Low confidence in teaching the education I never had.

[smilesonly]

Translation=I feel absolutely unqualified in teaching the Classical way, when I barely had a mediocre traditional education myself. I am also an older mom, dealing with heavy issues w/i myself healthwise(I *am* on the right road to healing!), and am certain I have adult ADD(though not even my dh knows this). Our dc are both 2E-one is "gifted" and has anxiety/panic dxes, the other is TAG w/anxiety and panic dxes.

 

I *want* to give my dc an education I never had, but feel ill-equipped. I don't have the time or energy to educate myself in order to pass it on to our dc. Don't get me wrong, I understand I need to self-educate to a certain degree, but I am not going to check out the Great Books and try to analyze them intelligently, in order to "be on top of my game" in home education.

 

Do I just throw in the towel on all things Classical and continue to painfully put together each years educational plans via eclectic route?

 

fyi-dd is 13.5 in 7th, ds is 9 as of this mid-summer and in 2nd.

 

TIA!:o

[Ruby]

My philosophy has always been..........one year at a time. Give it a whirl. Do your best and see how it goes. You'll do better than you think. :grouphug: Ruby

[LisaKinVA]

No! Don't throw in the towel. It doesn't have to be "all or nothing." There are lots of good programs that can add a classical dimension to any curriculum.

 

You don't have to cobble everything together yourself. You can use a standard history text (spine), and then add some literature to enhance (it doesn't have to be a lot). We use Veritas Press as a lit guide, but don't use the history program itself (although I plan to).

 

Depending upon finances, you can enroll your children in a home program with something like the Potter's School or Veritas Academy Online... which will provide the classical approach, but you aren't solely responsible for everything.

 

Doing the whole classical approach can be intimidating for anyone. There is no universally "right" curriculum or approach that is a perfect fit for anyone (not even within a family).

 

If what you are doing is painful and frustrating -- it's not a good fit. Maybe it would be better to try something structured that you "enhance" with some aspects of classical ed.

 

I've been there. I wanted so badly for WTM to "fit" my oldest son. It didn't. It was a year of tears and virtually no growth (except Math). K12 was our answer. However, 3 years later, my son wants to do more reading. I gave him the option of real books vs. what he's currently doing, and he wants more books. So, we plan to hit the "reset" button for 7th grade and try WTM style again.

 

For everything there is a season...and no matter what season you find yourself in with your dc education, you are not a failure.

[forty-two]

On the whole, I believe that people can do anything they set their minds to. If you value a classical education and are determined to give one to your dc, then, substandard education or no, I'm confident that you can do it.

 

But I didn't really get from your post *why* you value a classical approach over the eclectic one you've been using up to now. I understand not having the time to educate yourself up to the point where you can *teach* the Great Books :grouphug: - but if you don't see any value in just *reading* them yourself, then why do you see value in having your children read them :confused:?

 

(I admit that I am coming from an unschooling/libertarian-inspired perspective of it being unfair to require something of one's children that you don't require of yourself - but, to turn it around, aren't you just as worthy of a good education as your children? And it's never too late to get started :grouphug:.)

[5LittleMonkeys]

:grouphug: I had similar feelings when I first learned about Classical education. But after I read hundreds of articles and testimonials about the subject I realized that it didn't so much matter what I knew as much as the resources I provided for my dc. There is no way I can do as much self-education as some others do but I can learn with my dc. I learned more about history and fractions this past year than I ever knew before. We are starting Latin in July and I can't wait to take that journey with my dc. We have also created a list of great literature that I am looking forward to having great discussions with dc about.

 

This forum has been invaluable in searching for good solid curriculum for me and my dc. When I am faced with a subject I have limited knowledge in (upper level math and Latin for example) I ask here and I do a thorough search to find a program or books that are specifically for parents who have limited knowledge but that still provide the highest level of understanding. If you choose the right curriculum and great literature and your dc are motivated they will learn regardless of your lacking education.

 

Would my dc get a better education if I was knowledgeable in all subjects? Maybe, but I personally feel I would have missed out on some incredible bonding moments when we learn and figure things out together. :D

Edited May 13, 2010 by 5LittleMonkeys

[KrissiK]

I did not get anywhere near a classical education myself. However, I see the value in such an education and using TWTM as my guide, I think I can do it. I think anyone can do it. As was mentioned before, 1 year at a time. Don't look at the entirety of your child's educational journey. Just look at what's going on now.

