I don't get it

[mommaduck]

I live in the city. My daughters, particularly the eldest, has been making friends with girls in the neighbourhood. Here is the issue:

 

1) we don't live in the safest area.

 

2) hubby works 2nd shift, so we lock up early.

 

3) we also school in the afternoon to evening so we can have family time during the day when dad is home (on summer break right now).

 

4) few, if any, of the neighbor kids seem to be home during the day.

 

5) the kids are just coming out to play at 8 and 9 o'clock at night! What is up with that?! The sun is about to go down. There is no way!!! And if I do allow it, it's only for a little bit.

 

 

Why are these kids JUST coming out to play as it's getting dark :confused: Shouldn't they be home, having family time, getting ready for bed?

[lionfamily1999]

Day care, day camps, remedial classes, summer school, etc.

 

We had the same problem, even before we started hsing. Poor dcs, all their friends' parents worked, so no one was home during the day.

[Snickerdoodle]

Maybe because it's hot?

 

We live in the city and there were (youngish) kids rollerblading at 11:30pm yesterday and the other night there were toddlers out with their trikes at 2 in the morning.

 

Where is the "mommy is so tired" smiley?

[1bassoon]

Sometimes I wonder if there's even such a concept.

 

I went to a Wal-Mart in a smaller city once - and there in front of me was a two-year old, putting up a might fuss. Ten o'clock at night, and the mother said, "Don't start fussing now! You've been so good - just another minute, and I'll get you dinner."

 

:001_huh:

 

My mom just retired as principal of an inner-city elementary school. She said it was just amazing, the lack of concept of family life and parenting that exists there.

[Karen sn]

In our old safe neighborhood full of good kids (sigh) we used to let dd play outside very late. The kids played Manhunt and it needs to be dark for that. They couldn't even start til after 9. The 14yo boy who lived 2 doors down always walked her home when they were all done. Sometimes they would be out til almost midnight. (Dd was 10 at the time). They were safe in my neighbors' yards and I never worried.

 

I was one of those "in bed by 9" people until this. The kids were so close and so well behaved, I just had to let her have fun while she could. It was summer and I let her sleep in. I don't regret that at all - especially now that we live in hell.

 

But in a not so safe neighborhood......no way.

[mommaduck]

Well, it hasn't been hot here. (but then consider that I'm used to states where you could hold a dry washcloth outside your door, bring it back in and wring the humidity out of it...and this isn't one of those places).

 

 

 

Thanks for mentioning the "lost concept" fact. I've been feeling like a heel telling my dd that no, she can't play.

[mommaduck]

In our old safe neighborhood full of good kids (sigh) we used to let dd play outside very late. The kids played Manhunt and it needs to be dark for that. They couldn't even start til after 9. The 14yo boy who lived 2 doors down always walked her home when they were all done. Sometimes they would be out til almost midnight. (Dd was 10 at the time). They were safe in my neighbors' yards and I never worried.

 

I was one of those "in bed by 9" people until this. The kids were so close and so well behaved, I just had to let her have fun while she could. It was summer and I let her sleep in. I don't regret that at all - especially now that we live in hell.

 

But in a not so safe neighborhood......no way.

 

Yeah, definitely not happening here. We had no problem with them playing this late when we lived in the country...but the country was no longer affordable.

[dragons in the flower bed]

She said it was just amazing, the lack of concept of family life and parenting that exists there.

 

Oh! This is my rant!

 

Yes. "You're supposed to make them go to bed at the same time every night?! I can't even get to bed at the same time every night! How do you force a person to fall asleep?" It's difficult to convince a person of that idea by itself. I wouldn't even try to talk to them about a whole bedtime routine that involves tooth brushing and storytime or backrubs and lullabies.

 

The kids here go to school or day care all day, til five. Then they run errands with parents who just got home from work. They come home around 7 or 8 and play and have dinner an hour or so later, at 8 or 9. They play some more. Parents can't be bothered to use their hard-earned free time to help a kid with a nightly routine. Around eleven or midnight I see these children falling asleep in swings, in strollers, in carseats, on couches on porches, in diapers, in their clothes. The next day they're up at seven and off to school for the free breakfast program. And sooner or later, the lack of sleep catches up to them and they start having all the symptoms of ADHD. They're hyper, inattentive, and aggressive. The curriculum gets dumbed down so these kids can deal with it. And people like me pull their kids out of school . . .

 

I really think some of the reason we see literacy rates go up when kids are read to every day is because this tends to happen at bedtime, which means there IS a bedtime.

