I need curriculum help!going crazy!

[sherry80]

Hi, I am new to this board, I am a mom to 4, ages 8,6,3,and 8mo. We are currently using Christian Light Education for all subjects. I am probably only going to stick with their math and bible. We are doing grades 1st and 2nd. My younger is 1/2 way through CLE phonics so she still needs to finish phonics.

 

I think I am going to get FLL and WWE for grammar and writing. I was wondering how long these subjects take each day on the part of the mom. I am kind of nervous b/c they do seem like one-to-one curriculum, not where the child is working independently so I have to make sure I will have enough time to spend with each child.

 

I will probably finish phonics instruction with OPGTTR and just start where we left off in CLE.

 

My problem that I cannot decide on is history!!! I am thinking Sonlight or Story of the World. I am not a teacher by nature so I thought SL is more laid out, but I also don't like the idea of reading so many different books in one day. I love their read alouds but am also nervous because it will require a lot of time on my part.

SOTW seems like you have to organize on your own more. I would use it with the AG. I'm not the type that likes to do activities though so that doesn't really appeal to me. It seems like it would be a lot cheaper than SL b/c you can get books from the library to read with it.

 

My questions about history are:

How much time does SL core 1 take per day?

How much time does SOTW take with AG?

Are the books in SL similar to the ones listed in SOTW AG book list?

Which keeps your attention more?

Is one more biblically based/friendly than the other?

 

 

Are there any other curriculums you would recommend? I like bible based if possible, reading lists of books you can get from the library (I was going to get most of SL books from there also)

I also need something that is a little "open and go" I am happy to get school done, but don't have extra time for planning, although I don't mind library trips. I don't care if it follows classical timeline or not. I want a curriculum only for history and read alouds with good literature and wonderful books we will enjoy as a family.

I don't want a lot of projects although I do see the benefit of doing them sometimes.

 

Thanks for any help you have!

[Bird Girl]

You may be comparing things that are not exactly alike. SL core 1 uses two history books as spines--and it's worth it to buy both--the Usborne's World History and A Child's History of the World, by Hillyer. When I did Core 1 with my DD, I dropped CHOW and substituted SOTW, without the activity guide, since I thought that CHOW was too young for my DD, who's pretty advanced. Instead of activities, SL adds in geography activities for the markable map (any laminated world map will be fine,) and extra books, mainly historical fiction for the history portion of the core. If you want to spend a large part of each day reading--maybe 120 minutes or so--go with SL. I haven't used the Activity guide for SOTW so I can't comment on that.

 

I didn't feel that I read that many different books in a day with Sonlight. You have a history reading assignment, a "reader" assignment that the kids read to themselves, and often another literature book or poetry assignment in one day. (I don't use their bible program.) We often saved the read-aloud literature book for bedtime reading, and add in other books as we like. Unless you are using a totally workbook-based language arts program, you will still read from around three books each day, right?

 

If you want to buy the instructor's guide to Core 1, the two history spines, and get the other books from the library, you will be spending around $100, $50 for the IG, and $25 for each of the spine books. (Assuming you can't get any of it used--perhaps you can.) You can get the other books from your library or interlibrary loan, depending on the quality of your library. I don't know how much the SOTW AG is, but you should also factor in the cost of doing projects, whatever those might be.

[StephanieZ]

Hi, I am new to this board, I am a mom to 4, ages 8,6,3,and 8mo. We are currently using Christian Light Education for all subjects. I am probably only going to stick with their math and bible. We are doing grades 1st and 2nd. My younger is 1/2 way through CLE phonics so she still needs to finish phonics.

 

I think I am going to get FLL and WWE for grammar and writing. I was wondering how long these subjects take each day on the part of the mom. I am kind of nervous b/c they do seem like one-to-one curriculum, not where the child is working independently so I have to make sure I will have enough time to spend with each child.

 

I will probably finish phonics instruction with OPGTTR and just start where we left off in CLE.

 

My problem that I cannot decide on is history!!! I am thinking Sonlight or Story of the World. I am not a teacher by nature so I thought SL is more laid out, but I also don't like the idea of reading so many different books in one day. I love their read alouds but am also nervous because it will require a lot of time on my part.

