Do you have a kid who doesn't like history?

[Annie Laurie]

I have one kid who could care less about history. He's about to turn 9. I have tried too many different programs and have finally realized that he just isn't going to care. Truthfully, he doesn't care about most school related things, he just wants to get it done and go play with his Snap Circuits, Playmobil, Legos, and go outside. He doesn't like to read either so his only reading each day is what I assign.

 

So I have finally realized that I need to stop worrying and trying to make it fun, it's not going to change his mind and it's truly okay for him to just get down a solid history overview and have that be enough. He'd rather do science.

 

But his sister is 19 mos younger than him and advanced, so it seemed so easy to keep them combined for history. She loves history though, she will sit and watch documentaries, she liked the parts of John Adams she was allowed to watch. She reads constantly. She loves doing all the related crafts and projects too. History is probably her favorite subject, next to art.

 

So how do I keep them combined? Or do I not combine them anymore? She wants to really dig in with the history, she loves programs like SL and WP. She wants the crafts and tons of books.

 

I could just tell ds9 that he has to sit and listen to the history spine and then he can go, and then do the other stuff with dd. But I know him, and he'll just tune me out then and not retain a thing about it. It's like he has to have some kind of interaction, like writing down a short narration of what I read or filling out a related worksheet or something. The only things he retained from SL Core 1 last year were the info in the History Pockets, he did tolerate those.

 

So do I get him a history workbook or textbook for a short overview? Do I make him listen to the history spine and write something short about it and then dismiss him? Do I just not worry about it and wait until he's in middle school to start insisting on history participation?

 

Suggestions? Experiences with a kid who doesn't like history?

[Sue G in PA]

No suggestions...just sympathy. NONE of my kids like history. NONE. My ds9 can barely get his core subjects done w/out worrying about history or even science. I would just present it as one of the subjects he must do. Have him listen to the lesson/story for the day and do a narration. There are many ways to do narrations so be creative. Writing is only one way. Orally is another. Does he like to build? Draw? Sculpt? Write news articles or poetry? If he is not creative, don't include him in the creative stuff. Remember, he'll get more in middle and high school and perhaps by then he'll have some sort of tolerance or even a fondness for some aspect of History. Me? I HATED history until I started teaching it to my kids! Now, it's my favorite subject! I wasn't scarred b/c I didn't love history. I learned the info. and got the grade and promptly forgot. Now, I love it so I remember it. I keep reminding myself that if the kid's not into history, it's just not his "bent". We'll do it to say we did it, try to have some fun and learn something, but other than that...I have resigned myself to the fact that I don't have history loving kids. Good luck!

[5LittleMonkeys]

You said he doesn't like to read. Is that any kind of reading or just what he considers school related reading? Would he possibly be into reading historical fiction? Would he do better just being able to pick and choose what he learns about in history? You said he likes to build things. Could you possibly get him interested by showing him pictures of things throughout history he could try to build? Ziggurats, citadels, castles, seige towers, a Trojan horse? Have you tried finding history websites for kids? I remember seeing some of them that were somewhat interactive. Just throwing ideas out. :confused:

 

My dd5th doesn't love history either but atleast she will tolerate it if she knows there will be a craft or art project to do. I don't worry too much about what she is retaining. She is very talented in other areas (art) so we take a few minutes each week to preview what is coming up the next week in history and I let her come up with ideas for immersing herself into the topic through art. Sometimes she will be able to find books at the library that talk about the art of the region or time we are studying. I do require she listen to the read alouds and write a brief narration (I'm talking 3 lines max). She also will do the mapwork since she gets to color it.

 

Maybe letting your son direct how he learns history would be more appealing to him. Of coarse, I wouldn't worry too much about it at his age. Perhaps he just needs time to do his thing and grow a bit more. I would make sure you always give him opportunities to discover an interest in history. You never know what it might be that lights that fire. A book about great architects throughout history maybe.;)

[JennW in SoCal]

My kids hated history too!