Edited July 11, 2009 by dragons in the flower bed

[mommaduck]

Oh! This is my rant!

 

Yes. "You're supposed to make them go to bed at the same time every night?! I can't even get to bed at the same time every night! How do you force a person to fall asleep?" It's difficult to convince a person of that idea by itself. I wouldn't even try to talk to them about a whole bedtime routine that involves tooth brushing and storytime or backrubs and lullabies.

 

The kids here go to school or day care all day, til five. Then they run errands with parents who just got home from work. They come home around 7 or 8 and play and have different an hour or so later, at 8 or 9. They play some more. Parents can't be bothered to use their hard-earned free time to help a kid with a nightly routine. Around eleven or midnight I see these children falling asleep in swings, in strollers, in carseats, on couches on porches, in diapers, in their clothes. The next day they're up at seven and off to school for the free breakfast program. And sooner or later, the lack of sleep catches up to them and they start having all the symptoms of ADHD. They're hyper, inattentive, and aggressive. The curriculum gets dumbed down so these kids can deal with it. And people like me pull their kids out of school . . .

 

I really think some of the reason we see literacy rates go up when kids are read to every day is because this tends to happen at bedtime, which means there IS a bedtime.

 

So true! :iagree:

[dragons in the flower bed]

I was one of those "in bed by 9" people until this. The kids were so close and so well behaved, I just had to let her have fun while she could. It was summer and I let her sleep in. I don't regret that at all - especially now that we live in hell.

 

I can see this, in a safe neighborhood, in this era of cell phones and such, and if a child has no need to get up at a certain hour. I don't honestly care if kids sleep from 9 to 8 every day or from 7 to 6 or from noon to eleven at night. Whatever. I can see sleeping and homeschooling around an odd shift. But it's really a problem when children don't get the amount of sleep they need. And they need a lot more than people generally perceive them to need.

 

One to three-year-olds need 14 hours a day.

Three to six-year-olds need 12 hours a day.

Seven to twelve-year-olds need 11 hours.

Teens need 10 hours. Not until late adolescence/early twenties do people start needing only eight hours a night.

[mommaduck]

I can see this, in a safe neighborhood, in this era of cell phones and such, and if a child has no need to get up at a certain hour. I don't honestly care if kids sleep from 9 to 8 every day or from 7 to 6 or from noon to eleven at night. Whatever. I can see sleeping and homeschooling around an odd shift. But it's really a problem when children don't get the amount of sleep they need. And they need a lot more than people generally perceive them to need.

 

One to three-year-olds need 14 hours a day.

Three to six-year-olds need 12 hours a day.

Seven to twelve-year-olds need 11 hours.

Teens need 10 hours. Not until late adolescence/early twenties do people start needing only eight hours a night.

 

 

And when you add that my 11yr old also dealt with mono this past year...yeah, she MUST have her sleep!

[Melinda in VT]

One to three-year-olds need 14 hours a day.

Three to six-year-olds need 12 hours a day.

Seven to twelve-year-olds need 11 hours.

Teens need 10 hours. Not until late adolescence/early twenties do people start needing only eight hours a night.

 

I really wish someone would explain this to my 3yo!:glare:

[mommaduck]

I really wish someone would explain this to my 3yo!:glare:

 

LOL! :grouphug:

[skaterbabs]

Every family has a schedule that works best for them. Some might be shocked that my 5 year old is often up past midnight. However, that's her time to spend with her father, who is often gone well before she wakes up in the morning and doesn't get home until nine or ten at night. We have no need to be up early 6 days of 7, so no reason to go to bed at what other people consider a "normal" time.

[CatMomof3]

I really wish someone would explain this to my 3yo!:glare:

:iagree::lol:

[mommaduck]

Every family has a schedule that works best for them. Some might be shocked that my 5 year old is often up past midnight. However, that's her time to spend with her father, who is often gone well before she wakes up in the morning and doesn't get home until nine or ten at night. We have no need to be up early 6 days of 7, so no reason to go to bed at what other people consider a "normal" time.

 

 

I'm not worried about how late a child stays up. We are a second shift family and my children have had times where they stayed up late also. My issue is kids staying out to play, at night, in a not very safe neighborhood.

 

I just spoke with my daughter. Apparently these families BBQ a lot during the day and that is their family time. Might be cultural difference also.

[skaterbabs]

My point is that there is a lot of assuming that because they're out playing late that they're not being supervised or whatever. We don't know what their family schedules look like.

