TOG OR What??

[5 Hikers]

I looked up all the threads I could find, but it is not quite what I want to know.

 

1. You still have to make your own lesson plans, is this more than a glorified reading list? It is so expensive I was just wondering what you actually get since you have to add in writing for $50, Maps for.....

 

2. How do you combine your kids, say 1st,3rd and 7th? I know the 1st and 3rd would use the same books, but does the 7th grader do everything alone?

 

3. Is the Free 3week Sample a good representitive of all the other units?

 

What else besides math and phonics would I need to buy for my kids? Does this cover everything else?

 

Thanks!

 

Also, on a side note: I haven't been able to find a good history fit. Sonlight books are too mature, WinterPromise was too disjointed, HOD was in between my kids actual levels (either too easy or too hard,) AO is too British, and I could go on. I do not want something secular, and I do not want 1 book we just read from. I would like a bunch of books so we can skip around some. I just really don't want to make up my own curriculum, but feeling I may have to. My favorite thing so far was Beautiful Feet EArly American.

 

Are the Queen history guides similar to BF?

[TXMary2]

IMO it is not a glorified reading list. It is literature analysis, vocabulary, geography, art and more. Yes, you have to do your "lesson plans" in the sense that you have to plan what to do on which day, but otherwise it is all there. The Map Aids is worth it in my opinion, but I suppose if you have Wonder Maps or Uncle Josh Outline maps you could probably get away without map aids. The geography assignments are in the unit plan.

 

The $50 for Writing Aids is totally worth it - it is 12 years of info/instruction and again the actual writing assignments are in the unit.

 

There are literature SAP's (student activity pages) that focus on comprehension, literary terms etc for the main literature selections.

 

It is so rich and full I can't wrap my head around it. Definitely not a glorified reading list. :)

 

Edited to add:

 

You combine kids on most of the read alouds and they are "on the same page" theme wise, but each level does have their own work. The bonus is it is all there in the unit.

 

The three week sample of Year two is very representative of most units. Year 1 I haven't done or seen, but I have heard from others that it is slightly different, but I don't know how.

Edited November 22, 2011 by TXMary2

[Lang Syne Boardie]

All I can say is download the three-week sample and test-drive it.

 

Map Aids are worth it, Writing Aids is worth it, and there will be several books to choose from for each level. You can do a better job of customizing book choices for each child this way.

 

I bought TOG yr 1 (rhetoric level) for my oldest son for his ninth grade year. At the end of the first unit, I switched my entire family to TOG. I have a student in each level: lower grammar, upper grammar, dialectic, and rhetoric. We are having our best year ever!

 

Between inter-library loan and my own shelf of books (WTM, AO, and Sonlight) I only have to buy two or three books per unit for all of my students in LG, UG, and D.

 

I do have to buy for the rhetoric level, because I didn't buy those levels for WTM, AO, or SL, and my library never has anything truly classical above jr. high level.

Edited November 22, 2011 by Tibbie Dunbar

[matilda]

I looked up all the threads I could find, but it is not quite what I want to know.

 

1. You still have to make your own lesson plans, is this more than a glorified reading list? It is so expensive I was just wondering what you actually get since you have to add in writing for $50, Maps for.....

 

2. How do you combine your kids, say 1st,3rd and 7th? I know the 1st and 3rd would use the same books, but does the 7th grader do everything alone?

 

3. Is the Free 3week Sample a good representitive of all the other units?

 

What else besides math and phonics would I need to buy for my kids? Does this cover everything else?

 

1. Everything you need is in the week plan - worksheets, discussion outlines, etc. But you will have to decide what you want to use and then present it.

2. My D student does all of her reading on her own, but we are all on the same subject. So any project that we do that she wants to join go right along with her reading. Also, since everyone studies the same thing, the read alouds cover everyone, and I only have to keep up on one subject at a time.

3. Yes. But I have only used Y2, so I can't speak for everything else.

 

TOG doesn't cover science or languages, so you would need to buy those also.

[Candid]

I agree that it is not a glorified reading list. It is well worth it the price for just the 7th grader. Yes, the older child would work on their own although if you wish to do projects I'd try to do something all of them could work on.

 

I suggest using SWB's A Plan for Teaching Writing instead of Writer's Aids which I did not find very helpful way to nebulous and it doesn't really teach a child how to write. Instead it delineates various writing projects. SWB's audio talks are $4 and are extremely helpful in teaching the path to writing.

 

The 3 week sample is very accurate and if anything later years than Year One are better so the longer you stay with TOG the better it will get. (And if you are looking ahead, I would wait and get the revised Year One they are currently working on).