SOTW seems like you have to organize on your own more. I would use it with the AG. I'm not the type that likes to do activities though so that doesn't really appeal to me. It seems like it would be a lot cheaper than SL b/c you can get books from the library to read with it.

 

My questions about history are:

How much time does SL core 1 take per day?

How much time does SOTW take with AG?

Are the books in SL similar to the ones listed in SOTW AG book list?

Which keeps your attention more?

Is one more biblically based/friendly than the other?

 

 

Are there any other curriculums you would recommend? I like bible based if possible, reading lists of books you can get from the library (I was going to get most of SL books from there also)

I also need something that is a little "open and go" I am happy to get school done, but don't have extra time for planning, although I don't mind library trips. I don't care if it follows classical timeline or not. I want a curriculum only for history and read alouds with good literature and wonderful books we will enjoy as a family.

I don't want a lot of projects although I do see the benefit of doing them sometimes.

 

Thanks for any help you have!

 

I'm doing SL Core 1 (5 day, 2 Int readers) this year with my youngest. (We do not do the bible portion and we omit the occasional missionary story/book from the history assignments.) Our read-alouds are maybe 15-30 min each day. DD's reading is maybe 10 min/day (this will very a lot depending on which reader level you pick and how adept a reader your child is.) It's all quite quick and easy. Dd loves it. I love it. I love SL.

 

We've done SOTW (1 & 2) with AG's in the past. I like SOTW (and my olders are using it this year with core 6. . . and my younger loves to listen in to the CDs. . .) It's good stuff. It just became too much work for me when I moved somewhere with a crummy library. When I lived somewhere with a fantastic library and more time on my hands, SOTW was the cat's meow for us.

 

The SL books often come up on SOTW lists, as the SL books are awesome and the SOTW lists use many of the same criteria as SL -- but just have a much wider scope than SL does -- seemingly listing virtually every good option one could use as opposed to picking the best few. The nice thing about SL is that they comb through all the hundreds of possibilities for each year and choose the best. Really, they do, IMHO. So, instead of having to choose among 20 possibilities each week in the AG, you just have the 2 or 3 current books for SL and there you go. All in one box, one shelf, ready to go. I appreciate that convenience.

[JaneP]

Hi

 

No real suggestions here ... but since you be teaching four kids (if you continue to home school) have you considered choosing a curriculum where you could combine them in history? It might make a difference to what you choose now.

 

Biblioplan might be work a look. It uses SOTW.

 

All the best !

Edited December 17, 2009 by JaneP
added more info

[krismoose]

Are there any other curriculums you would recommend? I like bible based if possible, reading lists of books you can get from the library (I was going to get most of SL books from there also)

I also need something that is a little "open and go" I am happy to get school done, but don't have extra time for planning, although I don't mind library trips. I don't care if it follows classical timeline or not. I want a curriculum only for history and read alouds with good literature and wonderful books we will enjoy as a family.

I don't want a lot of projects although I do see the benefit of doing them sometimes.

 

You might look at Heart of Dakota http://www.heartofdakota.com/

The Bible is the core of it and is woven throughout the lessons. It is very open-and-go, and yet flexible enough to choose your own math & LA if you prefer. The history, bible and science are more intertwined, and would be harder to substitute, I think. It is also flexible enough that you could pick a level to combine your kids in for history, science, bible or do separate programs as best fit their needs. The read-alouds are more bite-size and the program teaches the student more independence as they progress through the guides, doing more reading & tasks on their own as they grow older. The books are excellent and very much "living books"; the curriculum is Charlotte Mason-style. Projects are done, but they call for everyday items that require very little planning ahead. The message boards on their site are also very helpful. I'm just doing kindergarten, and am so thankful to have found this program at the beginning of our homeschooling journey! HTH :)

[rachelkelly3]

Hi!

 

I was very recently struggling with the same thing.

 

I used Core K and am in the middle of Core 1 with my 8 and 6 year olds, with a 4 and 3 year old in the wings. I adore Sonlight's philosophy and reading lists. Love it!

