Our newborn & non-vaxxed visitors.

[bobbeym]

People repeatedly have said things to the effect of, "It doesn't matter whether you are vaccinated." I specifically said in the OP that we believe it does matter, and I am not interested in discussing the merits of it--that the advice I am looking for should be given in the context of *this* is what we believe, *these* are the choices we make based on what we feel is important. Simply saying, "Oh, well, it doesn't matter if you get vaccinated," is unhelpful to say the least. I also said that the point of this post was (quoting from the OP):

 

"I'm just wondering if there's any non-offensive way to tell them that we want to put our baby's safety first, even if they don't agree with our choices. Maybe we should say that we're taking some time to ourselves without any visitors at all, so we don't single them out? For how long?"

 

Maybe I wasn't clear enough, but I was looking for ways to minimize this family's hurt feelings / defensiveness while still putting the interests of our newborn first.

 

 

You cannot give a newborn a flu vaccine. The immunity boost they get from the mother being vaccinated is only slight--somewhere between 20 and 40% if I remember right. It is because a newborn cannot be vaccinated against whooping cough or the flu that makes this a concern for us.

 

We will not be bringing a newborn to the grocery store or a restaurant. We do not bring our newborns in public for the first two months unless we absolutely have to. I'm not saying that this will protect the baby 100%--of course not. Nothing is ever 100%. But I'm saying that you cannot equivocate exposing a newborn to a respiratory medical worker who is NOT vaccinated and who does NOT wear a mask in their office to a trip to the grocery store. The medical worker is far, far more high risk.

Because you clearly feel that vax/no-vax *does* matter, you can't minimize the hurt feelings by doing or saying something that singles out this particular family, esp. if they are as dear to you as you've said.

 

Since you're concerned about the baby getting sick during the peak of flu season and the potential for exposure from any source, you should simply share pictures via email/facebook and let people know that you won't be accepting visitors until the baby is x-months old, being whatever time you feel is safe.

 

[dirty ethel rackham]

I am all for the extended babymoon and limiting exposure during the flu-season months regardless of vaccination status. You really don't know whether or not any visitor has a latent illness they can pass on.  Most pertussis cases in our area have been among adults who were vaccinated, but did not get a booster.  I am not sure where you got your effectiveness stats for the flu vaccine, but I know in recent years, they missed the mark on the strains included in the vaccine.  Our local hospital was full of vax'd people mowed down by the flu.  I'm not arguing against vaccines (we do most), but just that I think you need to extend your caution to all, not just those who are vocal about not vaccinating. 

[Guest]

Do you have a link for this "As it happens, the data shows that healthy adults have a 90% reduced chance of getting the flu if they are vaccinated"

 

I like to review such studies.

I'm not the OP, but I'm guessing this will do: http://www.webmd.com/vaccines/how-effective-is-flu-vaccine. Sorry this is not a hotlink; don't know how to do it with the current format. ETA: Okay, maybe it is a hotlink.

[chiguirre]

We will not be bringing a newborn to the grocery store or a restaurant. We do not bring our newborns in public for the first two months unless we absolutely have to.

I think this is the solution to your problem. Simply post pictures on Facebook and state that you would prefer not to receive visitors for 2 months. Even the common cold can make a baby very ill so staying away from public places and visitors until the baby is older and stronger is reasonable.

[T'smom]

I haven't read all the replies, but I would just say that you are limiting contact with visitors until the baby is however old. I wouldn't say "you can't come over because you're not vaxed" I'd just say "we're not really entertaining visitors until x date"

[Supertechmom]

I'm not the OP, but I'm guessing this will do: http://www.webmd.com/vaccines/how-effective-is-flu-vaccine. Sorry this is not a hotlink; don't know how to do it with the current format. ETA: Okay, maybe it is a hotlink.

thanks!

[LMV]

I thought medical workers were generally required to get the flu vax.  ?

 

This depends on hospital policy.  Some hospitals do require it unless you meet exemption criteria.  Other hospitals strongly encourage but don't restrict those who don't comply.  Other hospitals are even more lax.  

[lovinmyboys]

I don't have much advice, but totally know where you are coming from. Our best friends don't vax and when my 3rd child was born they visited him in the hospital. No one seemed sick. Six days later both their kids were diagnosed with pertussis. Not fun.. DS survived and all is fine now.

 

I had a fourth baby and really struggled with what policy to have in place. We had moved, so those friends didn't get to visit him till he was older anyway. People I know are really open about whether they vax or not. I am not really close to anyone who doesn't vax here, so i just didn't invite them for a few months.

 

Good luck!

[Dahliarw]

I would treat everyone the same.  Don't come around if you've been sick in the last 24-48 hours.  Wash hands before holding baby, etc.  FWIW, there was a baby in my state a couple of years ago who caught pertussis from someone who was fully vaxed and the baby died.  You never know who the vaccine will and will not work for.  So it is best to treat all the same.

 

Also, if any of your friends get the inhaled flu vaccine, it can shed for up to a month, so I would be super careful.  They won't have symptoms of being sick either, but they can still get your baby sick.

[LMV]

I haven't read all the replies, but I would just say that you are limiting contact with visitors until the baby is however old. I wouldn't say "you can't come over because you're not vaxed" I'd just say "we're not really entertaining visitors until x date"

 

I think this is a good approach.  In general we try to avoid extraneous contact until our kids are at least three months old.  At that point the immune system has had some time to develop  and they are outside of that lovely mandatory spinal tap for a fever age.  I say that as a physician who has had tapped more than my share of febrile two week olds who more likely have some cold they picked from the neighbor than GBBS meningitis but the risk is there and the risk of missing the diagnosis is too great to not follow the literature and tap these kids.  As a mom I would completely understand why it had to happen [and truly spinal taps are very safe] if it was my kid but I'm also glad our youngest is now nine months old and we're outside of that window.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I'm not the OP, but I'm guessing this will do: http://www.webmd.com/vaccines/how-effective-is-flu-vaccine. Sorry this is not a hotlink; don't know how to do it with the current format. ETA: Okay, maybe it is a hotlink.

