S/O How can we help our kids be ready for earlier marriage?

[justamouse]

I think there's much to be said for this. The bolded was our experience, as well. My DH and I met at 18, moved in together at 19, got engaged a few months later, and married right after college. For all intents and purposes, we lived as if we had an "early marriage," in that from 19 on we lived together in a committed monogamous relationship that we intended to be lifelong.

 

We've had some really, really rough times. We had a lot of growing up to do. But, we did it together. The person I am is so shaped by the person my DH is, and the same for him. And despite having had some really rough times, we have something now that I'm not sure we'd have had if we'd met in our late 20s. We are both so connected to each other on this really fundamental level of having been, literally, the most formative influence on each other's development as an adult that not being together has never really seemed like an option. It would be like cutting ourselves in half, you know? My DH has determined so much of who I am, and I've determined so much of who he is, despite the fact that we're really, really different people (and in some ways more different today that we were when we met). I wouldn't want to give that up.

 

I also wanted to say that I think there are some benefits to being married in college. While we weren't married, we were engaged and living together for our last three years of college; we lived like old married people. ;) And, it was good. I think we both were able to focus more on our studies than our friends who were single, because most of them weren't happily single--they wanted a partner, they were looking for a partner, and there was a lot of partying and hooking up and stuff that took a lot of time away from school. Having the security of having somebody to come home to every day made a lot of aspects of college easier for me, and made it easier to focus on academics. I totally agree that having children in college would make it much harder to finish, and if my children did marry before they finished college and intended to graduate, I'd encourage them to wait to have kids. It's certainly doable to finish college with kids, but it is harder. But I think college while married, assuming you still have the financial support you'd have from your parents otherwise, is easier than college single. It's really only harder, I think, if your parents were paying for it or intending to pay for it and then cut you off and you then have to figure out how to pay for it on your own.

 

I also wanted to say that I'm a feminist. I may in fact be an official one, because I have an undergraduate degree and a master's certificate in women's studies. I still think that, on the whole, early marriage (and by early I mean late teens/early 20s) is a good idea. I think that changing things so that earlier marriage is more viable is a better idea that just pushing people to delay marriage longer and longer. I think respecting the fact that we are interdependent is preferable to promoting a false and unrealistic independence. I think that young people, including young women, should be treated as if they have agency and are capable of making important decisions.

 

I also think that we have some weird ideas about what growing up/maturing entails. We "find ourselves," I think, within close relationships with other people, ones where they depend on us and we depend on them, not by backpacking across Europe. Being married and having kids, for me, sure helped me to "find myself." Before that, I thought I was a patient, kind, and selfless person; I found out I was wrong! ;)

 

That said, while I do hope my children find their life partner when they are younger rather than older, just because I think there's much to be gained from that, I wouldn't push them to do so. But what I will be doing is supporting them no matter what choices they make regarding marriage, and I won't be encouraging them to delay marriage if they don't want to. If they meet the person they want to spend their life with at 18, like we did, we'll be happy to celebrate their wedding when they are 19, and continue to support them financially and materially and emotionally to whatever degree we'd been doing before and were able to. We're also willing to open our doors to our kids when they need us to, whether they are married or single. Our financial support and our willingness to have them live with us will not be contingent upon them remaining single. It's not, for us, about pressuring our kids to marry early, but supporting them if they decide to and doing what we can to make it a viable option for them.

 

I totally agree, with all of it, especially the bolded.

[Veritaserum]

You will miss something no matter what path you take in life. Young marriage? Old marriage? Adventures as a couple when young? When old? Stay at home mom? Working mom? Career when young? When old? Choose what is right for you. But, not one of us is special. It has been done. Someone has done it wrong, and someone has done it right. It has been wonderful for someone, and it has sucked for someone. It has been done a thousand times, a million times. But you can't have it all, certainly not all at once.

 

I have had amazing adventures. I made the right decision for me. It has nothing to do with anyone else.

 

:iagree: There are trade-offs. I'm glad I married when I did. I hope others are satisfied with whatever they chose for themselves.

 

Well, I think this is part of the disconnect. I married early (21), as did many others who have posted. I don't get the patriarchy vibe from any of the posts I read. Some of them even clearly stated they were atheists/non-religious, and although I'm a Christian, I am most definitely not in the patriarchy camp and never have been. I would have a tough time supporting my child marrying early for the reasons coming from the patriarchy movement too. That doesn't really seem to have come into this thread much if at all, though--I don't think I've read anyone posting that they want to prepare their girls to be good, submissive wives and to jump into prolific childbearing ASAP or that they're trying to make sure their sons are ready to take up the reigns as the sole-breadwinning (from his own entrepreneurial start-up) dictator of a home. We have talked about some religious reasons, but please don't lump us all in with patriarchy.

 

:iagree: Patriarchy disgusts me. My path in life was chosen by me, not by my father. If anything, he would have preferred me to wait. ;) But he recognized that my life is mine to live. I married at 19, two years after I had moved out of my parents' house. I got married, had a baby, finished my degree, and bought a house (in that order) by the time I was 21. :)

[Aelwydd]

That's true, but it's true at any age. Waiting to have kids until later doesn't automatically equal selflessness either--I've known plenty of older selfish parents as well.

 

Yes, I agree. I've known very selfish older parents. I just mentioned the younger aspect, because so many times I heard the argument that marrying young and having children = superior moral choice, becaue it's selfless. Whereas those of us who waited longer, were just doing so out of a selish desire to avoid the responsibilites of parenthood.

[twoforjoy]

Well, I think this is part of the disconnect. I married early (21), as did many others who have posted. I don't get the patriarchy vibe from any of the posts I read. Some of them even clearly stated they were atheists/non-religious, and although I'm a Christian, I am most definitely not in the patriarchy camp and never have been.

 

My DH and I were both non-religious when we met and married. We were raised Catholic, but neither of us practiced in college (or after). I was pretty actively (I mean, intellectually actively, not in the sense of like doing things about it) anti-Christianity at the time, and DH was and continues to be wholly uninterested in all things spiritual, including whether or not there's a God.

 

But our heathen selves wanted to marry. We put it off for a couple of years because my parents were dead-set against it and refused to support it. We most certainly weren't experiencing any family pressure to marry, but instead felt the opposite. Which is probably why we are so passionate about supporting our children fully if they decide to marry young.

[Stellalarella]

So what do suggest parents do when their 18 yr old dd announces she's getting married? I asking seriously - no snark. I was 25, dh 27 when we married - young enough. My parents were 29 - back in the 50's. We did not encourage young marriage at all. Yet my dd came home and announced she was getting married at 18 (they had known each other for 4 yrs). Short of hurting our relationship, in the end, it was her choice. I could either be there for her or boycott her wedding. So after many long talks, her dad and I were there for her. She's now been married 2 yrs., both she and her dh are attending college, they're happy and they're making it - so far. Now that's she's married, I'm there to help her all I can with encouragement and support. She does seem more mature for her age than many of her friends; this could be due to being homeschooled.

 

It's easy to say 'there's no way my kid is getting married before they're 24 or 25 or whatever' (I know, I use to say it). But if they do anyway, I don't know what else to do as a parent than to support them. We have a very, very good relationship, and I want to keep it that way.

 

:iagree: Thank you for sharing your experience.

 

I was a poophead at my sister's wedding (she was getting married at 19) and at the time I was quite unhappy about the man she chose. Years later I had to tell her I was wrong.

 

I wish I had not learned the hard way, both from how I've acted to others and from what I've experienced.

 

I appreciate hearing from posters about their experiences--many times I learn things I would not hear otherwise.

