Okay, I need to make a change for pre-calc. Regentrude, Jane, Nan, Jann, calling math moms!

[FaithManor]

Dh and I have an agreement that since I teach everything at the high school level except computer programming, that he takes over for me for pre-calc and calc. This is not because I can't teach beyond algebra 2, it's just a stress reliever for me. When dd was in pre-calc, she was taking online college courses, Classical Rhetoric with Aristotle, 3rd year of Spanish and since she wasn't licensed yet, I was the chauffeur to her tutor, volunteering (chauffeur mom again), advanced chem, etc. She had a full plate and I also had three young boys to homeschool as well. So, having a subject that I could count on dh to teach was a real life preserver for me.

 

Well, ds the 14 year old, will be ready for pre-calc this autumn. Dh is going to teach it again, but I think we need to make a curriculum change. He taught dd from an old college-trig/pre-calc book that he had once tutored from when he was a college math major - his freshman year he started in calc 2 but tutored the college-trig kids and was given this text. He's never had an instructor's manual and we've never been able to find one online. This made his grading time consuming and of course, he had to design all of her exams as well. I feel like I need to streamline this for him. Ds is an excellent, independent mathematician...final grade in algebra 2 - 98% - and he asked questions of me all of five times over the entire Lial's book/Great Courses lectures! He does love his math and it comes pretty easily to him. So, I'm not certain how much one-one with dh he will need, but I do know I don't want dh to have to take long periods of time to grade assignments or write up quizzes and tests. I also would like dh to be able to use the text with the eldest ds who won't be ready for it until January and this ds is going to need some hand holding so the explanations and examples need to be truly top-notch. Again, I won't be teaching him. At that point, the youngest will be in geometry and taking an algebra based intro to astronomy college course online. Youngest is a brilliant kid, but he has very little self-confidence. We are working on that, but at the present time being 12 and doing high school level work, he requires a good bit of my attention. He will eventually use whatever text I purchase as well.

 

Now that you know the background, what do you suggest? I haven't been in the market for a pre-calc text before and sheepishly, must admit that I haven't paid attention to any recommendations you've made in the past. If there is a previous thread with trig-precalc curriculum reviews, feel free to link it. My machine was acting up and when I attempted a topic search, it timed out. (This computer is old, and sad to say, I think it is running out of memory.)

 

Tell me about your favorites.

 

Thanks a bunch ladies,

Faith

[regentrude]

A few thoughts:

since your DH already taught from the book and designed exams fro your DD, why can't he just use the same - after all, he has already done the prep, and your son can simply do the same test.

 

For a strong math student (and it sounds like yours are), AoPS is fabulous, and that is what we are using. It does not require an instructor and does come with a solution manual. I would, however, backtrack to Intermediate Algebra, because that covers some topics not usually covered in algebra 2 but rather in precalculus.

 

I am not familiar with any other precalculus programs; once we found AoPS, we never bothered to research anything else. Sorry.

[Jann in TX]

The Lial Pre-Calc text is excellent and will be in a format your son is used to. They have solutions and video lessons ($35 or less) as well.

Look for 3rd or 4th editions. Most will be hardback. This is the same text as the 'College Algebra and Trigonometry' text (word for word other than the cover).

[kiana]

I really think that AOPS intermediate algebra/precalculus/calculus texts would fit the bill for your younger two perfectly.

 

For the older one, did your dh keep records of your dd's work? If so, could he just assign the same work to your ds? That would simplify his prep a lot.

[Jane in NC]

Well AoPS was not on our radar way back when so I had my son use the Dolciani series. I think the "precalc" book in that series (Modern Introductory Analysis) is fabulous but it is very time consuming since solution manuals, etc. seem hard to find.

 

For those on an engineering path, the Larson Precalc text might be a good choice. Lots of application problems and appropriate utilization of a graphing calculator (with things like modeling problems)--if the latter is a skill you think needs some work. Older editions of Larson would be fine. In my fourth edition, odd number solutions to problem sets are offered, while all solutions are given for the chapter tests and cumulative tests. These are solutions only.

 

Why does he not wish to use his book that he has on hand?

[FaithManor]

A few thoughts:

since your DH already taught from the book and designed exams fro your DD, why can't he just use the same - after all, he has already done the prep, and your son can simply do the same test.

 

 

 

The were done five-six years ago on another computer which we thought we had a full back-up of, but since cannot find the back-up. So, his work is lost.

 

Faith

[FaithManor]

 

Why does he not wish to use his book that he has on hand?

 

It was old when it was given to him and it's even older now. It got mildly damp, along with a box of other books that weren't being used, when we had a minor roof leak. It's a little musty smelling now which bothers my allergies and some of the pages were already falling out. Additionally, the computer he did the work on in terms of making up tests and quizzes has since been dispensed with due to age. We thought we had a full back-up of all of the work and since we've moved, can't find it anywhere. I don't know if it was not labeled properly or what. But, we've had no luck finding it so between the condition of the book and now DH having to start from scratch, I thought it was time to get a new text.

