AimeeM Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 My cousin's ex-husband is making noise about homeschooling their son against my cousin's wishes. I believe they share split custody (50/50). My cousin works until 6:30 pm, and her ex works several 24 hour shifts as a fire fighter every week. It seems the ex is under the impression that his girlfriend (of a few weeks) can homeschool his and my cousin's son. Can he do this without her permission? I know that in my state, he couldn't, but I do not live in NC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orthodox6 Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 No NC knowledge. Education choices are worked out with judge authorizing the final agreement is what I have read/heard. A girlfriend flunks all eligibility tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 No NC knowledge. Education choices are worked out with judge authorizing the final agreement is what I have read/heard. A girlfriend flunks all eligibility tests. That's what I'm familiar with as well. According to all agreements, they have equal say regarding education. Now, I'm sure this means there could be issues requiring more court if they can't agree, but... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 The courts typically default to what has been normal in the child's life, and they also default to the traditional setting (ie--public school). If the custody agreement says they have equal say, then he has to get a legal change to the custody agreement if he wants to act against your cousin's wishes. I am not, however, a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 A girlfriend flunks all eligibility tests. Especially this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I live in NC but I have no idea about the laws in this case, but my strong guess is that if she were to call a lawyer this would be nipped in the bud. I can't see any judge agreeing that homeschooling by a girlfriend of a few weeks would bring any stability whatsoever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarenNC Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 This is much, much more about custody issues than homeschooling, and needs to be addressed from that angle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 My understanding is that the courts nearly always side on the side of the parent who wants the child in school. While there could be some headaches getting this worked out, I'm sure your cousin's kid will stay in school in the long run. If I were her, I'd be at least as concerned about the gf of just a few weeks being thrust into such a huge role in the child's life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 By law, the homeschooling could be done by the girlfriend if the homeschooling parent wants her to. However the issue of whether or not to homeschool would probably have to be settled through arbitration or court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orthodox6 Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 By law, the homeschooling could be done by the girlfriend if the homeschooling parent wants her to. However the issue of whether or not to homeschool would probably have to be settled through arbitration or court. That surprises me. We have had discussions here before about states where one may not homeschool children that are not ones own. A girlfriend is neither wife of this man nor the mother of his children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 That surprises me. We have had discussions here before about states where one may not homeschool children that are not ones own. A girlfriend is neither wife of this man nor the mother of his children. The parent would be the one to set up the homeschool under their name as the principal of the school. Previously, parents had to be the primary instructor in core subjects (language arts, math, science, history). A few years ago, the largest state homeschool organizations lobbied, with the assistance of HSLDA, to get the definition of homeschool changed to be one where the parent determines the course of study and can "determine additional sources of academic instruction." These "additional sources" can be anyone, anywhere. The intent was to allow parents to enroll their students in classes (in-person or online) or hire tutors to exclusively teach any or all subjects. In the case the OP was describing, the homeschool parent could designate the girlfriend as a tutor and be within the law. NC law also allows a homeschool to enroll children of one additional household, so the homeschool could determine this for those additional students as well. Homeschool Statute: Article 39 Definition: “‘Home school’ means a nonpublic school consisting of the children of not more than two families or households, where the parents or legal guardians or members of either household determine the scope and sequence of academic instruction, provide academic instruction, and determine additional sources of academic instruction.†§ 115C-563. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orthodox6 Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 TechWife, I did not know you are in N.C. That info is right up the dad's alley! Must this "other person" be paid? I don't recall how regulated N.C. Is for homeschooling. (i.e. Receipts submitted, amount of time spent on coursework, etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 TechWife, I did not know you are in N.C. That info is right up the dad's alley! Must this "other person" be paid? I don't recall how regulated N.C. Is for homeschooling. (i.e. Receipts submitted, amount of time spent on coursework, etc.) No, they don't have to be paid. NC is a low regulation state. One parent must have a high school diploma, homeschool nine months out of the year (with "reasonable" time off for holidays and vacations), keep an attendance record, keep a vaccination record and give a standardized test annually. We are not required to turn any of this in, we just have to keep the records in case they are requested by the DNPE. They do ask us to voluntarily turn in test results, but there is no requirement to do so and there are no minimums core requirements. We determine our own curriculum and graduation requirements. ETA: The law allows the DNPE to "inspect" the homeschool annually, but that hasn't happened in at least fifteen years. With 60,950 homeschools that have 98,172 students, they simply don't have the resources to do it. Instead they do what they call "inspection by mail" where they ask us to voluntarily turn in our test results. Some years I turn mine in, some years I don't, it doesn't make a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Dp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 My understanding is that the courts nearly always side on the side of the parent who wants the child in school. While there could be some headaches getting this worked out, I'm sure your cousin's kid will stay in school in the long run. If I were her, I'd be at least as concerned about the gf of just a few weeks being thrust into such a huge role in the child's life. The child isn't in school - he will only be school age this fall. I'm sure she is concerned, but there appears she isn't able to do anything about the GF. Even if there