 

I thought I was plenty old enough when I got married at 22.

Now I know that I. was. not. old.

but I am still super glad I got married to my husband, and especially at that age.

[twoforjoy]

=

I was a poophead at my sister's wedding (she was getting married at 19) and at the time I was quite unhappy about the man she chose. Years later I had to tell her I was wrong.

 

I wish I had not learned the hard way, both from how I've acted to others and from what I've experienced.

 

I was not at all generous about my sister's marriage. It had nothing to do with her age; I just didn't like her DH-to-be, for reasons that were quite valid. But, it didn't matter. She was marrying him, and all I did by being a jerk about it was really damage my relationship with her.

 

They've been married for 8 years now, and her husband is a decent guy. I don't know if I was wrong about him or if he's changed, or both, but I do know that what I thought about him 8 years ago does not reflect who he is today. They're happy. I don't think, given some things that happened in their relationship early on (they started dating when they were both maybe 15 or so, and then had an on-again-off-again thing until they were about 20, then married at 23, and we heard all of the unflattering stuff about him during their off-again periods, which didn't cause anybody in the family to like him much), that any of us thought they'd make it past five years.

 

Anyway, whether he was a good husband for her or not, and whether it was going to last or not, was really irrelevant. She was going to marry him. And all I did by not being supportive was hurt our relationship. If things hadn't worked out, or he had been as much of a jerk as I'd thought he was, that wouldn't have mattered, because she wasn't listening at the time and later on she probably would have thought she'd get a "told you so" lecture from me.

 

Outside of truly dangerous situations, like physical abuse, I really think no good can come from opposing somebody's desire to marry. And even in an abuse situation, opposing the marriage is probably much less important than helping the person see the seriousness of the situation. It's not like if they didn't marry but stayed in the relationship things would be fine.

[caitlinsmom]

I was raised to be the brain child for the whole family. My family was not religious by any stretch of the imagination. I grew up wanting to go away to college, do charity work and eventually adopt an orphan by myself. My family expected great things of me.

 

Instead the moment I met my husband I knew I would marry him. I was 17 (married at 18) and as my dad said when my dh talked with him once "born older than most adults". My decision to marry young had no relation to my (now) religious beliefs. It had nothing to do with the way I was raised, my educational background, my dreams, etc. It had only to do with what my dh and I knew was totally right.

 

If my kids have the opprotunity to marry someone who challenges and accepts them, who loves and encourages them, then who am I to argue when that takes place (after legal age ofcourse).

 

I hope to encourage and teach my kids how to be decent human beings. How to compromise, love, respect, encourage, support, etc the most important people and relationships of their lives. If those come at 20 or 40 so be it. Marriage is hard work no matter the age or religious background. It takes two people at all times.

 

If they can walk away from our home knowing how to love and support others (and not in a creepy submissive way) then I can say we did a job well done.

 

PS And I agree with all the practical things like budgeting and what not.

[EthiopianFood]

This can happen the other way too though. I married young but we put off having kids and then when we decided to, I had problems getting pregnant. I often wonder what if we had decided not to wait. Maybe we would have had a whole house full of children. The chances of us having anymore children are pretty slim.

 

That would be part of being honest about the pros and cons. A lot of women today seem to be under the impression that they can wait until they are in their mid thirties to start having kids, and that it won't be an issue. That is not always the case, and women should feel that the benefits of being childless for so long will be worth it if they end up with no biological kids. Hind sight is 20/20, of course. :grouphug: We are talking about what we wish for our children, which always involves examining our own regrets or ruminations (which we all have in different areas, probably).

[EthiopianFood]

I'm honestly asking this, not trying to be snarky or rude...

Exactly what do people think they will miss if they get married young? I know a PP mentioned that a friend felt like she had missed things because she got married at 20. I'm just curious as to what would be missed.

Honestly asking. For reals. :) Thanks.

 

I'm not sure who this was directed at, but I did say something similar. The person I know has gotten to know herself more and she has aged (as we all do), and is realizing that, had she not settled down so soon, she could have had other experiences in her life that she now can't as a mother and wife. She has other skills and interests that she doesn't have the time or energy to pursue, things that she probably really would have enjoyed and benefited from. There is obviously a difference between being a single adult and a married adult. Once you make that step into marriage, you can't have that same freedom again. Even waiting a few years (e.g. marrying at 22 instead of 18) can give you time to have that, while still having the rest of your life to be married and have kids. Unless you get divorced, you can't do the reverse. You can't undo being a mother, either. My friend doesn't regret getting married or having kids! She just is now in a place where she is realizing how different her life might have been if she had had more time before she got married. She now looks forward to some of that once her kids are grown, but for ME, I'm glad I don't have this time in my life that I'm waiting for to finally have some freedom. I did that, and now can't imagine doing anything else with my life for quite some time other than what I'm doing. :001_smile:

[Aubrey]

First, what WE need to do as parents...I don't think is drastically different whether our dc marry at 18 or 28. They'll have an easier transition to adulthood--with OR without a spouse--if they've had some exposure ahead of time. Let them help balance the checkbook, pay bills, figure tax, interest, soc sec withholding, etc.

 

Shortcomings in these areas are probably going to be a) inevitable & b) similar to our own.

 

What are some specific ways we can help our kids be mature enough to marry around 18-22 if they meet the right person?

 

Some of my concerns are:

 

1. Daughters (and occasionally sons) who are not allowed to move out on their own may be very naive about how to choose an apartment or house, deal with faceless corporations like banks when something goes wrong, choose a decent landlord, avoid fake car repairs, etc.

 

Kids should have their own bank accts, I think, sometime before they move out. Why wouldn't they? Jobs, too. When they start driving, don't they start taking *some* care of their own car? Go along for repairs if not go alone?

 

What does the bolded mean? I moved out when I was 16, so I can see "allowed" in my case, but for most it's 18+, isn't it? I don't understand where "allow" comes into play for an adult.

 

I know it doesn't have to be this way, but our previous church was rather patriarchal and I think the young women seemed very naive. One man allowed his 21 year old daughter to move away to a Christian college and I think the elders were unhappy about it.

 

I REALLY don't understand allowing/not allowing a 21yo adult to do something! For the elders to have an opinion of that...well, that sounds scary, imo.

 

I know we all learn how to deal with situations like identity theft, etc through experience, but I'm concerned that kids that have never been allowed to move out until they marry may find it hard to learn to deal with life, marriage, living on your own, and a possible fast pregnency all at once

 

These experiences accrue. The not being allowed to move out thing is...unusual, I think. I'd say the 1st step in preparing kids for the maturity needed to marry early is avoiding environments like the church you're describing.

 

2. How can we help our kids develop their own "deal-breaker" list of what they absolutely don't want in a spouse? Again, my experience at our last church makes me think many of these kids won't have enough experience being friends with the opposite sex to figure out what traits would drive them crazy. The attitude of many of the parents seems to be that as long as a person is "godly," then not much else matters. I disagree. I know many men that I could never be happily married to. And likewise, I would drive then crazy. My husband and I, however, are a good fit, and traits that would drive other men insane don't bother him.

 

I don't know if that's the best way to approach marriage. I mean, I agree that there are good fits & bad ones, but I hesitate to tell someone to make a deal-breaker list about another person.

 

That said, I think we learn what traits will drive us crazy from our siblings. ;) But these things can be learned from the same gender--if you're a neatnik, you might think twice about marrying the slob. You will have had more experience w/ sloppy girls (if you're a girl) by the time you're an adult than you will have had w/ sloppy men, no matter what church you go to. The trick is not to let a good kiss distract you from that, right? ;)

 

Still, there's more to a person than their organization/kitchen hygeine. A slob has other strengths, & I think there's also maturity in recognizing that people can balance ea other. Imo, a good marriage is less about the individual characteristics of the 2 people involved than the results of those 2 sets & personalities coming together. The whole is more than the sum of the parts & all that.

