I saw Wishbone Dawn a few weeks ago - she and her family are doing well.

Love's Baby Soft!! The pink liquid one with white cap, I think. Mixed-feeling high school flashbacks. Jean Nate after-bath splash - my mother in the summertime

any homeschoolers in Wilmington/New Hanover County who can help me even a tiny bit?

any homeschoolers in Wilmington/New Hanover County who can help me even a tiny bit?

Hi all, I know I could post in the other forum (I forget what it's called) to try this, but it doesn't get much action. I wonder if there are WTM-style and diverse homeschoolers in the Wilmington NC area? My sister is there with her adopted, five-year old, racially-not-same-as-her, special needs twins (boy/girl), and has vaguely considered homeschooling in the past, but is reluctant because she thinks she won't know what to do and is not terribly interested. They are in full-day Kindergarten, and both received letters today saying they need extra tutoring twice a week and would end up being in school NINE hours a day for those days!! She wanted to know what I thought about that (because I've homeschooled both of mine all along, and because I teach lots of kids after school how to read/write/spell because the schools around here don't). HA, I may have given her my strong opinion about five year olds having to be in school for nine hours twice a week, lol! I am hoping to find some people/support groups in her area who do not require adhering to statements of faith, who are culturally and religiously diverse, who believe teaching academic skills is important, who aren't going to tell her she should join co-ops/Classical Conversations/etc., who have experience in working with "learning challenged" kids (her kids are quite able to learn - they just need teaching tailored to them and a few other adjustments), and who welcome casual get-togethers with kids and possibly Mom-get-togethers. I looked into some homeschool conferences in the NC region. I can't picture her going to any of these without being totally overwhelmed by the culture of it all. But a small group of people to talk about all the ins and outs with might work. Thanks for any info. you can give me!

Hi all, I know I could post in the other forum (I forget what it's called) to try this, but it doesn't get much action. I wonder if there are WTM-style and diverse homeschoolers in the Wilmington NC area? My sister is there with her adopted, five-year old, racially-not-same-as-her, special needs twins (boy/girl), and has vaguely considered homeschooling in the past, but is reluctant because she thinks she won't know what to do and is not terribly interested. They are in full-day Kindergarten, and both received letters today saying they need extra tutoring twice a week and would end up being in school NINE hours a day for those days!! She wanted to know what I thought about that (because I've homeschooled both of mine all along, and because I teach lots of kids after school how to read/write/spell because the schools around here don't). HA, I may have given her my strong opinion about five year olds having to be in school for nine hours twice a week, lol! I am hoping to find some people/support groups in her area who do not require adhering to statements of faith, who are culturally and religiously diverse, who believe teaching academic skills is important, who aren't going to tell her she should join co-ops/Classical Conversations/etc., who have experience in working with "learning challenged" kids (her kids are quite able to learn - they just need teaching tailored to them and a few other adjustments), and who welcome casual get-togethers with kids and possibly Mom-get-togethers. I looked into some homeschool conferences in the NC region. I can't picture her going to any of these without being totally overwhelmed by the culture of it all. But a small group of people to talk about all the ins and outs with might work. Thanks for any info. you can give me!

If it helps any, what I remember is how excited you were about her wedding! :)