 

But what they did like (both being boys and preferring legos over most anything else) was Discovery Channel and Nova shows that had to do with building and history. For instance, the Building Big series from about 10 years ago was absolutely cool. Each episode was about a specific engineering feat, and how it was improved upon over the centuries -- bridges, domes, tunnels, dams, and skyscrapers I think were the 5 episodes. Also, Nova had a terrific series called "Secrets of Lost Empires" where engineers tried to build pyramids, catapults and other ancient constructions using ancient techniques. Both these series are available on Netflix. There are also some great books about castles and pyramids that might appeal to their lego sensibilities.

 

They liked mythology, and some historical fiction, and would listen to audio books while building with Legos. They also learned quite a bit of history by visiting air plane and science museums repeatedly over the years. We revisited history in middle school and high school, and I've always tried to tie in history with their literature assignments, so they have a decent overview, if not the detailed knowledge I envisioned.

[PeterPan]

Well I'm the history hater and I have a history-lover dc. Nuts, my mother loves history (runs a museum) and her husband works at another and does antiques on the side! Me, I look like a fool when I talk about history, confuse the names, have no sense of time, etc. Just didn't carry over into my genes, lol. When I listen to your situation, my first thought is you need to work with his learning style. Have you tried a learning styles assessment? There are free ones like the one at http://www.educate.com (search around for it). If he's a visual learner, reading him the story will just go in one ear and out the other. Yes, writing it will improve retention for a visual learner. Giving him a TEXTBOOK or something he can read for himself will help even more.

 

I suggest you find his best learning style, which may be visual, and increase input in that method. You can integrate history into his other areas without being too heavy-handed. There is well-written historical fiction he might enjoy, despite its being history. COFA's (Childhood of Famous Americans), the nicely illustrated retellings of ancient lit (Wanderings of Odysseus, that type thing), etc. Consider getting him a timeline and USE it. Some people are parts to whole and others are whole to part. In other words, the facts of history scatter in the wind and don't seem to have a place, a file folder, when you study them all drawn out. When you put them into a place with a timeline or a tool like the VP history cards (AWESOME, highly recommend), he can see where things fit, how they connect. Growing up I thought I was supposed to be learning 10,000 years of history (an insurmountable task!), because no one ever informed me things overlapped. Imagine my surprise, hehe, when I found out things were occurring at the same time, that there were connections, and that it was a very discrete thing we were trying to cover. So the more you give him the big picture, be it with history books that SURVEY or visual representations that let him grasp the whole, the easier it may be. That is if his brain is that type of thinker. Again, read on learning styles.

 

BTW, VP history is unique in that it works well for this history hater (because it has discrete, clear expectations) and the history lover (because you can expand it, run with it, flesh it out). It might be a spine you could use with BOTH your young ones.

Edited November 5, 2009 by OhElizabeth

[Snickerdoodle]

We recently started History at Our House. We just listen to the prerecorded lessons. My son really likes it but he likes history.

 

Basically, there is 3 days a week of history lecture and one day a week of History through Art and a geography component.

 

Maybe this would be a good way to keep the kids together?

[samba]

My dd5th is a history hater too. I've tried a variety of things over the last few years in hopes of changing that. Last year we did Abeka 4 with Sonlight 3 and 4 lit and VP cards. It was our most successful year, I think because we weren't reading from sources all over the place. We got the nitty gritty from the cards and ONE text and enjoyed some great books. I read plenty of books that she easily could have read herself if I thought they would enrich our history studies. She produced an amazing notebook and this is the stuff she remembers. She found images from the computer, printed and cut them out and wrote about them. No coloring, making projects, etc. She needed finite assignments that got the job done. I think her grasp of history is weaker than it should be but that could change as we go through the cycles again. Then again, maybe it will always be like that (I don't love history but my mom does). I finally had to accept that and move forward with all the stuff she does do well.