 

3. How can we help them choose a career and prepare for it? Earlier marriage can still allow people to finish college, but once kids come, I think it becomes much, much harder for the wife to make sure she has some skills to fall back on in case she ever needs to get a job. Let's face it, if employees are getting passed over after being out of work for six months, what chance do I have (as a degree holder that never had a career

 

Choosing a career--for girls, I think it's awesome if they can think about the possibility of wanting to stay home w/ kids & the possibility of needing/wanting to work & seeing if there's any way to keep both of those options open. For boys, I think it's great if they can consider the potential of their career to offer their spouse similar choices.

 

Early marriage CAN still allow people to finish college (dh & I did), but "once kids come" implies control over when kids come. I think talking about birth control & what we/they believe about that is important. It's awfully hard to go into marriage young with college ahead of you & THEN decide you don't believe in bc, for ex. That said, I finished my BA after #1 came along & my MA after #2. I wouldn't recommend that route, though.

 

As far as something to fall back on, I think that's harder period. That's why I got my teaching cert & MA. I finished my BA right after 9/11 & there were NO jobs. Esp for lit majors w/ experience teaching college. So I went back. I chose teaching for the SOLE reason that I'd [cue Scarlett O'Hara voice] "never. be. un. employed. again."

 

Now look at the economy. I can't even get an *interview.* Some districts won't even take an application. Nobody's hiring teachers!

 

Which, btw, is a terrible career choice for someone who *knows* they want to stay home w/ their dc & hs. You really can't ever do that job from home, except in the hs situation, where you're not getting paid. :lol: Where were you guys back then to TELL me that? (I know there are exceptions, online schools, etc, but those didn't exist when I made my choice, & their existence still hasn't helped me get a job now.)

 

If I had it to do over, I think I'd be a chiropractor. If I ever make another stab at going a different direction, I'm going to be a psychologist.

[Aubrey]

I'm not sure who this was directed at, but I did say something similar. The person I know has gotten to know herself more and she has aged (as we all do), and is realizing that, had she not settled down so soon, she could have had other experiences in her life that she now can't as a mother and wife. She has other skills and interests that she doesn't have the time or energy to pursue, things that she probably really would have enjoyed and benefited from. There is obviously a difference between being a single adult and a married adult. Once you make that step into marriage, you can't have that same freedom again. Even waiting a few years (e.g. marrying at 22 instead of 18) can give you time to have that, while still having the rest of your life to be married and have kids. Unless you get divorced, you can't do the reverse. You can't undo being a mother, either. My friend doesn't regret getting married or having kids! She just is now in a place where she is realizing how different her life might have been if she had had more time before she got married. She now looks forward to some of that once her kids are grown, but for ME, I'm glad I don't have this time in my life that I'm waiting for to finally have some freedom. I did that, and now can't imagine doing anything else with my life for quite some time other than what I'm doing. :001_smile:

 

I got married at 19 & had my first baby at 21. Obviously, I'm not a poster child for success, & there were times during the first year or two that...well, I think those first years are hard no matter what!

 

I thought about the things I might have missed out on, & I realized I wouldn't want to do them w/out dh. I'd rather wait 20-30 years to do them w/ him when I'm older than do them w/out him when I'm young.

 

I realized that a lot of those things...I'd rather share w/ my dc than wait to meet my dc.

 

I realized that a lot of those things...I never would have done anyway. I probably would have done something similar to what everyone I've ever known has done: given up on my dreams, got an office job, worked. The courage I've got to keep dreaming *now* comes directly from dh.

 

In the end...I don't regret getting married when I did. I think the growth that has come from marriage & child-raising were just what I needed for where I was. The interests that I have less time to pursue? I pursue them *more* because they're dearer--they're the ones that remain in the face of the passion I have for my family. And all that time I had when I was single...tended to slip away. Sometimes in being lonely, sometimes in going out with friends. Now, it's much easier to be content to be at home & do my things.

 

I don't know if I care when my kids get married, although...well, I would encourage them to wait longer than dh & I did. But I want them to be prepared for marriage & family when the time is right. I want them to know *concretely* what's important & what's not, what's worth waiting for & what will never come.

 

Ds wants to be an engineer. He's wanted that for years, but in the last year or so, he's begun talking about it in terms of family. He knows he needs a master's degree before he gets married. He knows enough to know that engineering is a solid career that will give his future wife a choice about hs'ing & staying home w/ kids. He wants to make enough $ that they can be open to having as many kids as God wants them to have.

 

Now, he's young & adamant & b&w about things, just like I was at his age. :lol: I figure he'll mellow, BUT his plans at this point are solid enough imo that...well, he's not planning to get rich as a punk rock singer & then raise a family of 6.5 daughters. Kwim? His plans are concrete, realistic, & based on a reasonable morality. Sounds good to me.

[Mama Geek]

I got married at 19 & had my first baby at 21. Obviously, I'm not a poster child for success, & there were times during the first year or two that...well, I think those first years are hard no matter what!

 

I thought about the things I might have missed out on, & I realized I wouldn't want to do them w/out dh. I'd rather wait 20-30 years to do them w/ him when I'm older than do them w/out him when I'm young.

 

I realized that a lot of those things...I'd rather share w/ my dc than wait to meet my dc.

 

I realized that a lot of those things...I never would have done anyway. I probably would have done something similar to what everyone I've ever known has done: given up on my dreams, got an office job, worked. The courage I've got to keep dreaming *now* comes directly from dh.

 

In the end...I don't regret getting married when I did. I think the growth that has come from marriage & child-raising were just what I needed for where I was. The interests that I have less time to pursue? I pursue them *more* because they're dearer--they're the ones that remain in the face of the passion I have for my family. And all that time I had when I was single...tended to slip away. Sometimes in being lonely, sometimes in going out with friends. Now, it's much easier to be content to be at home & do my things.

 

I don't know if I care when my kids get married, although...well, I would encourage them to wait longer than dh & I did. But I want them to be prepared for marriage & family when the time is right. I want them to know *concretely* what's important & what's not, what's worth waiting for & what will never come.

 

Ds wants to be an engineer. He's wanted that for years, but in the last year or so, he's begun talking about it in terms of family. He knows he needs a master's degree before he gets married. He knows enough to know that engineering is a solid career that will give his future wife a choice about hs'ing & staying home w/ kids. He wants to make enough $ that they can be open to having as many kids as God wants them to have.

 

Now, he's young & adamant & b&w about things, just like I was at his age. :lol: I figure he'll mellow, BUT his plans at this point are solid enough imo that...well, he's not planning to get rich as a punk rock singer & then raise a family of 6.5 daughters. Kwim? His plans are concrete, realistic, & based on a reasonable morality. Sounds good to me.