[Michelle My Bell]

Short Answers...

 

I looked up all the threads I could find, but it is not quite what I want to know.

 

1. You still have to make your own lesson plans, is this more than a glorified reading list? It is so expensive I was just wondering what you actually get since you have to add in writing for $50, Maps for..... No, it is much more!!

 

2. How do you combine your kids, say 1st,3rd and 7th? I know the 1st and 3rd would use the same books, but does the 7th grader do everything alone? Yep

 

3. Is the Free 3week Sample a good representitive of all the other units? Yes

 

What else besides math and phonics would I need to buy for my kids? Does this cover everything else? Language Arts, Math, Science, Foreign Language,

 

Thanks!

 

Also, on a side note: I haven't been able to find a good history fit. Sonlight books are too mature, WinterPromise was too disjointed, HOD was in between my kids actual levels (either too easy or too hard,) AO is too British, and I could go on. I do not want something secular, and I do not want 1 book we just read from. I would like a bunch of books so we can skip around some. I just really don't want to make up my own curriculum, but feeling I may have to. My favorite thing so far was Beautiful Feet EArly American.

 

Are the Queen history guides similar to BF?

[Virg]

:lurk5:

[walkermamaof4]

Our favorite year ever was with BF Early American; so if you find something else that works, will you let me know? We are using MFW this year. Have you tried it?

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I've been trying to maximize the combining aspect.

 

Each week I give lectures (based on the Teacher's Notes, so mostly World Book information) complete with photos, video clips, timeline dates, and outlining on the chalkboard. The boys all seem to enjoy it. I spread it out over the week so we have time for this each day.

 

Then, it seems each boy wants to bring something to the conversation. I enjoy watching them teach each other!

 

On Wednesday, we do Geography. Again, we get out maps, atlases, internet links, and make the most of it all together.

 

On Thursdays and Fridays, the younger boys do crafts and activities. Sometimes the 7th and 9th graders want to join, and other times they are content to sit with us while they craft and they work on their lessons.

 

Each boy gets a weekly assignment sheet for independent work.

 

Rhetoric and dialectic discussions are on Fridays. The younger ones do coloring pages (or finish crafts) and listen.

 

Edited to add: After several weeks of this system, I've decided to add Year 1-specific memory work. We'll have recitations and read-alouds on Thursdays.

Edited November 22, 2011 by Tibbie Dunbar

[cjgrubbs]

I love the idea of TOG but have never actually seen it other than the samples. I decided if I did use it I would wait until my kids were older and I was more experienced in homeschooling. (this is only my 2nd year). My oldest is 6th grade this year but the co-op we do is now doing Diana Waring history for the olders. (Apolgia for the olders). We like the co-op for the social aspects and really don't want to give it up. I can't see having my son do TOG and Diana Waring history at the same time.

 

And we love MOH and that would be hard to give up! Just wishing Linda would write an American History curriculum!

[5 Hikers]

Our favorite year ever was with BF Early American; so if you find something else that works, will you let me know? We are using MFW this year. Have you tried it?

 

 

My favorite year was BF Early American too. I did that with my oldest for 2nd grade. I was thinking about just going back to BF for next year.

I did try MFW RtoR and ECC. I just thought the book choices were too much for my younger kids. I would love to combine if possible.

[delaney]

I've been trying to maximize the combining aspect.

 

Each week I give lectures (based on the Teacher's Notes, so mostly World Book information) complete with photos, video clips, timeline dates, and outlining on the chalkboard. The boys all seem to enjoy it. I spread it out over the week so we have time for this each day.

 

Then, it seems each boy wants to bring something to the conversation. I enjoy watching them teach each other!

 

On Wednesday, we do Geography. Again, we get out maps, atlases, internet links, and make the most of it all together.

 

On Thursdays and Fridays, the younger boys do crafts and activities. Sometimes the 7th and 9th graders want to join, and other times they are content to sit with us while they craft and they work on their lessons.

 

Each boy gets a weekly assignment sheet for independent work.

 

Rhetoric and dialectic discussions are on Fridays. The younger ones do coloring pages (or finish crafts) and listen.

 

Edited to add: After several weeks of this system, I've decided to add Year 1-specific memory work. We'll have recitations and read-alouds on Thursdays.

I love the lecture idea! My former PS daughter is much more comfortable with being "delivered" the info.

 

On a side note I have been trying bits of this and that this year and was convinced that CM was my savior...however it will not work with oldest DD. She is not comfortable with narration. I am using WWE with her to help this process. We are also using Phonics Road, Horizons math, and Mr Qs science. I also did not really care for the writing in TOG all that much. I will be turning back to TOG year 2 units 3 & 4. I hate to have all this extra stuff that I am not going to use but I can see now that TOG was getting it done and done well. The dialectic level discussion is really great too!

