she was going to do. I'm fairly certain she is not college bound. So we sat down with her and discussed what she would like to do. That gave me some direction to take with her high school electives. I have tried, this year, to build electives/courses around her interests. She is more apt to put the work and time into it if she's interested. For 9th and 10th, I pretty much chose her courses. I totally tailored them to her needs though. Writing is not her strength, so I have been pretty lenient on essays and papers. I'm thrilled if she gets something down on paper. The funny thing is, once I eased up on the writing, she started writing fiction on her own. She just has a "block" when it comes to essays/reports. I have let her do open book tests (Apologia Biology), and have her listen to audio books when it suits her needs. I spent all of 9th and 10th trying to find an Algebra program that fit her, finally she is doing well with Algebra I in 11th. That was the hardest thing, getting in her three math credits. She's been doing Algebra I for three years. She'll do Algebra II next year and she's doing Stewardship (Business Math) in co-op. For this year (and next), I gave her a lot of say in her courses. She wanted to study the Middle Ages, so we went with TQ so we would have more flexibility and an easier time choosing which level of books I wanted her to read. I am throwing together a Photography course as we go. We are doing a Jane Austen Lit Study with friends. I chose a Chemistry book that is "just" high school level so that she would get an understanding of Chem without having to worry about the math aspect so much. I guess for the most part I want her to learn about things with an interest and I'm not afraid to use lower level curriculum in high school to get her to learn and remember. With all these choices has come lots of free time. I made it clear that I wanted her to explore her interests and I wanted her to have plenty of time to do that. She plays piano, does photography with a lot of Photoshop work, writes fiction, and is just getting into some video editing. I explained that if she doesn't attend college, she'll have to do something and that some of her special interests could lead her into a job. What I need to do, that I haven't done yet, is work with her on normal everyday things, like doing laundry and cooking and shopping.

 

So I guess I just am a lot more relaxed with her. I am filling her credit requirements as I see fit. It's hard sometimes, as many of her friends are dual enrolled in cc and are doing college bound classes. They are taking SAT, ACT, and PSAT (which dd is not). And dd is really smart, she just gets caught up in the anxiety/sensory/processing issues which make heavy loads and deadlines ridiculously difficult.

 

Her love of photography and video editing have actually prompted her to look into a special 2 year college in our area for these things. We don't know if she will go that route or just self teach and freelance. It was a big deal that she would even consider it.

 

I don't know if I've done her a disservice by being so easy on her or not, but I am so pleased when she comes to talk to me about what she is learning. Before, she was so "done" with school and the stress that she didn't want to learn anything extra, or talk about it. It was just a box to check off. By using different curriculum and going with her interests, she's retaining more and excited (well, mostly) about what she's learning. In the end, I hope that that is more important than a bunch of facts shoved into her head that she will never remember. I wish I would have done a better job in 9th and 10th of getting her involved in her curriculum and giving her more free time to explore.

 

That was a big ramble, I hope that somehow that helps. If there is anything specific that I can answer, I'll try.

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My oldest will be in 6th next year and I'm having a tough time wiping the traditional S&S for middle and high school out of my mind.

 

Reality is, he's on a different path and has different needs.

 

This is good that you recognize his different path and different needs. Different is the key word here. Different doesn't mean he can't or won't learn. I try to keep my focus on how far my boys have come since this time last year and not compare them to what their peers are doing (regular school and homeschooled peers).

Any words of wisdom to share?

 

Would you share your SN dc's path?

 

I have two sons who are almost 17yo (10th gr.) and 13 1/2yo (7th gr.). Both sons have learning differences.

 

My older son has Asperger syndrome, which comes with a flowering of different dx under that heading. He had NO trouble learning to read and can has always read above grade level, *but* up until last year he had trouble reading *some* grade level materials unless I broke the reading into tiny chunks of reading. He just didn't have the *attention span* to read something that was full of info (science)OR was something that really made you think (history, lit & bible).

 

I just made adjustments in the *amount* of reading he'd in a book each day. He often didn't cover as much material or read as many literature books as h is peers might, but what he did read he got something out of it. I'd rather him cover less, but *really* get something out of what he covers than just "muddle" through a lot of stuff.

 

Math is his biggest issue. We've never had him dxed, but I am SURE he has dyscalculia in a MAJOR way! He completed TT pre-Alg. last year and did "fine" (upper C or lower B) on most daily work and tests, but at the of the year he told me that he just didn't really understand fractions, decimals and percents enough to move on to higher math. This year he's been working through the Key To...series. He just began the Percents series. I'm glad we've taken the year to do this. He's very pleased that he's finally understanding these basic concepts better.

