S/O on Yoga thread....

[Ibbygirl]

Do Tai Chi and Qi Gong have religious roots as well?? The Yoga thread got me thinking more about this. I have never done Yoga because I had some reservations about postures like the "sun salute" and saying "Namaste", but I have long been curious about trying either Tai Chi or Qi Gong instead of yoga for stretching and relaxation, but now I'm wondering about those as well. I really don't know much about them other than the fitness aspects of them so I was wondering if someone here knows if there are religious implications in them as well?? Thanks to all who reply. :)

[Jean in Newcastle]

Tai Chi moves are a physical representation of the religious philosophy of Taoism. Rosie might correct me but Taoism is basically a "way" of thinking that makes you one with the universe.

 

From what I understand Qi Gong is also Taoist in origin.

Edited January 17, 2010 by Jean in Newcastle

[Heather in Neverland]

Gosh, I really thought all of these were just exercise. :confused:

[Parrothead]

Gosh, I really thought all of these were just exercise. :confused:

Personally I really thing all of them can be "just exercise" if that is what you want them to be. God knows what is in your heart and knows if you are exercising or worshiping a pagan deity. He knows that there are some people that he brought into being that can only exercise (due to injury and/or illness) and take care of their gift from Him by doing those types of activities.

[mirth]

Tai Chi has firstly Buddhist, but mostly Taoist roots. A Shaolin monk (Chang) who already knew all the fighting styles one day watched a snake and crane fighting, and developed Tai Chi as a slow, meditative technique. The technology passed on to to a family called Chen who developed it further and added a martial (hard) form. The Chens guarded their technology for hundred of years because it gave them an advantage over opponents because it tricked people into thinking you were slow. A servant in the Chen household watched them and "stole" the secrets and developed it into another flowing style (Yang). From there is has been learned from various masters to students who have added styles.

 

I just overheard all this as dh was reading a kids book called Kung Fu and Tai Chi to ds.

Edited January 17, 2010 by mirth

[Ibbygirl]

Tai Chi has firstly Buddhist, but mostly Taoist roots. A Shaolin monk (Chang) who already knew all the fighting styles one day watched a snake and crane fighting, and developed Tai Chi as a slow, meditative technique. The technology passed on to to a family called Chen who developed it further and added a martial (hard) form. The Chens guarded their technology for hundred of years because it gave them an advantage over opponents because it tricked people into thinking you were slow. A servant in the Chen household watched them and "stole" the secrets and developed it into another flowing style (Yang). From there is has been learned from various masters to students who have added styles.

 

I just overheard all this as dh was reading a kids book called Kung Fu and Tai Chi to ds.

 

So Tai Chi is a fighting style?? I didn't know that. Wow! :)

[Rosie_0801]

Rosie might correct me but Taoism is basically a "way" of thinking that makes you one with the universe.

 

 

Or with God, if that's your persuasion.

 

Rosie

[Garga]

So Tai Chi is a fighting style?? I didn't know that. Wow! :)

 

That's what Khan was doing (Tai Chi) when he woke up from the freezer on the Starship Enterprise with Captain Kirk. And Khan was a good fighter, too. He even got to show up as the bad guy in one of the full-length movies later (The Wrath of Khan), so you know he was a good fighter!! :tongue_smilie: His movie was the one where those slugs went into people's ears, then grew really big and then ripped back out of their ears. That was the most gruesome thing I'd ever seen at the time (I was a kid.) Those images stuck in my mind for years and years and years...

 

Sorry. That was totally off topic.

[TXMomof4]

That's what Khan was doing (Tai Chi) when he woke up from the freezer on the Starship Enterprise with Captain Kirk. And Khan was a good fighter, too. He even got to show up as the bad guy in one of the full-length movies later (The Wrath of Khan), so you know he was a good fighter!! :tongue_smilie: His movie was the one where those slugs went into people's ears, then grew really big and then ripped back out of their ears. That was the most gruesome thing I'd ever seen at the time (I was a kid.) Those images stuck in my mind for years and years and years...

 

Sorry. That was totally off topic.

 

Those things in the ears gave me nightmares for years! Just thinking of it now give me the goosebumps.....

[helena]

helena's husband here

 

having been involved in chinese martial arts for over 20 years, studied in china with some of the top bagua/xingyi and taiji masters etc, just wanted to add my two cents.