[Luanne]

at around 11pm and almost always there is some parent there with at least one child under the age of 5 ... the child is whining and crying ... and the parent is totally ignoring them.

 

Of course, I could add that I used to work in daycare and Mondays were always the worst because the parents couldn't find time in their busy schedule to let their toddler take a nap at all on the weekend. The poor children would come in all grumpy and fussy, but you could pretty much guarantee that everyone of them took a good nap on Monday.

[Dobela]

My son (age 9) often is playing outside around 9pm. We might be inside watching from the window or out in the back, or on the porch chatting. But it is not uncommon, especially since we supervise. If we are out, we will sometimes let him play with a flashlight in our yard or even ride his bike on our street under the street lights. Several kids we know in the neighborhood are just getting home (from sporting events usually, most here play either soccer or baseball thru the summer) and it is a nice time to catch up with neighbors. Personally, even though we homeschool, I see it as part of summer specialness. I played out until dark as a child in the summer. It was the coolest part of the day, I didn't have to get up as early the next day, and it was just different kind of fun.

 

But then we have later bedtimes (10 and 11 pm) than most folks and I allow my children to sleep in later (8 or 9 am) in the mornings. My dh works late, and a second job, so if we did an 8pm bedtime he would have almost no time with them before bed. Sometimes if I know my son has had a tiring week, I will even let him sleep until 10. We decided that family time is better than an early bed time.

[BillieBoy]

One to three-year-olds need 14 hours a day.

Three to six-year-olds need 12 hours a day.

Seven to twelve-year-olds need 11 hours.

Teens need 10 hours. Not until late adolescence/early twenties do people start needing only eight hours a night.

 

Thank goodness I just thought my dd was the queen of Nod! 11 hours every night, we can set our clocks to her.

 

On the safety issue, we live in a fairly rural community near a small town but DH and I, do not let her run amok at all. Even at her age if she is not in sight, she must be within hearing distance and even then must be with our two big dogs. It's way to strange of a world these days. No way she'd be out after dark with friends. Do they still make those harness things for kids with a leash....Just kidding. :001_unsure:

[Harriet Vane]

My point is that there is a lot of assuming that because they're out playing late that they're not being supervised or whatever. We don't know what their family schedules look like.

 

I live in a poor city neighborhood, and have been here for twelve years. My dh and I chose to come here. I have taken the time to get to know my neighbors, as have the other "urban missionaries" that I know. Unfortunately all too often it really, truly IS poor parenting and lack of supervision. I wish it were otherwise.

[2_girls_mommy]

I was going to say it is a cultural difference. Our neighbors across the street are very family oriented people of a different nationality than us. We go to their bday parties and such, even though we speak a different language. Their children are younger than ours and are up VERY late every night. Later than me. Dh will tell me they are outside playing (with their family) when he is out late doing something. They are toddlers. The only thing I can think of is that they must all take long naps during the afternoons to stay out that late and be awake. The parents both work too, so they may sleep during the day at a babysitter's house, and spend family time at night.

So far they are young enough they do not come ask my kids to play that late. They just wave across the street when we are going in to bed at 7:00 or 8:00 and they are just getting started for the night:001_smile: It could be an issue in later years though. We also live in a city.

[mommaduck]

My son (age 9) often is playing outside around 9pm. We might be inside watching from the window or out in the back, or on the porch chatting. But it is not uncommon, especially since we supervise. If we are out, we will sometimes let him play with a flashlight in our yard or even ride his bike on our street under the street lights. Several kids we know in the neighborhood are just getting home (from sporting events usually, most here play either soccer or baseball thru the summer) and it is a nice time to catch up with neighbors. Personally, even though we homeschool, I see it as part of summer specialness. I played out until dark as a child in the summer. It was the coolest part of the day, I didn't have to get up as early the next day, and it was just different kind of fun.

 

But then we have later bedtimes (10 and 11 pm) than most folks and I allow my children to sleep in later (8 or 9 am) in the mornings. My dh works late, and a second job, so if we did an 8pm bedtime he would have almost no time with them before bed. Sometimes if I know my son has had a tiring week, I will even let him sleep until 10. We decided that family time is better than an early bed time.

 

 

What kind of area do you live in? Are there guns going off in your neighbourhood on a nightly basis? Drugs being sold around the corner? Posse showing off as they march down the street? A sexual offender on your block? Please understand my concern and "judgement" is based on what is going on in THIS area. I have had teenagers come INTO my backyard, thinking we weren't home, to sit on my back step to smoke their pot.