Having trouble with whole wheat baking

[momee]

I have read, re-read, and read again and I'm still having some troubles.

 

Problem #1 - don't have $ to waste food :) (need TRIED and true, like your stained, ripped, almost falling apart pages that you turn to over and over) So far, I've thrown two batches of whole wheat pancakes away - one flat as a brick, the other tasted like cardboard.

 

Problem #2 - trying to sub. bought loaves for homemade ones and family isn't going for it. They just want a decent sandwich.

 

Problem #3 - can't get my loaves to be "sandwich" quality high and sturdy. Can make about half the height of a wonder slice type bread, although it is delicious it isn't making the grade for sand's.

 

I just bought a Bosch and a Nurtimill. Been using dough enhancer and gluten and lectithin type recipes and still can't get enough height to my bread.

 

Yeast - I just got it day before Tksgvg so it can't be bad already...

 

I used the bread recipe in the Bosch book - blech! I also used the Breabeckers recipe (fav so far) and just today made this one from the boards here...

http://www.joyfullivingforyou.com/index.asp?PageAction=Custom&ID=1. It's rising on the counter. Didn't see how many loaves it made so used my experience (hah) and guessed 3. We'll see.

 

I would love your recipe that you use with your Bosch or DLX and that your kids just eat up and your dh gives you one of those long sweet kisses for:bigear:

 

While I have you, could you also post a cookie recipe that uses whole wheat, or is that just craziness to even attempt??

[MomOfOneFunOne]

Bread making is so individual so I hope I don't lead you down the wrong path however, I've made this bread many, many, times and have even used this recipe to teach a couple of class and several people how to bake bread. Once on another board someone asked for a good ww bread that made good sandwich bread. I posted this one and later when someone asked for a review, she gave it an A+.

 

Follow the recipe and you cannot go wrong. I substitute with honey and whole wheat flour (do not use pastry flour or graham or anything like that). This makes a lot of bread and you're to divide into two rounds. I make a round and a loaf or two loaves . . . whatever is needed. If you aren't vegan, ignore all that stuff. Scroll down past the recipe and you can see the comments ppl have left.

 

Good Luck!

http://vegweb.com/index.php?topic=5716.0

 

Oh, this is not my recipe. I take no credit for it at all but it is definately a tried and true!

Sorry, turbinado is sugar -- this is where I sub with honey or maple syrup.

Edited December 10, 2008 by MomOfOneFunOne

[Blueridge]

It will get better! What yeast are you using? SAF is a fantastic brand. Also, you may be using bread pans that are too large (wide). Check out the pans from the Urban Homemaker. Using Marilyn's recipe and a set of pans, you can make 5 loaves at a time. Also check out her site for informative articles and tons of tried and true recipes. King Arthur also has many wonderful recipes using ww. We use white wheat (prairie gold) here, instead of red wheat, and there is a difference in the tenderness and sweetness. Never throw away bread 'mishaps' but make croutons or bread crumbs with them. My favorite cookbook that uses the Bosch is Hearth and Home by Karey Swan.

Ginger

[KS_]

For me, I ended up going with about 60% whole wheat 40% white flour for my bread. With 100% whole wheat, I just wasn't able to get the texture I wanted, especially to use for sandwiches (it wouldn't hold together well enough, and broke apart when you tried to eat the sandwich). I tried a number of different recipes and techniques, and although the bread was very good, it wasn't working in the sandwich dept.

[Amira]

Since I agree that breadmaking is so individual, I don't really have specific advice, but I do want to encourage you to keep trying. It took me years to really feel like I could cook reliably with whole wheat, but now I don't have anything but whole wheat in the house. It does help to have a patient family. And if you don't have a good bread knife, I recommend getting one. My bread improved immediately after I got a decent knife.

 

Here's the recipe I use for our basic bread, but I do use some gluten. We use it for sandwiches and toast mostly. It makes 3 loaves. I've baked it at a variety of altitudes, from sea level to 5000 feet. I use SAF yeast and grind my own hard red wheat.

 

3 1/2 cups warm water

1 1/2-2 Tbsp yeast (or two packets)

1/2 cup sugar

1 Tbsp salt

1/4 c oil

1/2 c gluten

3/4 c ground flax seeds

About 8-9 cups whole wheat flour

 

Bake at 375 for 35 minutes.

[MommyX8]

I hadn't made a decent loaf of bread in over 6 months. Then it dawned on me that I was now buying yeast from Costco. It was active dry and I had always used SAF yeast, which is instant. I ordered from eBay as most online stores wanted to ship a bag of yeast via UPS($$). It was here in a couple of days and now my bread finally has rise.

