DD no sleeping - HELP

[jclinton]

We use melatonin, we've tried benadryl. We've got a bedtime routine. We go through this with every time change. You can imagine the bear I'm dealing with when she has such little sleep. This problem s compounded by the fact that my work schedule has changed and I am back working night shift temporarily. Her anxiety level has gotten higher. She has ADHD/NLD. She has a night light etc. Do we just ride this out and hope it resolves on it's own in a few weeks or is there something we can try now that might help?

JoAnne

[hsbaby]

We had the same issue with my dd for years!! We tried all the same things...the melatonin, benadryl, magnesium, etc. These would eventually get her to fall asleep, but then she would be awake playing in the middle of the night. She recently turned 13 and we have finally resorted to medication. She HAD to get some sleep. The lack of sleep was affecting her behavior, ability to concentrate, etc. So, now she takes Clonodine every night. I hated resorting to meds, but nothing else worked:( So far, so good. It's only been a few weeks but I have noticed a HUGE improvement in her day to day functioning, attitude, and ability to stay focused on our school work.

[Mergath]

I was like that as a kid. I would lay in bed for hours, wide awake, finally falling asleep at three in the morning or so. Some people just have a different internal rhythm. To this day, I'm still a night owl, and my brain is most active between around eight in the evening and three in the morning, though I have trained myself to go to sleep by midnight. Does your dd sleep better during the day, or does she refuse to sleep at all?

 

A couple things that work for me: the first is sleepytime tea. I recently bought some that has chamomile and valerian, and it definitely helps me unwind. Also, I find guided meditations to be very helpful. You can buy them and download them, and they can be a great way to let your mind settle down for the night. Many times, I've used them and fell asleep before I even reached the end.

[EKS]

She has a night light etc.

 

A night light can actually interfere quite significantly with sleep.

[iammommy]

COnsider trying Clonidine. It helps a lot of kids. Seroquel is also often prescribed for sleep. How much melatonin are you giving her? Too much can have the opposite effect. HUGS! I know how difficult these sleep issues can be. My ds takes Seroquel for sleep, after Clonidine stopped working for him. I wish he didn't but the usual methods didn't help him, and he NEEDS to sleep.

 

HTH!

[jclinton]

We've tried teas etc they dont' work for her - she is not a night olw. She is a never go to sleep ever owl! My sister and I used to joke (in a not so haha funny way) when she was a baby that if we were Native American her indian name would be "Child who never sleeps". Even as an infant she slept much less than infants are "supposed to".

As for the night light - she is terrified of the dark and without the night light the anxiety level becomes uncontrollable - even more than her baseline.

I don't want to have to go to meds - but I'm afraid that's where we're headed.

It hasn't helped that I am working night shift right now. However, dg is trying something new tonight with a fan, and some other white noise in the background. Perhaps that will help.

JoAnne

[hsbaby]

Well, I know how she feels when it comes to the dark. I am 32 and still sleep with the TV on. Otherwise, my anxiety is through the roof.....the silence and darknesss puts my brain in overdrive. I start worrying, thinking too much, etc....I know.....so ridiculous:lol: Anyway, I know medication is something we all dislike resorting to, but sometimes it is the only thing that will help. As I mentioned, my dd has had sleeping issues as long as I can remember. We just now started giving her Clondine and she is 13!! I wish I hadn't waited so long. It's so nice to see her wake up refreshed, no dark circles, and able to focus far better than she has in the past. Good luck...I hope you find what works:)

[cjbeach]

Oh gosh we've had this issue for years.

Melatonin holidays work. Then go back to it.....

I find that if I give him melatonin then lay beside him for a bit he's out like a light. So many parents of ASD kids have told me the same thing - they need to lay by their child for the child to fall asleep.

I *just* got out of the library yesterday Special-Needs Kids Eat Right by Judy Converse. She's obviously all about the diet.

We know we *need* to go back to gfcf and we're weaning into. Just kicked casein out the door....again.

I have the book in front of me. For insomnia she recommends these treatments to try:

Melatonin 1-2 mg PM

5-HTP 25-50 mg afternoon

Taruine to 500mg PM

Theanine to 100mg PM

Epsom slats in bath PM

Magnesium to 300mg PM (give with calcium)

Sleepy nights herb tincture, by Wish Garden

( I already looked up Sleepy Nights http://www.1cascade.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=7729)

 

What's not mentioned that I think should be.... fish oil. I definitely see a difference in my guy when I run out of what I use, Nordic Naturals Jr (strawberry Flavored)

 

HTH!

Kathy

Edited March 23, 2010 by cjbeach
forgot the fish oil!

[Guest Pianomom]

A white noise machine really helped our non-sleeper since she is a light sleeper.:iagree:

[MariannNOVA]

See my thread on this board about the Blue Oil capsules from

 

www.greenpasture.org

 

 

We have been able to give up melatonin and ds and dd are sleeping well -

[Mamakarla]

We have been using Melatonin (3 mg.) for about six months now....it's the only way ds can fall asleep....we also lay with him until he drifts off most nights.....

 

I was wondering....does anyone know how long a person can safely take Melatonin? Can you just continue on and on as long as it is working?

 

Thanks!

[Pippen]

If you're not familiar with it, check out Restless Leg Syndrome. It can really mess with kid's sleep, and requires a sleep study to diagnose. I had a bout of it when I was on blood pressure meds and while reading the message boards discovered adults coming through who had it all their lives but weren't diagnosed until adulthood.

