So this weird thing happened

[Katy]

Autism or mental health problems could both be the cause of behavior like that.  So I guess what would be the point of telling the pastor?  Do you want her cast out, unable to return? Do you want her to hear something approaching the gospel and receive it, even if her life will never look like a typical member?  What is the Christlike response to this?

[Scarlett]

Just now, Katy said:

Autism or mental health problems could both be the cause of behavior like that.  So I guess what would be the point of telling the pastor?  Do you want her cast out, unable to return? Do you want her to hear something approaching the gospel and receive it, even if her life will never look like a typical member?  What is the Christlike response to this?

Saying nothing. Which is what’ve have decided to do. I mean she wouldn’t be ‘cast out’.  But I don’t want to hurt her mother. 

[Scarlett]

I am interested in why she would do  this stuff.  She has a very sweet family. Mild  personalities. I know her extended family.  
 

I see nothing to indicate she is on the spectrum. She just seems….mean. 
I know people always want to explain things away with mental illness etc….aren’t people just sometimes choosing bad paths?  

[TechWife]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

Eww you. You aren’t the decider of when it is ok to observe something. 

 

1 hour ago, katilac said:

That's not a me decision, that's a polite society decision. 

It's a bathroom. 

Polite behavior does matter - it is critical to a respectful culture. Yes, culture does decide what’s ok and what’s not. Everyone has intrinsic dignity. As people in a specific place at a specific time, we either create & maintain a culture that recognizes that dignity or we don’t. Individual people within that culture engage in what is needed to either preserve a culture that recognizes dignity of people or diminishes it, maybe even destroys it. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by TechWife

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, TechWife said:

 

Polite behavior does matter - it is critical to a respectful culture. Yes, culture does decide what’s ok and what’s not. Everyone has intrinsic dignity. As people in a specific place at a specific time, we either create & maintain a culture that recognizes that dignity or we don’t. Individual people within that culture engage in what is needed to either preserve a culture that recognizes dignity of people or diminishes it, maybe even destroys it. 

I… got nothing. 
 

 

[Bootsie]

11 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Maybe I am just observant but I instantly knew something was up. You don’t think you would notice if someone faced all sides of a stall for 20 seconds or so? And that the bottom of the skirt kept disappearing from view and reappearing? It was so very obvious she was reaching up. I wasn’t initially suspicious of her…. But it was very suspicious behavior. 
I won’t be saying anything though. 
The damage is not much. Dh went in later to check it and he said it wasn’t obviously vandalism. 

I don't think I would notice in the set up of most stalls   If the bottom of the stall is one foot off the ground and I am seated on the toilet, most of the floor of the stall next to me would not be visible; once I am standing in the stall even less would be visible  A skirt that is not floor length would be even less likely to be seen.  Someone might reach up for a purse or other item hanging on a hook in the stall next to me, but I generally am not going to be noticing that.  I am curious as to how high the stall walls were and how high the vandalism occurred.  The average 17-year old would have to be reaching up fairly high (six feet?) for their skirt to be moving up significantly.  It does seem odd to me if a teen would choose to vandalize a bathroom stall they would do it by stretching up and scraping off paint so high on a stall wall instead of more at eye level.  

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

I don't think I would notice in the set up of most stalls   If the bottom of the stall is one foot off the ground and I am seated on the toilet, most of the floor of the stall next to me would not be visible; once I am standing in the stall even less would be visible  A skirt that is not floor length would be even less likely to be seen.  Someone might reach up for a purse or other item hanging on a hook in the stall next to me, but I generally am not going to be noticing that.  I am curious as to how high the stall walls were and how high the vandalism occurred.  The average 17-year old would have to be reaching up fairly high (six feet?) for their skirt to be moving up significantly.  It does seem odd to me if a teen would choose to vandalize a bathroom stall they would do it by stretching up and scraping off paint so high on a stall wall instead of more at eye level.  

Well now ya know I am going to have to measure the bottom of the stall.