 

I never really found a good sandwich bread. My family can't wait for bread to come out of the oven so that they can eat it hot. But as for sandwiches, I'm no help.

[FriedClams]

I would highly recommend the wheat recipe at Tammy's Recipes found here. It's AMAZING. The consistency is like store bought sandwich bread - but so much tastier.The recipe has some enhancers in it (lecithin and wheat gluten) which may be hard to find. In a pinch I use her Amish White Bread recipe and use half wheat.

 

I also recommend the rolls here - I use half wheat and half white. She also has great recipes and tips on using things like powdered eggs and powdered milk - check out her site.

 

For some great wheat ebooks - check out Heavenly Homemakers. She has great recipes here too. The whole wheat breakfast cookies (with chips and craisins) are amazing.

 

I've had some luck with trial and error - but overall I want real recipes that work. The ones above have been super consistent. hope that helps! Can't wait to see what else gets posted!

[FriedClams]

Forgot to add - I buy my yeast at Sam's. When I open a pack (it's a pound pack) I put it in a clean Mason jar and store it in the fridge - I've never had any problems. I freeze the other pack (Sam's comes in 2 - 1 pound packs) until I need it.

[FO4UR]

For bread, I use white whole wheat berries (milled, of course - haha), and cheat with a cup or two of BREAD FLOUR (per 5-6 c ww flour). Bread flour has dough conditioners in it that help it rise, and the texture is just better. I like Marylins Honey WHole Wheat recipe. That's what I use, except I don't use dough conditioner - just sub. a little bread flour instead.

 

For pancakes, I use SOFT WHITE WHOLE WHEAT berries, milled as fine as I can mill it (aka ww pastry flour). I like to put all the dry ingredients in Mason Jars, shake, store in fridge, and then just add wet ingredients in the morning;)

 

1c milk

1 egg

1TBSP oil

2TBSP sugar

1/2tsp salt

1 1/2 tsp baking powder

1 1/2 c flour

 

For cookies, I use the tried and true NEstle recipe (shhhh...:tongue_smilie:) and use SOFT white whole wheat.

 

If your family is used to white bread or store bought bread, your best bet is using white whole wheat for bread (anything that calls for yeast), and soft white wheat for pastries, cookies, pancakes. CHeck your yeast and baking powder. Those two ingredients can make/break your whole recipe.hth

[TraceyS/FL]

A friend shared this website once. I've had good luck - but i'm only baking white bread so far! But the "Amish White Bread" at allrecipes (that was shared here) makes great sandwiches!

 

HEre is what Patti shared.

 

http://www.sharskitchen.com/recipes/recipe.php?id=166&rec_cat=featured'>http://www.sharskitchen.com/recipes/recipe.php?id=166&rec_cat=featured'>http://www.sharskitchen.com/recipes/recipe.php?id=166&rec_cat=featured'>http://www.sharskitchen.com/recipes/recipe.php?id=166&rec_cat=featured

 

I haven't made my bread in about two months. I really love this bread

http://www.sharskitchen.com/recipes/recipe.php?id=166&rec_cat=featured

but, I have a Bosch and it makes six loaves at once. You just put in

your ingredients and let it knead. Cut the dough into about 6 loaves

and bake all at once. Then I freeze about 3 loaves, b/c one is eaten

immediately, and the other 2 go within about a day. You of course

have to eat it within about two weeks b/c no preservatives, even

though in the freezer it gets dried out.

 

She used to have a store in my old neighborhood, Glendale, AZ, and now

only has the other one in Gilbert, AZ. She has a ton of great recipes

on her site.

 

Patti - wishing she had a slice of homemade bread right now too!

[FO4UR]

Thanks for this thread! Now I'm craving some cookies and pancakes:tongue_smilie:

[JessMcG]

Follow the recipe and you cannot go wrong. I substitute with honey and whole wheat flour (do not use pastry flour or graham or anything like that). This makes a lot of bread and you're to divide into two rounds. I make a round and a loaf or two loaves . . . whatever is needed. If you aren't vegan, ignore all that stuff. Scroll down past the recipe and you can see the comments ppl have left.

 

Good Luck!

http://vegweb.com/index.php?topic=5716.0

 

Oh, this is not my recipe. I take no credit for it at all but it is definately a tried and true!

Sorry, turbinado is sugar -- this is where I sub with honey or maple syrup.

 

I do things very similar to this recipe and come out with great 100% WW bread.

 

As for pancakes, cookies and other quick bread stuff, I just substitute WW pastry flour in the regular white flour recipes. Things usually turn out alright.

[momee]

Success! The joyfully living link I gave in the op was a hit. Nice big airy pieces but substantial and yummy tasting. I think they are a bit brown and I filled them with too much dough so they spilled over making removal difficult but yay. They are a pleasure to the kids. The house smells yummy - and all is right with the world :)

 

Thank you all for your ideas and recipes. Can't wait to incorporate them.