 

HOWEVER, I cannot continue using Sonlight for the following reasons:

 

1) I cannot combine my kids without creating a monstrous amount of work for myself. Too much modifying = NOT an open and go curriculum. So, multiple cores.

2) My kids are mostly kinesthetic learners, so they need hands on stuff.

3) With 4 kids, I couldn't get the read alouds done every day, so I was constantly feeling like I was behind. Also, some of the books were WAY over their heads, so it wasn't enjoyable.

4) I really felt like the instructor's guide was disjointed. Read a chapter from this book, then jump over here to this other book that has nothing to do with what we just read...it was driving me crazy!

5) SL is expensive. Very. I bought everything second hand and it was still expensive. Something to consider.

 

Please keep in mind, I have zero creativity and very little time to organize, so I really wanted an open and go curriculum as well. To answer your questions:

 

My questions about history are:

How much time does SL core 1 take per day? For us, the read alouds, bible, and language arts takes between one hour and 1.5 hours. The math we usually finish in 20-30 minutes in addition to that. We can do an entire week of Core 1 science in an hour, so...we're looking elsewhere for that. :)

 

How much time does SOTW take with AG? This is my second try with SOTW and classical education because I am in love with the concept and structure. In my personal experience, SOTW with the AG takes between 20-60 minutes, depending on the project. We do it 3 days a week minimum, my kids are history buffs, and we read a LOT in our free reading time (books that tie in with SOTW).

 

Are the books in SL similar to the ones listed in SOTW AG book list? Yes and no. The read alouds are not, but what we do is use the Sonlight book list for our read alouds during family reading time. We just take our time and enjoy them. The best way to get the best history books is to use the Sonlight list, the Well Trained Mind lists, and the SOTW AG lists. Pick and choose! Can't go wrong with an Usborne!

 

Which keeps your attention more? SOTW is better for us. Like I said, the bouncing around in the Sonlight IG was making us very confused. I originally thought the SOTW was way too simplistic (I was a very insecure new HS mother) and I was convinced I needed something much BIGGER to make sure the kids were being educated. I have since discovered that SOTW is MORE than enough, it engages even the little ones, and the projects are wonderful. We are learning much more from SOTW than Sonlight, at this point.

 

Is one more biblically based/friendly than the other? SL has an actual Bible component, but we just bought the book they use and are using it independently. Both curriculums address world religions, missions, etc. We may use SL in the high school years for that.

 

Sorry, this got long. :) Basically, I'm a big fan of both SL and SOTW. What I did learn is that at this stage in the homeschooling journey, not much in the way of "curriculum" is necessary. A good math program (we use Singapore and Horizons interchangeably), a good LA program, and you're all set. Just read tons of books about everything! The goal at this stage is just to foster a thirst for learning. :)

[PeterPan]

In addition to Heart of Dakota, have you looked at My Father's World? It would be all the things you're wanting, have levels you could use to combine all your kids, be efficient, etc.

[....]

We are finishing up Core 1 - it's really NOT that much reading if you have kids who like to be read to...and can combine kids into one core... However...

 

If you have kids who need a lot of hands-on stuff, SL is not for you!

 

I also got most of the books from the library and only bought some of the odd selections (Usborne and CHOW) and of course the Readers (the books that the kids read themselves). :D

 

I gotta say, though...the Readers are awesome. My kids flat-out told me that they hate CLE and just want to do the SL Readers. :tongue_smilie:

 

I also have no regrets from doing the Read-Alouds (which we check out at the library). Some of those books made lasting impressions on the kids (like Mountain Born and Mrs. Piggle-Wiggle). You can even get some of the audio books on CD and listen to them in the car (we did). It's not very academic or workbooky, but SL's literature selection has a lot of classic books (and some Newberry Medals) that kids probably should read anyway.

 

But, you can see from my signature that we supplement - a LOT.

 

Good luck in your decision!

[sherry80]

What about using SOTW and adding in the sonlight books? And you can pick and choose which activity to do in SOTW right? What would I be missing from not getting the Sonlight IG?

 

I have used MFW for K and 1st for my oldest but I felt like I needed more "bookwork." HOD seems like I would have to modify too much since I don't want to use it for all subjects. Biblioplan seems a little basic, not enough book selections that would be at the library.

