Visiting Moscow

[Country Girl]

My dh has to go to Moscow in a few months for business and I may have an opportunity to go with him. The decision hasn't been made and many details still need to be worked out.... but I'm just thinking ahead. If I go, what sorts of things should I make sure I do while visiting? Any tips that would be helpful to know before I go? Would I be safe traveling around Moscow by myself?

 

Thanks!

[dangermom]

I don't know the answers to those questions, but...LUCKY! Wow!

[Teachaheart]

My dh has to go to Moscow in a few months for business and I may have an opportunity to go with him. The decision hasn't been made and many details still need to be worked out.... but I'm just thinking ahead. If I go, what sorts of things should I make sure I do while visiting? Any tips that would be helpful to know before I go? Would I be safe traveling around Moscow by myself?

 

Thanks!

 

I am on my way out the door, but I'll try to put in my two cents later tonight. For now though, if you and DH can manage to work in a side trip to St. Petersburg, it would definitely be worth it.

[Country Girl]

I don't know the answers to those questions, but...LUCKY! Wow!

 

I know, I feel lucky.... I've always wanted to travel to Russia. However, the thing that is holding me back the most is that it is during my ds's b-day. My dh feels bad being gone during his b-day but doesn't have a choice. I don't know if I can bring myself to choose to be gone on his b-day.

[Country Girl]

I am on my way out the door, but I'll try to put in my two cents later tonight. For now though, if you and DH can manage to work in a side trip to St. Petersburg, it would definitely be worth it.

 

Thanks, I look forward to your reply. If I go, I'll definitely check into a trip to St. Petersburg. We've had friends who visited St. Petersburg and highly recommended it as well.

[iwka]

I lived in Moscow in the 90' for over three years. You simply MUST go to St. Petersburg and you will be safe there.

 

As for Moscow, it depends how many days you will be there. The Kremlin by itself might take longer than one day.

 

As for St. Petersburg, just for Hermitage it might take a year to see every piece of art there.:)

[Country Girl]

I lived in Moscow in the 90' for over three years. You simply MUST go to St. Petersburg and you will be safe there.

 

As for Moscow, it depends how many days you will be there. The Kremlin by itself might take longer than one day.

 

As for St. Petersburg, just for Hermitage it might take a year to see every piece of art there.:)

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. I'm not sure how long we'd be in Moscow, probably right around 7-10 days. I was looking online and it looks like it would be pretty easy (and pretty inexpensive) to take the train from Moscow to St. Petersburg. Am I right in thinking this?

 

Thanks!

[iwka]

Yes, it will be easy, as this is still a very popular way of transportation in Europe. As for the price, it will depends on how fast you want to get to St. Petersburg and back and what kind of seat/bed you want.

 

I would take an overnight train with a sleeping bed. It is an experience by itself!!!

 

Thanks for the feedback. I'm not sure how long we'd be in Moscow, probably right around 7-10 days. I was looking online and it looks like it would be pretty easy (and pretty inexpensive) to take the train from Moscow to St. Petersburg. Am I right in thinking this?

 

Thanks!

[Susan in TN]

Well, I haven't been in Moscow since before communism fell ;) but you should definitely visit the main subway station and a small functioning monastery that is just a short distance from Moscow. Can't think of the name of it off hand. Visit Gorky Park, for the sake of the movie. If you happen to pass by a short, off-white non-descript building with "John Paul George Ringo" spray painted on it, I will pay you a large sum of money for a photo of it. I saw it from a bus window and could never find it again to take a picture. I suppose they've cleaned it off by now :D.

 

A train ride to St. Petersburg is a wonderful experience.

[Heather in the Kootenays]

I absolutely loved it and would go back in a minute. Do a crash course in Russian history and art before you go. There's so much to see there.

[PeterPan]

Well I think you should take me with you. You need someone with rusty russian to act as your tour guide. :)

 

Seriously, get some travel guides and do your research. The subway stations are amazing. They're color coded (or were when I was there), so with minimal trouble you can negotiate your way around. Do yourself a favor and learn the Cyrillic alphabet, at least enough to recognize the forms of words on signs and match them to your guide book.

 

I took the train, both in private overnight cars and in the shared overnight sections. It was safe (or rather, I didn't get mugged), but that contradicted what I had heard going in. This was years ago. To me, the wisest thing to do in Russia is NOT look American. ;) Wipe the smile off your face, dress low key. This is not the place to go looking hip in your best duds. When I was there, it was pretty much a 3rd world country with nukes. People were wearing hand-me-downs (think Goodwill) that came in humanitarian boxes. The street mafia walked around, nay strutted, in windbreakers and jogging pants, thinking themselves oh so cool. It's not the place to show up in Ann Taylor and Gap and flash your best, kwim? Blend in, that's my advice. When I went, I actually acquired a bunch of handmedowns and left all my regular clothes behind. But that's just me. At least I blended in.