 

Next year we'll be following the same approach that seems to be working this year: one textbook, BJU Heritage studies 6 with the workbook (she'll LIKE the workbook) and Ancient History portfolio for our notebook. It will add some variety to her writing assignments and present them in a neat format that she'll like, I think. I'll continue to pull great books from VP and Sonlight.

 

This is looking a little far into the future but I'll throw it out there anyway because I've been thinking about it so much lately. I really wanted to use TOG with this kid...already own Years 2 and 3. I love all the other stuff it adds (lit, worldview, philosophy, etc) but I knew the history overload would do her in and wasn't sure how to make it work. So here's my current plan: use the text spine listed in the alternate readings (Spielvogel; I think it's pretty good, especially from a non-history lover's point of view) and have this be it for the history portion. She'll get the basics she needs and we can still enjoy all the other offerings of TOG. Just throwing that out there...there are many different ways to get where we want our kids to be. It just won't look like how I initially envisioned it. I think part of it was pride on my part (What! You use a textbook for history?). I had to get over my hangup and do what works for my dd.

 

This was really long (sorry) but I have spent way too much time, energy and money worrying about history. I'm done worrying...we'll see what happens. Just wanted to share our saga :tongue_smilie:

[rafiki]

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[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I have one kid who could care less about history. He's about to turn 9. I have tried too many different programs and have finally realized that he just isn't going to care. He'd rather do science.

 

But his sister is 19 mos younger than him and advanced, so it seemed so easy to keep them combined for history. She loves history though,

 

So how do I keep them combined? Or do I not combine them anymore? She wants to really dig in with the history, she loves programs like SL and WP. She wants the crafts and tons of books.

 

Suggestions? Experiences with a kid who doesn't like history?

 

Your post made me think of this blog post written by Angelina (CajunClassical on these boards, I think). I read this a while back and it planted a seed.

 

Boys sometimes enjoy the gritty, manly facets of history while we moms offer up what appeals to our feminine senses. What's good for our daughters might not work equally well for our sons. Granted, you say he also doesn't like to read for pleasure but I can't help thinking it's worth a shot to put out books about scientific and/or boyish aspects of history (weaponry, spy techniques, wild west outlaws, etc.). Maybe he'd like to build a catapult for a craft project, as that includes some science and history. DS6 is currently enjoying some of the "You Wouldn't Want to..." books with all their unpleasantries while DD5 searches through all of our American history coloring books to find the pictures with the women and babies to color...and they are always "baby girls," of course. ;)

 

As someone who wants to keep all my dc on the same historic timeline for the long haul, I'm keeping an eye on the answers you receive.

[Stacy in NJ]

Require that he listen to the history reading and do some type of reinforcement via writing and map work, but don't force the extra hands on stuff on him. Supplement with your dd all she wants, but make a distinction between what is required and what is just extra for fun.

 

Both of my dss dislike crafts; many boys do.

[PeterPan]

Just for your trivia, Angelina (to whose blog Kristina linked) uses VP for history. And yes, there is a difference between the way you teach boys and girls history. My dd is all about relationships, who birthed whom, how their sons turned out, etc. Angelina's boy is very into the politics, the reasons, the gov't, the why's. What you're talking about there is what facets interest them, what topics you focus on or how you find books that will interest them. Then you have modality and methods that appeal to learning style. Within that you have input and output. And then you have the way their brains think (concrete, abstract, parts to whole vs. whole to parts, etc.). Each aspect figures into how you teach or present the history. It's not one thing.

[Storm Bay]

My eldest, 14, hates history when it comes to school. So far, we've done mostly a "just the facts" approach with a bit of other reading (usually historical fiction.) She did like SWB's SOTW books, because she likes the way SWB writes history. When that was done, and she was 12ish, we did All American History I, then II (took 2 years). She read the text, did the workbook, did a bit of other reading. Far short of a rich history program, but we got it done (required by law, for one thing).