 

Tell your son that engineers make the best dh's:D

[Mama Geek]

I'm not sure who this was directed at, but I did say something similar. The person I know has gotten to know herself more and she has aged (as we all do), and is realizing that, had she not settled down so soon, she could have had other experiences in her life that she now can't as a mother and wife. She has other skills and interests that she doesn't have the time or energy to pursue, things that she probably really would have enjoyed and benefited from. There is obviously a difference between being a single adult and a married adult. Once you make that step into marriage, you can't have that same freedom again. Even waiting a few years (e.g. marrying at 22 instead of 18) can give you time to have that, while still having the rest of your life to be married and have kids. Unless you get divorced, you can't do the reverse. You can't undo being a mother, either. My friend doesn't regret getting married or having kids! She just is now in a place where she is realizing how different her life might have been if she had had more time before she got married. She now looks forward to some of that once her kids are grown, but for ME, I'm glad I don't have this time in my life that I'm waiting for to finally have some freedom. I did that, and now can't imagine doing anything else with my life for quite some time other than what I'm doing. :001_smile:

 

All decisions have trade offs: whether you marry when you are younger or older, whether you go to college or not, whether you buy a home by going into debt or wait until you can pay cash, whether you take a low paying dream job or a higher paying job that isn't related to your dream job at all. There are trade offs and consequences to everything.

 

I don't regret getting married after just turning 20. My dh helps me to be a better person and has done so since the day we met. He has encouraged me to do things great things that I would never have considered doing on my own. We've traveled, we've sailed, we've gone whitewater rafting, we've camped and backpacked, we've have both had successful engineering careers. I wouldn't change it. I can't think of anything that I missed out on because of being married in college that would cause me to make a different decision had I to do it over. I have never met someone I would rather be spending my life with.

 

I guess it comes down to what do you value? What is important to you? Living the single life just wasn't important to me.

[Mama Geek]

That would be part of being honest about the pros and cons. A lot of women today seem to be under the impression that they can wait until they are in their mid thirties to start having kids, and that it won't be an issue. That is not always the case, and women should feel that the benefits of being childless for so long will be worth it if they end up with no biological kids. Hind sight is 20/20, of course. :grouphug: We are talking about what we wish for our children, which always involves examining our own regrets or ruminations (which we all have in different areas, probably).

 

We started trying in my mid to late 20's, and I know that I had stuff to learn and maybe that is why dd didn't come until I was in my mid 30's. I feel so blessed to have dd when I had given up on having children. We were literally a month or 2 away from sailing off into the sunset on our sailboat, when I found out I was pregnant. We are ok if more little ones don't come along. Dh and I are in a great position in life and we have so much that we can offer dd. We are still keeping the possibility of sailing off into the sunset open once dd is about 4 or 5 years old.

[Mrs Mungo]

I'm not sure who this was directed at, but I did say something similar. The person I know has gotten to know herself more and she has aged (as we all do), and is realizing that, had she not settled down so soon, she could have had other experiences in her life that she now can't as a mother and wife. She has other skills and interests that she doesn't have the time or energy to pursue, things that she probably really would have enjoyed and benefited from.

 

This is only true for the years that you have little kids. Unless you are the Duggars and have a kid for each of your childbearing years, your kids outgrow this stage and you are able to pursue your interests again to some degree. Moms who don't homeschool have even more opportunities. I know *lots* of moms now who have returned to school for degrees and are working in new fields (even many of those who had degrees before). Having kids young also means you can have a career after the kids are grown. I guess you might not be able to do that if you want until you are 40 to have kids. Like I said before, it is *always* a trade-off.

[twoforjoy]

This is only true for the years that you have little kids. Unless you are the Duggars and have a kid for each of your childbearing years, your kids outgrow this stage and you are able to pursue your interests again to some degree. Moms who don't homeschool have even more opportunities. I know *lots* of moms now who have returned to school for degrees and are working in new fields (even many of those who had degrees before). Having kids young also means you can have a career after the kids are grown. I guess you might not be able to do that if you want until you are 40 to have kids. Like I said before, it is *always* a trade-off.

 

Exactly.

 

I have a friend who got pregnant at 16, and she and her DD's father married when they were 18. Their DD is their only, which means that, when she turns 18, they'll only be 35. They'll be empty-nesters when I'm still dealing with diapers and tantrums.

 

That's not to say I'd recommend going off and getting pregnant at 16, just that there are always trade-offs. She missed out, no doubt, on a lot of stuff in her teens and early twenties that most of her peers got to do. But, she'll have the freedom and time in her late thirties and forties to do things that most of her peers won't have the opportunity to do.

 

I don't know, I don't think we should get too caught up in missed opportunities, because no matter what we choose, there will always be missed opportunities, and there will also always be new opportunities that arise. I think you can ruin your life by always asking "What if?" If you are going to be worried about what you might miss by getting married or having kids, then I don't think you'll ever do it, because there are things you'll miss. But there are also things you'll gain. It's just how any decision in life goes.

 

I'll say that, personally, it's hard for me to see what really productive, necessary experiences my children would have as unmarried people in their twenties that they couldn't have while married or even with kids. But, I don't put a particularly high premium on travel--it's not something I enjoy doing, and I think extensive travel is financially out of reach for most people--and other than that, it's honestly quite hard for me to see what you could absolutely not do. Then again, I'm not a person who thinks that once you marry or have kids, you've got to settle down and buy a house in the suburbs and start stressing about your financial portfolio and live the kind of conventional middle-class American life. I think there's plenty of room to have adventures and follow your passions when you are married and have kids, and some of the most interesting, close, and healthy families I know do just that.

[HS Mom in NC]

One of my favorite topics.

 

I got married at 20. My husband was 26 at the time. Compatibility issues were the kinds of things we discussed in depth between us since most premarital counseling is a joke. Interestingly, 12 years later, they were the same things our international adoption agency asked us to evaluate the stability of our marriage before agreeing to place a child with us. I compiled their questions and those topics we discussed prior to our engagement into a list of questions. It's here at my old website:

 

http://lisa.crews-family.org/wiki/index.php?title=Compatibility_Questions

 

Another very important aspect will be raising your children to put up with the annoyances of living counter-culture since the current cultural norms assume all young marriages are problematic. Young couples have to be responsible adults by 18 if they want to consider marriage- not the typical perpetual adolescent mindset that plagues American adults these days. A quick litmus test on adult thinking vs. childish thinking is: Children do what they want. Adults do what they should. Chronological age is not necessarily an indicator of maturity.

 

As someone with secondary infertility issues and international adoption experience, I will warn women that the biological clock is REAL. Take into consideration things that have limited time frames and things that do not have limited time frames. I've sat in fertility clinics and adoption agencies with women heartbroken over their decisions about how to spend their fertile years. They were very naive about how long their childbearing and adoption opportunities actually were.

[Kirch]

Another very important aspect will be raising your children to put up with the annoyances of living counter-culture since the current cultural norms assume all young marriages are problematic. Young couples have to be responsible adults by 18 if they want to consider marriage- not the typical perpetual adolescent mindset that plagues American adults these days. A quick litmus test on adult thinking vs. childish thinking is: Children do what they want. Adults do what they should. Chronological age is not necessarily an indicator of maturity.

 

 

Great post--very well put!

[AndyJoy]

I wonder what age people consider young for marriage? I usually think of 19 or under, but I guess others extend this? I was married at 21 and had 1 semester of college left; my dh was a few months shy of 20, but a college graduate. I think we were very well prepared for marriage. I attribute this to the fact that we were both encouraged to be hard workers, had a lot of responsibility as teens, and were used to contributing to a family, not focusing on ourselves. I didn't really consider us young because we were definitely adults in our maturity.

 

My parents encouraged me to interact with adults and solve my own problems as a teen. At 13, I made my own doctor's appointments, returned items to the store, ran into the store alone to pick up a few grocery items, called businesses for information like hours or availability of an item, etc. I filled out my own forms for things and then my mom checked them over.