[johnandtinagilbert]

You sound like many of the moms here who have now graduated dc with the classical method! You're not alone in receiving a "less than" education and you're not alone in not being able to tackle the great books all on your own. Something wonderful to ponder....growing with your dc! I have been and I'll tell you something funny....for the first time, I was able to answer an awful lot of questions on Jeopardy (dc were flipping through the channels and stopped). When I was in h.s....I couldn't answer any! It gets better with time.

 

Find materials that suit your needs and the interests of your dc and get started! You can do it!

[ChrissySC]

Can you read?

 

Well, if the anwer was yes, then have a wonderfully classical set of moments together! We are never to old to learn. We have to learn before we can teach. :) Well, darn, I'm still learning things I didn't know, and I have had an exceptional education. You can't compare apples and oranges other than that we call them fruit. When you learned it or how you learned it is irrelevant to the fact that you did.

 

I think you can do it. Correction - I know you can do it.

[smilesonly]

No! Don't throw in the towel. It doesn't have to be "all or nothing." There are lots of good programs that can add a classical dimension to any curriculum.

 

You don't have to cobble everything together yourself. You can use a standard history text (spine), and then add some literature to enhance (it doesn't have to be a lot). We use Veritas Press as a lit guide, but don't use the history program itself (although I plan to).

 

Depending upon finances, you can enroll your children in a home program with something like the Potter's School or Veritas Academy Online... which will provide the classical approach, but you aren't solely responsible for everything.

 

Doing the whole classical approach can be intimidating for anyone. There is no universally "right" curriculum or approach that is a perfect fit for anyone (not even within a family).

 

If what you are doing is painful and frustrating -- it's not a good fit. Maybe it would be better to try something structured that you "enhance" with some aspects of classical ed.

 

I've been there. I wanted so badly for WTM to "fit" my oldest son. It didn't. It was a year of tears and virtually no growth (except Math). K12 was our answer. However, 3 years later, my son wants to do more reading. I gave him the option of real books vs. what he's currently doing, and he wants more books. So, we plan to hit the "reset" button for 7th grade and try WTM style again.

 

For everything there is a season...and no matter what season you find yourself in with your dc education, you are not a failure.

 

Thanks, I really appreciate your sharing!

 

At this age of my dc, I needed to hear that it doesn't have to be all or nothing. I did the all or nothing when dd was about 6, and it led to burnout on my behalf. At the ages my dc are now, it is very intimidating to think about teaching latin, logic, *and* analyzing works from books I never encountered until college. I am going to reread TWTM (2004 printing) to see if I can come away with a baseline...If not curriculum-wise, even just my understanding of this Classical concept at a level beyond the early grammar stage would probably help.

 

I will definitely look into boxed?(not sure if that is what I mean) approaches for a classical education. Something that helps ME educate my dc. However, price is definitely a huge factor.

 

On the whole, I believe that people can do anything they set their minds to. If you value a classical education and are determined to give one to your dc, then, substandard education or no, I'm confident that you can do it.

 

But I didn't really get from your post *why* you value a classical approach over the eclectic one you've been using up to now. I understand not having the time to educate yourself up to the point where you can *teach* the Great Books :grouphug: - but if you don't see any value in just *reading* them yourself, then why do you see value in having your children read them :confused:?

 

(I admit that I am coming from an unschooling/libertarian-inspired perspective of it being unfair to require something of one's children that you don't require of yourself - but, to turn it around, aren't you just as worthy of a good education as your children? And it's never too late to get started :grouphug:.)

 

You didn't get the *why*, as I am not really confident in my reasons. I can say that when I first read(not studied!) TWTM, I experienced an "ah-ha" type moment. It made sense to me to regard a child's developmental stage when considering how/when the child is taught or introduced to material. I also was at a stage where I wanted to prove myself as a homeschooler to friends and family-I didn't just want my dc to know her city, state, and country, I wanted her to know about Rome and Africa. Not just verbs, but the various states of BEING. I loathed worsheets, and loved the concept of reading real books as opposed to textbooks. I loved the orderliness of learning as opposed to state standards.

 

I am not saying that I can't read the Greats, I just know myself well enough to know that I can't intelligently discuss them with a passion my dc deserve. I will admit, that religion aside, I am bored to death reading about history before the 1500's.

 

I appreciate your honesty about your current label as an unschooler-after that year of attempting TWTM, I unschooled for the entire next year. It suited me fine, but my dd *hated* it.