 

Oh, normal travel advice. Thin underwear you can wash in the sink and dry overnight. A few shirts and interchangeable pants or skirts. A hidden zipper pouch to keep your money and passport on your person. Don't trust the hotel. (Not personal experience, just stories I've heard.)

 

I think serendipity is good in exploring Moscow. There are many facets to it, and the normal tourist attractions are not the only thing of interest. Go to the markets around the subway entrances. Make SURE you buy russian candy, oh my. Go in the grocery stores and see how they shop. (It's different from our walmart.) Go to department stores and see what they DON'T have. Talk with people about their gardens and see if you can get someone from your dh's company to take you out to theirs. Really see how they live. Walk around the city and see how SIMILAR apartment buildings are. (Oh the joys of communism.) Go in some apartments and see how they live. Try to visit rich people and poor people to see the spread. Their idea of rich is usually below anything our middle class has. Rich when I was there meant your own, non-concrete, cookie-cutter apartment and a bosch washer and dryer. Drive out in the country and visit some houses people have built themselves and see how they live. It's just amazing. Mind-boggling.

 

If you can get someone from that company to take you around, that would be really cool. Nationals get into museums and things for less than foreigners, and they'd be able to explain to you what you're seeing and how things work.

 

Anthony Bordain of the Travel Channel did an episode on Russia. And yes, I SO wish I had gone to St. Petersburg. Bend over backwards. Get your dh to spend a couple extra days and the two of you go together. :)

 

If you're a christian, you could try to attend church while you're there. There are registered and unregistered churches. The Orthodox churches will let you in any time to see the icons and interiors, though they usually require headcoverings, which they will loan you.

 

PS. if you're the kind of person who needs snacks, take them with you. One experienced traveler gave me a bag of M&M's before we parted, and that was SO welcome. :)

Edited March 8, 2010 by OhElizabeth

[milovany]

If you're a christian, you could try to attend church while you're there. There are registered and unregistered churches. The Orthodox churches will let you in any time to see the icons and interiors, though they usually require headcoverings, which they will loan you.

 

I would say whether you're religious or not religious this should still be something one should do in Russia! I so wish I could attend a Russian Orthodox church, wow.

[Colleen in NS]

I went to Moscow and St. Petersburg in 1992 - do try to get to St. Petersburg. Do as much as you can in both cities and then come back here and tell us about it! The Metro system is amazing, the stations are museums, St. Basil's Cathedral is beautiful, the people are beautiful (and quiet on the streets), the Hermitage is beautiful, and the Winter Palace. I would love to go back for another visit some day.

 

OhElizabeth, I loved reading your description.

[Country Girl]

Thank you everyone for the thoughts and advice. Definitely sounds like a trip to St. Petersburg would be worth the time and money!

 

Great suggestion to visit a church, didn't even think of that.

 

Oh Elizabeth~ Great suggestions. I love the idea of really experiencing daily life like shopping, homes etc. I think dh will be spending quite a bit of time with a local "host" so maybe they would be able to help on that front. Also, thanks for the reminder about foreigners paying more to enter museums and such. I remember friends telling us about being surprised by that when they visited.

[PeterPan]

The garden and dacha are a HUGE part of life in Russia, even for city dwellers. For many it's a necessity to grow 1/2 or more of what you eat. I only stayed in Moscow a couple weeks (the rest of the time was elsewhere), but even the lady I stayed with had a plot outside the city. You'd ride the subway and see people going to or coming back from working in their gardens. It's one of those facets of life there.

 

The shopping thing stems from communism. You'll find more typical stores, but you'll also find the old style. And you'll find people on the street selling meat and milk and things that you wonder if they're safe. Rumor was the Moscow milk was watered down, but that's just what they say.

 

Oh, I almost forgot! The BREAD!!! Make sure you eat the bread, everywhere you go. Every city's bread is different, because it's made at a different factory. Not like you can avoid bread in Russia, haha.

 

When I was there the neatest place to shop was on Arbat Street. There's a book (Children of the Arbat?) of similar name. You might read the book before you go. I'm not much of a person for history, but it opened my eyes to things, making a lot of things make sense when I got there. A little bit of reading like that ahead of time would be good preparation. It will put little things you see in more context. For instance, when you go to buy a train ticket, they ask you for your passport. They ask NATIONALS for their passport. Back in the old days they controlled where you went, whether you could move from one city to another, and it's a vestige of that. So you start to put things in context.