 

They taught me to take care of household matters and made me responsible for things. I didn't do just my own laundry--I was expected to be a part of the family put in a load as necessary and dry, fold, and put it away as well. I made my own lunches and cooked dinner for the family quite regularly. I didn't feel put upon--it just made sense because my parents were working until 5 or later and I had the time and ability. During my jr./sr. years of hs, I did most of the family's grocery shopping because my parents were working and I had a free period during the day. I wanted to have more time with them in the evenings, so I took care of this while they were busy. I had the pin number to my mom's debit card and my name was on their checking account so I could write checks and make deposits for them.

 

I did not have a job other than babysitting until after my senior year because they wanted me to focus on doing well in school and playing sports. In my case, I don't think this was a bad thing. I still learned how to work in my family, by babysitting, and by volunteering a lot at my church.

 

I didn't have to pay for my gas/insurance because I was using it for the family's benefit, not to go off to do my own things. I did have a monthly allowance for clothes/toiletries which I could supplement w/my babysitting money if I wished. I spent my own money on gifts for friends & family.

 

I did not date at all until college because it was my personal conviction that I wasn't going to waste time hanging out and getting attached to someone I wouldn't marry. I thought I'd rather wait until I was ready to be married and then find someone who I could see myself marrying rather than get my heart broken a bunch of times along the way. My dh ended up being my 1st and only date. My sister thought I was crazy and doomed for failure because I didn't have enough experience. I told her I just had standards and knew how to be discerning and avoid dating the guys who weren't right for me. I knew what I was looking for, so when the right guy came along it was clear to me. I've been married 8 years; she is in her 3rd "long-term relationship" after two lousy ones.

 

I think my parents did a great job of teaching me how to be a responsible adult, and this prepared me for marriage. I don't think there is a magic formula, however. My parents taught my sister similarly, but she chaffed and balked at a lot of their attempts to teach her responsibility.

[AndyJoy]

Another very important aspect will be raising your children to put up with the annoyances of living counter-culture since the current cultural norms assume all young marriages are problematic. Young couples have to be responsible adults by 18 if they want to consider marriage- not the typical perpetual adolescent mindset that plagues American adults these days. A quick litmus test on adult thinking vs. childish thinking is: Children do what they want. Adults do what they should. Chronological age is not necessarily an indicator of maturity.

 

Excellently put. Dh and I joke that we were never teenagers. We didn't go through a rebellious, "no one understands me," "it's all about me," finding ourselves phase like many teens around us. We transitioned from childhood to adulthood without stereotypical teenage angst.

[FortWorthCookes]

DH and I got married at 22/21. What's worked for us?

 

• Getting our education out of the way EARLY. DH pushed through his MBA with two tiny kids in the house because we knew it would never get done otherwise.
  
• Living FAR away from our parents. You can't be rescued if there's no one there to rescue you! We solve our own problems and we cling to one another.
  
• Practice NFP - the divorce rate of NFP couples is about 2-4%. It requires a level of communication and trust that I haven't found anywhere else.
  
• Practicing a single faith together. Interfaith marriages can work for many people, but for us, sharing our faith alleviates so much stress.
  
• Getting married young. When you don't yet know who you are, it's nice to grow into that person with someone else at your side.
  
• We don't have a "deal-breaker" list. There are no "deal-breakers." We're in it together and we're in it for life. Unless he becomes a serial killer. At that point I may consider some alternative.
  
• We try to make every word we speak thoughtful, kind and forgiving. It's not hard to live with someone once you realize you couldn't liive without them.
  

At 28, I'm still young and probably naive, but I was raised with the tools to manage and manage well. Teaching children to manage money and a household long before you think they'll need the skills will prepare them far ahead of the curve.

[EthiopianFood]

The interests that I have less time to pursue? I pursue them *more* because they're dearer--they're the ones that remain in the face of the passion I have for my family. And all that time I had when I was single...tended to slip away. Sometimes in being lonely, sometimes in going out with friends. Now, it's much easier to be content to be at home & do my things.

 

This would be part of knowing yourself though, like I said. I have obviously stated my own opinion and bias, but truly, my point was that kids should have realistic views of early marriage versus waiting, and make an informed choice. Obviously a young marriage was right for YOU. I didn't have the experience you did. I had much more energy and freedom to do what I wanted when I was single, because I didn't have to worry how it affected a spouse. I went alone to India for two months, which I could never do now because dh has to work, and it would cost twice as much. I had the freedom to go out as I pleased, although this limitation now is related more to having children than to being married. I like the fact that we can both now say, "Now, it's much easier to be content to be at home." :001_smile: Whatever it takes for them to get there, that is what I wish for my kids.

 

I don't regret getting married after just turning 20. My dh helps me to be a better person and has done so since the day we met. He has encouraged me to do things great things that I would never have considered doing on my own. We've traveled, we've sailed, we've gone whitewater rafting, we've camped and backpacked, we've have both had successful engineering careers. I wouldn't change it. I can't think of anything that I missed out on because of being married in college that would cause me to make a different decision had I to do it over. I have never met someone I would rather be spending my life with.

 

We can't really do any of these things because we can't afford them. :001_smile: We don't even own our home, but our payments on our place are much more than what I paid for the room in a basement that I was able to rent when I was single. I'm not sure how typical your experience is though, considering that most people who take time to travel do it while they are college-age or thereabouts. Some do it when they retire, but again, that would depend on finances. Maybe you know a lot of people who do, though. Someone here mentioned that travel wasn't important to them, so it obviously depends on what you are interested in doing.

 

We started trying in my mid to late 20's, and I know that I had stuff to learn and maybe that is why dd didn't come until I was in my mid 30's. I feel so blessed to have dd when I had given up on having children. We were literally a month or 2 away from sailing off into the sunset on our sailboat, when I found out I was pregnant. We are ok if more little ones don't come along. Dh and I are in a great position in life and we have so much that we can offer dd. We are still keeping the possibility of sailing off into the sunset open once dd is about 4 or 5 years old.

 

:grouphug: Your dd was meant to be, clearly.

 

This is only true for the years that you have little kids. Unless you are the Duggars and have a kid for each of your childbearing years, your kids outgrow this stage and you are able to pursue your interests again to some degree. Moms who don't homeschool have even more opportunities. I know *lots* of moms now who have returned to school for degrees and are working in new fields (even many of those who had degrees before). Having kids young also means you can have a career after the kids are grown. I guess you might not be able to do that if you want until you are 40 to have kids. Like I said before, it is *always* a trade-off.

 

I guess I'm too antsy to want to wait until my kids are grown to do something I am passionate about. :lol: I agree with the rest of what you said, except for the fact that, when you have more kids, you have more expenses. You might have more time and energy when they are older (please, dear GOD, let that be true!), but it doesn't mean you will have the money to make travel, school, whatever happen. Again, as someone else pointed out, it depends on your interests. I am curious though, what do you feel is the trade-off of waiting until your mid 20s to marry, versus marrying at 18-20? I understand meeting the right person when you are young and just knowing you are meant to be together. Maybe I am assuming you won't "know" when you are that young, as I'm sure it would be hard to wait if you already know you've met the right person. Are there other benefits that you (or whoever here) see to marrying really young? I can see not regretting your choice, but I can't figure out any actual BENEFITS.

 

For whatever it's worth, as far as I'm concerned, WHENEVER you married, if you are lucky enough to STILL be happily married, then your story is a success, and you must have done something right! :D

[Aelwydd]

Well, this thread has kind of diverged into a chat on trade-offs of young vs. old. I agree that there are potential benefits and drawbacks to both.

 

But--the thread originally asked about how to encourage kids to be ready to marry young. And that's something I still don't really get. I don't see the benefit of actively encouraging my ds to marry at a young age. Yes, things can happen, and he may go that route. However, to encourage that choice? No, my dh and I don't feel that's the best approach.