 

:grouphug: I had similar feelings when I first learned about Classical education. But after I read hundreds of articles and testimonials about the subject I realized that it didn't so much matter what I knew as much as the resources I provided for my dc. There is no way I can do as much self-education as some others do but I can learn with my dc. I learned more about history and fractions this past year than I ever knew before. We are starting Latin in July and I can't wait to take that journey with my dc. We have also created a list of great literature that I am looking forward to having great discussions with dc about.

 

This forum has been invaluable in searching for good solid curriculum for me and my dc. When I am faced with a subject I have limited knowledge in (upper level math and Latin for example) I ask here and I do a thorough search to find a program or books that are specifically for parents who have limited knowledge but that still provide the highest level of understanding. If you choose the right curriculum and great literature and your dc are motivated they will learn regardless of your lacking education.

 

Would my dc get a better education if I was knowledgeable in all subjects? Maybe, but I personally feel I would have missed out on some incredible bonding moments when we learn and figure things out together. :D

 

I really, really appreciate what you are saying here and you have given me a lot of encouragement! Thank you! I do think I am good at knowing what my dc like and I consider myself a lurking research pro. Perhaps part of my problem is that I need to swallow my pride and post more questions.

 

I did not get anywhere near a classical education myself. However, I see the value in such an education and using TWTM as my guide, I think I can do it. I think anyone can do it. As was mentioned before, 1 year at a time. Don't look at the entirety of your child's educational journey. Just look at what's going on now.

 

This is actually part of my current problem. Until this year, I never planned on hsing beyond middle school. Now, we are commited till the end, and it is buggin me to not know the bigger picture of where dd is heading with her high school years. Also, there is a co-op here that offers high school level courses, and I need to be figuring out what i am going to do with her in order to prepare for possibloe enrollment. Sigh.

 

You sound like many of the moms here who have now graduated dc with the classical method! You're not alone in receiving a "less than" education and you're not alone in not being able to tackle the great books all on your own. Something wonderful to ponder....growing with your dc! I have been and I'll tell you something funny....for the first time, I was able to answer an awful lot of questions on Jeopardy (dc were flipping through the channels and stopped). When I was in h.s....I couldn't answer any! It gets better with time.

 

Find materials that suit your needs and the interests of your dc and get started! You can do it!

 

That is awesome and also very encouraging.:D

 

Can you read?

 

Well, if the anwer was yes, then have a wonderfully classical set of moments together! We are never to old to learn. We have to learn before we can teach. :) Well, darn, I'm still learning things I didn't know, and I have had an exceptional education. You can't compare apples and oranges other than that we call them fruit. When you learned it or how you learned it is irrelevant to the fact that you did.

 

I think you can do it. Correction - I know you can do it.

 

Lol. Yes, I CAN READ! HOWEVER, I am horrible with retention and distraction.;)

[texasmama]

:grouphug: I have felt overwhelmed by trying to teach things that I never learned, as well. I have taken the attitude that I am learning with them, rather than "teaching" them. We are still in elementary school together (:D), but I take each year as it comes, start slowly with things that scare me (like Latin) and so far, so good. I have also discovered the subject that is not going to get done unless I farm it out (science) so I found a homeschool co op for that. I have taken one scary unknown at a time and made progress with my own "demons"...namely, math. As I take the next step at a time, I feel more competent and capable. I really think that anyone can do this. :001_smile: I also use Sonlight for history, readalouds, readers and the invaluable (to me) istructor's guide, which helps me schedule the rest of our subjects because that part is already done for me. Everyone has different needs, but those are some things that have helped me. Each year I tackle a bit more and tell myself that I am not trying to win any sort of award, just educate these children to the best of my ability.:001_smile:

[elegantlion]

My education was far from classical. One book that really helped me feel like I provide a classical education is The Latin-Centered Curriculum. It has given me a framework that I feel comfortable in. Even if you don't plan on teaching Latin I believe the book has value. If you scroll to the bottom of the page on the above link, you can read an excerpt on "multum non multa" which you might find helpful.

