German, French, Norwegian?

[Medieval Mom]

Please help me choose a foreign language to study with ds8. My head is spinning!

 

1. German: I lived in Germany for a while, and was once pretty good at the language :) I tested out of 2 years of German in college, and took 1 more course. I can still read it well, pronounce it well, but my conversational skills definitely need brushing up. Materials are available. (The R&S German books look adorable.)

 

2. French: Always wanted to learn French. Dh thinks its an excellent language to learn. (Dh has lived all over the world.) Materials are easy to find. I know NO French, but am willing to learn.

 

3. Norwegian: Dh is from Norway, so half the dc's family is Norwegian. We'd be able to call up the dc's aunts, uncles, cousins, and grandparents to talk at no additional cost. (Thanks, Vonage!) My Norsk is so-so at best (my accent is pretty bad, I fear), and materials are HARD to find for this language. That said, I tested out of 1 year of Norwegian in college, and took another year. We'd have dh for a tutor, but only in the all-too-brief evenings, of course. We've asked the family for help in locating Norwegian learning materials, like readers, but they don't seem to understand what we mean. :confused: Of limited *use* except conversing with family in Norway.

 

4. Charlotte Mason style: That is, learn 2 or 3 of these, on different days. M-French, T-German, W-Norwegian, etc. We own several videos in foreign languages. So, we could do this during lunch time by watching Dora the Explorer or Muzzy in French on Mon., the same episode in Norwegian the next day, etc. We're in no rush; I'm not trying to reach any particular level of proficiency this year. But I do believe that languages are important; and the dc seem to sop this stuff up rather easily, even ds3!

 

 

Note: We're also studying Latin, so don't answer, "None. Latin!"

Edited April 10, 2012 by Medieval Mom

[regentrude]

here's my experience:

It really really helps if you are able to speak the language you are teaching. We are studying French, and I am learning with DD - but we eventually hit a roadblock and had to outsource.

Are your children fluent speakers in Norwegian? The easiest way to become a heritage speaker is for the parent to speak the language exclusively at home. If your DH has not been doing so, he should. If he did not make the effort so far, I would not count on him being able to make a big impact. I know what I am talking about because in our house both parents speak German almost exclusively, and it is still hard to get the children to become proficient - they speak and read, but their written work is lacking.

 

So, my vote would be for German because that is what you know and are able to help with.

I love French, and it is great to learn with the kids but it requires a LOT of time and effort and you will eventually not be able to teach anymore.

Unless your DH is committed to teaching Norwegian, I do not consider this a good idea, because occasional conversations with family are not sufficient to develop fluency.

 

ETA: The whole idea of doing two languages on alternating days sounds nice on paper, but is probably not going to work, because language learning requires a lot more time and effort than people commonly think. If you do two languages, I would stagger beginning and introduce the second language after the student has developed some skill in the first. In my home country, the first language starts in 3rd grade and the 2nd is not introduced until 6th grade (the third follows in 9th grade or so).

[nrself]

I have little to no experience with foreign languages (a year of Spanish in hs and the Latin my kids are studying now), but I'd second German. Your kids definitely have an advantage in your experience with the language. And since your the primary teacher that's the way I'd go.

 

Nicole

[kristinannie]

here's my experience:

It really really helps if you are able to speak the language you are teaching. We are studying French, and I am learning with DD - but we eventually hit a roadblock and had to outsource.

Are your children fluent speakers in Norwegian? The easiest way to become a heritage speaker is for the parent to speak the language exclusively at home. If your DH has not been doing so, he should. If he did not make the effort so far, I would not count on him being able to make a big impact. I know what I am talking about because in our house both parents speak German almost exclusively, and it is still hard to get the children to become proficient - they speak and read, but their written work is lacking.

 

So, my vote would be for German because that is what you know and are able to help with.

I love French, and it is great to learn with the kids but it requires a LOT of time and effort and you will eventually not be able to teach anymore.

Unless your DH is committed to teaching Norwegian, I do not consider this a good idea, because occasional conversations with family are not sufficient to develop fluency.

 

ETA: The whole idea of doing two languages on alternating days sounds nice on paper, but is probably not going to work, because language learning requires a lot more time and effort than people commonly think. If you do two languages, I would stagger beginning and introduce the second language after the student has developed some skill in the first. In my home country, the first language starts in 3rd grade and the 2nd is not introduced until 6th grade (the third follows in 9th grade or so).