 

Have you tried a weighted blanket?

 

How about a much earlier bedtime? Sometimes when my kids couldn't go to sleep, it was because they'd passed the window of tiredness so I'd put them to bed ridiculously early for awhile and that seemed to help.

[jclinton]

YEAH!!! We've found a combination that works. First we use a fan for white noise in her room. I've reinvented the bedtime routine - schedule etc. I no longer let her sleep late just because she didn't sleep because I've found it starts a vicious cycle with her. She can take a short nap during the day if needed but no sleeping until 10:30 or 11. We've also added a product called Power to Sleep PM. I found it at the Sunshine Market one morning. I didn't find anything about valerian root and kids so I asked a doctor I work with he said it is fine for my dd (fyi she is almost 100#'s and is nearly 5 ft tall). So far it is working fairly well. There have been 1 or two nights that have been a struggle - but I think part of that has to do with hormonal changes than anything else. At any rate, thanks for all the advice and commiserating. I was so desparate when I posted - desparate and exhausted!

JoAnne

[TravelingChris]

Hormonal changes can definitely play a big part. My dd always had sleeping problems but about two years after starting her cycles, the insomnia became very bad. We went on for a while with panic attacks starting, extreme irritability, fogginess, etc, etc, and she was finally diagnosed as PMDD. NOw she is on Lexapro 20 mg for 2 weeks a month (she is on 10 mg every day for migraine prevention) and it has made a giant difference. I know your daughter is younger but I am just telling my story if in a few years, everything gets a lot worse all of a sudden. I just think some people are more sensitive to hormone levels. That dd is amazed that her mom (me) didn't have any type of PMS problems until very recently with perimenopause. She isn't so lucky.

[cillakat]

I hated resorting to meds, but nothing else worked:( So far, so good. It's only been a few weeks but I have noticed a HUGE improvement in her day to day functioning, attitude, and ability to stay focused on our school work.

 

Sleep is so incredibly important that really, if extreme measures must be taken, then so be it.

 

My dh takes ambien Every Single Night b/c nothing else works and he needs sleep.

 

When my kids were struggling with sleep stuff, we had the most benefit from (1 hr before bed) 500 mg tryptophan on an empty stomach with a small amount of clear juice. Tryptophan converts to seratotin converts to melatonin. For whatever reason it worked better than melatonin did.

 

Benedryl, while it's often effective, tends to have the somnolence side effect for only 3-5 days before one adapts to it.

 

Other measures that can be helpful:

optimizing dietary and supplemental magnesium throughout the day - many have higher dietary needs than would be expected based on the RDI. I take 500-1000 mg depending on a variety of factors. My kids each take 250 mg of magnesium dimalate with dinner.

 

Sufficient vitamin c and sufficient p5p form of B6 (from food plus additional from supplements) can sometimes be helpful as they are the cofactors of the tryptophan->5-htp->seratonin->melatonin conversion.

 

Sufficient B5 from food/supplements can be helpful as adrenal support (and C here as well)

 

Valerian seems to be at least somewhat effective **but it takes about a month to work**:

http://healthlibrary.epnet.com/GetContent.aspx?token=e0498803-7f62-4563-8d47-5fe33da65dd4&chunkiid=21730

 

:)

K

[Jill]

Has your daughter been thoroughly evaluated for food allergies and intolerances? My ds sleeps much better since dx'd w/celiac and being on his GF diet, I also sleep better now that I'm on the GF diet. On top of it though, I cannot take chamomile as a tea or topically. Anyone with a ragweed (hayfever) allergy should be aware of this: they might react to other members of the same family including chamomile and echinacea. So both of those, while helpful for some, just made me more miserable.

My husband and I used melatonin around here for a while off and on but had similar concerns about long term usage. I would keep up on the info if you find you have keep using it with her. It may affect auto-immune disorders but not necessarily for ill. Is that thing about wearing blue-filtering glasses to help your melatonin production correct? maybe those would help.

We use a fan as white noise in ds's room and removed all night-lights. both of those things help though diet was the biggie.

[jclinton]

Hormonal changes can definitely play a big part. My dd always had sleeping problems but about two years after starting her cycles, the insomnia became very bad. We went on for a while with panic attacks starting, extreme irritability, fogginess, etc, etc, and she was finally diagnosed as PMDD. NOw she is on Lexapro 20 mg for 2 weeks a month (she is on 10 mg every day for migraine prevention) and it has made a giant difference. I know your daughter is younger but I am just telling my story if in a few years, everything gets a lot worse all of a sudden. I just think some people are more sensitive to hormone levels. That dd is amazed that her mom (me) didn't have any type of PMS problems until very recently with perimenopause. She isn't so lucky.

 

 

Oh my goodness - you hit the nail on the head! I noticed a few months ago that when I should have had PMS dd got it (you know the old idea that women in the same house have cycles that align). At any rate, I am 100% certain she has hit puberty - she hasn't started her "cycle" yet but her hormones are definitely in gear! The insomnia and anxiety were getting worse during that time of the month. However, it has been better since we started the supplement with Valerian root. Although I don't think I have PMS - (tongue in cheeck here!) I do notice that I actually have more insomnia as well during that time.

At any rate, thanks for the input.