My daughter hasn't finished high school yet, but I am pretty sure she won't be going to college (or what we call university in Canada) after high school; which is fine with me. She will have a decent uni-prep education when she's done, and she's very smart; but she is just not interested at this point in going to university. She has also had a very rough two years (all of 2015 and 2016) personally, and she just wants to finish her required high school work (we are trying to plan for her to finish early, since she's an October baby and she's antsy to be done), start working, travel a bit and maybe go stay with my sister down south for a few months, see a bit of the world and have some new experiences. She's very artistic and sociable. So I had a look around at our community college system (different from CC in the States), and found a few one-and two-year programs I thought she might like, that would train her to do some jobs that would pay her more than minimum wage and would probably help her find a job easily. She can live at home with us for free while she does a program. So right now her plan is to do a one-year program to be trained as a Continuing Care Assistant (I guess it would be like what nurses aids used to do?). There are tons of CCA jobs advertised around here, and they pay about 1.5 to 2 times as much as minimum wage. She's not terribly excited about it, but she realizes that the pay is good, that she'd be around people all the time, and that it's hands-on which she loves. She also sees that if she can work at something like that, she'll also have time and money to do some of the traveling she wants to do. Maybe take some art courses or radio/television courses for fun. And she knows she doesn't have to make a career out of it forever - it's something right now that she can do for a few years until she figures out something else she might want to do. Or, she can keep on doing it for a long time if she wants. She even said the other day she knows it's a base for possibly becoming an LPN or an RN someday, which surprised me (because RN's here need a BScN). Who knows? We're just thankful that she is alive right now and that she has some plans and hope for her future. I'm not bothered at all that she's not interested in university, as long as she's alive, happy, engaged in something, and working towards supporting herself (which she is very motivated to do). Oh my...I am so sorry to hear about her husband! I remember you talking about when they got married!!

I think SWB is almost finished writing Advanced Language Lessons for the middle grade years. I beta-tested it a few years ago and loved it (we loved the only available FLL 1 and 2 many years ago)!

I think you should celebrate his graduation exactly the way you want to! Maybe since he has all these other events, you could have a dinner out somewhere just as a family.

Mine got all A's! And a 4.something non-zero GPA. He took physics, calculus, English, chemistry, and computer science. With computer science, he was totally bored in the first couple of weeks. He was talking to an advisor one day, and the long and the short of it is that after e-mailing over an afternoon with another professor, ds was allowed to take a second year CS course instead and did really well in that, too. It was more challenging for him and he really liked the professor. Actually, he loved his CS, math, and physics professors. He went to visiting hours often and got to know them well. His physics professor also told him that he was the first student ever to get a 100% on the diagnostic test at the beginning of the semester!! He was dreading the required English class ("I'm tired of literature and tired of writing about it all through high school!" lol). But partway through, he actually admitted that it was sort of interesting. He feared having to do the handwritten essays in class, but they went well. And he feared doing the big paper of the semester, but that went well, too, and he got the highest grade the prof would give (she never gives 100%). He let me see that paper, and she had written all sorts of compliments on it about his points, etc. And one day she stopped him in the hallway and said (knowing he had been home-educated), "Where did you learn to write so well?" Well, I was so pleased when he told me this that I patted myself on the back and whispered, "Thank you, SWB!!" lol He just rolled his eyes and declared that all the credit goes to him because it's HIS brain. I just laughed and laughed. Seriously, I was very proud of him (and also grateful for our homeschooling experience, that prepared this kid who had sore hands from writing when he was younger). He starts again on Tuesday, with math, physics, modern physics, astronomy, and economics. He loves it all, and he loves having finally made some like-minded friends. And it's all paid for and I'm super happy for him at this point in his life (despite his having been dx'ed with Crohn's last June :( ).

For math and actuarial science, check out the University of Waterloo (excellent reputation for math in Canada) in Ontario: https://uwaterloo.ca/statistics-and-actuarial-science/ We live near Dalhousie University, so let me know if you have questions about Halifax and region. Also, my son applied to the science dept. (for math) and was accepted (and got a $3,000 scholarship). But he decided on another university just a few blocks from Dal (because they gave him full scholarship!). I don't know anything about applying to Dal as a transfer or an international student (although a poster named Bluegoat might), but there are tons of international students there. I think they have a decent math program...at least, that's where my son went to a weeklong math camp put on by the Canadian Mathematical Society and hosted by Dal a couple of years ago, and he loved it. And we know a guy who graduated from Dal with his PhD in math, and he's quite happy with his education. I mentioned U of W. A fellow homeschool mother I know who is some kind of Canadian expert in actuarial science went to U of W and has done some work at Dal. I think she teaches at Dal, or does workshops there or something. Anyway, she speaks highly of both places. Your American dollar will go far here. Dal also has a medical school, and the hospitals are very close to campus. Feel free to pm me, as I don't always check the boards (but I have my pm's set up to go to my e-mail).