Edited December 10, 2008 by momee
I will be trying all these hints, just not today. Baking with a baby = hard work.

[TraceyS/FL]

Success! The joyfully living link I gave in the op was a hit. Nice big airy pieces but substantial and yummy tasting. I think they are a bit brown and I filled them with too much dough so they spilled over making removal difficult but yay. They are a pleasure to the kids. The house smells yummy - and all is right with the world :)

 

Thank you all for your ideas and recipes. Can't wait to incorporate them.

 

Yahooo!!!!!

 

and

 

Last edited by momee; Today at 03:57 PM. Reason: I will be trying all these hints, just not today. Baking with a baby = hard work.

 

I thought you were SUPERMOM :tongue_smilie:

 

Kidding - i'm glad you got bread that works!!

[momee]

"I thought you were SUPERMOM :tongue_smilie:"

 

Fake it till ya make it, right? Thanks for the laugh.

[cjzimmer1]

I'm relatively new to bread making but with my second or third attempt I hit upon this recipe and haven't tried another since. It makes a fairly decent sized sandwich slice and I'm using the larger pans (9x 5x ?). I'm sure they would have fantastic height in a smaller pan but I don't have any and haven't bothered to find them either. We like the sweeter bread so I will often use a 1/3 c honey and little extra flour but it's very good as is. I use a combo of half hard white and half hard red wheat.

 

http://tadmitchell.com/cookbook/wheatbread.html

[MomsintheGarden]

We love this recipe, made usually without the blueberries. We use whole wheat pastry flour - no white flour. The lemon juice mixed with the milk is key. I no longer make bricks for breakfast. Enjoy!

 

GardenMom

 

PS We use the waffle recipe in the Joy of Cooking for delicious waffles made with whole wheat pastry flour.

 

Blueberry Pancakes

 

Makes sixteen 4-inch pancakes, serving 4 to 6.

 

When fresh blueberries are not in season, frozen blueberries are a good alternative. To make sure that frozen berries do not bleed, rinse them under cool water in a mesh strainer until the water runs clear, then spread them on a paper towel-lined plate to dry.

 

Ingredients

 

1 tablespoon lemon juice from 1 lemon

2 cups milk

2 cups unbleached all-purpose flour (10 ounces)

2 tablespoons granulated sugar

2 teaspoons baking powder

1/2 teaspoon baking soda

1/2 teaspoon table salt

1 large egg

3 tablespoons unsalted butter , melted and cooled slightly

2 teaspoons vegetable oil

1 cup fresh blueberries or frozen blueberries, preferably wild, rinsed and dried

 

Instructions

1. Whisk lemon juice and milk in medium bowl or large measuring cup; set aside to thicken while preparing other ingredients. Whisk flour, sugar, baking powder, baking soda, and salt in medium bowl to combine.

2. Whisk egg and melted butter into milk until combined. Make well in center of dry ingredients in bowl; pour in milk mixture and whisk very gently until just combined (a few lumps should remain). Do not over mix.

3. Heat 12-inch nonstick skillet over medium heat for 3 to 5 minutes; add 1 teaspoon oil and brush to coat skillet bottom evenly. Pour 1/4 cup batter onto 3 spots on skillet; sprinkle 1 tablespoon blueberries over each pancake. Cook pancakes until large bubbles begin to appear, 1 1/2 to 2 minutes. Using thin, wide spatula, flip pancakes and cook until golden brown on second side, 1 to 1 1/2 minutes longer. Serve immediately, and repeat with remaining batter, using remaining vegetable oil only if necessary.

Edited December 11, 2008 by MomsintheGarden
Formatting problems

[Lakeside]

Here is a link to another thread where I posted a whole wheat bread that we like.

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40465http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40465

 

It is dense, but not in a brick-like way. In more of a nice-bread-from-the-bakery way.

 

Here is the Pancake recipe I use:

 

1 egg

1 1/4 cups buttermilk

2 tablespoons oil

1 1/4 cups flour

1 teaspoon baking powder

1/2 teaspoon baking soda

1/2 teaspoon salt

1 tablespoon honey (optional)

 

Mix together flour, baking powder, baking soda and salt.

In separate bowl, beat the egg with the buttermilk, oil and honey.

Make a well in the dry ingredients and pour in the wet ingredients. Stir gently until just blended. The batter will be lumpy. Heat a pan and cook.

 

We got this from a children's story book and have used it ever since! The buttermilk makes them light and fluffy.