 

 

:iagree: You should teach German since you know it well. That is the same reason I am teaching German (although I am far from fluent). I think that your husband should start speaking Norwegian and the kids will probably pick up a lot of it! Maybe he could do 2 or 3 days a week where he only speaks Norwegian. I am sure that his family could send lots of children's books and DVD's. It is pretty easy to find a DVD player that will play those DVD's. If you need help, let me know. I bought one a year ago to play DVD's from Germany.

[Greta]

here's my experience:

It really really helps if you are able to speak the language you are teaching.

 

So, my vote would be for German because that is what you know and are able to help with.

 

:iagree: I thought I could learn Latin alongside dd. That works for about a first-year course level of knowledge, but beyond that, I realized we would need help. If you know a language, even if you need a little brushing up, that is the one to teach!

[Amira]

I think you could make a good case for any of the three. Usually I'd vote for French out of this group, since it's an international language, but having native speakers available for Norwegian is a big plus- as long as your husband or his family are willing and able to work with your kids. That might be hard to count on, especially since your husband is working and Norway's time zone is different. And it does make a difference that there are much better resources for French and German. It can be frustrating to teach a language that doesn't have much help out there.

 

I'd probably lean toward German because you're already reasonably comfortable with it and that makes a big difference when you're homeschooling a foreign language. But really, I don't think any of your choices would be wrong.

 

Does your 8yo have an opinion?

[Medieval Mom]

I've edited my original post to add that I've had the equivalent of 2.5 years college German, and 2 years college Norwegian.

 

I've also had 2 years Latin and a semester of Medieval Latin and Old Norse, but that's neither here nor there.

[Medieval Mom]

here's my experience:

It really really helps if you are able to speak the language you are teaching. We are studying French, and I am learning with DD - but we eventually hit a roadblock and had to outsource.

Are your children fluent speakers in Norwegian? The easiest way to become a heritage speaker is for the parent to speak the language exclusively at home. If your DH has not been doing so, he should. If he did not make the effort so far, I would not count on him being able to make a big impact. I know what I am talking about because in our house both parents speak German almost exclusively, and it is still hard to get the children to become proficient - they speak and read, but their written work is lacking.

 

So, my vote would be for German because that is what you know and are able to help with.

I love French, and it is great to learn with the kids but it requires a LOT of time and effort and you will eventually not be able to teach anymore.

Unless your DH is committed to teaching Norwegian, I do not consider this a good idea, because occasional conversations with family are not sufficient to develop fluency.

 

ETA: The whole idea of doing two languages on alternating days sounds nice on paper, but is probably not going to work, because language learning requires a lot more time and effort than people commonly think. If you do two languages, I would stagger beginning and introduce the second language after the student has developed some skill in the first. In my home country, the first language starts in 3rd grade and the 2nd is not introduced until 6th grade (the third follows in 9th grade or so).

 

 

Very wise post. Thank you!

 

Yes, being able to speak the language helps. Therefore German or Norwegian would be my best bet... Maybe we could hold off French for high school. :D

 

Our children are NOT fluent in Norwegian. Not by a long shot. Neither am I. I can converse with family, but I am very aware of my limitations. (That said, it's been years since I've conversed in German... and dh and I do speak to each other in Norwegian fairly often (several times per week.) )

 

So far, my dh has not spoken much Norwegian to the dc. In fact, when we do speak Norwegian between us I'm the instigator. Frankly, although he was born in the country and grew up speaking the language with his family all over the world, all his upper-level schooling has been in English. He *thinks* in English now.

 

I'm afraid multiple languages during the week might not pan out, either. I'm attracted to it because I wouldn't really have to prioritize these languages, but do them all! (I love languages.) OTOH, I wonder if we'd ever get anywhere. Sigh!

 

Thanks again, Regentrude.

[Medieval Mom]

:iagree: You should teach German since you know it well. That is the same reason I am teaching German (although I am far from fluent). I think that your husband should start speaking Norwegian and the kids will probably pick up a lot of it! Maybe he could do 2 or 3 days a week where he only speaks Norwegian. I am sure that his family could send lots of children's books and DVD's. It is pretty easy to find a DVD player that will play those DVD's. If you need help, let me know. I bought one a year ago to play DVD's from Germany.

 

We do have some children's books and DVD's in Norwegian, which helps. The best dvds are Dora the Explorer, actually. In these films, Dora is speaking Norwegian and learning English! :) The other films we have are spoken in high, fast-paced, squeaky-voiced characters in rather uncommon situations. (Imagine learning Norwegian from Woody the Woodpecker or Donald Duck...)