 

My 11 yo loves history, so I won't discuss what she does here. My 9 yo hated history and found it boring until this year. We're doing SOTW. He is doing just the book & the mapwork, but it's more than he's done before. At least he's being exposed to history, and we will enrich it when he's older and he doesn't mind. It's also what he reads aloud to me, so he's hearing it as well as reading it. He's more into math & science, like my eldest.

 

All that said, in high school I'll be expanding what my history haters do, although you're not there yet. My eldest is going to have to read a history of math book (the one by Boyer), a few historical biographies on swimming (that's her sport), some historical fiction in the lit part of her English, and hopefully some history of science. For her World history this, I plan to use SWB's History of the Ancient World as a spine during the second semester and whatever I can get to interest her. At this point, it's likely to be an OT History course on tape with no writing. I'm not planning to do great books with her until she hits the Age of Reason, which I predict to be c. 16.

[Annie Laurie]

There are many ways to do narrations so be creative. Writing is only one way. Orally is another. Does he like to build? Draw? Sculpt? Write news articles or poetry?

 

Those are all good ideas. I've been meaning to make a narration jar for awhile, with different ideas the kids could pull out at random.

 

You said he doesn't like to read. Is that any kind of reading or just what he considers school related reading? Would he possibly be into reading historical fiction? Would he do better just being able to pick and choose what he learns about in history? You said he likes to build things. Could you possibly get him interested by showing him pictures of things throughout history he could try to build? Ziggurats, citadels, castles, seige towers, a Trojan horse? Have you tried finding history websites for kids? I remember seeing some of them that were somewhat interactive. Just throwing ideas out. :confused:

 

He doesn't like to read period. He can read very well, so it's not that. He is just a busy, busy kid and doesn't like to do anything that involves sitting still. He actually gets annoyed at historical fiction because he always wants to know if the book is a true story. He prefers non-fiction. I require silent reading everyday and we all grab a book and read for awhile. We have a huge variety of books around to choose from and he'll always choose a non-fiction book and just skim and look at the pictures, or something way below his reading level, like a picture book.

 

I've tried hands-on history projects, we have Hands and Hearts kits and he complains.

 

Really, I think a lot of it is him just not liking anything that's required of him. I ask him what he wants to study all the time and he doesn't know. We tried WP CAW this year because he wanted geography and it's been a very expensive bomb.

 

I like the computer website idea and need to work on finding more interactive things like that for him.

 

My kids hated history too!

 

But what they did like (both being boys and preferring legos over most anything else) was Discovery Channel and Nova shows that had to do with building and history.

 

All good ideas and reassuring to me. I know that he would tolerate websites, history shows, and field trips the best, so we will definitely work a lot of that in.

 

When I listen to your situation, my first thought is you need to work with his learning style.

 

I suggest you find his best learning style, which may be visual, and increase input in that method. You can integrate history into his other areas without being too heavy-handed. There is well-written historical fiction he might enjoy, despite its being history. COFA's (Childhood of Famous Americans), the nicely illustrated retellings of ancient lit (Wanderings of Odysseus, that type thing), etc. Consider getting him a timeline and USE it.

 

BTW, VP history is unique in that it works well for this history hater (because it has discrete, clear expectations) and the history lover (because you can expand it, run with it, flesh it out). It might be a spine you could use with BOTH your young ones.

 

You hit the nail on the head. He is HIGHLY visual. He remembers everything he sees, he memorized the names and order of the presidents at 7 due to a poster we had on the wall. I read Sonlight stuff and he has no idea what most of it was about. That is so hard for me, because I think reading aloud is so important and it's my instinct to read them a ton of history books.

 

Interestingly, he does love the SL timeline book and will spend a lot of time putting the figures in there.

 

I will look at VP but it's hard for me to move away from SL and WP myself, because I love history myself and those programs suit me, as well as dd.

 

What about a sort of unit study approach? Maybe he could find some topics that interest him related to history and you could put something together. Or hey, if he likes science, maybe he would enjoy learning about the history of science.