[5 Hikers]

All I can say is download the three-week sample and test-drive it.

 

Map Aids are worth it, Writing Aids is worth it, and there will be several books to choose from for each level. You can do a better job of customizing book choices for each child this way.

 

I bought TOG yr 1 (rhetoric level) for my oldest son for his ninth grade year. At the end of the first unit, I switched my entire family to TOG. I have a student in each level: lower grammar, upper grammar, dialectic, and rhetoric. We are having our best year ever!

 

Between inter-library loan and my own shelf of books (WTM, AO, and Sonlight) I only have to buy two or three books per unit for all of my students in LG, UG, and D.

 

I do have to buy for the rhetoric level, because I didn't buy those levels for WTM, AO, or SL, and my library never has anything truly classical above jr. high level.

 

 

Thank you, and for more info too! I printed out the 3 week sample for Egypt. I do own the majority of the books and was able to request the others. I would have to buy Old Testament Days and Streams of Civilization.

I plan to start it next Monday if the library gets those books to me soon.

 

Someone mentioned a sample for the other years. I wasn't able to find that. I would love to look at another year too.

[5 Hikers]

I've been trying to maximize the combining aspect.

 

Each week I give lectures (based on the Teacher's Notes, so mostly World Book information) complete with photos, video clips, timeline dates, and outlining on the chalkboard. The boys all seem to enjoy it. I spread it out over the week so we have time for this each day.

 

Then, it seems each boy wants to bring something to the conversation. I enjoy watching them teach each other!

 

On Wednesday, we do Geography. Again, we get out maps, atlases, internet links, and make the most of it all together.

 

On Thursdays and Fridays, the younger boys do crafts and activities. Sometimes the 7th and 9th graders want to join, and other times they are content to sit with us while they craft and they work on their lessons.

 

Each boy gets a weekly assignment sheet for independent work.

 

Rhetoric and dialectic discussions are on Fridays. The younger ones do coloring pages (or finish crafts) and listen.

 

Edited to add: After several weeks of this system, I've decided to add Year 1-specific memory work. We'll have recitations and read-alouds on Thursdays.

 

Thank you for this schedule! This is what I want our homeschool to look like too!

[Hedgehogs4]

I agree that it is not a glorified reading list. It is well worth it the price for just the 7th grader. Yes, the older child would work on their own although if you wish to do projects I'd try to do something all of them could work on.

 

I suggest using SWB's A Plan for Teaching Writing instead of Writer's Aids which I did not find very helpful way to nebulous and it doesn't really teach a child how to write. Instead it delineates various writing projects. SWB's audio talks are $4 and are extremely helpful in teaching the path to writing.

 

The 3 week sample is very accurate and if anything later years than Year One are better so the longer you stay with TOG the better it will get. (And if you are looking ahead, I would wait and get the revised Year One they are currently working on).

 

I absolutely agree about the writing aids. Most of the moms in our TOG co-op are using WWE or WWS after trying Writing Aids from TOG.

 

The great thing about TOG is its flexibility. I love that I can choose from so many resources, as well as have everything there at my fingertips for the information I need to know how to guide the students in the discussion. At the moment I am reading along with the kids, but there are weeks when I can't get it all done. The Teacher's notes included in each week's lesson plans are so thorough, it is a great way to springboard your own self-education.

 

My son, is Upper Grammar (UG) agewise, but is so enjoying the curriculum and the things we're studying, that he has asked to do the Dialectic work. To my surprise, in the last two weeks he has done all of the UG work and all of the D work, as well. It has not been too hard for him but I would say it has been just right for him. He is also able to participate in the Dialectic discussions with good mature comments. Okay, so it looks like it is time to move him up. :001_smile: I have all the resources at my fingertips--I don't need to go hunting for a more aggressive curriculum or reading lists at the library. I just go to the next level's assignments and pick and choose what I think I want to include in his reading, which right now is everything, apparently. :001_huh: I think in January I will drop UG altogether and move him into dialectic.

[Georgiana Daniels]

MUCH more than a glorified reading list, IMO. I get so much from the teachers notes--things I won't even be going over with my kidlets until the next time around, or maybe the time after that. The self education aspect is huge for me. For example, this week I'm brushing up on literary analysis. Will my kids learn this? Not now, that's for sure, but it's useful knowledge and helps me in myriad ways.

