Japanese vs. American Math

[JRmommy]

I am a new homeschooler, and have begun researching various curricula, particularly math. While the options are limitless, I am trying to first understand the basic differences between Japanese and American math. I figure once I get my head wrapped around these differences, then it will be a bit easier for me to choose a math curriculum for my son. I have read repeatedly that the children in Japan consistently score higher in math than children in America. Is it only because of the curriculum? What about the cultural differences? I read that the Japanese are very vigorous in their approach to academics in general. Children in Japan spend more days in school (240 days, I believe) and while they are there, they spend more time doing academic work vs. the children in America.

 

If anyone has any resource/information that I could read to understand this better. Perhaps, I can make a more educated decision about math curriculum (or at least that is my hope).

 

Your opinions are also welcomed to this discussion thread.

 

Thank you!

Edited October 5, 2010 by justicesmom
spelling error

[Crimson Wife]

Read Knowing and Teaching Elementary Mathematics by Dr. Liping Ma. While she is discussing Chinese math, it's the same basic approach as is taken in Japan.

 

If you decide that you want to use a Japanese math program as opposed to one of the other Asian-based ones (Singapore, Math Mammoth, Right Start, Math in Focus), do a search on this forum for Tokyo Shoseki.

[FO4UR]

Read Knowing and Teaching Elementary Mathematics by Dr. Liping Ma.

 

:iagree:That is the first place to start.

[Capt_Uhura]

The education systems are quite different. However, I've seen various things quoted and in other places, those same statistics debunked. I read a book a few months ago that looked at actual hours of instruction and in fact, the US wasn't much different from China or Japan. Yes, Asian kids spend more hours in school but they also had more breaks, more recess, longer lunch, and more extracurriculars. Asian math places a stronger emphasis on understanding math over rote methods. They also cover fewer topics and spend more time each year on those fewer topics.

 

I too would start w/ Leping Ma's book.

[JRmommy]

Thank you! And, I guess I should have titled this thread Asian vs. American Math.

 

I will definitely check out this book.

[Spy Car]

I'll forth reading Liping Ma's book.

 

Bill

[Homemama2]

I just started Liping Ma's book last night and I can't put it down! FINALLY the difference btwn Asian and American math makes sense. :001_smile:

[jahkamakura]

My kids have gone through the Japanese system until grade 5. The biggest differences I notice is there is more rote memory in Japanese math than in the US, which seems different than what someone else said here. Kids are required to learn a multiplication song forwards and backwards and they are regularly tested on it.

 

In grade one they spend FOREVER learning number bonds for 10. Then this skill is used for bigger number. Not like anything I learned.

9+7=16 because 9+1=10, 16-10=6 so therefore 10+6=16.

 

They do attend school more days a year, but a bigger reason is that almost every child in Japan does a correspondence course, Kumon or cram school. Schools give homework (amount depends on school), but kids also have homework from their other classes. Skills are reinforced or enhanced depending on the kid or program.

 

Japanese math is also a mastery approach. My son is in 5th grade and just getting to fractions. This year they will do all 4 operations with fractions, but he rarely knew what a fraction was before now. I also think with a mastery approach less topics are covered in a year so they spend more time on each one. They do the same in science.

 

A few things I don't see in Japanese math are no work with patterns and usually only one method is taught. I did notice this year that their textbook sometimes has several different examples of how to solve the a problem. There also isn't much discovery or hands on materials used in the class, but that can vary with the teacher. There is also not enough critical thinking. They aren't challenged to use their math knowledge in other ways, like Singapore word problems.

 

I can't say which is better because I really think there are some math programs out there that are not Japanese. Singapore seems similar, though with less practice. I think the fact they spend so much time on basic facts when the students are young, really helps.

 

My kids have transferred into a British/Australian program and find it very easy. They had trouble with the vocabulary at first, but now are doing very well. Perhaps their Japanese math helped.

 

Juli in Japan

[Corraleno]

I am a new homeschooler, and have begun researching various curricula, particularly math. While the options are limitless, I am trying to first understand the basic differences between Japanese and American math. I figure once I get my head wrapped around these differences, then it will be a bit easier for me to choose a math curriculum for my son. I have read repeatedly that the children in Japan consistently score higher in math than children in America. Is it only because of the curriculum? What about the cultural differences? I read that the Japanese are very vigorous in their approach to academics in general. Children in Japan spend more days in school (240 days, I believe) and while they are there, they spend more time doing academic work vs. the children in America.

Well, kids in Finland score higher in math than either Japanese or Singaporean kids (Finland is 2nd only to S. Korea in math), and Finnish kids spend less time in school, and have less homework, than Asian or American kids. OTOH, they teach math with an emphasis on conceptual understanding, like Asian countries do, rather than the way it's taught in US schools.