 

Faith

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

What Great Courses did you use for algebra??

[FaithManor]

What Great Courses did you use for algebra??

 

Algebra 2 with Dr. Sellers, Penn State U. Additional assignments from Lial's Intermediate Algebra and also used the Lial's chapter exams so I wouldn't need to make my own. The guidebook that comes with the lectures has well explained examples, but only 10-12 problems per lesson.

 

Faith

[KimberlyI]

At that point, the youngest will be in geometry and taking an algebra based intro to astronomy college course online.

 

Faith

 

Could I briefly interrupt and ask what you are using for the astronomy course? I'll also be taking notes on the pre-calc. Thanks!

[Nan in Mass]

Definately not an expert at this lol.

Mine used Blitzer. Something-or-other: An early functions approach. I have a love/hate relationship with it. It is meant for college, so it is organized into long, very wordy lessons which spent quite a lot of time trying to convince the student that the stuff was useful. It has lots of everything - subjects, problems, etc. The challengine problems were "interesting" according to an exceedingly picky relative who taught calculus at the local prep school for years (including AP). That was a complement. She suggested doing all the odds in each lesson. There are a lot of them. Calculator use is incorporated and there are some instructions which put together with an online tutorial for our specific calculator was enough to give an intro to that, but not more. The convince the student stuff also served as a foundation for a pretty applied approach, one that was good for my engineering-minded student and for my non-mathy one. (I would guess a more theoretical student would be better off with a different program?) It cost the earth and came with all sorts of extras. I would have picked something else except that my older one used it at the cc so we had the book already. I think Jenny on the Singapore board recommends it to follow the NEM series. If it had been laid out in a more high school friendly way, I would have liked it better. As it was, it took a long time to read one lesson and a long time to do the excersizes. Clear and applied but long. I liked very much that it attacked math from two directions - here is the data let's find the formula that fits it, and here is a formula and some givens let's find the unknown. I seem to remember each section beginning with the first and then moving on to the second? Maybe? When I did pre-calc, I don't remember the two directions being quite so overtly explained before.

 

Probably not very helpful.

Nan

[Muttichen]

 

For those on an engineering path, the Larson Precalc text might be a good choice. Lots of application problems and appropriate utilization of a graphing calculator (with things like modeling problems)--if the latter is a skill you think needs some work. Older editions of Larson would be fine. In my fourth edition, odd number solutions to problem sets are offered, while all solutions are given for the chapter tests and cumulative tests. These are solutions only.

 

 

This is what we used. My dh, who has a PhD in math looked at everything, including AoPS, and liked it best. It covers the material thoroughly and has lots of interesting problems.

[jhschool]

What about getting the Life of Fred Advanced Algebra, Geometry, and Trigonometry?

With Home Companions. I don't know if they cover everything you need for

"Precalculus" but you could check the tables of contents against a good standard

high school text (or you could just stick with a good standard high school text--I

don't know them though).

I have a friend with a Mathy kid--for some reason they are not into AoPS but they

love Life of Fred.

[AngieW in Texas]

Since it looks like you have already used Lial's for Algebra II, I would stick with it for Precalculus.

 

I used Larson's Precalculus for my oldest, but didn't like it, so I switched over to Lial's for my middle dd.

 

I didn't continue with Lial's for Calculus this year because I knew my dd would need my help for that one and I wouldn't have the time. I have not been very happy with Thinkwell. My dd is now just going through all the video lectures and then we'll work through Calculus the Easy Way this summer. She's going to be repeating Calculus at her university in the fall, so she doesn't need a super in-depth course, just something that covers the material.

[flyingiguana]

We're doing ok with Thinkwell calculus, although it does need a lot of my input. (However, I'm not sure there are any rigorous books/programs out there that would work for a student working alone.) Thinkwell is seeming to cover everything. There are some programs that don't. (Can't remember which they are though -- I just remember running into them)

 

I haven't seen the pre-calc from Thinkwell. If it's the same guy, he's pretty good, although there is the occasional need for supplementary problem sets in the calculus course. I've found that was more the case at the beginning of the course, though. If there are tests, I don't know about them, so we just haven't done tests. I'm not sure they're necessary. Every problem is a test, in a sense. But Thinkwell might be more pricey than getting used textbooks (unless you get a lot of supplementary material).

 

For pre-calc we used a Larson book (Larson and Hostetler). It was the teacher's edition, so we had all the answers, but that's all we had. It worked fine. I haven't needed worked out solutions for pre-calc though (I only start to really appreciate that in calculus).

 

However, I have several other pre-calc books around. They all seem about the same. The only reason we used the Larson was because we had to pick something.

 

My only complaint about these books is that there are too many problems. I have to actually assign things, so it's not a package in that respect. If I just send the kid in and tell them to do every odd problem, it will be way too much. (But I'd rather have too much to choose from than too little, so it's not much of complaint.)

 

Once again, though, these are not books my kids could have got through without help from me.