Funny, I just saw your signature - look at mine! :D Yep, we can turn that into a verb. :D

I think should be fine. My son did TLI and TLII. But TLII was rough (and I don't remember why - I'd have to find my TLII book to explain why - let me know if you want me to find it) and he didn't do it as thoroughly. Then somewhere between him and my daughter starting logic, I discovered that the WTM recs had changed (maybe it was in the 3rd edition? or a lecture or comment from SWB on the boards? I can't remember). I had my daughter do TLI but not the second book. Now I'm looking at my new 4th ed. WTM and seeing an improved explanation about the different types of logic (and acknowledgement that kids have different mental maturity timelines to be able to study logic), and a statement that going into a second year of formal logic (meaning TLII) is optional. (I don't have the 3rd ed., but it seems to me that when I looked at the library copy, it said it there also) Despite doing TLII roughly, my son did fine in his rhetoric studies. My daughter is about to start rhetoric studies, and I think she is more than ready for it, despite having "only" had TLI.

Congratulations to everyone so far!!

I would start wherever, in any given book you use, at the place where your son needs to start learning. It doesn't matter if it's the beginning or middle or whatever. What matters is that he starts learning and reviewing and continues learning and reviewing. Try not to focus on "I must get this book done this year because it's this particular grade." We used the first two levels of First Language Lessons (before levels 3 and 4 were published, or I'd have used those, too) for grammar, and Writing With Ease Instructor Guide for writing/composition. I'm pretty sure FLL changed from the blue read-aloud-and-discuss instruction book to workbooks, and I'm not sure how those work, but someone could probably give you a better idea of how much physical writing is involved. With the WWE IG, you can take full control of how much reading and writing your son will do. And it doesn't involve writing lots and lots of sentences - just a little bit four days a week, week after week, to build skills and stamina.

It doesn't depend as much on the age/grade of the student as much as it depends on the skill of the student. If the student has phonics skills and can easily sound out words, then he/she doesn't need phonics instruction anymore. If he/she can't, then give whatever phonics instruction is necessary. You may also find that you think a student is done with phonics instruction, but may need some review at times until he/she gets fluent in reading and continues to build on that fluency with more in-depth books. That "Readers" section has two subsections (at least in my 4th ed. copy - I'm not sure which ed. you're looking at - if you have 1st or 2nd ed., I can go look at my copies of those to see what you are referring to): resources written to parents (such as the "Books to Build On") to find more lists of books written to kids, and a list of suggested books written to kids. This second subsection lists books that are appropriate for kids to practice their reading skills aloud on (with you deciding which of the three levels any given book falls under for any given student). So, yes, use books from this second subsection to practice the three levels of reading skills. Or, if it's a 4th grader who has some phonics background already, you could practice these same three levels on more advanced books. But if the 4th grader doesn't have enough phonics, it's perfectly fine to use this second subsection list of books (I am tutoring a ten-year old right now who is working her way through some Frances books and Amanda Pig books - she doesn't care about the simple-to-her-sounding stories because she is so happy to be learning how to read finally). Reading comprehension: you can ask questions about the reading skills-building books, or you can ask questions about the reading-literature books. I'd practice the questions first on the skills-building books every week so the student gets used to the questioning/comprehending process with easy books, and then move the process over to the reading-literature books as soon as the student seems ready for that (but keep having him/her practice reading skills on skills-building books) so that he/she doesn't get sick of the questioning process with every single book. The questions would be the same, since you're just trying to determine what they understand or help them to understand and sort out confusing parts. Two that I use are: "What happened to whom?" and "Who did what to whom?" If the student doesn't seem to know, then just figure out some more specific questions such as "Who are the characters in this story? What did they do? What happened to them? And then what happened?" and so forth. If they can't figure out those things, figure out more specific questions such as "Well, what did Frances say to her friend about the tea set? And then what did her friend say? What happened after that?" Hmm...as for a list of questions...I think I gleaned the questions above from our experience in using the Writing With Ease Instructor Guide. I hope something here helps. I remember what it was like trying to sort out all the "how's" and "why's" when I was first learning how to teach using the WTM book! But I was determined to figure things out, and I'm glad I persevered. Let me know if anything I wrote is still confusing to you.