 

So I guess I am either thinking:

1. SL core 1 by itself

2. SL core 1 adding in SOTW book, maybe AG to pick hands on, but this might be too overwhelming

3. SOTW with AG using SL book lists added in as we have time(a lot of what appeals to me about SL is the read alouds, which could be used on their own for family reading)

 

I like that SOTW reads aloud from SOTW but then the book list, from what I understand is for kids to read on their own. So when things get busy, I would only HAVE to read aloud from SOTW, whereas SL you could get behind a lot faster since there is more reading aloud required. SOTW also has the CD option as well.

 

Is the SOTW book list really good? Can you pick and choose what activities you want to do, you don't feel like you have to do all these complicated activities, having to shop for a bunch of supplies?

 

Do any of you use CLE Math and add in something else? It seems like my kids are moving through the math really fast and it only takes them 20-30 minutes per day and I'm not sure if that is enough time to spend on math. I like CLE but should I add in a supplement?

 

Do you think FLL and WWE will be easy to implement? How much time do these take per day of the teacher?

 

I really appreciate all of your help!

Sherry

[JudoMom]

Hi

 

No real suggestions here ... but since you be teaching four kids (if you continue to home school) have you considered choosing a curriculum where you could combine them in history? It might make a difference to what you choose now.

 

Biblioplan might be work a look. It uses SOTW.

 

All the best !

 

I was going to suggest Biblioplan. It makes it very easy to combine different ages.

[siloam]

What about using SOTW and adding in the sonlight books? And you can pick and choose which activity to do in SOTW right? What would I be missing from not getting the Sonlight IG?

Yes you can do all of that. The SL IG has exactly what to read scheduled out for you each day. SOTW AG only gives you what books would go nicely with that chapter. It doesn't tell you exactly what pages to read on what days.

 

The mapping is also slightly different. With SL there is the big markable map, and anytime you read about a place you generally mark it on the map. With SOTW the mapping is more traditional. Generally more about a specific time or event, so you map the whole area and not just fine one place.

 

SL doens't have any coloring pictures or activities that SOTW AG has. SL does have comprehension questions, but won't have the review cards, prompts for narration and such that the SOTW AG has. SL really doesn't have any sort of review. SL is more about exposing the child to ideas, where SOTW can be used for more mastery of content. Now that doesn't say you couldn't easily modify either, but that is they direction they naturally lend themselves to.

 

I didn't compare book lists.

 

I have used MFW for K and 1st for my oldest but I felt like I needed more "bookwork." HOD seems like I would have to modify too much since I don't want to use it for all subjects. Biblioplan seems a little basic, not enough book selections that would be at the library.

SL has a heavier base reading schedule than MFW, and it doesn't have the book list for extra reading the MFW has. It is scheduled daily like MFW.

 

If you don't think MFW has enough "bookwook" I am not sure you will find SL better. It does have the comprehension questions, but the mapping is light, IMO. The focus is much more one of reading and enjoying the books. The comprehension questions were not part of the original program, so while they are there...it is only because people have asked for them, not because the authors are trying to make the program demanding, KWIM?

 

So I guess I am either thinking:

1. SL core 1 by itself

2. SL core 1 adding in SOTW book, maybe AG to pick hands on, but this might be too overwhelming

3. SOTW with AG using SL book lists added in as we have time(a lot of what appeals to me about SL is the read alouds, which could be used on their own for family reading)

 

Remember that at the Core 1 level the Read Alouds don't correlate with history. You really could easily add them to SOTW. The order doesn't matter.

 

 

Is the SOTW book list really good? Can you pick and choose what activities you want to do, you don't feel like you have to do all these complicated activities, having to shop for a bunch of supplies?

 

I don't know about the book list, but you can pick and choose the activities. I found them to be a bit complicated for me, but at the time my oldest was 6 and I had three toddlers in the middle of anything we tried to do. Anything more than an ice holding contest was exhausting. :D Too many "helping" hands.

 

Do you think FLL and WWE will be easy to implement? How much time do these take per day of the teacher?