 

He wants to continue using the Key To books, so he'll move into the Key To Algebra and then the Key To Geometry. He and I both realize that the Key To Algebra is NOT full Alg. I course. I'm totally OK with this and so is he. He *really* wants to learn and realizes he may not cover as much ground as his peers do in highschool math. College is something he aspires to, but he realizes that he will probably have to take some of the Dev. Math courses at the CC level at first. HE is OK with this. Honestly, I've told him that if he just "muddles" through some regular Alg. I and II courses instead of using the KEy to Alg., he might struggle with even the Dev. Math classes at the CC. I think the way he's approaching his math studies now will help him be successful in those CC Dev. Math classes.

 

My son has also always struggled with *handwriting*, especially cursive. He types almost everything.

 

Because of my son's math struggles, he doesn't have the math that is needed for higher level science courses. We've dabbled with some science textbooks (mostly bio.), but have decided to take a different path with science that is more suited for HIS interest.

 

We are using almost all living books for science. Most of the books he's read or will be reading have centered around the *history* behind scientific developments. Last year his biology year morphed into a zoology year, using living books, because of his love of animals.

 

What he's read and will continue to read for his science credits are written on a high reading level (not easy reads), but the scientific info is weaved into the writing in a way that makes it very understandable to him and is usually presented in smaller chunks, unlike text books that are just overloaded (for him) with too much info too fast.

 

My son also does VERY well with oral and written narration (written narrations are now really essays and sometimes research reports).

 

Let me add, did you do anything differently to allow time for your dc to "catch up" if they have?

 

There are some areas our kids may never "catch up" in, even when they are in college! But that's OK. My son doesn't aspire, at least at this time, to major in anything that would be heavy in math. IF at some point he does decide to do this, HE will be motivated from within to find all the help he needs and work harder than I could EVER force him to work to acheive that goal.

 

When did things seem to click?

 

Hmmm...Ages 12-14 were HORRIBLE. I mean HORRIBLE. He had NO, and I mean, NO attention span. It was like he reverted back to being a 1st grader in that area. He was extremely irritable, always sleepy (this is when my bright and early riser began to want to sleep til noon), but also always full of this energy that kept him from focusing.

 

Honestly, during those years just so I could keep my mother/son relationship in tact and also to prevent him from hating to learn, I lowered my expectations a bit. What he was doing daily compared to his peers was laughable, *but* it did accomplish my goal:)

 

Around age 15, he began to slowly return to his normal self, well a more mature "normal". He started to LOVE to read books that really made him *think* no matter how hard they were to read. I still do sometimes have to reduce the amount of reading he does at a time from a book, but most days he now can handle a lot. He now enjoys arguing with author's and concepts in the books he reads more than he enjoys arguing with ME:)

 

What do you feel helped your dc the most?

 

I think when *I* let go of the expectations that *I* had based on what his peers were doing. The moment I decided to meet him where he is at that moment and work from there instead of muddling through something is also what helped the most.

 

Would you have done anything differently?

 

I would have slowed down the math even sooner. Well, over the years, I have slowed down the math, then about the time he seems to be *really* undertanding the concepts for a certain level, I would get excited and push on. I wish I had just went slow and steady over all the years. He probably would not be any further along in his math skills from where he is now, but I think he would have ENJOYED math and not be as fearful of it as he is now.

 

Oh, and I would have certainly skipped the formal textbooks we used for a few years in upper elem. and middle school. Living books for science is a wonderful fit for him. Just wonderful!

 

HTH!!!:)

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My 16yo dd has Asperger's and Anxiety. She started school early (at 4 almost 5) so she will graduate at 17. We've had many a discussion about taking an extra year of high school, but at this point (she's a junior) she is just not wanting to do that. So my first piece of advice would be to build in an extra year if needed, right away, when there is little opposition to an extra "5th year" of high school or repeating a grade ;)

 

I could not agree more! Especially if your child not only has learning issues, but this is especially helpful advice to follow if your child has any social issues.

 

We added that extra year for my son, so he will be 19yo when he graduates (his b/day is in March, so he will only be 19 for a few months before graduating in 2013).

 

 

 

That gave me some direction to take with her high school electives. I have tried, this year, to build electives/courses around her interests. She is more apt to put the work and time into it if she's interested.