[Jen+4dc]

:grouphug: I have felt overwhelmed by trying to teach things that I never learned, as well. I have taken the attitude that I am learning with them, rather than "teaching" them. We are still in elementary school together (:D), but I take each year as it comes, start slowly with things that scare me (like Latin) and so far, so good. I have also discovered the subject that is not going to get done unless I farm it out (science) so I found a homeschool co op for that. I have taken one scary unknown at a time and made progress with my own "demons"...namely, math. As I take the next step at a time, I feel more competent and capable. I really think that anyone can do this. :001_smile: I also use Sonlight for history, readalouds, readers and the invaluable (to me) istructor's guide, which helps me schedule the rest of our subjects because that part is already done for me. Everyone has different needs, but those are some things that have helped me. Each year I tackle a bit more and tell myself that I am not trying to win any sort of award, just educate these children to the best of my ability.:001_smile:

:iagree::iagree: Emphasis mine! I think anyone committed to their children's best interests can do this! Keep going one day at a time and ask questions as often as you need to! I've found that's what works for me.

:grouphug:

[TandLMommy28]

I didn't get to have a classical education myself. I am so excited about learning the things I never got to learn in school myself.

 

For example, I moved around a bunch so I never had US History! I kept missing it because every district planned it for a different year and it just never happened. In college I only had to take World History. I'm so excited to learn American history with my kids!

 

My theory is that I may not give my kids a perfect classical education--but I can get them an awful lot closer than our local public schools can!

[ChrissySC]

Lol. Yes, I CAN READ! HOWEVER, I am horrible with retention and distraction.;)

 

:thumbup:

 

Me Too!!!

[Colleen in NS]

Translation=I feel absolutely unqualified in teaching the Classical way, when I barely had a mediocre traditional education myself. I am also an older mom

 

I felt this exact way today. Some basic algebra lessons started this week in ds' math book, and I had to sllllooooowwwww down and absorb what was explained. It was VERY helpful, though, because they sure didn't teach me algebra like that back in high school!! Meanwhile, he got it right away and had to sit there while I tried to understand. Also today during Latin study, I was trying to understand something he said, and he sighed, "I wish I had a better Latin teacher" and instead of getting mad I said, "So do I." And then he rushed over and gave me a big hug. In fact, he gave me several big hugs today, as he could see my frustration with my slower understanding.

 

Still, I know this is the way to go for me and my family. And I'll keep struggling along, because I am seeing fruits of it and know that more fruit is coming.

[MamaT]

You can do it! I learned so much along with my oldest two through high school. It was daunting to think about reading the Great Books, learning Latin, having to teach algebra, etc., but once I actually started the ideas drew me in, the study of logic helped me teach higher math, and so on. Now that my third son is in high school, I am enjoying learning even more and the Great Books feel like old friends. I am finding more to think about and discuss with him. You don't have to know everything or pick up a Great book in order to study it. Just begin to read it and you may find yourself actually being drawn in. There is a reason they are called Great Books! :001_smile:

[Ester Maria]

I *want* to give my dc an education I never had, but feel ill-equipped. I don't have the time or energy to educate myself in order to pass it on to our dc. Don't get me wrong, I understand I need to self-educate to a certain degree, but I am not going to check out the Great Books and try to analyze them intelligently, in order to "be on top of my game" in home education.

Two things.

 

One, you will NEVER be "equipped enough" - saying this as somebody who graduated from a classical school and to whom this mode of education is as natural as it can be (as a matter of fact, I find the American school system very unnatural, since it's so different from what I was raised with and taught to consider a default education). To learn for yourself is one thing, to pass that knowledge onto others, particularly children, requires a distinct set of skills as opposed to pure knowing the material, and usually requires to know the material a lot more in-depth than you yourself studied. So really, the "comparative advantage" some people have in the end cannot 'spare' you the need to brush up on some things, relearn them and then continue working on yourself - you would be surprised how much, actually.

 

Two, "great books". I loathe this pretentious label, which can really be given only by somebody who understands very little about literature in the first place - so I would seriously recommend you not to burden yourself with thinking in those terms. Yes, there is an entire canon of literature that has been historically influential, for this or that reason, and yes, for a person well-versed in humanities most of those books are a must-read at some stage of their education (whether formal or informal). I don't deny that. What I do deny is that had you had the privilege of classical education yourself you would necessarily "read it all and get it all", because that's just incorrect. People who have "read it all and get it all" are those who chose their university formation to be based on Comparative Literature, not those who had a chronological study of literature in high school. You would also be pretty surprised how shallow that instruction tends to be in most of the schools that do loosely follow a classical model of education.

 

Seriously, a LOT of what you are going to read on these boards when it comes to "good ol' fashioned classical education" are romanticized perspectives. People are genuinely trying to copy the model that for most of them was not the model they were educated in, and a lot of them felt just as intimidated as you are on many points during that process. Which is understandable and normal.