 

If you don't do caffeinated tea, then you better take decaf with you. They do a LOT of tea drinking (because the water isn't safe and becomes magically better with boiling, right?) and it will certainly be an issue. Even in summer they drink hot tea. Nothing more cooling than a cup of hot tea in a stifling soviet era concrete apartment kitchen... :)

 

Have fun. Make sure you visit that Arbat St. and get some cool stuff.

[Country Girl]

The garden and dacha are a HUGE part of life in Russia, even for city dwellers. For many it's a necessity to grow 1/2 or more of what you eat. I only stayed in Moscow a couple weeks (the rest of the time was elsewhere), but even the lady I stayed with had a plot outside the city. You'd ride the subway and see people going to or coming back from working in their gardens. It's one of those facets of life there.

 

Oh, I almost forgot! The BREAD!!! Make sure you eat the bread, everywhere you go. Every city's bread is different, because it's made at a different factory. Not like you can avoid bread in Russia, haha.

 

When I was there the neatest place to shop was on Arbat Street. There's a book (Children of the Arbat?) of similar name. You might read the book before you go. I'm not much of a person for history, but it opened my eyes to things, making a lot of things make sense when I got there. A little bit of reading like that ahead of time would be good preparation. It will put little things you see in more context. For instance, when you go to buy a train ticket, they ask you for your passport. They ask NATIONALS for their passport. Back in the old days they controlled where you went, whether you could move from one city to another, and it's a vestige of that. So you start to put things in context.

 

If you don't do caffeinated tea, then you better take decaf with you. They do a LOT of tea drinking (because the water isn't safe and becomes magically better with boiling, right?) and it will certainly be an issue. Even in summer they drink hot tea. Nothing more cooling than a cup of hot tea in a stifling soviet era concrete apartment kitchen... :)

 

Have fun. Make sure you visit that Arbat St. and get some cool stuff.

 

Thank you again! It sounds like a really interesting place to visit and one of those places that has always been on my wish list to see. My dh was working on his ticket and finalizing trip plans today and once he has that figured out we will better be able to determine if I will be tagging along or not.

[Teachaheart]

Well, I did not manage to post last night like I thought I would, so I am glad to see others, particularly OHElizabeth, gave you lots of information. I agree with all of the suggestions and tips, but I did want to mention some of my favorite places.

 

I lived in St. Petersburg and only took a couple side trips to Moscow, but my favorite things in Moscow were visiting the Kremlin and Red Square, spending an afternoon at Gorky Park, and wandering the Arbat. I also really enjoyed and highly recommend going to the Trinity Lavra (monastery) of St. Sergius in Sergiyev Posad just outside Moscow.

 

As has been mentioned before, the Metro stations are museums of their own. I found that to be true in both Moscow and St. Petersburg.

 

For traveling to St. Petersburg, I recommend taking the night train. It is a good cultural experience, and you don't waste time traveling that you could be using for sightseeing.

 

In St. Petersburg, I loved just wandering the streets along the Neva and along the various canals. Of course, I had lots of time to do that while living there. Since your time will be more limited, maybe more focused wandering would be in order. In that case, I recommend walking along Nevskiy Prospekt and its side streets along the canals. You would be able to visit the Hermitage/Winter Palace, Kazan Cathedral, Gostiny Dvor, and Dom Knigi (my favorite bookstore). Other places of interest, such as The Church of Our Savior on Spilled Blood, are only a short walk off Nevskiy Prospekt. My other favorite places include the Peter & Paul Fortress, the Summer Garden, St. Isaac's Cathedral, the Russian Museum, and so many more. In fact, this site http://www.saint-petersburg.com/virtual-tour/index.asp would be a great place to begin working out an itinerary. I've been to all the places on that page and love them all. If you are in St. Petersburg in June, you will get to experience the White Nights, which just adds another dimension to an already amazing experience.

 

Oh, I nearly forgot one of my most favorite places...the bread factory. Any bread factory. If you can time it just right, you can buy fresh, hot bread that is amazingly delicious. Try different kinds of bread, especially black bread.

 

One other important thing, the water in Russia is not drinkable as is. It MUST be boiled for at least 10 minutes in order for it to be safe enough for consumption, and even then some foreigners still manage to get giardia. You should buy bottled water and make sure you always have some on you and in your hotel room. Some people even have trouble using the tap water to brush their teeth. You may not want to take any chances and just use bottled water for that too.