 

I agree. This is why my son's 9th grade science year was so successful. We started the year using Apologia Bio, but soon moved to reading living books about animals. He LOVED and learned a lot.

 

This year, I've made sure he's had enough time free from "book learning" to volunteer with an Urban Ministry program our church has. He helps out at the church where they tutor/mentor elem. aged children two afternoons a week. He also is an Awana volunteer every Wed. night. He LOVES kids and has a heart for missions, so this is just as important as his regular school work.

 

 

What I need to do, that I haven't done yet, is work with her on normal everyday things, like doing laundry and cooking and shopping.

 

I started working more dilgently on those "everyday" skills during those tough puberty years (12-14yo). He had little to no focus for sitting still and really thinking, so I kept his *body* busy. He did more house work during those years than I did!

 

I'm glad I did that then, so now that he's busy reading and studying a lot and is spending more and more time out of the house volunteering (and going to the gym), I don't have to worry about teaching those everyday skills.

 

Those middle school hormonal years are perfect for teaching all this stuff!

 

So I guess I just am a lot more relaxed with her. I am filling her credit requirements as I see fit. It's hard sometimes, as many of her friends are dual enrolled in cc and are doing college bound classes. They are taking SAT, ACT, and PSAT (which dd is not). And dd is really smart, she just gets caught up in the anxiety/sensory/processing issues which make heavy loads and deadlines ridiculously difficult.

 

Yep, yep, yep!!!

 

I don't know if I've done her a disservice by being so easy on her or not, but I am so pleased when she comes to talk to me about what she is learning.

 

I feel the SAME way!!! It's funny to me that many of my friends who have so called "normal" children never have this experience with their dc.

 

 

Before, she was so "done" with school and the stress that she didn't want to learn anything extra, or talk about it. It was just a box to check off.

 

That's where my son was last year (9th gr) by November. During the summer before 9th grade, we sat down and explained to him *all* he would have to do over the next 4 years to be able to get into his college of choice at that time (of course, now he doesn't even want to go to that college anymore). He went into his 9th grade year full steam ahead, but VERY quickly burnt out. By November he was telling me that he didn't want to go to college at all!

 

Once we regrouped on what he was doing for school and the PACE of the day, he slowly changed his mind about college. At that same time, we began to talk to him about the fact that CC *might* be a better starting place for him than a 4 year university right out of highschool. That's what dh and I did, so we can speak from experience about this. He now is very content in the fact that he will be attending CC at first. This will be good for him socially and educationally.

 

By using different curriculum and going with her interests, she's retaining more and excited (well, mostly) about what she's learning. In the end, I hope that that is more important than a bunch of facts shoved into her head that she will never remember.

 

This has been our exact experience once we changed course also. Honestly, my son's days are really simple. He reads his bible everyday (no formal bible study), does *his* math that is perfect for *him*, reads literature selections, reads living books for history and science, writes everyday and spends lots of time volunteering each week. He LOVES to talk about what he's learning.

 

 

 

 

:)

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Greta,

 

It is so comforting to read that someone else is following the same pattern as we are!!! It's also good to know that I made some sort of sense in my post :tongue_smilie: I so wish that dd would take that extra year of high school, but I have finally left it in God's hands. She knows that the door remains open if she changes her mind.

 

I just wanted to let you know you made my day just by understanding :grouphug:

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Greta Lea, thank you so much for your posts! My son sounds similar to yours, esp. with the math. He is doing the Key to... series this year and it's been good for him. We plan to do Key to Algebra and Geometry in 9th and 10th, and then we'll see where that takes us. My son has also decided that he will be fine with going to (or starting with) community college/tech school! I've been a worried mess about high school plans in general though. It was nice to read over your posts! :)

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Michele,

 

I wish I could go back and completely re-do high school for my ds. Ds was not delayed in academics in anyway. He was academically advanced. He scored well on the PSAT, etc. He completed the typical high school course load.

 

If I could go back, I would worry much less about the academic path. I would focus more on the skill/training/vocation path. I was pretty much an ostrich w/ds when it came to realizing that he was never going to function on a normal level. It was an easy mistake in some regards b/c he made great grades (he went to a private school for awhile and had the highest grade in a couple of his classes. Even last semester at the local CC he made one of the highest grades in English and in pre-cal)

 

BUT.......academics and future don't necessarily mean the same thing. Ds needs training for a routine, repetitive job b/c his Aspergers is a real disability (not some designer label meaning his intelligence is superior and his obsessions are wonderful strengths) which impacts his ability to function. He is unable to see the big picture and interprets things literally. He can't see the obvious next step in jobs, etc. He can do exactly what he needs to do when told specifically what it is that needs to be done......but don't expect him to do anything other than the specified tasks, etc.