It has an excellent reputation for math here in Canada. Also, I have a fellow homeschool Mom friend who went there for actuarial science (she adores math), and now she's some kind of national expert in her field of work (which I don't understand).

Phonics instruction. And some phonics programs include spelling instruction (I used The Writing Road to Reading). Welcome to the forums!!

About the "big picture" and "whole-to-parts" vs. "parts-to-whole" - I'm guessing he is 12 or 13, so I wonder if he is grasping for the big picture just because of his age. I know when I started WWS with my son and then my daughter, *I* struggled to figure out where all those details were going, lol. I figured that was because I am an adult. Because, as of two days ago lol, I've officially finished teaching WWS 1-3 twice, I can look back through all three levels and see the big picture. So I'm just wondering if it's just esp. frustrating for your son because he's just entering the age where he's questioning everything, not just any particular program. If you see the big picture of all the detailed instruction, could you just carry on with giving him the "big picture" explanation as he asks for it? Would he better be able to cope with it if he just trusts you that all the detail is getting him somewhere? I can't now exactly remember when, but I think my son started WWS 1 in Grade 8. So he was definitely older than the original intended audience. But I had used the WTM methods and then a skim-through of the WWE Instructor Guide with him, so I figured carrying on with the methods would be helpful for him. He finished WWS 3 sometime in Grade 11. And by the way, he was one of those boys who "hated writing." He, too, struggled early on with writing out sentences and hand cramps. WWE/WTM 4th level dictation was torture for him, and I had to reduce the amounts. :D He also had to transition from copywork to dictation via a tape recorder. But hey, it worked and that's what counted. I also let him learn to type earlier than I had planned, and I let him use it for his writing earlier (but I had taught him to print and do cursive, and had him continue practice in those things - I'm glad I did, because he had to write his SAT essay by hand, and even this fall in his first year university English course, he had to write lots of essays in class by hand). And then there's my daughter, who loves to do creative writing. She just finished WWS 3 on Friday (yay! and her final project was excellent!). I'm glad I had her work through all the levels because all those details gave her more of a structure to work from. Yes, it takes time to get used to following all of the steps involved, but after you get used to them, you use them (or not) as you see fit in any writing project anyway. It was good for her free-flowing self to have something to work from because now she knows how to research an idea and put it into an essay in a variety of different forms. My son, who is super-glad that his first-year-university English course is now over so he can move on to science, math, and all of his loves; told me an interesting story a few weeks ago. He was just enduring his English class for the credit requirement. And he dreaded having to write response essays *in class and by hand and in a time crunch.* I just reminded him, "Remember the steps of the topoi, Those are what will help you dig around in your mind as you write. You can do this." Then he dreaded having to write a mid-term essay (outside of class). But he did his best and gritted his teeth just to get it all done. And one day his English professor stopped him in the hallway and said to him, "Where did you learn to write so well??" She had given him the top grade she could for his mid-term essay, and she has written all sorts of positive comments on his various in-class assignments. I was over. the. moon. when he told me all this. He has come a long way from that little boy who hated taking dictation by hand, lol. Anyway, my vote is that you keep going with WWS - it sounds like he is still willing, even if he struggles to grasp the big picture. Another thing; it's OK if you take more than a week for a "one week" assignment in there. We did that a lot, with both of my kids, for various reasons. hth