 

Let me bring up one aspect of age that I don't think has been mentioned: age difference between couples.

 

I was married 2 months shy of 24 years old. However, my dh was 32 yo-- 9 1/2 years older than me.

 

If his parents had encouraged him to marry young, we'd have never met. Or, if we had, he'd already be taken. The alternative being if I married him at a very young age, and besides it being illegal, it would have stunted my growth in many ways.

[EthiopianFood]

I don't see the benefit of actively encouraging my ds to marry at a young age. Yes, things can happen, and he may go that route. However, to encourage that choice? No, my dh and I don't feel that's the best approach.

 

Yes, this. I think that is what I am reacting to more, not whether or not I think grown women did the right thing in marrying young.

 

I know I've contributed to this thread going OT, but just to add something that is actually relevant, I think it is beneficial for all children, whether they marry young or not, to be raised to be adults at 18-22, not just full grown children. I think the advice in this thread is probably useful no matter what your goal is regarding marriage.

[Kirch]

Well, this thread has kind of diverged into a chat on trade-offs of young vs. old. I agree that there are potential benefits and drawbacks to both.

 

But--the thread originally asked about how to encourage kids to be ready to marry young. And that's something I still don't really get. I don't see the benefit of actively encouraging my ds to marry at a young age. Yes, things can happen, and he may go that route. However, to encourage that choice? No, my dh and I don't feel that's the best approach.

 

That's not how I understood the OP--she was asking how to prepare kids so they're ready in case they DO meet the right person and want to get married early, not so much trying to encourage them TO marry early:

 

What are some specific ways we can help our kids be mature enough to marry around 18-22 if they meet the right person?

 

I can see it from your point of view too, especially given the context of the discussions. I guess it's a matter of interpretation.

 

I won't be *actively encouraging* my boys to marry early, but I won't be trying to instill the idea that it's better to wait, either. I don't think early marriage is the only way or even always the best way for everyone--but I want to make sure my child is ready if it's the right choice for him. We won't be encouraging early marriage in the sense of trying to push them to get married early even if they're not currently in a relationship (i.e., "FIND SOMEONE!") or if they're not interested. But if they are and they want to, I want to support them in that, encourage them in that (in the sense of helping through rough spots, giving advice, cheering them on, etc.), and make sure they're as ready as possible. In my thinking, the "encouraging" part comes in more after they make the decision and in not standing in the way of it.

 

 

Let me bring up one aspect of age that I don't think has been mentioned: age difference between couples.

 

I was married 2 months shy of 24 years old. However, my dh was 32 yo-- 9 1/2 years older than me.

 

If his parents had encouraged him to marry young, we'd have never met. Or, if we had, he'd already be taken. The alternative being if I married him at a very young age, and besides it being illegal, it would have stunted my growth in many ways.

 

:lol: Most definitely! :eek:

Edited October 3, 2011 by Kirch

[Mama Geek]

Well, this thread has kind of diverged into a chat on trade-offs of young vs. old. I agree that there are potential benefits and drawbacks to both.

 

But--the thread originally asked about how to encourage kids to be ready to marry young. And that's something I still don't really get. I don't see the benefit of actively encouraging my ds to marry at a young age. Yes, things can happen, and he may go that route. However, to encourage that choice? No, my dh and I don't feel that's the best approach.

 

It is coming from the belief for some Christians that sex outside of marriage is sinful. I don't think those of you who disagree with this belief should necessarily want the same for your kids.

 

Let me bring up one aspect of age that I don't think has been mentioned: age difference between couples.

 

I was married 2 months shy of 24 years old. However, my dh was 32 yo-- 9 1/2 years older than me.

 

If his parents had encouraged him to marry young, we'd have never met. Or, if we had, he'd already be taken. The alternative being if I married him at a very young age, and besides it being illegal, it would have stunted my growth in many ways.

 

I think the age difference is less important than having the same values (whatever they may be.)

[HS Mom in NC]

Benefits of Early Marriage

 

 

1. Optimal Childbearing Years

 

Since a woman's optimal childbearing years are in her 20s some women prefer to date only men ready for marriage when the women are in their late teens and very early 20s. It's not categorically true that young women do better in childbirth but it is generally true. This is not so much an issue for women who want 1-2 or maybe even 3 kids close together, but couples who want large families and don't want "stair-steps" sometimes choose earlier marriage so that the mother is done having babies by her early 30s.

 

2. Optimal Fertility

 

I cannot emphasize this enough. If you haven't had fertility issues you may be fairly clueless about the incredible time, money, and energy suck infertility can be. Even those of us with secondary fertility issues (fertility problems after live births) can be slammed hard with this.

 

Most fertility issues are discovered after a couple has tried conceiving. So, there's the amount of time/$ (ovulation monitoring) and energy they spend trying on their own, there there is the time/$/energy they spend investigating the problem, then there is the time/$/energy they spend considering options, then there's the time/$/energy they spend trying different options, then there's the time/$/energy spent on delivery (if treatment was successful) whether the pregnancy was normal or higher risk. It's very common for women with fertility issues to have higher risk pregnancies. All women become less fertile as they age. Someone with other non-age related fertility issues doesn't need any more factors contributing to her difficulty conceiving.

 

If fertility options are abandoned then adoption options come into play. Not everyone who adopts does it for infertility issues, but it's very common. It took us 12 years and tens of thousands of $s to get 3 kids. My husband aged out of our preferred adoption route by age 43 so we have fewer kids than we wanted. Good thing we started at 20 and 26.

 

Foster care- I've been certified as an adoptive parent in AZ. I interviewed foster parents and found that it can be another huge time suck. Most children in the foster cares system have not had their parent's right revoked. Based on the few successful people I talked to, it took more the 3 years of biting their nails and going through hell. For a parent to finally lose custody they have to do nothing the courts require. If they do comply even partially, that time frame extends and the foster parents live in constant fear the children they love will not stay with them.

 

Private adoption-Very difficult to get a newborn. If you already have bio kids it's even harder. There were agencies that told us not to bother trying because birthmothers choose childless couples over people with kids. Basically, if you're relying on private adoption, you have to know birthparents who want you or it's incredibly difficult. Less than 1% of unplanned pregnancies result in placement for adoption in the US.

 

International Adoption- Very expensive and they don't take credit cards. To do this one you need a few tens of thousands of dollars available. There are age limits. Ours rejects parents starting at age 43. Fast countries can get you a child in about a year. A few can get you an infant. The rest take longer and you must be open to taking a toddler or older. It depends on the country, but in general you should be married at least 3 years, have a normal body weight, and have never been on anti-depressants. You typically cannot have more than 4 children already in the home. Each country is different, but these are common requirements.

 

Different adoptees can have very different issues. A child with issues can require much larger spacing between the adopteee and the next sibling. Transitions for traumatized children can be far more demanding than than most typical biological children. The rates are higher and have to be factored in to family planning.

 

3. Avoiding the Sandwiched Generation

 

This is getting more common in families where 2 generations chose to wait until they were older. The Grandparent becomes more dependent on the adult child who often waits until later to have kids. Since most people have fewer children and it's common for siblings to live away from their parents, elderly people with mild-moderate elder care needs are more often moving near one sibling. If you have never helped care for an elder relative (I have. My mother is an only child and I have 3 brothers who are local) you may be surprised how much hands on care an elderly person needs. Doctor's visits, medication monitoring, diet, help in an out of vehicles, up steps, around the house, lifting things, etc. can take all day. It's hard to do that with kids in the house needing lots of hands on attention.

