What is the point of spelling anyway?

[FairProspects]

I have looked through so many spelling programs in anticipation of next year that I think I'm going cross-eyed.

 

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

Why are there so many different philosophies of spelling?

 

I've checked out Spelling Workout A, which to me, looks identical to our phonics workbooks, SRA Phonics, so what specifically makes it "spelling"? I don't want to double our phonics paper and pencil work for little benefit.

 

Then there is Memoria Press 1, which would be a continuation of what we are doing for K. They have spelling lists as part of the program, which as far as I can tell have a general theme, like long A words, but otherwise are just lists to memorize.

 

I also have AAS 1, which looks good, but time intensive and I'm not convinced that knowing or practicing the rules of spelling translates to good spelling usage.

 

So, do I go with lists, phonic workbooks, O-G programs of rules & dictations, something completely different? Anyone care to talk spelling and the purpose behind such different approaches?

[abrightmom]

I have looked through so many spelling programs in anticipation of next year that I think I'm going cross-eyed.

 

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

Why are there so many different philosophies of spelling?

 

I've checked out Spelling Workout A, which to me, looks identical to our phonics workbooks, SRA Phonics, so what specifically makes it "spelling"? I don't want to double our phonics paper and pencil work for little benefit.

 

Then there is Memoria Press 1, which would be a continuation of what we are doing for K. They have spelling lists as part of the program, which as far as I can tell have a general theme, like long A words, but otherwise are just lists to memorize.

 

I also have AAS 1, which looks good, but time intensive and I'm not convinced that knowing or practicing the rules of spelling translates to good spelling usage.

 

So, do I go with lists, phonic workbooks, O-G programs of rules & dictations, something completely different? Anyone care to talk spelling and the purpose behind such different approaches?

 

:iagree: with all of your thoughts and questions. I about keeled over dead going in circles with these questions. :lol: I'm still not convinced that rules matter even though I'm teaching them . . . .for now. Frankly, I am more convinced that Charlotte Mason methods make more sense with the occasional foray into rules as needed (if a kiddo has a trouble spot they can't get over).

[MerryAtHope]

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

 

For some children, yes. Some kids seem to naturally internalize that letters and combinations of letters stand for sounds, which ones work and which ones don't in certain instances, how to sound out words and how to decide how to spell a word. Reading a lot is certainly a valuable aid for spelling that is important for all kids. But using visual strategies alone can also be a handicap. Some kids visualize the shape of a word--in which case, house and horse have the same shape. So does horce.

 

I'm guessing that you probably use more than visual strategies--if you are presented with a new word, I bet you could guess the spelling or come close to it, because you know that letters stand for sounds, you can guess which ones are most likely to stand for those sounds--you probably naturally use some auditory strategies. You probably would also think in terms of morphemes--if you know a part of the word, you'll remember how to spell that root, prefix, or suffix.

 

Likely you also have internalized some rules--you may know that cake cannot be spelled "cace" because that C would be soft, pronounced "case." Maybe no one had to point that out to you, but somehow in reading a lot, you noticed and internalized that concept. Likely there are some rules you've never thought about, you just "intuit" them without putting direct thoughts and words to what you are doing.

 

AAS actually teaches 4 main strategies--"rules" are just one of those strategies, but people tend to think of them first because they are prominent in the first 2 levels and are used throughout. They are one of the easiest and more basic strategies to learn, but not by any means the only strategy. Here's an article on strategies that you may find helpful, whether you go with AAS or another program.

 

HTH some! Merry :-)

[kristinannie]

I haven't taught spelling yet, but I can tell you that spelling does matter (whichever way you end up learning it). My sister wasn't taught spelling. They were focusing on allowing kids to be creative so they didn't do spelling. She can't spell anything. She will send me an email with about 10 typos in it. She has a high paying job and got good grades in college, but I don't see how she can look smart when she can't spell! I am not sure how to approach it all though!

[Susan in TX]

I don't think there is any need for a spelling program while you are still teaching phonics. I don't start with a spelling curriculum until we are done with phonics. Some kids do not need a formal spelling curriculum. If your child is able to spell without much trouble then I wouldn't use a spelling curriculum. If they ever do get to the point where spelling becomes an issue, you can deal with it at that point. For the kids that do need help with spelling, I have had success with Rod and Staff and Soaring with Spelling and Vocabulary.

