The UPS guy is a fount of local information ;) My UPS guy is my bil........ he's okay, but he's my bil. :lol:

Yes, but those are just silly things that men do. Prayer, though?!? Omg! One of those kids could end up a Christian (Saints Preserve Us!). I get it.

From the other side... Yes, I've lived here most of my life. That does not mean I actually know the street names. I know WHO lives on WHAT street (the street two down from the Johnson's), just not the names. Oh, and half the businesses have new names, but I don't know the new names (they're like when Prince went with the symbol - the store formerly known as Little Sue's). :lol:

How much does that cost? I tried to get some stuff printed out locally and it was ex.pen.sive., so I'm hoping to find somewhere cheaper :) Nanowrimo is National Novel Writing Month. So, it's not for a specific grade so much as any child that is ready to do that kind of work. You could try to make it easier for him by reading the questions and writing his answer (like narration). We're going to shoot for the moon and try to do it all in November, together (dd, ds and ME).

:iagree:

http://stores.lulu.com/classicallyeclectic This is a good one :) You can d/l the Ebook and stories free (so you can take a look before you buy). And besides, who doesn't love freeeeeee?

That's the difference between what percipitated the original court order and what happened nine days later. They had been leading the school in prayer, what got them back into court was praying over a meal, among adults that wished to take part. Now, if you were at a banquet dinner, like a large friend and family function or a group of peers, and most of you went to the same church and you announced, we're going to bless the food if anyone wants to join us, that would be (imo) appropriate. Whereas demanding that everyone there bow their heads would be out of line. The way the order is worded (at least as it is put in the articles I've read) these men are not allowed to participate in or start a prayer. Which means, they cannot pray. How can you pray if you are not allowed to participate in or start a prayer? The wording does not distinguish between personal prayer and, what they'd gotten into trouble for, forced group prayer. :iagree:

Ah, the stage whisper.

I like this idea a lot! I have been to a few churches where children are involved, or at least expected to sit through, the entire service. For me, I always kept quiet snacks (raisins) and papers with crayons. It's possible for my dcs to be quiet (at that age), but not to sit still. Sometimes I let them sit on the floor and for my youngest I would bring cars and just sit all the way in the back so he could play quietly out of the way.

I keep falling off the wagon. She does say to clean light fixtures and wash walls, but if she mentions shampooing carpets, I've missed it, lol.

That's odd..... maybe she's scared of rejection? I'm sorry about your brother.

That was beautiful. Not the post I quoted, but the original post you wrote ;)

Do you have siblings? Do you hate eachother? Personally, my big sister and I are best friends. My sil and I are very close and my brother is the person I turn to when it seems like dh has lost his mind. We're all close. Even my bil. I could not imagine 'hating' either of my siblings, or their spouses. If your experience is different (assuming you have siblings), why not point that out? "Gee, my sister and I get along great!" or "my brother and I are such good friends, I just assumed all sibling got along." She'll get the picture.

So far, homeschooling seems, imo, to be the best I can offer my dcs. I've seen great opportunities for highschool, but most of those are colleges ;) As of this moment, I can't imagine putting ds in school.

You're right. Sorry, I overstepped it. We are to bow to our leaders, as they have been appointed by God. The Bible is above the law, but we are required to be just under the law, until it becomes unjust. Thanks for the reminder. It was meant for those that kept repeating and rerepeating posts made earlier. It doesn't matter what actually happened, it doesn't matter where it happened. As far as this case goes, to those that think they deserved jail time the realities of the case don't matter. The differences, and even the reasons behind the judge dropping the charges don't matter. That's all. Sorry if it seemed I was attacking you. It was not meant that way. There is a comparison when people are told they are not allowed to pray at all. The way the order was worded, in the articles I've read, that is exactly what they did. They said these people could not pray there, period. For people that believe we should bless our food before eating it, this would be putting us in a similar, albeit on a smaller scale, situation as the one Daniel faced. Especially if you take into account the admonishment that we should every moment of the day, prayers of praise and thanks as well as prayers for wisdom and guidance. I agree with the reason for the court order, but I think it went too far. They had completely trampled over the freedoms of the kids with the original handbooks and stances. The response, though, went too far in the other direction, imo.

At this point, I'm pretty sure you could have a quote from the judge saying it was held on church property (oh wait, I DID) and it wouldn't matter. No one cares that this incident was completely separate from what got them the court order. No one cares that it was in a different venue with different people. They just want these guys strung up, period. The Bible is above the law. Period. If you push Christians to choose they will side with God. Making laws that infringe upons people's rights to exercise their religion are EXACTLY what the wall of separation was supposed to prevent.

http://www.pnj.com/article/20090917/NEWS01/909170317&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL That was on the Washington's Post's web site, you can use the link if you'd like. It was held ON CHURCH PROPERTY. I'll concede, though, it was during school hours.

It's my homepage, pops up whenever I open a window :)

No, on CHURCH PROPERTY. He was barred from it IN SCHOOL.

It was a building dedication, not in the middle of the school day, it was an after school thing for the people that had helped get the money and the building up.

The link was back two pages. This is the link to the article which states they were on church property. It also has the judge's reasoning behind dropping the charges.

No tv, little radio, I get my google home page news every time I log on. Then, there's here (where I learn all kinds of interesting news). I also read some papers online.

Actually hung out with mine for his lunch hour today :lol:

They were on church property when it happened. Praying is not coercion in and of itself. Forcing others to pray, that's coercion.