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I've graduated my ADHD/Aspie son and he is doing very well in his adult life.

 

In middle school we worked on writing and math skills, and for the rest of it (science, history and literature) I read aloud and we watched lots of great movies and documentaries. At age 13 he started pursuing his interests in theater lighting design with a mentor at church.

 

In high school he followed the non-college prep path with the intention of going to community college or into a apprenticeship. He made it through algebra and geometry, 3 years of English, a year of American history, world history, and a semester each of economics (mostly personal finance) and government. He also had health, life science (biology lite) with a lab component, and some kind of physical science. He made it through a year of Spanish, I think -- a combination of Rosetta Stone and my trying to teach him some grammar. Nothing terrific. He did learn to write an essay and to do research, but most of his "output" was a project of one kind or another. He made videos, such as his "public service commercial" on the health benefits of coffee, he did a radio show from WWII featuring news stories, music and commercials. We used the Movies as Literature curriculum, though he also did a fair amount of reading.

 

But mostly he did theater off and on stage. He continued to volunteer at church as their lighting guy, he worked as a stage manager in a youth theater company (wrote their stage manager manual as a senior project, in fact.) He sang and acted, too, but mostly he learned everything he could about lighting design and by his senior year was designing the the lighting for school and community productions.

 

Fast forward to age 19 and he has found a university that fits him and he will be getting a 4 year degree in production design. He spent last year working in the Disney College Program in Florida -- far away from us -- and did very well on his own. He is home until school starts in September and is now getting paid to work at church and to design lights for area community theaters.

 

The lessons I learned from homeschooling him was to be creative. I read aloud, we listened to audio books, we watched lots of documentaries (I spent lots of time searching on the internet!!) and continued visiting museums. I kept text books to a minimum and banished any and all busy work. (As in no fill in the blank work sheets, and comprehension questions were done orally and conversationally, and heavily edited!) We did algebra on a big white board and had fun with geometry constructions with paper, compass and pencil. We put his love of theater to use, too, in our study of history and literature. I assigned essays, but maybe one per month -- it was the slow and steady approach to improving his writing. He wrote well, in complete sentences and such, but it was the organization of arguments that eluded him.

 

I taught him to cook, to do laundry, to balance a checkbook (though everything is on-line these days!). Driving was terrifying and he still doesn't have a license! We're working on that right now, in fact.

 

OH! And I have to echo Greta Lea. Ages 12-14 were horrendous!! It felt like a time of regression for him and I truly despaired! 15 was marginally better with 16 and 17 delightful. 19 is pretty cool, too, especially since younger brother is now on the other side of the awful years and they make an entertaining pair. I think lots of love, patience and grace are what get you through that 12-14 period. Remember toddlerhood? It is like that only they are bigger and smellier. Read aloud. Watch old movies together. And don't take their bored expressions personally. And treat yourself to chocolate and a regular glass of wine in the evening:tongue_smilie:

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I Driving was terrifying and he still doesn't have a license! We're working on that right now, in fact.

 

 

My 16yo dd feels the same way! She got her temps but her anxiety skyrockets anytime we talk about driving. We decided not to push her into Driver's Ed. Once winter is over, we will begin working a little more at easing her into this.

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I haven't posted here regularly since the old boards and am not at liberty anymore to say much:glare:;).

 

In our case, my dc is gifted as well. What we have worked on, (and some of these things we're still working on) are:

 

organization and time management skills

 

writing essays in general and not just because of attitude, but sometimes grappling with getting the right words out in that first sentence. Without that first sentence, the paper does not get written

 

asking for help when needed

 

not arguing with the one giving needed help

 

setting up a page so that the person checking the work can read it

 

erasing mistakes rather than writing over them

 

learning to restate the question in the answer (a necessary step, IMO, even if you don't always do that later)

 

Learning to take a standardized test within the allotted time frame (ie, learning strategies and not stopping forever on one hard problem or losing focus because it's boring) this is important re: future PSAT, SAT, etc

 

I can't think of anything else, but there was more

Edited by Karin
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Our ds is not allowed to get his driver's license at this pt. It would be like handing a toddler a loaded weapon and setting them loose with it. He is very distractable. It would not be an exaggeration for him to see something out the window that caught his attention or get distracted by wanting to change the station on the radio. A car driving 45 miles/hr is a means of severe tragedy when under the control of someone who isn't equipped to control it.