The question is whether you're willing to let some potentially great things fall behind out of fear. In the end of the day, what's the worst thing that can happen? Your children might not receive an education in accordance with your own romanticized version, but I would still be willing to bet that what they will receive will be a lot better than at local public school, and will equip them with a base to expand later on their own.

What more than that do you need?! Relax, you will do fine. :)

There are lots of good programs that can add a classical dimension to any curriculum.

This is also an important note.

It's possible, and fully legitimate, to decide not to follow the classical approach fully, but only to give a classical "flavor" to what you're doing. If you really find the whole thing overwhelming and too much, you can consider doing that.

 

"Classical" is just a label, in reality there are many shades and flavors of "classical". I went to a, shall we call it, "ultra-classical" school (Latin, Greek, classics in originals, Philosophy with Formal Logic and all that jazz), but there are also many decent, shall we call it, "modern classical" schools (which maybe have only Latin less philosophy and chronological approach to history and literature), as well as those who aren't classical by label, yet possess some of the characteristics that are discussed on these forums.

 

What TWTM advises is actually a system of "modern classical" education and is only one possible interpretation (or, better, reinterpretation) of what a classical education should be. I actually "ideologically" disagree with TWTM when it comes to languages and sciences, but I value it as a legitimate approach that has helped many to provide their children with a good education. It's just important to keep in mind it's not the only way to do things.

I am not saying that I can't read the Greats, I just know myself well enough to know that I can't intelligently discuss them with a passion my dc deserve.

On a middle/high school level, anyone can discuss those works provided they read them and perhaps helped themselves with a study guide of some sort - they are often a good starting point to see possible approaches to the work and questions that arise.

 

The typical middle/high school literature instruction DOES NOT focus on the form of the work (which is the only approach I recognize on higher levels of education), but rather on the layer of theme and, often, context. You don't need a degree in literature to do that or any heavy literary theory.

I started to "intelligently discuss" things only when we started to talk about the form rather than about the layer of theme and context - and that was mostly in university. So relax, most of the discussion you will have can turn out into good-quality discussions regardless.

Also today during Latin study, I was trying to understand something he said, and he sighed, "I wish I had a better Latin teacher" and instead of getting mad I said, "So do I." And then he rushed over and gave me a big hug.

:grouphug:

You're both advancing and working on yourselves - which is, ultimately, the most important thing.

[Janice in NJ]

Lots of us here have boot-strapped our way from the land of "????" into a world where we know a thing or two.

 

It's totally do-able. It's work. But a bunch of us can attest to the pay-out: It's worth it!

 

Just do it! What ever "it" is for you.

 

Be encouraged,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

[Laura Corin]

I think that learning alongside your children is fine. I've never set myself up to know everything - the children often hear me say: 'I don't know; let's look it up.' Most of the curricula I use are 'do the next thing' style. The only thing that I do in advance is to read the books that my elder boy is going to study (not every book that I assign to him - only the ones that he will study in depth).

 

Laura

[Colleen in NS]

You're both advancing and working on yourselves - which is, ultimately, the most important thing.

 

You're darn right about that! For him to sympathize with me like that was amazing. Besides that, I can see the structures forming in his mind now and becoming useful to him. This from a mama who knew no Latin before four years ago. I may not be as quick as my kids, but I am determined to keep them moving along! (and I *am* finding at least that I am recognizing Latin in English words nowadays, and the grammar study *is* enhancing the English grammar study - yay! any progress is better than none!)

[crimsonkelley]

You can do it!!!! I learned more teaching 1st grade history to my daughter than I ever learned through high school or college! I found great joy learning new ways to add and subtract by watching the MUS videos, and I had great fun reading books I never read as a child - Chronicles of Narnia, Little House on the Prarie, etc.... (Yes, it is very sad I never read all those wonderful books - I could go on, but it's just too pathetic!)

 

We are now in 5th grade. I'm still learning!!! Now we are on to Latin. Thanks to Leigh Lowe, we are learning together - although my daughter is way ahead of me!!! I'm amazed at all that I've learned these 5 years!!!

 

I think we have to change our point of view. We are not experts teaching our children, but teaching our children how to learn. I'm a great example of that. I'm always saying, "WOW - I never new that!" My kids think it's great they know more than me. They continually share what they read in books to add to our lessons.

 

Best of luck!!! Homeschooling this way is a blast!!

[smilesonly]

A BIG thank you to each of you! :grouphug:

 

I really appreciate your encouragement, insight, wisdom, and knowledge. I am printing this thread out, as it's a keeper.;)