 

We do have a dvd player which is zone-free, which is lovely. I really wish that ALL dvd players were zone free. Sigh!

[Medieval Mom]

I think you could make a good case for any of the three. Usually I'd vote for French out of this group, since it's an international language, but having native speakers available for Norwegian is a big plus- as long as your husband or his family are willing and able to work with your kids. That might be hard to count on, especially since your husband is working and Norway's time zone is different. And it does make a difference that there are much better resources for French and German. It can be frustrating to teach a language that doesn't have much help out there.

 

I'd probably lean toward German because you're already reasonably comfortable with it and that makes a big difference when you're homeschooling a foreign language. But really, I don't think any of your choices would be wrong.

 

Does your 8yo have an opinion?

 

 

Ahh... Your post is echoing all the thoughts inside my head!

 

My 8yo, when asked, shrugs and either says, "All of them!" or "Whatever YOU think, Mom." Sigh. He likes watching the videos we have in any of the three languages.

 

Part of me thinks we should hold off altogether until he has a definite opinion. But when I hear how quickly he and his little brother pick up new words in a foreign language, and how GOOD their accent is (compared to mine, in Norwegian, that is), I think it's a shame to wait. I could AT LEAST give them exposure to listening to the language so they develop a bit of an ear for it, for example.

[EKS]

It is extremely difficult to teach a foreign language that you don't know. I vote for Norwegian if your husband is on board to help *a lot* and for German if he is not.

[Embassy]

I agree that any of the languages would be a good choice. I don't find it too impossible to do more than one either if you all don't mind the extra time it will take. We are attempting to learn several concurrently and are making slow and steady progress. We make the most progress when we cover the languages every school day for a short period of time in each language (15-20 min) than when we spent longer (30-40 min) with alternating days.

[stripe]

I think Norwegian should be a given. The others are a plus.

 

(My kids are also learning their father's heritage language.)

 

If you could have your son (with all of you is fine too, don't mean to imply solitarily) go stay with your in laws that would help. My kids saw a HUGE benefit to playing with other kids whose English was minimal, much more so than grandparents, who were fine but not the same as other kids. Or even their father, who just doesn't seem to have anything much to say. (Is this a male problem?)

Edited April 10, 2012 by stripe

[lillehei]

I think learning Norwegian sounds good in theory but practically speaking, it is not going to be used anywhere but Norway or with their dad. I guess I would go with German, so you can help them. I wouldn't wait until your ds makes up his mind. Just pick one and start. I like the ideas of watching Norwegian videos and looking at books, but for real language lessons, I say German.

 

I learned 6 years of Spanish in high school and college and am glad I did, but I am not even conversational anymore (it has been 20+ years!). I can at least help the kids with Rosetta Stone or help them look up a word in the Spanish-English dictionary. It helps a lot. Also, I would never recommend Rosetta Stone. Again, good in theory, but my kids have not learned any meaningful, conversational Spanish. They can't parse or understand tenses. If I had't bought the 5 year homeschool Latin American Spanish (why did I do that again!?), I wouldn't be using it at all. I guess it is better than nothing. I will have to reevaluate next year.

 

PS My husband is of Norwegian heritage and we have continued the traditional Norwegian naming system but cannot read his family history. Thankfully, a nice relative in Norway translated a bunch of old records for us, so that has been fun. We can trace his ancestry back to the 1400s.

[stripe]

I think learning Norwegian sounds good in theory but practically speaking, it is not going to be used anywhere but Norway or with their dad.

However, many people regret not knowing their family's heritage language or being able to speak to relatives, and knowing any second language helps learn other, more relevant ones later.

 

I say this as someone whose children's other language is also not particularly "useful." I still think it's important for them personally.

[mumto2]

A friend who is Dutch has made sure all of her children are able to do GCSE level Dutch. We live in the UK so they actually take the exam through their school. They know very little before the exam process starts even though their parents speak it constantly at home. They really improve when they have a goal. They also enjoy interacting with their family much more now. They take the exam early at 12. Maybe this would be a good goal for the Norwegian -- a IGCSE or at least the guidelines. I also think study materials could be obtained. My friend doesn't use them but I think I saw something on line.

 

I picked German too. You know it.