 

4. Multi-Generational Living

 

Those of us who married younger and started families younger have kids who often knew and had relationships with not only grandparents, but great-grandparents. My older kids personally knew and spent time regularly with 5 of their 8 great-grandparents. They were 15, 13, and 6 when the last two died this spring and summer. The older two have memories of the other 3.

 

5. Modest Living

 

Most women intentionally opting for early marriage plan to live on one income and take care of the kids themselves. There is no adjustment to a humbler lifestyle when the kids come along and if she plans to homeschool. Every financial decision is made based on the husband's single income. If it takes time for the couple to have kids, the wife's income can be saved for fertility treatments or adoption. Otherwise her income is saved for college, an IRA, etc. People who always live on one income have options when the kids are in school. Mom can work to pay private school tuition.

 

Since income levels are typically lower when parents are younger, the benefits of humble living through childhood kick in. Children learn that they can't have everything they want. They have to share bedrooms, wear hand-me-downs, limit activities, eat at home, not take expensive vacations, and experience delayed gratification when it comes to things that cost money. They are less likely to have entitlement mindsets because they experience being happy with less stuff. As they get older and parental income typically increases, they have a foundation of memories and experiences of happy humble living. They are more appreciative of the more expensive things when they do get them because of it. It's not impossible for children of parents with higher incomes to be grateful, but it's harder.

 

6. Living by Faith

 

For those with a faith that teaches abstinence outside of marriage, earlier marriage can be a way to fulfil religious teachings about sexuality. There are plenty of medical benefits to virgins marrying each other and being monogamous. Many faiths teach spiritual and emotional benefits to this too. The teachings about Christ's fidelity and commitment to The Church is supposed to be reflected in His believers through marriage. Some Christian denominations consider it a sacrament.

 

7. Avoiding Empty Nest Syndrome

 

Some women prefer to delay their careers until after optimal childbearing years, which keeps them available to travel, work, volunteer in unpaid ministries/ charities, take care of elderly dependents, etc. "Me Time" is usually not something people who prefer early marriage think should happen until the kids are living on their own or are more independent teenagers.

 

 

Early marriage is clearly not for everyone, and other people may have other reasons, but these are the ones that most impacted me and my family.

[EthiopianFood]

Benefits of Early Marriage

 

Thank you for sharing this. I feel I understand where you are coming from much better now. :001_smile:

[Aelwydd]

Benefits of Early Marriage

 

 

1. Optimal Childbearing Years

 

 

 

2. Optimal Fertility

 

 

 

 

3. Avoiding the Sandwiched Generation

 

 

 

4. Multi-Generational Living

 

 

 

5. Modest Living

 

 

 

6. Living by Faith

 

 

 

7. Avoiding Empty Nest Syndrome

 

 

 

 

Yeah, it's definitely an individual thing. For me, your list would factor in as follows:

 

1.) Gave birth at age 25 1/2, and the labor was "textbook perfect" according to the CNMs. Spent 4 hours in active labor before delivering. Had no drugs, no IV, and sat in the jacuzzi for most of it.

 

2.) Too many people in the world already. I wasn't interested in trying to add to the 6+ billion people on the planet. I was fine with living my life without having children, because there was enough to challenge and interest me besides having a passel of kids. I ended up having one child, and that's fine. No more, though. If I did have a burning desire to have several kids, I would seek to adopt kids orphaned and poor, and in need of a home.

 

3.) Because we only have one child, and my sister has only two (her dh is snipped, so they're done), and we have another sister who will possibly remain childless, the "sandwich" thing is not likely to be an issue with our family. Limiting the number of kids means more resources to support our parents, and to put in our own retirement, so as not to burden our children.

 

4.) Multigenerational living is something we've experienced as well, even having waited to the ripe old age of 25 to give birth. I have a picture somewhere of my great grandmother's 100th birthday. In the picture, are my great-grandma (who passed last year), my grandma, my father, myself, and my ds. My ds has a loving relationship with my grandma, who is his great grandma.

 

5.) Some of the greediest and most covetous people I know are from modest backgrounds. Also, living economically is hardly the purview of young marrieds, with multiple kids. My dh, myself, and our ds live in a rented 2 bedroom apartment, in a working class community. Our ds is indulged, but he is also appreciative of what he has, and is most generous in sharing and giving his things to less fortunate people.

 

I would also add the caution that, given the economic upheaval of today, what would be considered a livable, modest wage 10 years ago, would have many families actually living in cars, or depriving their kids of more than toys: food, health care, clothes, other necessities.

 

I really think that the whole argument of "Large families don't need all those extras, because they have learned to live without," is somewhat boastful, and a form of defensive pride. I don't think kids need all the toys and gadgets that have proliferated America today, but neither do I think going years without a single family vacation is a fantastic answer either.

 

Like St. Paul said, whether you live in want, or enjoy a very comfortable lifestyle, the key is contentedness, which really has nothing to do with your actual possessions. It's an outlook, and an attitude that is adopted. You cannot instill this acceptance--a child learns it from the way his or her parents relate to material things. My dh and I try to teach our ds to see money and things as a tool, and something that can bring enjoyment--but they can also bring stress and misery. What makes us happy is being together and sharing life together.

 

6.) There's plenty of negatives to virgins marrying as well. I won't go into them, but suffice to say, my first time was much better than it should have been, because my dh was not a virgin. I'm a christian, but I also believe that a lot of teachings and practices about sex are far more rooted in cultural ideals and practices from superstitious and backward societies, than they are derived from the divine. I'm tired of hearing that a woman's virginity is a "gift" for her husband.

 

Her sexuality is her own, and it is something she chooses to share; it should not be regarded as a commodity she must cede as part of a marital transaction.

 

7.) Empty nest syndrome is not exclusive to either young or old parents. Whether you have your kids young or wait, I think what most likely predisposes one to this syndrome is a style of parenting that makes parenting the end all and be all of one's energy, efforts, and goals.

 

If you have no further goal than to be a mom, that's great. But, at some point, parenting gives way to a new phase of life. I'd argue that those parents that continue to pursue other interests and goals on the side while their kids were growing up, are more likely to find purpose and to be productive after the last one has flown the coop.

 

The point to all this is, I don't think it's wise to encourage ds to marry young, struggling to eek out an existence for himself and a burgeoning family, and become an old man early. I don't require grand children from him (that's an unfair burden), and I am raising him to know that there are many ways to find fulfillment in life, besides early and ceaseless reproduction.

[Mrs Mungo]

If you have no further goal than to be a mom, that's great. But, at some point, parenting gives way to a new phase of life. I'd argue that those parents that continue to pursue other interests and goals on the side while their kids were growing up, are more likely to find purpose and to be productive after the last one has flown the coop.

 

I am confused, I thought the argument was that you cannot pursue such things as a parent due to lack of time and/or money. I do pursue outside goals and interests while being a mom, that was one of my points.

 

The point to all this is, I don't think it's wise to encourage ds to marry young, struggling to eek out an existence for himself and a burgeoning family, and become an old man early. I don't require grand children from him (that's an unfair burden), and I am raising him to know that there are many ways to find fulfillment in life, besides early and ceaseless reproduction.

 

You are arguing components of a lifestyle that does not necessarily go hand-in-hand with marrying before age 25. My dh is in the top 10% of wage earners in the US. We have 3 kids, the youngest was born when I was 28. We aren't having to eke out some hard-scrabble existence. I find these arguments bizarre in the context of a discussion of marrying before age 25.

[texasmama]

This is a sensitive question.

 

 

Management coaching

 

repeatedly reported

[Free]

Yeah, it's definitely an individual thing. For me, your list would factor in as follows:

 

1.) Gave birth at age 25 1/2, and the labor was "textbook perfect" according to the CNMs. Spent 4 hours in active labor before delivering. Had no drugs, no IV, and sat in the jacuzzi for most of it.