 

I adore FLL and WWE. I don't find either take a huge amount of time, though I don't follow the scripts in FLL. I use it more for big idea prompts which I cover in my own way. WWE I actually follow the script a lot closer. The thing that takes the longest is to read part of the story being summarized. The questions we can usually go through pretty quickly, though we do have those occasional days when they don't remember anything and it takes a lot longer.

 

If you want something Bible based I would suggest The Mystery of History (MOH). Volume 1 works great for younger kids. The activities are doable (the ice holding contest is from the week of covering the Ice Age). The hard thing is that volume 2 is quite a step up, so you might have to revert back to SOTW. My oldest did fine with it in 2nd grade, but she adores history. Pumpkin, my 2nd dd who doesn't like history, did the activities, but really didn't sit in on the reading much. The activities are very doable, but the book list isn't going to be easy to find at the library. You could use the SL books through. Lots of SL users add in MOH, which is what I did, so there are several schedules in the MOH Yahoo files.

 

BTW I do a TON of 1 on 1 programs. My best advice is to take it one step at a time. It is the toughest emotionally when you have littles running around. Once they are all potty trained it is amazing how much easier things can be. There is just something so draining about dealing with other people's bodily functions. You will learn how to step it up as you go. Right now I do have to have things split into daily activities, which they can do independently, and those which they do with me one on one that are the most important. Then I also have "loop" stuff that they do one on one with me a couple times a week. I just don't have enough time to get it all done in one day. Yet we are still moving forward.

 

Heather

Edited December 17, 2009 by siloam

[Another Lynn]

What about using SOTW and adding in the sonlight books? And you can pick and choose which activity to do in SOTW right? What would I be missing from not getting the Sonlight IG?

 

I have used MFW for K and 1st for my oldest but I felt like I needed more "bookwork." HOD seems like I would have to modify too much since I don't want to use it for all subjects. Biblioplan seems a little basic, not enough book selections that would be at the library.

 

So I guess I am either thinking:

1. SL core 1 by itself

2. SL core 1 adding in SOTW book, maybe AG to pick hands on, but this might be too overwhelming

3. SOTW with AG using SL book lists added in as we have time(a lot of what appeals to me about SL is the read alouds, which could be used on their own for family reading)

 

I like that SOTW reads aloud from SOTW but then the book list, from what I understand is for kids to read on their own. So when things get busy, I would only HAVE to read aloud from SOTW, whereas SL you could get behind a lot faster since there is more reading aloud required. SOTW also has the CD option as well.

 

Is the SOTW book list really good? Can you pick and choose what activities you want to do, you don't feel like you have to do all these complicated activities, having to shop for a bunch of supplies?

 

Do any of you use CLE Math and add in something else? It seems like my kids are moving through the math really fast and it only takes them 20-30 minutes per day and I'm not sure if that is enough time to spend on math. I like CLE but should I add in a supplement?

 

Do you think FLL and WWE will be easy to implement? How much time do these take per day of the teacher?

 

I really appreciate all of your help!

Sherry

 

Just .02.... I've never used MFW, but I'm just wondering what you mean by bookwork? Also, I do know that there K and 1st grade guides are a little different from their other guides. At upper levels I think you can chose your own math and LA where (I think) those subjects are built in for K and 1st? I guess I'm saying I wouldn't discount MFW's later guides based on what you thought of it's K and 1st grades. Also, if you're looking for more bookwork, I'm wondering if FLL and WWE will seem light to you as well?

[sherry80]

I used mfw for k with one child that loves workbooks and was begging for more work! I did MFW 1st that same year with a child who does not like school but wasn't reading well so I felt she needed more review/practice.

 

I did love how they implemented the bible throughout.

 

I guess why I was thinking about changing LA from CLE b/c I was reading a little about FLL and WWE and it seems to be more understanding what's important to learn---compared to asking a lot of reading comprehension questions about stories that aren't really great literature.

 

After searching the boards it does seem like CLE LA is a strong program so I was kind of reconsidering. CLE does work well b/c it is more independent instead of one-to-one. I am a very busy mom with littles around.

 

I do think I might just switch my younger one to OPGTTR b/c she is so ready to read and CLE 1st moves fast but starts at the beginning of learning to read. She did that in K and she is so ready. I was thinking about doing OPGTTR with math and really focusing on finishing out the rest of the sounds/spelling rules/phonics. I think we would move pretty fast, she loves school.