 

Other sources list it as being much less effective. 

Influenza activity is widespread in 47 states, CDC stated in its FluView report covering the week ending January 5. The agency also reported in the January 11 Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report that the 2012–13 influenza vaccine has been shown to be 62% effective at preventing the virus.  Excerpted from

http://www.pharmacist.com/influenza-vaccine-found-be-62-effective-flu-activity-widespread-47-states

 

For this reason, I would not count vax status as a reason to allow a visitor.  Much better to go with the no visitors rule for a while. 

[Desert Strawberry]

If you don't take the baby in public for 2 months, then it follows that you would not have guests either.

[xixstar]

Each family has the right to establish their own boundaries and you're making it clear that you do not want your infant around any un-vaxed people or the general public for the first 2 months. I would just state that clearly to all friends and this clears the air if you're having some people over and not others.

 

You can speak privately to your close friends to let them know that it's not directed specifically at them but that this is just what you need to do to be comfortable and you respect their right to choose for their family, but that for a few months you will be unavailable to visit or hang out. You can also throw out specifics that you don't want anyone visiting that is sick or recently was either, even minor illnesses. This extra caveat may help it sound like you're firmly in the Overprotective Parent crowd and I say go ahead and go with that stereotype and own it, accept it and just shrug off any feedback otherwise.

 

I think that would be the best way to address the issue. Coming up with anything else to say would be difficult for me because then I'd have to keep up with whatever reason or story I gave and would get all tripped up if I was trying to paint a slightly different light.

 

I'm not trying to belittle or insult by using the Overprotective Parent thing, btw, it is a great way to just to get your point across. I have friends that are pretty germphobic and they just own the insanity (their wording, they know they're over-the-top worried) of it and don't apologize for it.

[annandatje]

How would you react if the parents of the unvaxed family kindly asked you and your children to stay away from them for a certain period after you or your children were vaxed because they were concerned about you spreading infection to them from the vax (not saying this actually happens)?  Your honest reaction to that situation might be a reasonable predictor of their reaction to the situation you pose.

 

There just isn't a good way to tell people to stay away from you because they may make you or your kids ill.  Their feelings will be hurt even if they know their choices are controversial.

 

Life is full of risks.  Germs can be spread before the onset of symptoms.  Keep the babe home alone for awhile until your concern subsides about his/her immune system. 

[magnificent_baby]

The flu this year was horrible. It was rampant in our area, whether people were vaccinated or not. My sister (who was forced by her employer to get the shot), had it something fierce. It knocked her down for weeks. I know numerous others who got it even with the vaccine. Hopefully it was one of those rare, bad years for flu and it won't be so bad this year.

 

Whether visitors are vaccinated or not, I'd keep my newborn away from as many as possible in the winter months. For those that do visit, insist on strict hand washing.

[bobbeym]

thanks!

 

@Supertechmom, there's a lot of discrepancy on flu vax success rates.  I think that 90% is based on only one study from several years ago. Most recent sources report a 60% success rate for the injected vax in adults 18-65.  The nasal spray for kids has a higher rate of success, but also is more likely to carry over to someone else.

[HS Mom in NC]

Our ped (who has lots of patients who are not vaxxed) tells every parent regardless of their or anyone else's vax status, "Never hand your baby to anyone in the first 6 weeks.  Never put them in any type of childcare situation.  Stay home. Make sure they're sleeping close enough to you to hear their breathing and breastfeed." 

 

He will tell you the biggest risk to newborns is elderly relatives that were vaxxed for pertussis but it's worn off. Pertussis is very common even among vaxxed communities. Most drs. will assume it's pertussis if it's a bad cough and the kid isn't vaxxed.  They will diagnose other things like croupe, cold, etc. if the kid is vaxxed. He actually tests to specify.  He's always telling his patients who aren't vaxxed about the latest strains every few years that he's confirmed through tests even in vaxxed patients.

 

When my middle child was born I lost a lot of blood.  That reduced my immunity to illness (she was born in Nov during flu season.) We don't vax. The flu vax has way too low an effectiveness rate to consider anyone vaxxed as "safe." We just told everyone we weren't taking visitors during my recovery.  My crazy SIL insisted on coming over anyway with a meal.  My husband didn't let her in and reminded her that he had specifically told her not to.  She was mad.  Oh well. People can set any boundary they like whether someone else thinks it's reasonable or crazy.

 

My girls wanted a female ped in their Jr. High years.  Our ped. gave us the name of a female ped.  She very nicely met with us and then calmly stated that she didn't take patients who weren't fully vaxxed because she considered it a risk to the other patients who were not old enough to be vaxxed yet.  I was not upset or hurt. I didn't roll my eyes and get into it about the other ped. who's had both in his office for years with no problems whatsoever.  I live by my convictions and would never ask someone to live contrary to their own-that's hypocrisy. I thanked her for her time and calmly left.  I explained to my girls that she was well within her rights to decide that even if I think it's silly. 

 

Anyone in a snit about the whole thing is being ridiculous.  You don't make the decision to not vaxwithout considering the possibility that someone might choose to limit their child's exposure to your child at some point for some time. You also have to consider that having a vax preventable illness could mean voluntarily staying home to avoid exposing others.