 

Here's a link to the Liping Ma book on Amazon. You can also buy inexpensive used copies (under $5) of the previous edition, which has the same basic information. It's well worth reading, and a book I would seriously recommend to all homeschoolers.

 

Jackie

[jahkamakura]

Well, kids in Finland score higher in math than either Japanese or Singaporean kids (Finland is 2nd only to S. Korea in math), and Finnish kids spend less time in school, and have less homework, than Asian or American kids. OTOH, they teach math with an emphasis on conceptual understanding, like Asian countries do, rather than the way it's taught in US schools.

 

Here's a link to the Liping Ma book on Amazon. You can also buy inexpensive used copies (under $5) of the previous edition, which has the same basic information. It's well worth reading, and a book I would seriously recommend to all homeschoolers.

 

Jackie

 

And isn't the author of Math Mammoth Finnish? That is what we are using with our son who's last day of Japanese school is today.

[stripe]

Japanese kids also clean their schools themselves and have a high sense of parental expectation for success. Don't underestimate either one.

[bbrandonsmom]

I'm reading both Liping Ma's book as well as The Learning Gap-why our schools are failing and what we can learn from Japanese and Chinese Education. I've just started that one and so far according to the book, kids are allowed to be kids until 1st g, and then the focus is on study. Unlike the US, where we are pushing our kids into preschool at age 2.

I'm a bit into the math chapter-they mention that more teachers there understand math better, and can teach the kids different ways to come about solving a problem. The US teachers get stuck-basically, because most of us only know one way to solve a problem. So, a kid is only going to learn what the teacher knows. Also that US has not many word problems/how to relate them to real life. One example (I can't remember if it was this book or LM's book) was the author asked a US math teacher, "If I wanted to paint that one wall, went to the store and bought a gallon of paint, would it be enough to effectively cover the wall per square ft?". The teacher replied they didn't know how to solve that problem, so could not expect the kids to.

One other thing they mention about math in general, is that the US is accepting that we are poor in math. It's ok if someone says they are bad at math. Yet in Japan and China it's not accepted. It's a mindset. I think the US is the same for reading too-how many kids are allowed to move ahead a grade, and not be able to read?

[Capt_Uhura]

AH THAT"S the book!!!! The Learning Gap! I've been trying to recall that title for days! I think that's the book that mentions that they don't see a literacy gap in boys and girls that are homeschooled.

[Spy Car]

I'm reading both Liping Ma's book as well as The Learning Gap-why our schools are failing and what we can learn from Japanese and Chinese Education. I've just started that one and so far according to the book, kids are allowed to be kids until 1st g, and then the focus is on study. Unlike the US, where we are pushing our kids into preschool at age 2.

 

 

Kids can be kids in preschool. Attending a good developmental nursery school can be a tremendously enriching experience young child.

 

Bill

[stripe]

Kids can be kids in preschool. Attending a good developmental nursery school can be a tremendously enriching experience young child.

 

Bill

There's some great footage of a Japanese preschool in this travel documentary starring two young American sisters (i.e. kids) called Little Travelers. In fact, while I am not sure I liked this movie, I did love the footage of Japanese kids. The preschools looked very well organized and fun, not academic. And they do stuff like take their pants off to nap which is just hilarious.

[Spy Car]

There's some great footage of a Japanese preschool in this travel documentary starring two young American sisters (i.e. kids) called Little Travelers. In fact, while I am not sure I liked this movie, I did love the footage of Japanese kids. The preschools looked very well organized and fun, not academic. And they do stuff like take their pants off to nap which is just hilarious.

 

My son attended a wonderful coop nursery school. He had a marvelous time. They had a rich variety of art, and play, and stories, and he made good friends he continues to see and play with on sports teams, play-dates, and attends events organized by the mommies in our group.

 

They didn't do "academics" beyond small amounts of rug-time listening to stories, or learning the day of the week, or the name of the color they were painting with, or how to build with blocks, or make a puzzle.

 

We did "academics" at home. But used playful means that respected where children are developmentally at 3.5-5 years old.

 

The preschool years should be rich ones, and a nursery school experience can be every enriching.

 

Bill

[bbrandonsmom]

Yes, many of the preschools are just play. But on the other hand, there are parents out there who actively search for those preschools that focus on learning and not playing.

I think that's what they were getting at. Americans seem to have the general mindset that earlier is better-teach the 2 and 3 year olds the numbers, letters, shapes etc, even if the child shows no interest. Our culture is set for it-dvd's, flashcards and books all set starting at infancy to teach them these things. I think parents get caught up in it, and those who are super focused on it are the ones who want preschools that actually teach, instead of play.