Monica, I'm wondering if this thread about Henle, starting with posts #19 and 29, might help you: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/330830-guide-for-henle-that-is-a-bit-faster-than-cheryl-lowes-mp-guide/

My son started yesterday with Welcome Week. It was our first day of the new routine of driving him back and forth to the bus terminal (how I wish it was within walking distance of our home). Anyway, we are finding that the Welcome Week schedule is not very clear; at one point he found himself in the middle of a session for international students. He told me he just tried to blend in, and that he got to enjoy a bowl of chili, some bread, and some salad. Elsewhere, he did manage to check some things off his "to do" list (get a bus pass, get health insurance information, get his student ID) and get information on some other academic things we parents were told to encourage. Then today he did the bus routine again (at some points frantically running to catch connections - I told him this would all smooth out as he figures out the various schedules) to attend a "Healthy Start in the Park" event. It was described as being an afternoon of touring a local park, playing games there, frisbee, etc. Instead he found himself following the group of students (yes, he went to the correct meeting place) to a football game. He got bored halfway through, figured out how to find a phone to call and tell me when his bus would arrive, and got himself back to the bus terminal. He also tried to sign up for a day trip tomorrow, but found out it was full. So he's staying home tomorrow (and happy to do so for now). Monday, though, should be different - he has his orientation for a 30-student science faculty mentorship group that he signed up for. He will meet his peer mentor and the 29 other students in the group. This group has three classes/labs together, so he will see them a lot over the semester. I'm glad he'll finally get to meet all of them on Monday. And then Tuesday is an orientation to the science faculty. And classes start on Wednesday and then he'll be super busy! I'm hoping he'll sign up for a club or society this week, too. It has been...interesting...getting him ready over the past few weeks. He is SO anxious to be fully independent that any time I make a suggestion about something or ask a question or just plain old tell him to get something done that he needs to get done, he gets grumpy with me. I realized last week that he'd never used any type of time-planner, so I dragged him to Staples to show him examples and show him how to use them. He finally agreed to buy one. Then there was the slow process of getting him to start writing things in it. And then the night before his first Welcome Week day, there was the whole process of asking him questions to get him thinking about what he'd need to take with him. Oh. my. word. And clothes shopping last week. Clothes are purely utilitarian to him. I whipped through the thrift stores as fast as possible, pulling out nice-looking quality t-shirts (short- and long-sleeve), pants/jeans, and sweatshirts/sweaters for him to try on and talking aloud about my choosing process so he'd have some clue about how to spot quality clothing at frugal prices. I'm trying to do the "back off, he's 18" thing, but if I didn't do or say any of this stuff over the past two weeks, he'd be panicking late at night or early in the morning. I'm willing to let him learn some things the hard way right now, but I also want him to have a positive first few weeks when his classes start by giving him half a chance at having most practical details prepared (like remembering to pack lunch and snacks, pens/pencils, paper, etc.). I do think he'll do fine after all this crash-course preparing, but I am worn out!!!!!! He is really looking forward to his classes: physics plus lab, chemistry plus lab, computer science plus lab, math plus recitation (I don't know what that is), and English (not looking forward to this, but it's his only English requirement of the four years). Some people have said this is a heavy duty course load, but I don't really know. I do know he is looking forward to doing the sciences with professors and interested students! Anyway, that's how it's going here - I canNOT believe that I am posting this nearly twelve years after having found these forums! It's such a feeling of contentment.

Oooo, this sounds interesting for your situation! I look forward to hearing more as your story unfolds!

I know; I wish I could "be there," too.

:grouphug: I'm sorry things look bleak today. Please hang on to the smallest bits of hope you still have (helping your children) - you never know when you're going to have a better day and a new idea might spring into your mind or a new opportunity might come up. It's OK for hopes and dreams to change, too, and give way to new ones. This sometimes happens as you get older and as your kids get older. Life is hard, but it's ours to live each day. Hang in there.