 

Susan in TX

[siloam]

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

Are you sure your kids have that skill? I had to learn it at 37 when I discovered that one of my children didn't have it and neither did I.

 

Why are there so many different philosophies of spelling?

 

Different learning styles.

 

Some kids can see patterns and learn from them so a program like Sequential Spelling, built on patterns, works for them. It also encourages visualizing skills.

 

Some kids need to have more meaning assigned to spelling, so a morph based spelling, that looks at the parts of words, their meaning and how they go together works better.

 

Some kids need direct explicit instructions becuase they neither visualize or see any patterns.

 

My oldest sees words like you do. That said she has improved using AAS and memorizing the spelling rules and phonograms. She started in at a 5th grade level and jumped to a 7th grade level just in memorizing the phonograms. Since she has progressed to an almost ninth grade level by learning syllable rules and additional spelling rules. She is now in AAS book 5.

 

It really comes down to what you want. If you are fine with the child's current spelling level and they can visualize the words, then feel free to drop spelling. If you want or they want more mastery, then feel free to continue. You set the goals here.

 

Heather

[Crimson Wife]

If you want a program that's similar to AAS but more independent, look into How to Teach Spelling.

 

I have one "natural" speller, who did no formal spelling until this year (3rd). She placed into level G of Spelling Power, but I backed her up and had her do selected lists from E & F. She is cruising through SP and will most likely be done with it by this summer. Most of the lists she only gets a few wrong and usually it only takes 1 or 2 more tries to memorize the correct spelling. After she finishes SP, I'm planning to have her work through the Hexco Valerie's Spelling Bee Supplement program.

 

My 2nd seems to need more explicit teaching of the rules, so I'm using AAS with him.

[JoyinIndo]

Are you sure your kids have that skill? I had to learn it at 37 when I discovered that one of my children didn't have it and neither did I.

 

 

 

I agree with this. Since I do have the skill, as does my 3rd grade daughter, I didn't understand that although my 4th grade son loves to read, he does not have that skill.

 

I am just now figuring out that I have to take a different approach with him and that he won't just pick it up through reading, like me or my daughter.

 

So, I am looking into AAS to help with that.

Blessings,

JoyinIndo

[JoyinIndo]

Sorry I messed up the quote above....I'm such a newbie I don't know how to fix it! :)

 

JoyinIndo

[bluemongoose]

I haven't taught spelling yet, but I can tell you that spelling does matter (whichever way you end up learning it). My sister wasn't taught spelling. They were focusing on allowing kids to be creative so they didn't do spelling. She can't spell anything. She will send me an email with about 10 typos in it. She has a high paying job and got good grades in college, but I don't see how she can look smart when she can't spell! I am not sure how to approach it all though!

 

:iagree: I was also taught this way in both grammar and spelling. I have never had a spelling test or instruction in my life, and was never given grammar instruction past the use of periods, exclamation points, and question marks. Now I have to pay the price because I didnt soak it up naturally! This is from a student who began to read at the age of 4 and who read thick chapter books when most of my classmates were still reading leveled easy readers. Just because I was an excellent reader they all assumed that this method of soaking in the rules through my reading would work. But it didnt! Imagine being very smart, graduating with honors, but still learning things like which has that second h in it in embarrassing situations like writing on the board in front of a class. Or never wanting to write a note in handwriting because it doesnt have spell check or having to look up words that my 6yo asks help with because I cannot spell them either. It is humiliating :glare:.

[abrightmom]

For some children, yes. Some kids seem to naturally internalize that letters and combinations of letters stand for sounds, which ones work and which ones don't in certain instances, how to sound out words and how to decide how to spell a word. Reading a lot is certainly a valuable aid for spelling that is important for all kids. But using visual strategies alone can also be a handicap. Some kids visualize the shape of a word--in which case, house and horse have the same shape. So does horce.

 

I'm guessing that you probably use more than visual strategies--if you are presented with a new word, I bet you could guess the spelling or come close to it, because you know that letters stand for sounds, you can guess which ones are most likely to stand for those sounds--you probably naturally use some auditory strategies. You probably would also think in terms of morphemes--if you know a part of the word, you'll remember how to spell that root, prefix, or suffix.