[Medieval Mom]

A friend who is Dutch has made sure all of her children are able to do GCSE level Dutch. We live in the UK so they actually take the exam through their school. They know very little before the exam process starts even though their parents speak it constantly at home. They really improve when they have a goal. They also enjoy interacting with their family much more now. They take the exam early at 12. Maybe this would be a good goal for the Norwegian -- a IGCSE or at least the guidelines. I also think study materials could be obtained. My friend doesn't use them but I think I saw something on line.

 

I picked German too. You know it.

 

 

Thanks for mentioning the IGCSE. I hadn't heard of it before. Unfortunately, they don't offer Norwegian (but do offer German and French, of course).

 

The resources lists for these languages could be very helpful for anyone learning these language-- Just a note out there to those who are looking for help finding language learning materials.

 

Thanks so much!

[Medieval Mom]

However, many people regret not knowing their family's heritage language or being able to speak to relatives, and knowing any second language helps learn other, more relevant ones later.

 

I say this as someone whose children's other language is also not particularly "useful." I still think it's important for them personally.

 

Thanks for this perspective, Stripe.

 

I do try to keep this in mind, especially as, according to Norway, they are also Norwegian citizens. They *could* legally move to Norway at some point (not that we plan on it).

 

As for having the dc spend time in Norway-- Yes! That would certainly be ideal. Then, we'd have to choose between the two official Norwegian languages (Bokmål or Nynorsk) to determine which relatives to visit. ;)

 

That's another "strike", actually, as I see it, in studying Norwegian. It's SO fluid that picking up a Norwegian book from 100 years ago is like reading Danish. Sure, English, French, German, and all living languages change over time, but Norwegian changes FAST! Even in the last 10 years or so, many of the standard Norwegian words have been displaced by "Norwegianized" English words.

 

Oh dear.

Edited April 10, 2012 by Medieval Mom

[NatYoung17]

I have to agree with the op about learning your heritage language. I think it's important that the kids are able to communicate with family abroad.

I'm half Serbian and half German, was born and raised in Germany and have lived here in the US for 14 years. I did start out teaching my kids some serbian and my dd (7) can talk to my Mom and other relatives, although I didn't do very well keeping it up.. :-( (I, too, think in English and since Serbian was my 2nd language, I had a hard time remembering to speak it with the kids).

I just started teaching them German and so far they are really enjoying it.

You might check the bilingual message board for some advice and check out this site for resources: http://www.multilingualliving.com/2012/02/27/language-challenge-180-language-pages/

Good luck & have fun!

[Medieval Mom]

I agree that any of the languages would be a good choice. I don't find it too impossible to do more than one either if you all don't mind the extra time it will take. We are attempting to learn several concurrently and are making slow and steady progress. We make the most progress when we cover the languages every school day for a short period of time in each language (15-20 min) than when we spent longer (30-40 min) with alternating days.

 

Are you familiar with the languages you are teaching, or learning alongside your dc?

 

MM -- Wishing she had studied French before now.... Sigh! But hopeful she can still learn it someday :)

[Embassy]

Are you familiar with the languages you are teaching, or learning alongside your dc?

 

 

 

I'm learning along with them and had no previous experience with the languages when we started learning them. I did take classes and have some exposure with other languages, but not the ones we are currently learning.

[Medieval Mom]

I'm learning along with them and had no previous experience with the languages when we started learning them. I did take classes and have some exposure with other languages, but not the ones we are currently learning.

 

Ah! Thank you! So there's hope!!!! :) :) :)

[SuperDad]

I think you could make a good case for any of the three. Usually I'd vote for French out of this group, since it's an international language, but having native speakers available for Norwegian is a big plus- as long as your husband or his family are willing and able to work with your kids. That might be hard to count on, especially since your husband is working and Norway's time zone is different. And it does make a difference that there are much better resources for French and German. It can be frustrating to teach a language that doesn't have much help out there.

:iagree: I also like what regentrude and Wehomeschool said, but my multiquote is not working right now.

 

I'd say, start a focused German study now. You can help teach it and there's plenty of resources out there for it. In the meantime, informally introduce Norwegian by having your husband speak it to your kids. Hunt down some resources and casually introduce those, too. Once German is strongly rooted, up the intensity in the Norwegian study. Then, somewhere in the "middle school" age, start French. In high school, the student may choose which language(s) to continue to an advanced level.

[Medieval Mom]

Thanks, everyone, for your thoughts. Dh and I are still thinking it over, but it really helps to get various perspectives on this.