 

Finally, for now anyway, I agree with whomever suggested learning the Cyrillic alphabet before you go. I would also suggest getting a CD and book of travel/survival Russian and learning some basic phrases too. You can get by with only English, but the experience is so much richer if you can use even a little Russian while you are interacting with people.

 

Keep us all posted on how things work out for this trip!

[TammyinTN]

I have nothing to add, but I desperately want to go. I hope you can go! :D

[PeterPan]

The family I lived with would boil water and leave it in a pot on the counter for the day so that no one was ever tempted to just drink straight tap water when they wanted a drink. The lady I stayed with in Moscow had a water filter on her tap, though I have no clue if it did any good. It was the heavy metals I had heard were the problem. You might run into different things in different places, depending on the people you're with. Bottled drinks (of all sorts, haha) are readily available on the street.

 

I had no problems with the water while I was there. Culture shock, that I had, lol, but not the water. I came back with a low level cough from bad nutrition, but that was over the course of a summer, not just a week.

[Amy in KS]

I studied in St. Peterburg in 92 and took weekend trips to Moscow (so my advice may be dated).

 

Try riding the various types of transportation. I loved riding around on the subway (very safe), the tram and the autobus!

 

The pieroshki sold by the street vendors are usually delicious!!!! They are basically little bread pockets with meat or fruit inside them. The dark bread is great, too.

 

In Moscow, you should definitely see Red Square and GUM (the department store next to it). See an orthodox church (bring a scarf and long skirt for that day).

 

In St. Petersburg, I think you start at the Hermitage and stroll along Nevsky Prospekt. I loved Dom Knigi (Russian book store). You should also see a palace or two. I suggest reading up on czars and communism before you go, it will make the trip more interesting. If you can see a ballet, do it!

 

St. Petersburg is like a artistic Venice of the East. Lots of beauty and art. People are very kind and helpful.

 

I absolutely agree about the water. You must boil it. Be careful not to drink juice as it is usually diluted with water. You don't want to mess with giardia (an intestinal bug that resurfaces every 30 days). Also, St. Petersburg did some sort of cleaning of their central water lines every June and the water is rust colored and COLD only (hokey pokey showers were the order of the day) so you won't really want to drink water straight from the tap. Steaming hot coffee and tea got me through. They have fantastic coffee.

 

If you are there in the summer, you will be there for the midnight sun (very little if any darkness during the night). Very neat, but it will be hard to block the sun out to sleep. We had to hang blankets on our windows.

 

Bring enough in your carry on bag to be able to live on for a few days. My bag "disappeared" and I had to rely on help from strangers. I don't feel that their airport was very efficient at getting lost bags straightened out.

 

There is crime. There is a mafia. Mostly, they extorted people so their apartments wouldn't be broken into. I wouldn't say there was lots of violence, but some petty theft. They are big cities, just be aware. Would I say it was a very safe place? No, but I wouldn't say it was unsafe either. Don't look for the same kind of luxury or ease you might find on vacation in the U.S. It is just different. I was advised as a young lady to not travel alone and I would be fine. I think it was very good advice.

[Susan in TN]

If you don't do caffeinated tea, then you better take decaf with you. They do a LOT of tea drinking (because the water isn't safe and becomes magically better with boiling, right?) and it will certainly be an issue. Even in summer they drink hot tea. Nothing more cooling than a cup of hot tea in a stifling soviet era concrete apartment kitchen... :)

 

QUOTE]

 

Oh, water is still bad? Well, please avoid the delicious apricot juice that may be served at your restaurant table! Very delicious (especially when fruit is scarce) but very very bad a few hours later when you are forced to run to a public toilet ( and unless they have been modernized, learn how to squat.)

[PeterPan]

Oh, haha, totally forgot about the toilet thing! Yup, anywhere more typical, it's just a hole in the floor, not even necessarily with a door. Take your own tp. I took kleenex. Easy to use lots of ways. ;) The McDonald's in Moscow had toilet paper and regular toilets, and I remember it being such a refreshing change after more typical accomodations in the smaller towns where I was.

[MistyJ]

Visit monasteries and churches. Don't drink the water. Stay off the street after dark.

 

I absolutely agree about the overnight train rides. The experience cannot be duplicated. St. Petersburg is the perfect destination. Go to the Hermitage!

 

I lived in Russia a year, and thought I had all the time in the world to go to the Hermitage, and never did. St. Basil's in Red Square was under renovation (kind of a laugh, as almost everything was) while I was there, so never saw inside. We (college girls) would drink the water when we wanted to lose weight.

 

Accept every dinner invitation!

 

Estonia is lovely, if you have time.