 

Likely you also have internalized some rules--you may know that cake cannot be spelled "cace" because that C would be soft, pronounced "case." Maybe no one had to point that out to you, but somehow in reading a lot, you noticed and internalized that concept. Likely there are some rules you've never thought about, you just "intuit" them without putting direct thoughts and words to what you are doing.

 

AAS actually teaches 4 main strategies--"rules" are just one of those strategies, but people tend to think of them first because they are prominent in the first 2 levels and are used throughout. They are one of the easiest and more basic strategies to learn, but not by any means the only strategy. Here's an article on strategies that you may find helpful, whether you go with AAS or another program.

 

HTH some! Merry :-)

 

Merry,

 

This is eye opening! I did NOT know that AAS is more than "just rules". Thanks for sharing the article. It is so helpful. I am encouraged to stay the course with AAS (and studied dictation :001_smile:) for now. We'll just be starting Level 3 as soon as it arrives.

[siloam]

Sorry I messed up the quote above....I'm such a newbie I don't know how to fix it! :)

 

JoyinIndo

 

 

I can help with that! You need to close the quote, just like you would if you were quoting someone on paper. To do that you have to add:

before your response.

[lamamaloca]

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

 

That works for some kids, and doesn't work for others. I have a 3rd grader who can read fluently, well above grade level, and reads constantly, but can't spell even the most basic words. This has affected his desire to write, because he knows that he doesn't know the spelling, but can't get anywhere close to accurate on his own.

 

I'm trying to find a spelling program that will work for him but is easy on me.

[kalanamak]

They were focusing on allowing kids to be creative so they didn't do spelling. She can't spell anything. She will send me an email with about 10 typos in it. She has a high paying job and got good grades in college, but I don't see how she can look smart when she can't spell!

 

This is me, and I have to labor over things to make it look good. For my level of education, I am a terrible speller, but......HOMESCHOOLING IS MAKING ME BETTER!!

[bluemongoose]

This is me, and I have to labor over things to make it look good. For my level of education, I am a terrible speller, but......HOMESCHOOLING IS MAKING ME BETTER!!

 

 

Amen:001_smile:

[FairProspects]

Merry,

 

This is eye opening! I did NOT know that AAS is more than "just rules". Thanks for sharing the article. It is so helpful.

 

I didn't know that either. That is helpful thinking about going forward with spelling.

 

I just wish everything for 1st grade wasn't so time & parent intensive. Especially as I have to add my will-be-then 5 y.o. to the mix next year who can't even hold a pencil yet :tongue_smilie:. Maybe I can just put off spelling for a bit or alternate it with grammar or something.

[MerryAtHope]

I didn't know that either. That is helpful thinking about going forward with spelling.

 

I just wish everything for 1st grade wasn't so time & parent intensive. Especially as I have to add my will-be-then 5 y.o. to the mix next year who can't even hold a pencil yet :tongue_smilie:. Maybe I can just put off spelling for a bit or alternate it with grammar or something.

 

My kids are 2 years apart, so I can relate. Plus both of mine were late readers and reluctant writers--the years when they were 2nd & K, 3rd and 1st were long years for me! To be honest, I didn't work much on spelling back then because I was working on basic reading, writing, and math skills, plus trying to fit in some "fun" stuff (and using Sonlight, so lots of reading aloud...). Do what you can when you are able.

 

One thing an older HS mom told me back then that I've always remembered, is that she liked to pick a focus for each year. If time was running short, the kids were antsy, or just "life happened," then she would do her focus subject first, and if she didn't get to everything else, she knew she was still meeting her goals for the year.

 

That helped me so much! Some years I focused on reading, some on math, some on LA, some on spelling...I always did all of the subjects that I felt were important each year, but I didn't stress if one subject got less coverage than another.

 

Once the oldest starts reading, things will get easier. Hang in there! Merry :-)

[jvenice]

That works for some kids, and doesn't work for others. I have a 3rd grader who can read fluently, well above grade level, and reads constantly, but can't spell even the most basic words. This has affected his desire to write, because he knows that he doesn't know the spelling, but can't get anywhere close to accurate on his own.

 

I'm trying to find a spelling program that will work for him but is easy on me.

