AO users, help please

[faiths13]

I am very interested in using Ambleside Online, but I am pretty confused about where to place my two oldest sons. They are 13 & 11. We just started this year with CM style curric, so narration and dictation, etc. and this is their first time reading older (17th/18th Century) books. They are both good readers though.

 

Last school year we did Ancients because I was given the first SOTW. So this year we started with K12 and my oldest continued with Middle Ages and my 11 yr old started on Early Modern. Then we left K12 and I had them both do Middle Ages.

 

So I was thinking I would stick with the same history schedule, but Im not sure I can do that with AO. Im not sure if my oldest can do Year 7 or not. I cant look at most of the books for that year right away to get a feel for them. And Im not sure if I do AO if I should have them both stay with Middle Ages because that would bring my 11 yr old up to Year 7. So I am really confused! Can someone please help?

[KS_]

I definitely wouldn't put them both up in Year 7. My dc are close in age to yours, and we are doing a combined Year 5. My 13 yo could be in a higher year, but since dd was always listening in, I ended up combining them. If you want to keep them in the same history period, you could look through the books in the lower years and rework the history rotation and keep the other books.

[faiths13]

The only lower year for middle ages is year two...

[SuperDad]

Hmm. I wouldn't worry too much about keeping them plugging along chronologically in history; it's better to place them according to ability IMHO. A combined Year 5 could work, especially given their ages and stages... but it might be too much for your 11 y/o. Is it at all feasible for you to a) rework the book selections and do some major tweaking, and/or b) NOT have the kids combined in one year?

 

Sorry, that's not very helpful... just some thoughts.

Edited March 6, 2012 by SuperDad

[Kfamily]

If you've already completed the middle ages , you could move to the Renaissance & Reformation. This would be Years 3 and 8. You could combine with a new spine (Renaissance & Reformation Times by Dorothy Mills) and pull books from both years.

If you want to follow AO perfectly, then you could start with Year 4 or 5.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Kfamily

[Homemama2]

you can always tweak AO, too. We use parts of AO, but I want to keep mine together right now for history and science to make it easier for me. So I find other CM friendly things for those. You can check out Simply Charlotte Mason's website and also Charlotte Mason Helps (a blog) for some ideas.

[faiths13]

No I dont have to combine years. But then what years would I put them in?

[SuperDad]

If you've already completed the middle ages , you could move to the Renaissance & Reformation. This would be Years 3 and 8. You could could combine with a new spine (Renaissance & Reformation Times by Dorothy Mills) and pull books from both years.

If you want to follow AO perfectly, then you could start with Year 4 or 5.

:iagree: But I wouldn't recommend placing a new-to-AO 13 y/o into Year 8 - even if s/he is an advanced student.

 

Maybe... place the 11 y/o in Year 3 and the 13 y/o in Year 5 (or roundabouts, based on ability), but have them both do the Year 3 history. Have them both read through the books on the Pre-Year 7 booklist that they missed.

[faiths13]

We havent completed middle ages yet. We just started really getting into it. My older son has done it for a little longer tho. I guess we could move ahead ... i am still in the process of figuring things out. we were following the traditional school year and then at the beginning of this year i decided to leave our charter and try a year round schedule. do you think i should keep them in the same year or separate? im just really confused. i asked on the yahoo groups yesterday and didnt get much response, but not to put them too low - I had mentioned I might start on Year 3 for both.

Edited March 7, 2012 by faiths13

[Amy Jo]

:iagree: But I wouldn't recommend placing a new-to-AO 13 y/o into Year 8 - even if s/he is an advanced student.

 

Maybe... place the 11 y/o in Year 3 and the 13 y/o in Year 5 (or roundabouts, based on ability), but have them both do the Year 3 history. Have them both read through the books on the Pre-Year 7 booklist that they missed.

 

That should work. Or you could have the younger do year 3 on Charlotte Mason Help, and the older year 5 on AO. That would have them in similar history periods I think.

 

For combining, check out Simply Charlotte Mason (one of their study guides) and Milestones Academy (history page).

 

ETA: If you are going to deviate from AO's plan, you might like Simply Charlotte Mason's "Planning Your Charlotte Mason Education".

[faiths13]

I guess the question is, what factors do i use to determine what they ability level is for the AO program? Is it just their reading level?

[Amy Jo]

I guess the question is, what factors do i use to determine what they ability level is for the AO program? Is it just their reading level?