is a caveat in the agreement about over night guests (I'm not sure if there is), she still wouldn't be able to do anything about the girlfriend being around. I think they share completely split custody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 She needs to talk to her lawyer, the one who helped her with her custody and or divorce. That is the person who can give her the most practical help. That person will be familiar with the law where she lives and be able to actually do something about it. If she has 50/50 legal custody (as opposed to physical custody, which are 2 different things) then she can refuse and tell him to take her to court over it. Let him be the one to pay the lawyer. If she has 50% physical custody she can continue to bring him to school and tell the school the dad isn't bringing him on his weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Hmm. But wouldn't he have to petition to change the custody agreement to do this, since they share equal "say" in education and share custody 50/50 (literally one week here, one week there, from what I understand)? And since Dad works so many 24 hour shifts, that is unlikely to go in his favor if attempted, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 If she has 50% physical custody she can continue to bring him to school and tell the school the dad isn't bringing him on his weeks. This won't work if the dad withdraws him from the school. I think she really does need to talk to a lawyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 ETA: The law allows the DNPE to "inspect" the homeschool annually, but that hasn't happened in at least fifteen years. With 60,950 homeschools that have 98,172 students, they simply don't have the resources to do it. Instead they do what they call "inspection by mail" where they ask us to voluntarily turn in our test results. Some years I turn mine in, some years I don't, it doesn't make a difference. *Records* may be inspected, not the homeschool itself. And the only records that may be "inspected" are the most recent standardized test scores. From HSLDA: Although the Division of Non-Public Education has attempted to perform home visits under this provision, the law gives its officials no right to enter homes or to inspect any records besides test scores. There is also no statutory requirement for parents to attend regional meetings arranged by the Division of Non-Public Education for the purpose of reviewing their records. Copies of testing results can be simply mailed to the Division of Non-Public Education upon request Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarenNC Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 The child isn't in school - he will only be school age this fall. I'm sure she is concerned, but there appears she isn't able to do anything about the GF. Even if there is a caveat in the agreement about over night guests (I'm not sure if there is), she still wouldn't be able to do anything about the girlfriend being around. I think they share completely split custody. Be aware that legal "school age" as in mandatory education is 7-16 in NC, even though one can enroll in public kindergarten as long as the child is 5 by Sept 1. It is not possible to register as a homeschool with the state until the year the child turns 7. We went straight to homeschooling, so I'm not sure of the steps required in withdrawing a child who is currently enrolled in a school but not yet 7. If the mother wants NC homeschooling laws, she really needs to go to the source---the NC Dept of Nonpublic Education. http://www.ncdnpe.org/# So far, honestly, other than the mom objecting that this person is the father's new girlfriend, I haven't seen anything that would indicate the woman is any less qualified under NC requirements to teach the child than the child's parent (or other instructor designated by the parent) would be. Neither their relationship status nor length of relationship really comes into play as far as homeschool laws go. As I said, this is primarily about a custody struggle and a control issue between divorced parents and is more about the parents' relationship (or lack of one), not really a homeschool issue. It would be the same if one parent wanted the kid in a private school and one wanted a public one, or if they wanted different private schools or different public schools. It all hinges on the divorce decree and who gets the final say according to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 This won't work if the dad withdraws him from the school. I think she really does need to talk to a lawyer. She definitely doesn't have money for a lawyer. The good news here is that he doesn't either. If I'm not mistaken, he's tried to have custody modified before (don't quote me on that - I'm not positive). His work schedule works against him, and I think he knows better than to try to have custody modified. Due to his 24 hour shifts, the child spends 50% of his "Dad time" with his paternal grandmother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwik Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 The girlfriend probably won't be around by fall. Here once the child has been enrolled you have to formally withdraw and apply to homeschool even if they are still below the legal age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 *Records* may be inspected, not the homeschool itself. And the only records that may be "inspected" are the most recent standardized test scores. From HSLDA: You are correct, the records may be inspected, not the homeschool. However, in addition to the standardized test scores, the attendance record can be inspected. On that, HSLDA is wrong. They cannot inspect the immunization record as that is confidential medical information. They can, however, ask you if you are keeping it on file. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 She definitely doesn't have money for a lawyer. The good news here is that he doesn't either. If I'm not mistaken, he's tried to have custody modified before (don't quote me on that - I'm not positive). His work schedule works against him, and I think he knows better than to try to have custody modified. Due to his 24 hour shifts, the child spends 50% of his "Dad time" with his paternal grandmother. Child care arrangements can't be held against a parent in custody issues. I would assume that the mother also has the child in some type of care arrangement when she is working. If you look at a ten day period and take into consideration the amount of time people sleep, they have the same amount of waking hours with the child. Mom works 8 hours a day, they sleep 8 hours a day, the remaining 8 hours they are together, x 10 days = 80 hours together Dad works 24 hours a day for five of those ten days. Of the remaining five days, they spend 8 hours sleeping, so they have 16 hours x 5 days = 80 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orthodox6 Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 For those unfamiliar with the work schedule of a firefighter, I shall gamble that my son's schedule is fairly standard for non-emergency times. He works 24 hours on, then 48 hours off in a never-ending sequence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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