 

I do really like the idea of learning phonics/learning to read before you work on grammar and spelling and CLE does not do that. You start all those subjects at the same time (1st grade)

 

***ALL IN ALL- I am leaning towards getting SOTW with AG, adding in read alouds of good books(like SL's books)

I think I will finish out phonics instruction with OPGTTR and then just move back to CLE LA at least for this year.

 

 

Thanks for all the suggestions!

Sherry

[zantoc]

Sherry,

I have used and sold quite a few things: Sonlight, HOD and MFW over the years and now am using Biblioplan and it is wonderful. It incorporates a wider age range than MFW and I like doing my own Bible and science, so that made a difference for us. Their read alouds are very good and the schedule is only for 3 days a week so I have a few extra days to catch up so to speak. Plus it schedules in SOTW and MOH so it includes everything I wanted to do but couldn't. And the price is nice to even utilize it as a booklist!

HTH

Christa

[sherry80]

I am thinking of sotw with activity guide.

I think maybe we should try the narration in sotw and see how that works for us before we switch our cle la. I think the main thing that annoys me about cle is all the diatrical markings. It looks like it starts to decrease half way through 2nd grade.

sherry

[Julie in MN]

***ALL IN ALL- I am leaning towards getting SOTW with AG, adding in read alouds of good books(like SL's books)

 

 

Sherry,

It sounds like you've made up your mind -- always a relief!

 

But for others reading this thread, it would not make sense to say that SOTW & AG would be considered "more book work" than MFW, since MFW uses SOTW (books 2-4 & AG-4), and tons of other resources added to that. SOTW on its own would be like using 1/4 of MFW, so it couldn't be classified as "more" unless you add to it -- which you can do with any program.

 

Just trying to be clear,

Julie

[sherry80]

Yes, I cannot comment on MFW 2-8th grade as I only used K and 1st. I didn't think it was light on history, I needed more worksheets for LA and Math and phonics.

So I guess I didn't mean that I picked SOTW b/c of it having more book work. I have CLE for other bible, La, reading and math, which is a workbook type of curriculum. I figure with SOTW we will see how we do with narrration for this subject and read a lot of really good books, and less bookwork than a textbook history curriculum.

I like workbooks b/c the kids can work a little more independently.

Sorry if I was unclear!

Sherry

[Julie in MN]

Sorry if I was unclear!

Sherry

 

Thanks, Sherry, I didn't mean to say that I'm always clear, myself! But just wanted to put that out there. These threads stay on the boards forever, ya know :)

[rachelkelly3]

Sherry, I think you'll be happy trying SOTW with AG and adding the Sonlight books in. We are REALLY enjoying the read alouds WITHOUT a specific schedule, assignments, etc. My kids are much happier with the laid back and engaging style of SOTW, FFL, and WWE! Hopefully, it continues to work for us :)

 

Feel free to message me anytime as we try this new approach at the same time :)

 

Rachel

[Lovedtodeath]

What about SOTW all planned for you? Picture books and read alouds with no scheduling to do, no library trips or decisions needed?

 

Personally, with FLL and WWE it took me a while to get used to doing both instead of one or the other.

Edited December 18, 2009 by Lovedtodeath

[RootAnn]

I have a bunch of little ones running around and we like SOTW at this point. We use the AG & pick and choose activities to do. We usually do the coloring as the 6 yr old is an 'artist' and the 8 yr old needs lots of practice in fine motor skills. SOTW 2 has many cooking activities that they like and we've even made a craft project or two. (The hanging snakes were a hit & we just made the coin purse.)

 

We use the literature list in the AG in combo with a really nice BIG library about 1 1/2 hrs away and love it. When we just used the local library and lots on the 'history' list, we didn't like it very much.

 

So, don't think you have to use SL books if you can find the AG-listed literature books at your local library. I think that in general you will like them. (They do tend to be 'at grade level' so if you use SOTW later/earlier, you may want to add in appropriate history-related SL -suggested books.) We are big readers here (although my 6 yr old isn't yet), so more books are better at our place.