 

I am not purely following AO, but I am basing my selections on their books and on HUFI (CM Help - which was based on AO long ago). My eldest is not an independent reader, he is improving, but still struggles with fluency. So I placed him more on comprehension level, using books from years 3 and 4. I read to him, and I'm trying to get him used to audio books. He loves and understands the books, and I don't want to short-change him.

 

I'd say reading and comprehension, unless you have a special situation. Make sure they are challenged. I recommend reading everything on CM Help - it really clarified things for me. Linda has a wonderful way of explaining things.

 

Have you thought of easing into it? Perhaps start with just a few books - a challenging one to read together, and another (less challenging) for the child to read alone. After a few weeks you'll know where they are.

 

You might check out the half year lists. (3.5 and pre-7). Then you'll know which books are vital.

[faiths13]

OK, a mom on the AO yahoo group says I should pick a book or two from each of the years I am considering, then work on having the kids read and narrate from them for a few days to see which works best. I guess I will try that.

[faiths13]

So Im looking at some of the books for Year 4 & 5 -is there really much of a stretch between the two years? My 11 year old I think is advanced in reading. At the beginning of the school year the charter tested him in reading and he was at 6.5 reading level. So Im not sure if it matters if I start him on Year 4 to start a little easy or just put him right into Year 5. I havent looked into Year 6 or 7 yet. My 13 year old is at age range for reading I believe.

 

ETA: We just finished The Hobbit last month. I asked them both how they found the level of reading. My oldest said it was challenging and my 11 year old said it was perfect for him. So what do you think?

Edited March 7, 2012 by faiths13

[raceNzanesmom]

So Im looking at some of the books for Year 4 & 5 -is there really much of a stretch between the two years? My 11 year old I think is advanced in reading. At the beginning of the school year the charter tested him in reading and he was at 6.5 reading level. So Im not sure if it matters if I start him on Year 4 to start a little easy or just put him right into Year 5. I havent looked into Year 6 or 7 yet. My 13 year old is at age range for reading I believe.

 

I'd place them where you think they'll succeed but still be challenged- and where you want them in history. I'm looking at 4 and 5 now. I think they're close enough in reading ability you can pick either and it'll be good.

 

I'd also look at where you want them in the future. We didn't start HSing or CM until my oldest was older. Some things we had to fly through so I could linger longer over other stuff.

[woolybear]

That should work. Or you could have the younger do year 3 on Charlotte Mason Help, and the older year 5 on AO. That would have them in similar history periods I think.

 

For combining, check out Simply Charlotte Mason (one of their study guides) and Milestones Academy (history page).

 

ETA: If you are going to deviate from AO's plan, you might like Simply Charlotte Mason's "Planning Your Charlotte Mason Education".

I was going to mention Milestones. Definitely check it out if you haven't yet. It is similar to AO, but combines in history and science. I really like her program.

[momto2blessings]

One thing I would consider is how much do you think the kids will be reading independently? By Y4, many AO moms have their kids doing much of their own reading. This could be a bit challenging sharing books, but doable...unless you're reading quite a bit aloud..then it wouldn't matter much.

 

I started straight AO, with kids in different years and didn't like us being split in history (my kids are 3 yrs. apart). We now use AO's lit. and free reads, and some other suggestions at the level best for each of them (different years). For history, I use Truthquest as my guide and plug in mostly SCM books as independent history readers so I can have them on the same cycle. I do use some AO history books as spines I read to both (my kids are 9 and 12). Hope that was helpful and not confusing:) Blessings, Gina

 

P.S. If you do happen to want to make a custom plan, SCM's "Planning Your CM Education" is a great resource to make sure all CM bases are covered. We live by their printable schedules.

[faiths13]

The Milestones Academy looks great too! My sons will be reading independently - they are both good readers. Now that I have looked at the MA I am even more confused! lol It makes me wonder which would be a better fit. I like the idea of combining them in subjects, but I also like the idea of them working independently and not having to share books.

[faiths13]

OK, I need help again. I had my oldest read a chapter from Our Island Story and he said it was too challenging. That book is used for Year 1 &2. Now what?

[Aurelia]

Our Island Story is meant for the parent to read to the child, and it is fairly challenging. Perhaps have him try one of the selections from Tales from Shakespeare or The Incredible Journey.

[Another Lynn]

Here's a thought for doing AO a little more loosely...

 

Let SOTW (or something like it) be your spine for history. Keep your children together. Keep working through Middle Ages with vol. 2. Add in some of the books from AO year 2 and 3 (as read alouds or read alone - whatever works). They will get the benefit of hearing the rich literature, even if you are reading it aloud and prepare them to read more of the works on their own. Don't sweat it if you don't do every single book in the list. If you're using SOTW you will move through history quicker than AO. If you need to choose a few "easier" books for them to read alone (from other reading lists, or from reading suggestions in the SOTW AG), that's fine. Just keep a couple AO read alouds going at the same time.

