................... Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 My son who is doing great with computational math using Saxon 6/5 is doing Singapore CWP 4. He is almost totally unable to do them. Even when I "help" him it seems I practically end up doing the whole thing for him. And FYI these are challenging for me too. When I even try to get him to do it mostly on his own, we have tears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Maybe the problem is in the different ways Singapore and Saxon present word problems? Singapore has a unique style of writing and wording their problems, and that makes them very challenging! If we had not worked through Singapore 4A & 4B, my son could not have done CWP 4. Does that make sense? Do you think your son could probably do the math to solve the problem if he could just understand what the problem is? Since this is a WWYD question, I'd work with him through the problems until he understands how to read them with a Singapore understanding/vocabulary (even if that means always working with him). Best wishes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Well, for instance today's problems required making charts to solve. We did 3 together. I was unable to figure out the 4th one. After I looked in the back, I had a "well of course" moment, but honestly I couldn't even get it. But it was still valuable, tO talk it through together. Even if he can't do them on his own, he is watching and seeing at least. I just wonder if I should go back to level 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmoira Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Did he go through level three first? I usually recommend not starting the series later than this. Never mind, I just saw your update post. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 No- maybe I should do that. I totally don't care what "level" the cover says because I know my son really really needs to strengthen his problem solving skills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmoira Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Well, for instance today's problems required making charts to solve. We did 3 together. I was unable to figure out the 4th one. After I looked in the back, I had a "well of course" moment, but honestly I couldn't even get it. But it was still valuable, tO talk it through together. Even if he can't do them on his own, he is watching and seeing at least. I just wonder if I should go back to level 3. I'd go back to three. You also might want to pick out some of the word problems in MEP Y3a and up (some are in the worksheets, some in the lesson plans). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraidycat Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Ugh. Word problems seem to be my mathy DD's nemesis, too. I am actually thinking about starting her way back in CWP 1 or 2, since it's not a matter of practicing the math, but making sense of what the question is asking. Once she gets more proficient making sense of the words, then I'll move ahead. I honestly believe that math and math word problems are two totally separate skills/subjects, so students will not necessarily be on the same level in one as the other. I checked this book out from the library a few months ago. I am going to just buy it for her to use a reference. It is a step by step "how to" read the problem to figure out what they're asking. http://www.amazon.com/Word-Problems-Made-Easy-Making/dp/0766025128/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1342724980&sr=1-2&keywords=word+problems+made+easy As a matter of fact, I just did order it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 There are some really tricky questions in CWP 4, 5, & 6. The Kumon word problems books are more straightforward, and I'd actually recommend working through those if CWP is too difficult. I would start with the Grade 5 Kumon book for a student in Saxon 6/5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Well I sat down and re-read the cover of the book. These questions are all "graded" in increasing difficulty within each chapter. So I should expect the beginning to go fairly smoothly with my son needing more help as the chapter progresses. So that makes me think I should just stick with this level for now. I looked at the grade 3 samples and they are similar to the word problems he is facing in Saxon 6/5 (Saxon is asking for similar logical reasoning but using higher math of course.). I'm amazed that there are slews of 10 year old who can solve the harder problems in the ends of the chapters independently. :blink::blink::blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimm Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 My kids can't do them on their own. But I've only recently bought the CWP books (I know, bad bad mom). ;) My plan is to have us doing them all together for a while till they get easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I'm amazed that there are slews of 10 year old who can solve the harder problems in the ends of the chapters independently. :blink::blink::blink: We're not up to that level yet, but I'm with you. The hard problems are really, really hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Well I'm glad I'm not alone! And, honestly, as usual, if I adjust my expectations, these can be a lot of fun and not stressful, while still learning a lot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Well I'm glad I'm not alone! And, honestly, as usual, if I adjust my expectations, these can be a lot of fun and not stressful, while still learning a lot! Just wanted to say thanks for saying this. Our day has been absolutely awful, and this is just what I needed to hear. I hope level 3 works out well for your student. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 I'm sorry you've had a bad day . :grouphug: Cut your losses, order a pizza and Have a Netflix night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fractalgal Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Did he go through level three first? I usually recommend not starting the series later than this. :iagree: You may also want to consider these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 1) solve the problem to be solved at next lesson. 2) write down the questions and answers used to solve it 3) group those questions by stages (stage of working problem > question > answer) If you do the above before-hand then questions supporting the work can be optimized and problems of understanding can be anticipated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpaharris Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 There is nothing more humbling to a so-called educated Mom than to sit down and try to figure out your kid's 4th and 5th grade Singapore IP and CWP!!!:willy_nilly: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 There is nothing more humbling to a so-called educated Mom than to sit down and try to figure out your kid's 4th and 5th grade Singapore IP and CWP!!!:willy_nilly: :lol::lol::lol: There was one problem in the 1B IP that neither I (Stanford alumna) nor my visiting mom (Berkeley alumna) could figure out even with the answer key in front of us. It was one of those "puzzle" problems and we couldn't figure out how to arrive at the correct answer. Even Mr. Quant Jock DH had trouble with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BinahYeteirah Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 My dd is doing CWP 2 right now. Is this level considered very easy? She's about halfway through the book and so far she thinks they are way too easy. We'll see how she does when she gets to the really challenging levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critterfixer Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I was actually tempted to purchase CWP for my boys doing MEP. Then I thought, "What in the world am I thinking? My boys struggle with the word problems in MEP, so I go get harder ones? I hate word problems myself, I've struggled with them all of my life, and I'm even considering something that will frustrate me and bring them to tears?" What I did instead was to purchase a book called Word Problems Made Easy. The book shows step by step ways to approach the problem, how to pick out the information needed, to get rid of the excess, and then how to choose the best methods to solve it. So now the fear factor is gone, and we can actually learn. So I think that if a child is having trouble with CWP I'd back off and do something a little less challenging and a lot more instructive. In essence, put the training wheels back on instead of giving the child a ten-speed to ride. In the meantime, working on the CWP yourself could help you to be able to teach them better when he is ready for it. I think it is a far different thing to be made aware of one's deficiencies as an adult than it is to be made aware of them as a child. As an adult, we are motivated to work harder, to study and try to understand. As a child, it would be very easy to discourage them by showing how little they know. Just my thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom-ninja. Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 You may also want to consider these. How are these different? Frankly, we've given up on CWP. At least for now. They have me baffled. I've been looking for a word problem book that doesn't just use the bar method. Yes, I know that you don't have to use the bar method with CWP, but it would be nice to have the examples showing other methods as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 My dd is doing CWP 2 right now. Is this level considered very easy? She's about halfway through the book and so far she thinks they are way too easy. We'll see how she does when she gets to the really challenging levels. CWP 1-3 are pretty straightforward. It's 4-6 that contain some really tricky problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Frankly, we've given up on CWP. At least for now. They have me baffled. I've been looking for a word problem book that doesn't just use the bar method. Yes, I know that you don't have to use the bar method with CWP, but it would be nice to have the examples showing other methods as well. The Kumon word problems series books are more straightforward than CWP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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