 

I'm in the same boat. My 3rd grader reads exceptionally well with inflection, long chapter books above grade level, etc. but can't spell at all!! I don't understand it. I have AAS on the way and have high hopes for it. We have tried the CM methods with integrated spelling and it did not work for them. Phonetic Zoo was a disaster. I don't want a 'list' program, although that worked for me in elementary. I disagree on the phonics thing--that you don't need to teach spelling and phonics at the same time. My two that did Abeka which is intensely phonics based are my worst spellers. AAS, please get here!!

[Aloha2U]

I have looked through so many spelling programs in anticipation of next year that I think I'm going cross-eyed.

 

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

Why are there so many different philosophies of spelling?

 

I've checked out Spelling Workout A, which to me, looks identical to our phonics workbooks, SRA Phonics, so what specifically makes it "spelling"? I don't want to double our phonics paper and pencil work for little benefit.

 

Then there is Memoria Press 1, which would be a continuation of what we are doing for K. They have spelling lists as part of the program, which as far as I can tell have a general theme, like long A words, but otherwise are just lists to memorize.

 

I also have AAS 1, which looks good, but time intensive and I'm not convinced that knowing or practicing the rules of spelling translates to good spelling usage.

 

So, do I go with lists, phonic workbooks, O-G programs of rules & dictations, something completely different? Anyone care to talk spelling and the purpose behind such different approaches?

 

Have you read Wanda Sanseri's (the author of SWR) Senate Hearing Speech. It's well worth taking the time to read it, if you haven't already.

 

:001_smile: Melissa

[johnandtinagilbert]

aaahhhhh not teach spelling :willy_nilly::willy_nilly::willy_nilly:

 

:lol: totally agreeing w/ the others. Some need it, others don't. Either way, I can tell you when a kid doesn't come by it naturally, it's a real disaster (pun intended).

[boscopup]

I just started AAS 2 days ago with my first grader. He always did great in spelling tests in school (pulled him out at Christmas time), as he pretty well understood the spelling rules once he learned the phonics of it. I brought him home and went to teach spelling. First tried R&S Spelling 2. Words were too easy and there seemed to be no teaching of why things were spelled that way. My son did the first week, aced the test (because really he already knew those words), and I moved on to Sequential Spelling. We did that for a week, and he did pretty well with it, but then when we did something like "pinning", he asked why you double the 'n'. Now I know how to answer that question, but when we get further in and have more difficult spelling rules that he asks why about, I will have no clue. I didn't learn spelling rules. I'm a natural speller, and I pretty much internalized the phonics (which I may or may not have been explicitly taught - I don't remember! But I read and spell very phonetically), plus I'm good at memorizing words and how they look. My son is likely a lot like me, and just needed phonics instruction (he taught himself to read at 4, skipping the phonics stuff except for what's in starfall.com). We were doing phonics instruction, but it was b-o-r-i-n-g.

 

We started AAS when it came on Tuesday. My son and I both enjoyed it a lot! We didn't even get to the fun letter magnets until yesterday, and he still enjoyed it. He liked learning the phonograms (knew most of them, but didn't know all of the possible sounds of each vowel), and I've already seen him applying the phonogram knowledge this morning when writing some words in a workbook. He explained the sound that the vowel was making and why it made that sound. I was :D because it was obvious that it's already starting to sink in! And AAS is way more fun to teach than R&S Spelling (which was largely independent). Go figure.

 

AAS takes 15-20 minutes a day. You set the timeframe. It's completely scripted, so you don't have to work. You just follow the book. You go at your pace through the step. You can spend a week on a step if you need to, or you can do 5 steps in one day (we did the first 4 steps on day 1, the next 2 steps on day 2, and will probably do another 2 steps today). Looking ahead at level 2, I can really see how this program will help with spelling. And my son and I both really enjoy it (he loves the letter magnets). We've dropped the phonics program, so we now just have spelling, not phonics and separate spelling.

 

Institute "quiet time" with your younger child if you need to (and if naps have been dropped already). That will give you plenty of time to do one-on-one instruction. My 4 year old goes for quiet time at the same time that my 1.5 year old takes his nap. We then do a huge chunk of school during that time.

 

I know first grade requires a lot of mom being present. That's just the nature of the beast. But as they learn to spell, they can do more work independently, because they aren't having to say "Mom, how do you spell xyz?" ;) Or if the child is like mine, they don't break down in tears when faced with writing just about anything that's not copywork. My son is a perfectionist. If he doesn't know how to spell a word, he breaks down.