 

taiji, and qi gong have historically been practiced by all of china's religious groups - though clearly, much of taiji's terminology is rooted in philosophical daoism (which is quite distinct from religious and or village level daoism). In relation to the study of martial arts, as well as traditional medicine, one could sum up the basics of this, as an understanding of the forces of nature, 5 elements etc. a descriptive process by which one brings understanding to the material at hand:

metal destroys wood (think ax). wood destroys earth (tree absorbs nutrients from earth). earth destroys water (absorbs it), water destroys fire etc.

descriptions such as how a willow tree bends in the wind, where a seemingly stronger oak tree may be blown over. these are non religious concepts rooted in a philosophical understanding of the world in which we live. There have been famous chinese martial artists from buddhist, religious daoist, muslim, and christian religious backgrounds, both past and present, who use these concepts to explain the physical movements, and or principles contained in both martial as well as healing arts, without contradiction to their faith (most likely understanding the origin of these things from their own religious understanding). The atheist for instance who practices qigong will understand it all in purely scientific terms (of which there is plenty of supporting science - relating to blood flow, electro-magnetic currents etc). Likewise, those of a religious background may or may not see the hand of God, the Spirit of God etc present in this activity, in the same way they may see it manifest in the world around them - but taiji or qigong in and of them selves, have no inherent religious overtones (other than what a particular group and or teacher may bring to it).

 

generally speaking, most taiji teachers from china are pretty secular (they may have a taoist or buddhist background, but it's not going to be too evident). there are as mentioned earlier, also plenty of masters from china and taiwan etc who are christian. really, the only thing to watch for, for the christians who are concerned, would be that some teachers from a buddhist or folk daoism/confucian type of background, would have some type of alter. in that case, you could either move on to a teacher who doesn't, or explain you are christian, and that you cannot bow to the alter etc.

[Ibbygirl]

That's what Khan was doing (Tai Chi) when he woke up from the freezer on the Starship Enterprise with Captain Kirk. And Khan was a good fighter, too. He even got to show up as the bad guy in one of the full-length movies later (The Wrath of Khan), so you know he was a good fighter!! :tongue_smilie: His movie was the one where those slugs went into people's ears, then grew really big and then ripped back out of their ears. That was the most gruesome thing I'd ever seen at the time (I was a kid.) Those images stuck in my mind for years and years and years...

 

Sorry. That was totally off topic.

 

LOL I always thought Khan was kinda hot. hehehe Wasn't he played by Ricardo Montalban or something?? Sorry, too lazy too Google it. How pathetic is that??!! hehe

[Ibbygirl]

helena's husband here

 

having been involved in chinese martial arts for over 20 years, studied in china with some of the top bagua/xingyi and taiji masters etc, just wanted to add my two cents.

 

taiji, and qi gong have historically been practiced by all of china's religious groups - though clearly, much of taiji's terminology is rooted in philosophical daoism (which is quite distinct from religious and or village level daoism). In relation to the study of martial arts, as well as traditional medicine, one could sum up the basics of this, as an understanding of the forces of nature, 5 elements etc. a descriptive process by which one brings understanding to the material at hand:

metal destroys wood (think ax). wood destroys earth (tree absorbs nutrients from earth). earth destroys water (absorbs it), water destroys fire etc.

descriptions such as how a willow tree bends in the wind, where a seemingly stronger oak tree may be blown over. these are non religious concepts rooted in a philosophical understanding of the world in which we live. There have been famous chinese martial artists from buddhist, religious daoist, muslim, and christian religious backgrounds, both past and present, who use these concepts to explain the physical movements, and or principles contained in both martial as well as healing arts, without contradiction to their faith (most likely understanding the origin of these things from their own religious understanding). The atheist for instance who practices qigong will understand it all in purely scientific terms (of which there is plenty of supporting science - relating to blood flow, electro-magnetic currents etc). Likewise, those of a religious background may or may not see the hand of God, the Spirit of God etc present in this activity, in the same way they may see it manifest in the world around them - but taiji or qigong in and of them selves, have no inherent religious overtones (other than what a particular group and or teacher may bring to it).

 

generally speaking, most taiji teachers from china are pretty secular (they may have a taoist or buddhist background, but it's not going to be too evident). there are as mentioned earlier, also plenty of masters from china and taiwan etc who are christian. really, the only thing to watch for, for the christians who are concerned, would be that some teachers from a buddhist or folk daoism/confucian type of background, would have some type of alter. in that case, you could either move on to a teacher who doesn't, or explain you are christian, and that you cannot bow to the alter etc.

 

Thank you so much for posting this. I really appreciate your taking the time. :) I'm so glad you did. I have long been curious about learning either Tai Chi or Qi Gong and I'm glad that I can do so with a free conscious. Thank you again. :)