She is less than 5 feet tall and 100 pounds.  Her skirt was very long, brushing the tops of her feet when she was walking in. T was black with a swirl of color around the middle of it.  I remember thinking how cute it was on her. 
 

As for why she stood up and reached up and turned  around to all sides of the stall to peel off paint….I don’t know.  I would love to ask her why she does stuff like that.  But I would get a wide eyed shocked expression and she would say she did not do it. 

[EKS]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

As for why she stood up and reached up and turned  around to all sides of the stall to peel off paint….I don’t know.

Maybe she feels compelled to.  Sort of how some people feel compelled to peel a sunburn. 

With regard to noticing what's going on in the next stall...I don't know how anyone could say that they wouldn't notice.  It's usually pretty obvious. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by EKS

[Tenaj]

1 minute ago, EKS said:

Maybe she feels compelled to.  Sort of how some people feel compelled to peel a sunburn. 

With regard to noticing what's going on in the next stall...I don't know how anyone could say that they wouldn't notice.  It's usually pretty obvious. 

I was thinking the same thing - maybe the paint was loose or looked loose and she just had to pull on it.  I probably wouldn't even think the word vandalism - just brush it off as something weird that happened and sweep up the paint.  To me vandalism would have to be a higher level - like paint or permanent marker on the divider.

Definitely would have noticed the next stall at church - only a two-stalk bathroom at ours.    I don't think it's strange at all for Scarlet to have noticed something going on "next door".   It's not unusual to carry on a conversation at my church while taking care of business.  I thought that was a unique feature of my small church until I had occasion recently to visit a much larger church several times with a 10 stall bathroom and experience many conversations floating from stall to stall.  Obviously lots of ladies notice who is "next door".🤣

[Terabith]

They carry on conversations with people in the restroom???  No wonder nobody in Gen Z is attending church!  That would make me so incredibly uncomfortable!  You ignore other people in public restrooms!!!

[Scarlett]

33 minutes ago, Tenaj said:

I was thinking the same thing - maybe the paint was loose or looked loose and she just had to pull on it.  I probably wouldn't even think the word vandalism - just brush it off as something weird that happened and sweep up the paint.  To me vandalism would have to be a higher level - like paint or permanent marker on the divider.

Definitely would have noticed the next stall at church - only a two-stalk bathroom at ours.    I don't think it's strange at all for Scarlet to have noticed something going on "next door".   It's not unusual to carry on a conversation at my church while taking care of business.  I thought that was a unique feature of my small church until I had occasion recently to visit a much larger church several times with a 10 stall bathroom and experience many conversations floating from stall to stall.  Obviously lots of ladies notice who is "next door".🤣

Yes, many times especially before and after services there is a lot of talking going on. 

[Tenaj]

54 minutes ago, Terabith said:

They carry on conversations with people in the restroom???  No wonder nobody in Gen Z is attending church!  That would make me so incredibly uncomfortable!  You ignore other people in public restrooms!!!

I think the key word is "public".   I would never expect that in a public restroom.  These are church restrooms - think church family, very comfortable with each other which even as a visitor I appreciated.

[kbutton]

1 hour ago, Tenaj said:

 It's not unusual to carry on a conversation at my church while taking care of business.  I thought that was a unique feature of my small church until I had occasion recently to visit a much larger church several times with a 10 stall bathroom and experience many conversations floating from stall to stall.  Obviously lots of ladies notice who is "next door".

Yep, not odd here either (the so-called “polite” Midwest, lol)! 

1 hour ago, Terabith said:

They carry on conversations with people in the restroom???  No wonder nobody in Gen Z is attending church!  That would make me so incredibly uncomfortable!  You ignore other people in public restrooms!!!

I think this is geographic. It’s not unusual in some places for people who know each other and enter the restroom together to keep conversing. Striking up a conversation spontaneously would probably be restricted to, “Excuse me, could you pass me some toilet paper—this stall appears to be out” or waiting to speak at the sink. But a fair amount of people of all ages absolutely do continue a conversation across stalls.