 

Anyway, I've gone from dreading spelling the last couple weeks (because I just hated teaching it), to LOVING spelling and not being able to wait until I teach the next lesson. Granted, it's still new to me, so we'll see how I do when the newness wears off, but I really think I will enjoy this program long term.

[Laura Corin]

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

My two boys did very little spelling work, because they are natural spellers. Other children don't learn like this, however. As soon as my boys were reading, they could pretty much spell what they had read - if that happens to your children, then you might not need to focus on spelling as a separate skill.

 

Laura

[happypamama]

I'm thinking that maybe teaching spelling and the rules of spelling and all is helpful for one subset of children. For others, I think it's not useful. I spent years acing spelling tests in school without studying for them, won spelling bees, and just generally have a good reliable sense of whether or not a word looks right. Sure, I read a lot, though not always the most challenging stuff, but I think spelling just comes naturally to me. I don't think having spelling lessons really did anything for me at all. My husband, otoh, is brilliant, absolutely brilliant, near perfect scores on the English SAT, an incredibly gifted writer, reads voraciously (and reads challenging stuff too), gets accused of using words too big for other people to understand, etc. And he cannot spell. He went through the same school system I did, so pretty much the same spelling books/tests/etc., and it just never stuck. He just doesn't have that sense of whether or not a word looks right (though he can always phrase a sentence better than I can). I proofread all of his important e-mails, letters, etc. for him. It wasn't until the last year or so, in his mid-thirties, that he decided he really needed to make himself remember how to use "it's" and "its" appropriately (he does do a lot of contract-writing in his career, and I'm not generally able to proofread those for him). I think spelling lessons in school were pretty useless for him too.

 

Now, my mother says that she does think they were helpful for my also brilliant, but very math-oriented, younger brother. For him, learning to apply the rules of spelling was helpful. So I guess my answer is: it depends on the child. I don't think there's anything wrong with doing spelling lessons if they're helpful for your child, and I don't think there is anything wrong with skipping them if they're not needed either.

[Mallory]

Maybe I can just put off spelling for a bit or alternate it with grammar or something.

 

We do both of these ;) Starting in 3rd or 4th grade we do either a formal spelling or grammar program. If they are writing everyday, there isn't any way to ignore thier trouble spots in the other subject, but for a formal text we only do one or the other.

[Annabel Lee]

I'm butting in here w/o reading most replies, but after eyeballing The Phonics Road to Spelling & Reading off and on for about a year and finally watching the sample DVD last night, I WISH I had known about it when my children were your kid's ages. It puts those spelling rules to use, it explains why words are spelled how they are. It also streamlines your entire language arts so that you're practicing phonics on the spelling words and other time-savers so you're not doing almost the same thing twice. There's alot more to it than that, though.

 

ETA: I meant to say that if you look at this, it might give you a clearer picture of a different way & reason to accomplish spelling.

Edited January 21, 2011 by Annabel Lee

[Tabrett]

I have looked through so many spelling programs in anticipation of next year that I think I'm going cross-eyed.

 

I just don't get it. Why do I have to teach spelling anyway? I swear I just learned to spell by reading a lot of words in books until I could visualize in my head how they looked. Will that not work well enough?

 

 

I don't see ANY picture of anything in my head. If I am spelling a word that I am not sure of, I hear it spelled in my head. I say new words over and over in my head till I know the correct spelling when I hear it. I am an avid reader and a horrible speller.

 

I didn't even realize people saw pictures or pictures of words in their heads until I started homeschooling and read about the technique. I kept thinking "Wow! How do people do that!". :lol:

 

I don't visualize books when I read either. I hear the book being read more like listening to a conversation. Sometimes if it is a real exciting part in a book I hear a musical score in my head as I "hear" the book read in my head.

 

Book that are very descriptive about scenery bore me to tears. OK. OK. There are trees and bushes in the forest......tell me something interesting....get on with the story! I don't need the descriptive detail of a leaf!!!!!

[min]

Apparently "natural" spellers visualize. One of my kids does it naturally, one certainly doesn't. We're trying to teaching visualizing, and it is helping.

 

Personally, if I have to remember a pattern - say a bunch of mixed up squares, triangles and stars, I firstly convert it into sound (square, triangle, star, square, triangle, star) - DH can just remember the shapes.

 

Min