S/O: Do you think free public ed. 1-12 is a right that should be available to all?

[CactusPair]

If you do feel that public education should be free and available to all for grades 1-12, why? Or why not?

 

How/why is the 1-12 education "right" different from the "right" to say, a college ed. or even health care? Can/will you define why one may be is a right and one may not be?

 

Does a practice eventually become considered a "right" by the majority because it has been in place for X # of years? Does tradition = a right?

 

I'm trying to distinguish between and define for myself what is

 

a right,

 

a responsibility (came up in debate last night, though I was unclear as to whose responsibility they meant),

 

and a privilege

 

within a democratic and capitalist system.

 

thanks for sharing your ideas!

[swellmomma]

I think that an education is a right of all, whether that be public schooling, homeschooling, private etc. I also think that public education should be free for those that chose to go that route as long as the option it is still available to make other educational choices, to me it should be open and free to everyone who wants to access an education via that route. I also think that those who chose other educational methods should be given the money that the public school would have received for their child to be used towards their education. Alberta does this now with homeschoolers, we are given a portion of that money for buying curric etc, the rest goes to the board we are registered with. We all pay taxes towards education and I think making the choice of what route that education occurs should not be based on finances.

[Katrina]

I also think that those who chose other educational methods should be given the money that the public school would have received for their child to be used towards their education. Alberta does this now with homeschoolers, we are given a portion of that money for buying curric etc, the rest goes to the board we are registered with. We all pay taxes towards education and I think making the choice of what route that education occurs should not be based on finances.

 

Question: Do you guys have free choice in curric? If you wanted to pick a religious curric are you allowed or would your money be taken away? I don't homeschool for religious reasons, but I do like being able to choose which curric I want.

[Diana in OR]

I believe that all children should, by right, be entitled to a good education, be it public or otherwise. I believe that first and foremost, parents have the responsibility to see that their children receive an adequate education, be it public or otherwise.

 

I believe the government has some responsibility in this. In our post-modern society, education is more critical to our society than it was in the past. And citizens, pooling their resources to provide public education is one way for the government to acheive that. I don't think it's unreasonable to fund the system from all citizens, not just those with school-age children. (I would agree, however, that there are some programs that are a waste of taxpayers money. Don't get me started on NCLB.)

 

Unfortunately, I think there are many parents (NOT HOMESCHOOLERS!) who would not ensure their children received much of an education at all if it weren't for compulsory attendance laws.

 

What I would really like to see, though, is a shift in public thinking. I would like to see parents, in general, accept responsibility for their child's education and therefore whatever path they choose is just that-their choice. For example, this year for the first time, both my dc are in public school. That's what dh and I chose for our dc. It was a conscious choice made by us after evaluating all the options. And I think that if parents treated schooling as a commodity, instead of 'that's just what you do'; and expect quality, then it sheds a whole different light on the matter. On the flip side, if ps had the attitude of "We're so glad you chose us :) " then they might see the services they offer in a different light as well.

 

 

Sorry if this got a little OT. You did ask a very complicated, if not extremely LOADED question.;)

[Stacy in NJ]

k-12 is for children, minors. 18 yo's are adults.

[GreenKitty]

No

[Audrey]

Question: Do you guys have free choice in curric? If you wanted to pick a religious curric are you allowed or would your money be taken away? I don't homeschool for religious reasons, but I do like being able to choose which curric I want.

 

 

Because this subject pops up so often, and just as often gets completely miscontrued, PLEASE don't start thinking that all Canadians get money for homeschooling -- WE DON'T!

 

AB, and BC both do. Might be another one who subsidizes, but not all of us get money, and not all of us want the money either.

 

In my province, I fill out 3 one-page forms per year. No one calls me, nor visits me, nor requires me to use any particular curriculum (nor restricts my choice of curriculum), nor requires me to provide any kind of proof, nor to test, yada yada yada...

 

And I LIKE it that way. :D

[chiguirre]

I believe k-12 education is a right and a responsibility. The cost of supporting a large population of illiterate, unemployable people is a huge burden. I do think parents have the right to choose how to provide an adequate education to their children.

[Katrina]

Because this subject pops up so often, and just as often gets completely miscontrued, PLEASE don't start thinking that all Canadians get money for homeschooling -- WE DON'T!

 

 

I'm not an expert on homeschooling in Canada becaues I'm not, but I didn't think all Canadians got money for homeschooling. But I am curious for those places it does how the system works. In America we're afraid that getting tax money back would mean we would be restricted in our choices: what kinds of curric to pick out, and when to teach what subjects. (I don't want to be told I can't follow a four year history cycle because 1st graders here are learning about America.)

 

I believe I've read that in Alaska they get money if they choose to homeschool because not everyone has access to a public education, but they can't purchase nonsecular materials with it. (Even if it's just from a nonsecular publisher)

[Aggie]

After being in the ps as a teacher for many years, here are my thoughts.

 

"Free" education is being taken for granted by a lot of people. Students aren't learning, parents aren't holding their dc accountable, schools' hands are tied. And it's not for lack of funds being poured into the system, nor is it a lack of qualified, caring teachers.