 

My 12yo read some of Year 7 books last year, but not all. And there was no way he was ready for Year 8 this year. There are a lot of things I like about AO, but a 6 year history cycle feels too slow to me. Also, it seems like AO spends very little time on Ancients and really slows down through time periods we don't enjoy as much.

 

I guess I'm saying, use it in whatever way works the best for you.

[faiths13]

i was going to use the history books from Year 2 for history, then use science and geography from year 5. but i dont know. i spent alot of time last night going over the years and books to figure out what i wanted to do, only to find out the history books are to hard. ugh. i cant do much for read alouds with them because my youngest two are very distracting. they have been doing all their reading independently.

[SuperDad]

Just thought it was important to add- AO Years do not correspond to grade levels. As a rule of thumb, you'll want to place your dc at least one Year below their actual grade level, even if he or she is advanced, accelerated, gifted, or all three.

[faiths13]

Just thought it was important to add- AO Years do not correspond to grade levels. As a rule of thumb, you'll want to place your dc at least one Year below their actual grade level, even if he or she is advanced, accelerated, gifted, or all three.

 

well Year 2 is way below both of their grade levels, lol

[momto2blessings]

I think AO's history readings are sometimes even more challenging than the literature. My 3rd grader would have a hard time reading AO's history on his own, but can do the literature just fine. I've looked at upper level AO history and it seems challenging for ME to understand...part of why I decided against AO history (and because I want us to study the same time period). That's why it's worked better for us to use something different for history, but still gain the depth of the lit. of AO:) Blessings, Gina

[MicheleinMN]

OK, I need help again. I had my oldest read a chapter from Our Island Story and he said it was too challenging. That book is used for Year 1 &2. Now what?

 

Too challenging in what way? Did he have trouble narrating or reading or both?

If you read aloud, does that help his ability to narrate?

[faiths13]

he said it was difficult to read. I didnt read it to him and he couldnt narrate back really, because he said there were too many words in it he didnt know, so he couldnt understand it. i dont think i will be able to read it to them. i need something they can read independently.

[MicheleinMN]

If he heard the words, would he know them? Librivox has An Island Story available for free, so if he could listen on his own would that make a difference? Also, I think Ambleside takes some time to get accustomed to the more difficult language, both vocabulary and sentence structure, so maybe it give it a chance before giving up on it entirely. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

HTH

[Amy Jo]

If it makes you feel better, Charlotte Mason Help (aka HUFI) moved Our Island Story to 4th and 5th grades. You might find some good middle ages reads there. We are reading Robin Hood (family) and Beowulf by H E Marshall (9yo). I just got Green's King Arthur to add to the mix for my oldest.

 

An audio book might be good - I've selected Our Island Story and one of Arabella Buckley's nature books for my eldest as audio books (free at librivox). Then I don't have to read everything.

 

In the end, you'll probably just have to take the plunge. The AO list always says it's better to start low and bump them up than the other way around.

[faiths13]

He says he understands books better when he reads himself, vs being read to. So I dont think the audio books are a good idea. If Our Island Story is a Year 2 book, I cant really start him any lower than that. He is not used to that kind of writing - he is used to reading easy things. I could try to have him just read through the chapters much slower, but I will probably be better of just picking another book for history. There is no point in having him read something for history that he feels is to hard to understand. I have SOTW 2, but I think its too easy. I was hoping to use AO to beef up our curric. I do like the suggestions for science, etc. I was going to use Year 5 for those. I will have to try one of those books to see how that works. I think another thing is his interest level. He said the book was boring. It may be because it was to difficult.

[AngelBee]

He says he understands books better when he reads himself, vs being read to. So I dont think the audio books are a good idea. If Our Island Story is a Year 2 book, I cant really start him any lower than that. He is not used to that kind of writing - he is used to reading easy things. I could try to have him just read through the chapters much slower, but I will probably be better of just picking another book for history. There is no point in having him read something for history that he feels is to hard to understand. I have SOTW 2, but I think its too easy. I was hoping to use AO to beef up our curric. I do like the suggestions for science, etc. I was going to use Year 5 for those. I will have to try one of those books to see how that works. I think another thing is his interest level. He said the book was boring. It may be because it was to difficult.

 

Have him try reading the book while listening to audio book. That may help.

 

Or do smaller chunks of reading followed by written or oral narration.