 

Those are great ideas!

 

We recently started History at Our House. We just listen to the prerecorded lessons. My son really likes it but he likes history.

 

Basically, there is 3 days a week of history lecture and one day a week of History through Art and a geography component.

 

Maybe this would be a good way to keep the kids together?

 

I'll take a look at that one too.

 

My dd5th is a history hater too. I've tried a variety of things over the last few years in hopes of changing that. Last year we did Abeka 4 with Sonlight 3 and 4 lit and VP cards. It was our most successful year, I think because we weren't reading from sources all over the place. We got the nitty gritty from the cards and ONE text and enjoyed some great books. I read plenty of books that she easily could have read herself if I thought they would enrich our history studies. She produced an amazing notebook and this is the stuff she remembers.

 

Thanks! Good thoughts in your post. I do wonder if my son would actually prefer a textbook.

 

My 2nd hates SL and fiction. He still falls asleep when I read. I'm just going to play SOTW in the background while he plays Legos and call it history through 4th.

 

The boys have watched the Liberty Kids and Horrible Histories as well. My 2nd grader will read COFA, but only if they are assigned. On his own, he'll pick up a sports stat book or sports magazine. My 2nd grader is much more into Science (and Art as well). I use multiple programs for both in addition to kits. While it would be easier for me to use the same thing for both, I don't feel it's best for them, so I've split them and select materials that fit. The Complete Book of US (or World History) is another option for a colorful overview. We're struggling this year too with Core 2, it just has a different feel or we've burnt out, I don't know. Not all kids will fit into the great books/passion for history mold.

 

SOTW cds was one thing I had thought of. I'm wondering if my son would enjoy listening to a section of SOTW a day with headphones on and then writing or drawing a short narration of what he heard. He is not very auditory, but I think the headphones might help and he might like feeling that he's in charge of his history lesson.

 

I had forgotten about Horrible Histories. I'm going to add those to my list as well as the You Wouldn't Want to be... books. If it's gross he likes it.

 

I am starting to think it might be better not to combine too. But there is only one of me and I have four kids and feel like I struggle to get to everything as it is.

 

Your post made me think of this blog post written by Angelina (CajunClassical on these boards, I think). I read this a while back and it planted a seed.

 

 

That was a great blog post, thanks for pointing it out. You know, my dh has pointed this out to me before when I worry that ds doesn't read enough, he says that he's always preferred non-fiction himself and likes books with a lot of action and ds tunes me out because I read things like Understood Betsy which dd and I love but ds doesn't. I do try to mix it up. I am reading The Apple and The Arrow to my 5 yr old and my other kids are listening in, I noticed that when it got very suspenseful with William Tell having to shoot the apple, ds was listening very closely.

 

Require that he listen to the history reading and do some type of reinforcement via writing and map work, but don't force the extra hands on stuff on him. Supplement with your dd all she wants, but make a distinction between what is required and what is just extra for fun.

 

Both of my dss dislike crafts; many boys do.

 

This seems simplest. I may go ahead with WP AS 1 or SL 3 and tell ds he needs to listen to the history part, write something short and fill in his map and timeline and then he can go. Then I'll give some related non-fiction books and Horrible Histories and the like to read on his own to flesh it out.

 

My oldest just doesn't like anything required. History is not his thing. When he was 10 I gave up trying to find something he liked. Instead I gave him a pattern to follow. he read the material and then wrote a paragraph about what he read. In this way our writing instruction was tied to whatever the reading was that day. Not only did this work on writing but I was able to see if he understood that day's reading. It was very effective.

 

He was 10 yo and that year wrote a paragraph after the reading. I would shorten it a little for a 4th grader and help more with the writing or other notebooking. In general though, yes, I would read and have him produce something (a few sentences, a picture, narration, exc) and then let him move on to other work while you do more reading and projects with your dd.

 

Thanks for this confirmation that this will work. My ds just doesn't like anything required either.