 

I think a system similar to the USMC should be put in place. If a marine isn't doing well in his school and flunks out, he gets some crappy assignment. Guess what? That encourages a lot of people to work and study.

 

K-8 should be mandatory, but really, by 8th grade, there should be an understanding that if the students aren't putting forth effort, there's an alternative: work. Or trade school. Or at any time during high school that a student decides not to attend school or study, out of school. No public assistance for those who aren't doing one or the other. I don't have details worked out, but public high school is a waste of time for some kids. And, therefor, a waste of money for the schools.

 

This may sound harsh, but the education is available for those who want it. Those who don't participate shouldn't be a drain on the system. Mandatory attendance does not equal learning. :(

[Katrina]

I guess I should post my rely to the OP. Yes, think PS education is a right.

[Haiku]

No, I don't think it is a right, but I think it would be a stupid government that didn't make sure it's children had access to free education. I don't like the idea of privatizing K-12 education because I don't think it should be a commodity subject to market fluctuations.

 

Tara

[VaKim]

No. Nor do I believe in compulsory attendance. People got much better educations back when they had to work or pay for it themselves. It meant something to them then. And those who had no interest weren't in there making it hard on everyone and wasting everyone's time. (There were a few forced to go by their parents, but not nearly as many as there are now, who do nothing but cause trouble for everyone else.)

[Haiku]

K-8 should be mandatory, but really, by 8th grade, there should be an understanding that if the students aren't putting forth effort, there's an alternative: work. Or trade school.

 

I think I like that idea. I do think that by the time kids are 14, they can be working. I am not in favor of the extremely extended childhood that we have created in America. I'm not really a fan of government telling me what I have to do with my kids, but I wouldn't want kids to just drop out of school after 8th grade and hang out. There would need to be a way to make sure that these kids are doing something. The best way would be a paradigm shift so that society expects it. The least desirable way would be to have the government mandate either school or work.

 

Tara

[laughing lioness]

I think that education is a privilage, not a right. There are certainly many that are going through the motions of getting an education and in reality are squandering it. Our niece is going to a large state university and plastered all over the dorms are posters such as how to identify if your roomie has alcohol poisoning and what to do for them if you think they are dying, how to protect yourselves from STD's (abstinence isn't mentioned- go figure), where to get free b.c., etc. She has plotted out the days that she'll miss, based on how many the syllabus tells her she can before getting a "C" so that she can "enjoy college." That's education? Our 11 yo nephew, though he can't read, is in 5th grade because the parents and teachers don't want him to feel the stigma of being "left behind." I don't consider that education. I consider that a total disservice to the boy, and the many others like him.

 

I would like to see education in America de-monopolized. There should be more educational options, charter schools, vouchers, private, church sponsored, UMS's, etc.

 

The number of functional illiterates in our country continues to grow because of the inadequate job done by government schools. On that issue at least it's time for a change!

[Zelda]

Education is not, IMO, a right.

 

It is a privilege and it is in government's best interest to see to it that the populace is educated by providing access to a basic education.

 

It is the responsibility of parents to see to their individual children's education in whatever way they deem fit.

Edited October 8, 2008 by Zelda

[Jennifer in NH]

Education is not, IMO, a right.

 

It is a privilege and it is in government's best interest to see to it that the populace is educated by providing access to a basic education.

 

It is the responsibility of parents to see to their individual children's education in whatever way they deem fit.

:iagree: Well said!

[Tabrett]

After being in the ps as a teacher for many years, here are my thoughts.

 

"Free" education is being taken for granted by a lot of people. Students aren't learning, parents aren't holding their dc accountable, schools' hands are tied. And it's not for lack of funds being poured into the system, nor is it a lack of qualified, caring teachers.

 

I think a system similar to the USMC should be put in place. If a marine isn't doing well in his school and flunks out, he gets some crappy assignment. Guess what? That encourages a lot of people to work and study.

 

K-8 should be mandatory, but really, by 8th grade, there should be an understanding that if the students aren't putting forth effort, there's an alternative: work. Or trade school. Or at any time during high school that a student decides not to attend school or study, out of school. No public assistance for those who aren't doing one or the other. I don't have details worked out, but public high school is a waste of time for some kids. And, therefor, a waste of money for the schools.

 

This may sound harsh, but the education is available for those who want it. Those who don't participate shouldn't be a drain on the system. Mandatory attendance does not equal learning. :(

:iagree:After 8th grade it should be considered a privilege. Too many high schools are baby sitting because the states demand student stay in school.

[swellmomma]

Question: Do you guys have free choice in curric? If you wanted to pick a religious curric are you allowed or would your money be taken away? I don't homeschool for religious reasons, but I do like being able to choose which curric I want.

 

 

When registered as traditional yes we do, there is 3 different ways of registering, traditional gives the most freedom and the least amount of money. In fact it doesn't even HAVE to be used for curric, it can be used for lessons, museum admissions, conference fees etc. With those things you submit receipts and they reimburse, because I use mine for curric, I use purchase orders so I never have to pay out of pocket.