[JadeOrchidSong]

Japanese kids also clean their schools themselves and have a high sense of parental expectation for success. Don't underestimate either one.

I grew up in China and students took turns cleaning the classroom, straightening chairs, wiping the blackboard and even waxing the wood floor (which was our class's first job before we started school when I was 11). We also had to buy and bring our own textbooks, notebooks, pencils and erasers to school and back to home every day. There was no wasted papers or pencils. We also pulled weeds in the school yard.

 

Parental involvement was non-existent when I was in school. My mom never went to my school except when we couldn't afford to pay the $2 textbooks and other paper fee per semester and she she had to petition for exemption of this fee. We were extremely poor and often went hungry. There was no breakfast or lunch at school. We had to buy our own lunches at nearby restaurant. I almost never ate breakfast (because of no food at home) before I turned 16 and went to college. The Lord blessed my brain and enabled me to learn despite my hunger.

However, things are different now, or different in each family. Teachers are still highly respected and parents are expected to help their children to succeed.

School started 7:30 with 30 minutes' student individual reading aloud/reciting aloud the ancient Chinese poems or English texts/new words.

Then at 8:00 the first class period started and 45 minutes and after that we had 10 minutes break when we could jump rope and play games and be physically active. The second period of class was also 45 minutes long followed by a 20 minutes break to do morning eye exercise and whole body stretching exercise and then a little break for kids to play with friends. Then two more 45 minutes classes before lunch break and nap, which is 2.5 hours long. Most children walked back home for lunch because parents also had 2.5 hr break from work. There were two more 45 minute class periods in the afternoon before school was over.

Math was learned with focus on mental/oral math and speed. The teacher would give us a problem like 365/23 or 2587x37 or a word problem and we would spit out the answer right away. We were encouraged to solve problems in various different ways. We had homework every day.

I love the way math was taught to me. My kids are using Singapore math and I have trained them to do oral math well. For example, my ds5.5 can do 8x8 or 7x5 in his head (by doing 8x2 first and then get to 32 and then get 32+32) and give me the answer in seconds. He hasn't memorized the facts yet but he does 8+6 or the likes very fast.

Hope this helps.

[Corraleno]

And isn't the author of Math Mammoth Finnish? That is what we are using with our son who's last day of Japanese school is today.

Yep. :001_smile:

 

Jackie

[Guest Darin Ow-Wing]

Dear Justicesmom:

 

While there are certainly complex differences in Japanese and American cultural attitudes toward education, there is one simple difference in how Japan teaches math that makes all the difference. American math textbooks typically teach about 25 different topics or types of operations per year, while Japanese textbooks teach only 10 per year.

 

So while American kids get forced to jump from one topic to the next before they have mastered them, Japanese students get to spend weeks on each topic, ensuring excellent master by ALL the students in class.

 

The American math system lightly introduces a vast number of topics, then repeats those topics every year (with new ones introduced of course). This means that American teachers aren't as concerned if a kid doesn't learn a topic on one year, because it will be covered again the following year.

 

There are two problems with this. One is that obviously the buck just keeps getting passed each year by the new teachers. The other problem is that, when American kids get overwhelmed by so many topics which they do not master, they start to think that math is hard and cannot be learned. Many experience failure with math instead of success. Kids start being separated from each other by perceptions of math ability.

 

In Japan, each topic is covered in succession and in depth and never repeated. So that teacher that year knows every kid has to learn every topic or they will never learn it - and that s/he will be held responsible for that failure in learning.

 

But just as the turtle beat the hare, by late middle school Japanese kids are over a year ahead of American kids in terms of the level of math they can do. In America, we speed through but so many fail that we have to loop back over and over, so ultimately we go slower. In Japan, by going slower they build more solid competency, and so they don't waste time going backwards. And importantly, the vast majority of students all move forward together, while in America kids are divided into advanced, middle, and remedial math courses.

 

It's so common sense, and it has NOTHING to do with cultural differences in attitude toward education. It's just a matter of treating kids humanely, giving them the time to gain mastery, and not subjecting them to forced failure.

 

For more info, here is a link

 

http://sitemaker.umich.edu/schueller.356/curriculum

 

Good luck!

[Beth in SW WA]

 

In Japan, each topic is covered in succession and in depth and never repeated. So that teacher that year knows every kid has to learn every topic or they will never learn it - and that s/he will be held responsible for that failure in learning.

 

 

Welcome, Darin. Thanks for sharing your insight. :)