[Birkenkathy]

I so feel your pain. It took me about 2 1/2 years to learn to make edible ww bread. I also have a bosch and a nutrimill. I have 2 recommendations. These may have been mentioned already, but I haven't read all the replies.

 

The Urban Homemaker (Marilyn Moll) has a great recipe. It is usually in their catalogue, or in one of her e-cookbooks. She also recommends a dough enhancer that she sells on her website that made my bread much more springy and tear-resistant. And you only use 2T per 6-loaf batch.

 

The thing that helped me the most was that Crystal Miller, on her website thefamilyhomestead.com, sells an instructional cd on ww breadbaking. She has pictures of every step. That is what helped me. I just couldn't understand how to tell if the gluten was fully developed. After seeing her pictures I could bake bread. I've also found that adding much less flour than I thought I needed was a big help.

 

Good luck. You'll get there.

 

Kathy

[jeri]

I bought a Bosch in June and never looked back. Here is the recipe I use. It has a couple of things in it that others haven't mentioned, but I get a high rising loaf that all my kids love. And it makes an excellent sandwich. Sorry it's in weight but I've found that being able to weigh ingredients makes measuring much easier and much more accurate. This is for 6 loaves. Usually I add about 6 oz of gluten and another 1/2 C water.

 

6 oz. oj

6 C water

3 sticks butter

72 oz ww flour (I use 2/3 ww and 1/3 white ww)

7.5 oz sugar

7.5 oz potato flour

6 oz dry milk

2.5 T sa;t

5 T yeast

 

I dump it all together in my Bosch, turn it on for about 8 minutes, turn it off and dump it on the counter for a first rise. Then I divide it into 6 loaves (scale comes in handy here too), and roll it out into a circle. Fold that circle so the edges barely overlap in the center, roll it out again so it is about 8 in in width, then roll it up tightly and place it seam down in the pans. Let rise until it just crests the top of the pan, then preheat oven to 350 and put them in for 20 min. After 20, put foil over it and go another 15. I use an instant read thermomether and when it's 190, it's done.

 

 

Again, all of us love this recipe and even though it looks like a lot of ingredients, it is really easy and only takes 10 min to do.

 

jeri

[Nicole M]

I don't know about nutrimill or Bosch, but I've been using the Laurel's Kitchen Bread Book recipes for almost 20 years and have never had a failed loaf. Our favorite is buttermilk bread (made in the smaller sized pans as someone mentioned earlier). These loaves are very high and light. In fact, I'm on my second copy of the book because the first one fell apart. I'm sure your library has it. In the regular Laurel's Kitchen book there is a chapter called "A Loaf for Learning" (I think), and it walks you through the technique.

[mamaof2andtwins]

In regard to your pancakes, are you using WW pastry flour or bread flour (like Prairie Gold or some other red wheat)? Using WW pastry flour in anything that uses baking powder or baking soda as a levening will make a better product.

 

Also, I have found that if I let my dough rise twice even though I shouldn't have to with the Bosch I get a better bread product.

 

Jennie

[momee]

Thanks ladies. Just to add to the conversation, I think it's very interesting there are so many ways to do a good loaf - and I think it's frustrating :)

 

I'll keep trying to incorporate your suggestions and methods and appreciate them all.

 

I'm not sure I want dh to know there are ladies out there who are making bread Boschless and Millless (shhhhhhhhh)

 

:001_huh:(Should I have bought it, uh, can't go there)

 

Now that we have the mill and the mixer (no mortgage money but what the hey...) I really would like to concentrate on makiung the most of those. I have the Laurel breadbook mentioned and it seems to be all hand kneading loaves. There is a machine in the back - would I just confuse myself trying to adapt her method to the Bosch for kneading? It's been a good tutorial on things like the chemistry of baking bread - but I just want a good loaf now, kwim?

 

Your posts will help me acheive that goal and for that I thank you all for your comments. I'll keep checking back for other wisdom. Thanks hivemind!

[TraceyS/FL]

LOL, well hey - i may be Bosch-less - but i'm only making 2 loaves at a time and it's driving me bonkers!

 

YOu will get there - :grouphug:

[MommyX8]

I would highly recommend the wheat recipe at Tammy's Recipes found here. It's AMAZING.

 

 

I just tried this recipe and it made a wonderful loaf of bread. I used my Bosch and it worked beautifully so I will try my Zo tomorrow and see what happens.

:thumbup:

[Shenan]

The kids and I really enjoy this chocolate chip cookie recipe . My husband doesn't like the lemon extract in it. It uses wheat and all-purpose flour.

 

I too am struggling with a light and airy bread issue. I use my Kitchenaid to knead the dough. I just recently cut back on the kneading time and did notice a higher rising loaf.

 

I will be taking a lot of the suggestions from this thread and trying/testing them. :D