 

Our state does have a rehabilitation center where we can take him and have him tested in a simulator to see if it something he should be allowed to pursue. At this pt, however, even he knows that it would not be a good decision, so it is a moot pt.

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Jumping into this conversation a bit late....

 

I was wondering how y'all are calculating credits for high school. At THIS point my ds is performing about 2 grade levels behind (he's in 8th and working on BJU 6th grade science, for example). His main struggle is language (I highly suspect he has CAPD), which of course gets in the way of what he's able to understand conceptually in other subjects. I offered him the option of taking an extra year to complete everything for high school, but he didn't want that.

 

Currently he is strongly considering going into the military after high school, so I do need some sort of credit-based transcript for him. My struggle is in actually calculating those credits. I went to the HSLDA website, and it wasn't much help. They basically said that if a student completes a year's worth of a high school textbook, that's a credit. Or if I'm putting together my own course of study, it's a certain amount of time. However, if I don't start counting credits till he's working at the high school level, then he'll only have 11th and 12th grade to do it (if he continues at the pace he currently is working at...although I told him that by choosing to not take an extra year he's pretty much giving up his summers so he can get caught up). If I use the amount of time spent...well he takes extra time since he doesn't "get it" as easily.

 

I guess I have no idea what a credit for a slightly delayed student would consist of. I don't want to count it as a full credit unless it actually is, though I don't want the standard to be TOO high either, if that makes sense.

 

Any suggestions?

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  • 1 year later...
  • 2 weeks later...

I am so, so grateful to have found this particular thread. In particular, I appreciate reading about the various responses to the idea of driving. We have an almost 14 year old son who was adopted at age 8 1/2 who has some pretty serious deficits which are not immediately observable until you spend a little time with him. He was reading at a 1st grade level at 11 years old (he is now at a solid 5th grade level and we are re-visiting phonics one last time with Wilson Reading System), he has severe CAPD, speech delays (bilateral cleft lip and palate), working memory and long term memory issues, processing speed is quite a bit below average, and ADD.

 

He is also the most delightful and insightful kid you'd ever want to meet, seriously. He has tremendous gifts, a wonderful salesman's sense, is kinder than any boy his age I've ever met, and a heart filled with gratitude for the effort I put into helping him.

 

We currently have him classified as a 14 year old sixth grader, which is appropriate and well suited as he is capable of doing that level of work and IS making progress, though slow.

 

Added to the mix are two daughters who are 13 and 14, grades 5 and 6 respectively, who are learning English and home two years. Both are amazing and doing quite well. All 3 will graduate at 20 or 21 years old.

 

Oh yea, then a 13 year old son who we suspect has dysgraphia (earlier post tonight asking for opinions), and a 9 year old working way ahead of schedule.

 

Our 13 year old possible dysgraphic will be our first in high school next year, and I already gave up on it looking the same as everyone else. We have too much in the mix for "normal". We are going to do what works, keeping it academically engaging and somewhat challenging, yet recognizing that we are not raising Harvard kids here. We want a strong overall basic education, with a focus on life skills and career exploration. We will "check some boxes" in some areas, such as foreign language using Rosetta Stone, and we will delve much more deeply in areas of possible career direction. All will eventually read very well and some already are. Some will write well,and some will write well with adaptive technology helping them. Science will be lighter except for our youngest, who might be heading into medicine one day in some form.

 

We will do the best we can, while recognizing strengths and weaknesses and not wasting time pretending strengths exist that don't. My one son we are not even sure he will truly live on his own, but he will be extremely high functioning if he doesn't...it'll be a close call. The others will all do fine, and some might obtain a 4 year degree...maybe.

 

Reading this thread thought has helped me feel much better about our path the next few years. This board can be so darned intimidating!!! Then throw in a passel of special needs and being behind, and you begin to feel as if you will never be able to do enough.

 

Thanks forgiving me permission to see that maybe,what we are doing is indeed "enough".

 

Cindy

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  • 3 years later...

Oldie, but a thread I found quite helpful. I had printed it off and was just clearing out my high school binder and came across it. 

 

It's been 5 years, jump in with updates and additional thoughts. 

 

Edited by eligo esse felicem
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