[Colleen in NS]

The McDonald's in Moscow

 

Hey Elizabeth, when were you there? I think when I was there in 1992, the McDonald's was very new. I remember standing OUTSIDE in a huge lineup that went all the way around a park, just to get into McDonalds.

 

Train ride to St. Petersburg - yep, do that. I took an overnighter with the team I was with. We slept in bunks, 4 per room. My friend and I locked ourselves in and wouldn't let anyone else in with us. Another guy friend (about 25yo) on our team shared a bunk room with an elderly woman. :D And I didn't use the toilet at all on the train - 8 hours of holding it in - the toilets smelled so bad. And I got pinched a couple of times while walking through crowds, in the daytime, even while with friends. Don't know if it's the same anymore. I have friends in Ukraine, who have been there for 17 years or so, and they say so much has changed and become more westernized. I would love to visit Moscow again.

[PeterPan]

Hehe, I'm dating myself here. I was there the summer of '96. I stayed with families in the unregistered churches, went to their summer camp, etc. It was QUITE the experience. It wasn't a touristy thing at all, more just living with them and seeing what it's really like. Went to orphanages, a children's hospital, worked in the gardens, hoed potatoes and broke dirt with a shovel, ate potatoes cooked in the fire, split a small can of meat between 13 people for dinner, lived on macaroni and milk soup so long I came back sick. But it was eye-opening. People don't realize what they have.

[Amy in KS]

Colleen--

I was there in 1992, but I was studying at Gornyi Institute in St. Petersburg. When I visited McDonald's in Moscow, I was SOOOOOO grateful for American food (and I'm not a big fan of McDonald's)! There were still a lot of food shortages then. My normal dorm food consisted of cabbage salad for breakfast, cabbage soup for lunch with some buckwheat, and brown bread with whatever they found that day. If we were lucky, they had Kefir...

 

Do you remember the lines? There were lines in random places and people would just get in them in case it was something they needed (like shoes, vegetables, etc).

 

I miss going to see the ballet for next to nothing (ruble was worth very little in 1992), the rich coffee (Turkish?), the subway, sitting on the beach at midnight in the bright sun with ultra cheap Georgian wine, samovars, nevsky prospekt and the older people playing chess on a cardtable set up in front of the Hermitage.

[PeterPan]

Cabbage sounds like a step up from the radish salad we ate for breakfast. Whew, that gets strong first thing in the morning! :)

[Colleen in NS]

My normal dorm food consisted of cabbage salad for breakfast, cabbage soup for lunch with some buckwheat, and brown bread with whatever they found that day. If we were lucky, they had Kefir...

 

Yes!! I ate a lot of bread and potatoes there. Tomatoes and cold cuts and cheese for breakfast, lots of soup

 

Do you remember the lines? There were lines in random places and people would just get in them in case it was something they needed (like shoes, vegetables, etc).

 

I do remember lines everywhere.

 

I miss going to see the ballet for next to nothing (ruble was worth very little in 1992), the rich coffee (Turkish?), the subway, sitting on the beach at midnight in the bright sun with ultra cheap Georgian wine, samovars, nevsky prospekt and the older people playing chess on a cardtable set up in front of the Hermitage.

 

Oh wow, you are bringing back memories! My team (missionaries) did go to the opera - tickets were = to about 10 cents American. And I remember the sun still being out at about 10:30 p.m. (in August). And yes, I do now remember people sitting out at tables playing games! I also saw a bear being led on a leash, somewhere near the Hermitage. I took a picture of it. I also drank a lot of lemon-lime soda from stands all around the city, because of lack of water - though I did buy bottled water.

 

The thing I really remember is how quiet people were on the streets. We team leaders were continually "shushing" the kids on our team whenever we were out walking, because we didn't want to be stereotypical Americans. I wonder if it's still like that. People were quiet, sober, and serious.

 

Oh, and I remember kittens being sold by vendors near the stairs going down under the streets to the Metro.

 

Arbat Street - definitely go there, too. And there was a huge market area near Hotel Izmailovo (sp?).

[PeterPan]

The thing I really remember is how quiet people were on the streets. We team leaders were continually "shushing" the kids on our team whenever we were out walking, because we didn't want to be stereotypical Americans. I wonder if it's still like that. People were quiet, sober, and serious.

 

 

Now I know some happy russians, but this is very true and part of blending in. I finally asked why nobody smiled, and they replied that only DRUNKS smile like that. And with the people I was with, if you went to take a picture of them they wiped off their smile. I remember one girl, with whom I had been visiting and talking, saying to stop, take her picture (as she wiped off her smile), and saying to remember her, remember this moment, because life is HARD. That sort of explains it all, kwim?