[Annie Laurie]

Just for your trivia, Angelina (to whose blog Kristina linked) uses VP for history. And yes, there is a difference between the way you teach boys and girls history.

 

How time consuming is VP if I did the cards separately with ds? Do we flesh out the cards with our own books?

 

My eldest, 14, hates history when it comes to school. So far, we've done mostly a "just the facts" approach with a bit of other reading (usually historical fiction.) She did like SWB's SOTW books, because she likes the way SWB writes history.

 

My 9 yo hated history and found it boring until this year. We're doing SOTW. He is doing just the book & the mapwork, but it's more than he's done before.

 

You mentioned having success with SOTW with two different kids who don't like history and SOTW was one thing I was considering, I already have all the books. But they're used in SL 6 and 7 so I can't decide if I want to go ahead and have him use them already. Since SL isn't really rigorous at that level, I thought it might work for him when he gets older since he won't want to work on history for a real long time each day and can read more to himself.

 

Lots to think about here. Thanks for sharing so many good ideas everyone! Sorry I snipped comments, it wouldn't let me post with too many characters.

[Storm Bay]

Sorry I snipped comments, it wouldn't let me post with too many characters.

 

Snipping comments is good, particularly if you're just addressing some of it or don't need all the info to reply.

[Karen in CO]

Take a look at these books. Do Not Open and Take Me Back. I think they have a lot of kid appeal and are the official present this year for all of my dd8's friends. They love the one she has. She will sit for hours and read over the books and whisper over the content.

 

Since you have a history hater, I'd focus on finding something appealing and just letting him read it. It is amazing how much they retain when they are excited. You can save the analysis for later or workbooks for later. I'd focus on trying to find appealing content. When I took my ds out of school, he was compliant but not very excited about anything, especially history. I just took him repeatedly to the library and had him find books and read. Later, I had him read Sonlight books, but that was after he started showing an interest.

 

So, try the Do Not Open book. It is full of "secrets" and my dd and her friends both male and female like reading it for fun. Take Me Back is more specifically history, but Do Not Open content on topics like Houdini, the Titanic, and what is inside Cheyenne Mountain. They really all count as valid history topics, and might be just the type of approach to cure a history-hater.

[PeterPan]

Attachedto4, I think I posted my schedule at the VP_Elementary yahoo group where I coordinated the spines from SL3/4 to the VP cards. Then you'd have the best of both worlds: the SL stuff you love with the VP cards and clear expectations he would like. You really should look at it. It's a totally different approach, very concrete, but it might be just the thing. And it wouldn't hamper you in your SL/WP stuff at all. Notice in my sig we're using elements of all three. :)

 

If you're going to do a read aloud of a fictional book, give him his own copy of the book to read along. Or give him a coloring page on the topic. For a non-fiction/informational reading, having him outline , take notes (more fun than you'd think), make a notebook page, or record something on a timeline as you read. Long time ago I read of somebody making a one page timeline, much like the CHOW timeline, that they used for notebooking as their dc listened to the day's read aloud. She photocopied them and had a new one for each day's reading, keeping it on a clipboard, ready to go. It gave the listeners a visual way to make notes and put everything in perspective. Giving him something visual to do while listening will probably help. It's the very act of translating it to visual that solidifies it. I always make notes when I listen to stuff if I want to remember, even if I never look at the notes again. It helps THAT much.

[Annie Laurie]

Thanks for the Do Not Open recommendation Karen and for your suggestions too Elizabeth. I somehow missed this before but am going to go look at your VP schedule. I think giving him something visual to fill in while I read is right on.

[woolybear]

The G.A. Henty stories are great for boys. We especially like the audio books by Jim Weiss. Depending on your boy, you can focus on various warrior cultures (Romans, Knights, etc.). Dressing up is always fun and if you connect it with some reading, even better. My less history buff son liked a book I read him about Colonial tools.

 

I would try to keep the two kids together and just do more with your dd.