Disappointed in MUS Geometry - suggestions?

[bluebonnetgirl]

My two boys have been doing MUS Geometry and lately they have been not doing so well on the lessons or the tests.  Looking into it, it seems that there is not enough teaching of the concepts in detail.  They are up to Chapter 10 and they both failed the test.  

I am thinking of using Khan Academy as a supplement and going back tot the beginning with Khan and seeing if they can get a better foundation.

Any other thoughts or suggestions?  

I also feel that the MUS Geometry is rather inadequate in the teaching component and there are a lot of questions on the lessons and tests that are not covered well enough in the teaching portion.

 

 

[RootAnn]

First thought - Can you teach it?

Second thought (a question) - What was your reason for choosing MUS Geo in the first place? (so when people give you suggestions, they do it in the vein of what you are looking for.)

[HomeAgain]

I like MUS quite a bit, but a few of the other options we looked at were
-Jacobs Geometry: clear, written well, and easy to follow.  No video component.  My oldest used the student text when his public school book was lacking.
-Videotext: Expensive, but is easy to follow.  If Jacob's hadn't worked this would have been next on my list.

In any case, I also keep Patty Paper Geometry on my shelf because it's a great introduction and keeps the subject hands on.

In your shoes my first steps would be to go through the front of the book again and read the teacher's notes.  MUS has a process: learn (from dvd or teacher), practice (with hands on pieces usually), write, review, and teach (student back to the teacher).  When a student can teach it back, then they're ready for the test.  If they can't, it's time to go over it again to make sure they really get the material.  We used to alternate new worksheet with review one, and go through the steps often until I was sure the information was understood, and then it was test time.

[freesia]

I like TT geometry a lot. We used the old non-self grading version, bc I wanted to see the proofs written out and check it myself.

[...................]

I would maybe just ask here about the actual concept at hand. Chapter ten is pretty far into it and maybe they are struggling with this one thing.

How far into the year is Chapter 10? I mean, if it’s two months and they’ve struggled the whole time maybe you can try another program. 

But they’re just starting to struggle now it might be best to hire a tutor to get them over the rough spots and back up one or two chapters, rather than starting over. 

[MerryAtHope]

I don't remember where exactly, but I can remember sometimes feeling that the examples in the videos were easier than the problems in the lessons in the higher levels. However, are your sons also reading and working the examples in the Teacher's Guide? That actually adds more info in, and I know somewhere in the MUS literature it said that the student should also be going through that. Here's what I used to do--I'd have them watch the video. If they felt confident, I had them do the first lesson--if not, they read the TG and worked through those examples.

If the score on the first lesson didn't go well, I also had them either re-watch the video, work through the TG, or both. I actually found that worked almost all the time. 

Also, for any questions they got wrong in the lessons, we worked back through them. I worked the problem so I could see where their misunderstanding was, and then helped them see where they went wrong. Or, if I couldn't figure out what they did wrong, I had them read the solution and follow it step by step until they could understand what they did wrong. A lot of times, just seeing a problem or two worked in the solutions manual helped them track with how to do things. 

If they failed a test, I had them re-do a couple of lessons or do the optional extra page from online and then try the test again. 

Anyway--not sure that helps at this point if you are really wanting to switch, but it's something you could try if you haven't already. I hope you find a solution that works!

[EKS]

I thought the MUS people said somewhere that the video wasn't meant to be used in place of actual instruction by a human.  I'd try teaching them yourself before moving to something else.  If that doesn't work, we found the old TT course to be adequate. 

[bluebonnetgirl]

Thank you all for the suggestions.  I also reached out to MUS.  The boys are also working through the written instruction - I print the pages.  There are no additional worksheets, only the 5 lessons per chapter, which often does not seem enough - there are only 15-20 questions per lesson, and 5 lessons per chapter..  Merryathope, I agree with you that the lessons and tests are harder than the DVD and written instruction.  I think the issue with Geometry so far is that it is very heavy language based and one son has a language processing disorder and autism, and the other son has some sort of language based disorder.   Algebra was way easier, since it is so procedural and number based.    I am going to have to get more hands on with teaching it and find additional problems for them to work through.  There are just not enough practice problems to get them ready for the test.

[klmama]

I would follow the suggestions here regarding the extra material in MUS teacher manual and then supplementing, as needed, rather than just jumping to a new program.  The old TT course doesn't have any more practice problems than MUS; I'm not sure about the newer versions.

[bluebonnetgirl]

Thank you.  I am already using the teacher manual (which is just the written instruction for the lesson).  I am going to see if MUS can send me some extra practice problems for problematic chapters.  And have an upper level instructor call me. 

I agree that jumping to another program this far in does not make any sense.

Edited October 24, 2018 by bluebonnetgirl

[...................]

Those are great options because they are low cost, but don't underestimate the value of a math tutor.  My kids have one at a local tutoring center, and though we don't always need him, when we do he is worth his weight in gold.  He brings a new perspective.  He is able to teach.  More than that, my kids don't feel alone with their math, which is the most important factor. ?

[...................]

1 hour ago, bluebonnetgirl said:

Thank you all for the suggestions.  I also reached out to MUS.  The boys are also working through the written instruction - I print the pages.  There are no additional worksheets, only the 5 lessons per chapter, which often does not seem enough - there are only 15-20 questions per lesson, and 5 lessons per chapter..  Merryathope, I agree with you that the lessons and tests are harder than the DVD and written instruction.  I think the issue with Geometry so far is that it is very heavy language based and one son has a language processing disorder and autism, and the other son has some sort of language based disorder.   Algebra was way easier, since it is so procedural and number based.    I am going to have to get more hands on with teaching it and find additional problems for them to work through.  There are just not enough practice problems to get them ready for the test.

 

I still agree with many others, and my earlier post, but the language disorders changed my thinking just a little..... if the supplementing doesn't work,you could consider switching to the Key To Geometry which is not proof-based.  They don't need a lot of Geometry for Trig or PreCalc or Calc.  But I think what is in the Key To Books would suffice, EVEN if they were planning to be STEM Majors, but start a new thread and check with the Math people here to double check my thinking. 

I would not worry too much about Geometry.  Unless the kids really love it, all you need is the basics. 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Calming Tea

[bluebonnetgirl]

texasmom,

Unfortunately there are no extra practice sheets for the upper MUS  levels - that is what the MUS people said and I also could not find any for Geometry.

[bluebonnetgirl]

Thank you Calming Tea.  I will look into Keys to Geometry as a back up option if we cannot push through.

[almondbutterandjelly]

Hi, bluebonnetgirl, I just wanted to encourage you to embrace the hands on stuff for Geometry.  I bought a ton of manipulatives and "learning centers" and shapes and whatnot from Lakeshore Learning, and we used them a LOT when we did MUS Geometry.  Also, a cheap quick manipulative for lines is pipe cleaners ("chenille stems") and pompoms for points.  A flat piece of cardboard is a great "plane."

Best wishes!