 

2.) Too many people in the world already. I wasn't interested in trying to add to the 6+ billion people on the planet. I was fine with living my life without having children, because there was enough to challenge and interest me besides having a passel of kids. I ended up having one child, and that's fine. No more, though. If I did have a burning desire to have several kids, I would seek to adopt kids orphaned and poor, and in need of a home.

 

3.) Because we only have one child, and my sister has only two (her dh is snipped, so they're done), and we have another sister who will possibly remain childless, the "sandwich" thing is not likely to be an issue with our family. Limiting the number of kids means more resources to support our parents, and to put in our own retirement, so as not to burden our children.

 

4.) Multigenerational living is something we've experienced as well, even having waited to the ripe old age of 25 to give birth. I have a picture somewhere of my great grandmother's 100th birthday. In the picture, are my great-grandma (who passed last year), my grandma, my father, myself, and my ds. My ds has a loving relationship with my grandma, who is his great grandma.

 

5.) Some of the greediest and most covetous people I know are from modest backgrounds. Also, living economically is hardly the purview of young marrieds, with multiple kids. My dh, myself, and our ds live in a rented 2 bedroom apartment, in a working class community. Our ds is indulged, but he is also appreciative of what he has, and is most generous in sharing and giving his things to less fortunate people.

 

I would also add the caution that, given the economic upheaval of today, what would be considered a livable, modest wage 10 years ago, would have many families actually living in cars, or depriving their kids of more than toys: food, health care, clothes, other necessities.

 

I really think that the whole argument of "Large families don't need all those extras, because they have learned to live without," is somewhat boastful, and a form of defensive pride. I don't think kids need all the toys and gadgets that have proliferated America today, but neither do I think going years without a single family vacation is a fantastic answer either.

 

Like St. Paul said, whether you live in want, or enjoy a very comfortable lifestyle, the key is contentedness, which really has nothing to do with your actual possessions. It's an outlook, and an attitude that is adopted. You cannot instill this acceptance--a child learns it from the way his or her parents relate to material things. My dh and I try to teach our ds to see money and things as a tool, and something that can bring enjoyment--but they can also bring stress and misery. What makes us happy is being together and sharing life together.

 

6.) There's plenty of negatives to virgins marrying as well. I won't go into them, but suffice to say, my first time was much better than it should have been, because my dh was not a virgin. I'm a christian, but I also believe that a lot of teachings and practices about sex are far more rooted in cultural ideals and practices from superstitious and backward societies, than they are derived from the divine. I'm tired of hearing that a woman's virginity is a "gift" for her husband.

 

Her sexuality is her own, and it is something she chooses to share; it should not be regarded as a commodity she must cede as part of a marital transaction.

 

7.) Empty nest syndrome is not exclusive to either young or old parents. Whether you have your kids young or wait, I think what most likely predisposes one to this syndrome is a style of parenting that makes parenting the end all and be all of one's energy, efforts, and goals.

 

If you have no further goal than to be a mom, that's great. But, at some point, parenting gives way to a new phase of life. I'd argue that those parents that continue to pursue other interests and goals on the side while their kids were growing up, are more likely to find purpose and to be productive after the last one has flown the coop.

 

The point to all this is, I don't think it's wise to encourage ds to marry young, struggling to eek out an existence for himself and a burgeoning family, and become an old man early. I don't require grand children from him (that's an unfair burden), and I am raising him to know that there are many ways to find fulfillment in life, besides early and ceaseless reproduction.

 

Loving all your posts in this thread Rebekah. Especially agree with the bolded parts.

[Aelwydd]

I am confused, I thought the argument was that you cannot pursue such things as a parent due to lack of time and/or money. I do pursue outside goals and interests while being a mom, that was one of my points.

 

I haven't made that argument. I know that there are cases where young parents really don't have the resources to pursue any other interests. But, if you read again what I wrote, I was talking about young and old families. The phenomenon I'm talking about is where a parent never pursues an interest in anything that isn't related to parenting, or has very few outlets. I think that type of parent is the most likely to be at risk of "empty nest syndrome."

 

 

You are arguing components of a lifestyle that does not necessarily go hand-in-hand with marrying before age 25. My dh is in the top 10% of wage earners in the US. We have 3 kids, the youngest was born when I was 28. We aren't having to eke out some hard-scrabble existence. I find these arguments bizarre in the context of a discussion of marrying before age 25.

 

Are you claiming your husband's single example as proof that, statistically speaking, couples that marry young have the same or lesser rates of poverty than couples that marry older? Because everything I've read suggests the opposite trend--that couples that marry young, especially older teens, are at higher risk for everything from divorce, to poverty. There's nothing "bizarre" about acknowledging that trend, and not wanting my ds to become "another statistic."

 

Also, IMO, this economy is going to create a much larger class of low wages and poverty for many years to come. When you think about the projected increases in food, health care, and other necessities, and then consider the stagnant wages, and the fact that they have been that way for at least 20 years, where does that analysis take you?

 

To the conclusion that most young adults will be able to work and provide for multiple children in 10 years' time? I'm not even sure that older, more experienced, and more educated adults will be able to keep up with the cost of raising a family.

[Aelwydd]

Loving all your posts in this thread Rebekah. Especially agree with the bolded parts.

 

Thanks! :blush5:

[Dustybug]

Nothing really to add here, but since we are giong to encourage(not force) our daughters to live at home until they are married, I find many of these posts helpful. :)

[Chelle in MO]

Tell your son that engineers make the best dh's:D

 

I'll second that! :D

 

ETA: Oh, my gosh. He's at it again! My dear, dear husband had taken a long break from changing my avatar, but as I posted this I noticed he did it again! Maybe I'll take back my above agreement...;) But it is a funny one considering what our lives have been like lately w/two teen boys in the house!

Edited October 5, 2011 by Chelle in MO

[Mrs Mungo]

I haven't made that argument. I know that there are cases where young parents really don't have the resources to pursue any other interests. But, if you read again what I wrote, I was talking about young and old families. The phenomenon I'm talking about is where a parent never pursues an interest in anything that isn't related to parenting, or has very few outlets. I think that type of parent is the most likely to be at risk of "empty nest syndrome."

 

What proof are you offering of your stance? I actually have teenagers. Most of the parents I know of older kids have outside interests. Again, I have known many who have gone back to school and now work in outside jobs. The few people I know who are my age and have no interests outside of parenting are older parents, and it is because their kids are still little.

 

Are you claiming your husband's single example as proof that, statistically speaking, couples that marry young have the same or lesser rates of poverty than couples that marry older? Because everything I've read suggests the opposite trend--that couples that marry young, especially older teens, are at higher risk for everything from divorce, to poverty. There's nothing "bizarre" about acknowledging that trend, and not wanting my ds to become "another statistic."

 

Again, what statistics do you offer that marrying when you are between 21 and 25 and have graduated college is dooming anyone to poverty? You are putting everyone who marries under 25 into one category. You are combining it with everything that you associate with young marriage from poverty to patriarchy. That is what is bizarre to me.

 

Also, IMO, this economy is going to create a much larger class of low wages and poverty for many years to come. When you think about the projected increases in food, health care, and other necessities, and then consider the stagnant wages, and the fact that they have been that way for at least 20 years, where does that analysis take you?

 

To the conclusion that most young adults will be able to work and provide for multiple children in 10 years' time? I'm not even sure that older, more experienced, and more educated adults will be able to keep up with the cost of raising a family.

 

There is little in the way of objective facts in these two paragraphs, it is mainly supposition.