 

Between maps, reading, questions/discussion, and lapbooks (yes, we definitely get those!) we keep our little hands busy and we're always learning cool new facts.

 

We love ToG, and are looking forward to using it for years to come!

[serendipitous journey]

Someone mentioned a sample for the other years. I wasn't able to find that. I would love to look at another year too.

Here's year 2; I think these are the only two years with samples available right now.

 

Here are schedules for the first three weeks of Year 1. TOG doesn't include schedules, so you can't purchase them for the whole year, these are meant to give you a feel for scheduling Tapestry. They might make your test drive easier :).

[Renaissance Mom]

I just want to chime in on Writing Aids ... as a pp mentioned, it does give specific instructions on how to complete a huge range of writing projects for K-12. That in itself, is a wonderful resource. However, as another pp said, it is not the best thing out there to teach HOW to write in general.

 

I do several years of another writing instruction program with each child to teach them the fundamentals. But there comes a point when it is more important to apply those skills to writing across all subjects instead of treating composition as a subject unto itself. That's where the TOG writing assignments and WA absolutely shine!

 

We take the basic skills we've learned and apply them to the history we study in a myriad of ways. I will pull in a more systematic "how-to" writing program the first time we tackle a new type of project (how to write a lit analysis paper or how to really break down the essential elements of an essay). But we always go back to the TOG assignments and WA to get consistent practice and continued challenge.

[JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst]

Thanks for the links to the schedules-I don't think I ever noticed it.

 

There is one point the OP brings up that hasn't been addressed.

 

She didn't like the book selections from Sonlight because they were too mature. I find that there is a large overlap of books between Sonlight and TOG. Not 100% but there are many titles that are the same.

 

May I recommend that the OP take a look at the selections for TOG either at the Bookshelf (which is easily linked on TOGs website) for the primary selections. For a list of both primary and secondary texts try this link

 

http://www.lampstandbookshelf.com/ZC/index.php?main_page=resources&zenid=73223697ea634c9c564c4301fdddbe97

 

I'm not sure what you mean by mature or for which age group so perhaps seeing a book list will help.

 

ETA: One history program not mentioned by the OP is Biblioplan. It is also based on a 4 year cycle and can be used with a variety of ages at one time. They now have lots of supplementary materials, too.

Edited November 23, 2011 by JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst

[shanvan]

Popping in on this thread to stick up for Writing Aids. I think Writing Aids can work very well if the parent is a good writer (or has a child who is an intuitive writer) and likes the idea of working through various assignments giving guidance as suggested in WA. I also wonder how many people are utilizing the cd component of Writing Aids which includes teaching points to discuss and rubrics and guidance for grading. If you just look at the book for direction you are missing a lot. Our family uses and enjoys the Tog Writing assignments along with WA guidance. I find it gives a nice balance of requirements without bogging down assignments with elaborate writing formulas. Of course it won't be a good fit for every family. Just thought I'd mention that it does work for some.

[Kathryn]

I keep looking at TOG but am still so confused. One big question I have is about the activity sheets. When you look at the online 3 week sample, they are in there, but if you are "shopping" you are asked if you want them and for which level. It doesn't mention that they are already in there and you'd be getting additional ones. So, are student sheets included, or are they extra?

 

The other big question I have is what kind of credits this would produce for high school at the rhetoric level?

 

My boys are 4 years apart and we're thinking about TTC next year, which would give us two four-year age spreads. Something like Tapestry of Grace sounds like it would work well when both (or all) are in formal schooling, but I'm still confused!

[shanvan]

I keep looking at TOG but am still so confused. One big question I have is about the activity sheets. When you look at the online 3 week sample, they are in there, but if you are "shopping" you are asked if you want them and for which level. It doesn't mention that they are already in there and you'd be getting additional ones. So, are student sheets included, or are they extra?

 

They are included on the loom (which is the cd that comes with the print version). You can print them off the Loom, or if you have DE then you'd print them from there. Some people make up workbooks and like to just order a set of SAPs to save themselves the trouble of printing.

 

The other big question I have is what kind of credits this would produce for high school at the rhetoric level?

 

Scroll down on the page linked below and credits for each year plan are described for you. Click on the year you'd like to view.

 

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/loom/year-all/drhelps.php

 

 

My boys are 4 years apart and we're thinking about TTC next year, which would give us two four-year age spreads. Something like Tapestry of Grace sounds like it would work well when both (or all) are in formal schooling, but I'm still confused!

 

Hope this helps. Wish I had time to give more info, but I have to make Cranberry sauce!

[Janice in NJ]

Many of your questions will be answered. :001_smile: If not, you'll still get a strong sense of the program.

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey