Volunteering at dd's synchro club - need to deal with parent who doesn't pay.

[LBC]

Dd belongs to a small synchronized swimming club. The head coach has done all the organizing up to this point, but she just got accepted at med school in a different city, and has handed the position of Treasurer over to me.

 

The very first situation I have inherited is an NSF check from one of the parents. I asked if this was common, and was told that this parent had just paid her fees for the year (due last September), and the check had bounced. :confused: She also said that it's been quite difficult to get fees from this parent. I know from experience that this parent is almost impossible to get in touch with, since her dd was my dd's duet partner, and when I had an important meet decision to make I sent her two emails and left two phone messages, and never heard back from her.

 

At this point, I'm the treasurer, director, and president of the club, but there are a couple of other moms who have agreed to volunteer as well. I'm wondering if we need to set a policy that the girls may not participate until their fees are paid (I'm actually very surprised that this isn't already a policy). Does anybody have experience with things like this? I hate confrontation, and really don't want to spend time chasing someone down for fees.

 

Lori

[Hillary in KS]

Well, what was done at our club is this:

 

1) Send a certified letter to parent with a bill, and notice that her account must be brought up to date by July ____, 2009. (Give her 2 weeks) Advise her that after this date her dd will not be allowed in the water until her account is current.

 

2) Follow through. If there is a male who is willing to be there that day, that migh help. If dd shows up that day and mom isn't with her, just send dd home or have her sit on the bleachers until the mom comes to pick her up.

 

What she is doing is not fair and is unreasonable. It's not fair to other parents who are being responsible.

 

No need to feel badly about this.

[LaxMom]

:iagree: That is exactly what I would do. She clearly knows her check was returned because her bank sent her notice, as well, and I'm sure she is notified of when fees are due in the same manner as everybody else. It seems as if it's simply not a priority for her.

[LBC]

It seems so obvious when you put it that way.:D

 

I guess I just feel a bit alone in this role. Perhaps I'll wait until I've had a chance to meet with the other volunteers, and let them know (without mentioning names) what I plan to do, just so that if it all blows up in my face, there's a bit of support from the other parent volunteers.

 

Thanks! I'm going to print this off.

 

Lori

[Hillary in KS]

It seems so obvious when you put it that way.:D

 

I guess I just feel a bit alone in this role. Perhaps I'll wait until I've had a chance to meet with the other volunteers, and let them know (without mentioning names) what I plan to do, just so that if it all blows up in my face, there's a bit of support from the other parent volunteers.

 

Thanks! I'm going to print this off.

 

Lori

 

You know, honestly, I wouldn't wait too long. Seeing as you're new you have the "She's just getting the books in order" advantage.

 

If you don't want to be seen as singling anyone out, you can send everyone a version of the same letter. "I've just inherited this job..... yada yada ..... looking forward to working with everyone... blah blah... In an effort to make sure all accounts are current, I will be sending home a statement of your account on this date." Send one to everyone, but send the scofflaw mom one via certified mail so you get a signature.

 

For those with delinquent accounts, add the bit about "All accounts must be made current by THIS date in order for the swimmer's schedule to remain uninterrupted."

 

Our club did this last summer when the new treasurer inherited a MESS of books. Everyone knew to expect a statement. She was very patient working with those of us whose payments had been lost or credited to another swimmer.

 

because you're new, people will expect you to be getting things in order. Whatever you do, I wouldn't put this off. She knows she's getting away with not paying. Again, it's not fair for the swimmers and families who ARE paying and being responsible.

 

Does your club have a Board of Directors? If she comes back at you and is giving you flack, call an emergency meeting of the Board and explain what is going on. If they don't support you, I'd be tempted to tell all parents that from now on dues are optional. See how long the club will stand by people not paying their bills.

 

Take courage! Don't put off dealing with this because of fear. If anyone hassles you, just tell them she hasn't paid any dues in the past 22 months.

[LaxMom]

Do not forget to add any fees your bank assessed for the return.

[Hillary in KS]

Do not forget to add any fees your bank assessed for the return.

 

Yes! That's right! Good call.

[bettyandbob]

Yup. I would not let the girl practice. Use the club listserv to generally tell all families that the policy is that if fees are not up to date that children will not practice. Then send certified letters to all families not in compliance, letting them know their children will be out of the water after one week. To the family whose check bounced, I would say in the letter since the check bounced, they must pay by money order. Then follow through. Coaches and appropriate volunteers will be given the names of the children who can't enter the water.

 

Then, in September set firm dates when all new year accounts must be paid and again don't let the children whose families don't follow through in the water.

 

Does your club have a board or at least a small group of parent managers. I think you should not be the only one setting and enforcing policy.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Yup. I would not let the girl practice. Use the club listserv to generally tell all families that the policy is that if fees are not up to date that children will not practice. Then send certified letters to all families not in compliance, letting them know their children will be out of the water after one week. To the family whose check bounced, I would say in the letter since the check bounced, they must pay by money order. Then follow through. Coaches and appropriate volunteers will be given the names of the children who can't enter the water.

 

Then, in September set firm dates when all new year accounts must be paid and again don't let the children whose families don't follow through in the water.

 

Does your club have a board or at least a small group of parent managers. I think you should not be the only one setting and enforcing policy.

 

You probably also need some sort of policy on swimmers being cut from a competition lineup. In other words, if someone isn't swimming practice because of non-payment, at some point a competition group will need to be formed with or without that swimmer.

 

Honestly, some families will just decide that actually paying their obligations isn't that important to them.

 

You might also discuss with the board that you should have some sort of work for practice scholarship opportunity available.

 

And one final comment. You need more help. DO NOT be the president and the treasurer. This is the way that groups get into trouble, either because some one is careless or because someone gets desparate for the money or because someone else gets annoyed and starts throwing around accusasions. Get others on the board, share the load and have more than one set of eyes on the money. I know too many groups where everyone was friends and trusted each other only to have bad things happen later on.

[fivetails]

If dd shows up that day and mom isn't with her, just send dd home or have her sit on the bleachers until the mom comes to pick her up.

 

Aye, I wouldn't do that... Yes, non-payment is a problem and needs to be addressed - but please don't humiliate the child in front of her peers. (Which is exactly what having her sit on the bleachers or leave is likely to do.)

 

Do you (OP) know anything about the family? Just wondering if there's a low income issue at play or anything.. if there was, maybe some other arrangements can be made - Mom can volunteer a bit with the group for reduced fees or something?

 

(Yeah she might be just not wanting to pay, but I figure it doesn't hurt to check that out)

 

If she's just flaking on the payment, then yeah you might have to let her know the child can't attend anymore after X date - but please don't make her sit out or leave if she shows up alone... that would be terribly embarrassing for the daughter and it's not HER fault, y'know?

[FlockOfSillies]

Hmmm. That sounds like something the girl's own mother should be eager to prevent, instead of relying on the kindness and forbearance of others to let her dd continue to swim competitively... for free.

 

The ability to prevent the girl's humiliation is completely within the mother's power. All she has to do is pay up or quit.

 

It's not like the OP is going to walk around with a bullhorn saying, "Girls! You see so-and-so up on the bleachers? It's because her mom didn't pay the fees. Her mom's a deadbeat! Everybody make faces at her. Ready?! One... two... three! Neener, neener, NEE-ner!"

 

This mom has had the whole year to make arrangements with the swim club -- to come to them and say, "I'm having trouble affording the fees this year. I'd be glad to help out to work off the fees, if my dd's not available for scholarships." But the OP said that she's hard to get a hold of for everything -- not just $$ stuff. Some people are just like this, and they count on the softies in this world to let them get away with murder.

[phathui5]

Aye, I wouldn't do that... Yes, non-payment is a problem and needs to be addressed - but please don't humiliate the child in front of her peers. (Which is exactly what having her sit on the bleachers or leave is likely to do.)

 

Do you (OP) know anything about the family? Just wondering if there's a low income issue at play or anything.. if there was, maybe some other arrangements can be made - Mom can volunteer a bit with the group for reduced fees or something?

 

(Yeah she might be just not wanting to pay, but I figure it doesn't hurt to check that out)

 

If she's just flaking on the payment, then yeah you might have to let her know the child can't attend anymore after X date - but please don't make her sit out or leave if she shows up alone... that would be terribly embarrassing for the daughter and it's not HER fault, y'know?

 

The OP said she has left two messages and sent two emails. If the mom needs help, she needs to return those messages and say so. I know it can be hard to do (we've had to ask ourselves).

 

But if you don't pay, you can't play. A store wouldn't send you home with stuff you weren't going to pay for and someone shouldn't be able to get around paying fees for activities by just not doing it.

[LaxMom]

Hmmm. That sounds like something the girl's own mother should be eager to prevent, instead of relying on the kindness and forbearance of others to let her dd continue to swim competitively... for free.

 

The ability to prevent the girl's humiliation is completely within the mother's power. All she has to do is pay up or quit.

 

It's not like the OP is going to walk around with a bullhorn saying, "Girls! You see so-and-so up on the bleachers? It's because her mom didn't pay the fees. Her mom's a deadbeat! Everybody make faces at her. Ready?! One... two... three! Neener, neener, NEE-ner!"

 

This mom has had the whole year to make arrangements with the swim club -- to come to them and say, "I'm having trouble affording the fees this year. I'd be glad to help out to work off the fees, if my dd's not available for scholarships." But the OP said that she's hard to get a hold of for everything -- not just $$ stuff. Some people are just like this, and they count on the softies in this world to let them get away with murder.

I agree whole-heartedly. It is not as if anyone, including the OP, has suggested the young lady be benched without warning. It is unfortunate for her if her mother decides to ignore the letter and just drop her off, thinking the team has no recourse, but that is not something the OP should have to make up for.

 

And, yes, I was thinking the same thing about financial hardship - if my children were interested in pursuing an activity we could not afford up front, I would be asking about payment plans, scholarships, work trade, whatever, and also having a conversation with the kids that it may just not be feasible.

[fivetails]

 

It's not like the OP is going to walk around with a bullhorn saying, "Girls! You see so-and-so up on the bleachers? It's because her mom didn't pay the fees. Her mom's a deadbeat! Everybody make faces at her. Ready?! One... two... three! Neener, neener, NEE-ner!"

 

Of course she isn't. :)

 

But do you think the kids won't ask? They see a fellow swimming mate sitting on the bleachers, looking sad (as the girl no doubt would look, having arrived for her lesson and been sent to sit out!) - they're gonna stare, ask questions. Even if the swim instructor tells them to mind their own business, it still has this poor kid sitting there feeling horribly embarrassed. Makes *me* cringe just to think about it - and I don't even know her!

 

I just think it's best handled in private - no need to draw the attention of the other kids to the situation and put the girl on the spot like that.

[Spy Car]

Of course she isn't. :)

 

But do you think the kids won't ask? They see a fellow swimming mate sitting on the bleachers, looking sad (as the girl no doubt would look, having arrived for her lesson and been sent to sit out!) - they're gonna stare, ask questions. Even if the swim instructor tells them to mind their own business, it still has this poor kid sitting there feeling horribly embarrassed. Makes *me* cringe just to think about it - and I don't even know her!

 

I just think it's best handled in private - no need to draw the attention of the other kids to the situation and put the girl on the spot like that.

 

I agree with you.

 

Everything possible should be done to avoid humiliating a child. That's basic human decency.

 

Bill

[kaylk in tx]

but if the parent just drops the kid off, what's the swim club supposed to do? let her swim anyway? that's exactly what's been happening and the parent will keep doing that as long as she's allowed to.

 

we swim (not synchro, just regular) and our club has a similar policy. you get so far behind in your dues and you don't get to participate until your account is made current. our team does electronic payments. perhaps after a certain number of "bounces", the family could be required to set up payment that way.

[Hillary in KS]

Of course she isn't. :)

 

But do you think the kids won't ask? They see a fellow swimming mate sitting on the bleachers, looking sad (as the girl no doubt would look, having arrived for her lesson and been sent to sit out!) - they're gonna stare, ask questions. Even if the swim instructor tells them to mind their own business, it still has this poor kid sitting there feeling horribly embarrassed. Makes *me* cringe just to think about it - and I don't even know her!

 

I just think it's best handled in private - no need to draw the attention of the other kids to the situation and put the girl on the spot like that.

 

Not necessarily. I've seen kids sit out before and never heard from the kids "OH! She's in trouble!" It's more natural (for the athletes, anyway) to assume that she's not feeling well. Or that she forgot her suit. Or something like that.

 

But then, I'm not one to think that simply having a child sit out will humiliate them. I can think of LOTS of ways to do that, but simply sitting out is not one of them. I'd worry a bit about my 13 yo son if his coach made him sit out for any reason and he told me he was humiliated. (ETA: Unless he was misbehaving. If he was misbehaving and was asked to leave the pool and sit out, I would hope he might feel some sort of shame about his bad behavior.) Now, if he was 5 or 6, maybe, but these are teenagers we're talking about. Life will be very long and hard for them if simply sitting out will cause humiliation.

 

I've also, as a child, had to sit out at events for one reason or another. Hurt foot. Tummyache. Broken arm. Forgot my glove. No one made fun or mocked. I just sat and waited for Mom or Dad to come. It's not a big deal unless you make it one.

 

Now, if you announce to everyone "SUSIE'S MOM IS A DEADBEAT!" well, sure. That's a problem. But simply and privately saying, "Susie, I'm sorry, but you'll have to sit out today. When your mom comes to pick you up we can talk about it together."

 

IMO, if mom knows that Susie can't swim after July 10 unless she pays the bill, and still chooses to send Susie, any hard feelings that may occur are not my doing. If you're worried about humiliation, call Susie aside after practice and say, "Susie, you cannot swim after tomorrow until your account is paid in full. Make sure your mom knows. Tomorrow's fine, but after that I cannot allow you into the water."

 

Susie's mom has counted on people not wanting to embarrass her daughter or confront her about her delinquent fees for nearly 2 years.

 

Nothing will change unless the people in charge set rules and stand firm.

Edited June 30, 2009 by Hillary in KS

[Renee in NC]

but if the parent just drops the kid off, what's the swim club supposed to do? let her swim anyway? that's exactly what's been happening and the parent will keep doing that as long as she's allowed to.

 

we swim (not synchro, just regular) and our club has a similar policy. you get so far behind in your dues and you don't get to participate until your account is made current. our team does electronic payments. perhaps after a certain number of "bounces", the family could be required to set up payment that way.

 

Wait outside with the girl next time and talk to the mother when she picks her up. Then the girl has some warning at least that she won't be able to swim.

[Hillary in KS]

Wait outside with the girl next time and talk to the mother when she picks her up. Then the girl has some warning at least that she won't be able to swim.

 

Sure. But if you do that,it should be done *before* the deadline. Not afterwards. If the girl comes to swim after the deadline, and the account is still not clear, she should sit out.

 

By letting the girl swim after any deadline, her mother gets the message that she can do what she wants.

[LBC]

Do you (OP) know anything about the family? Just wondering if there's a low income issue at play or anything.. if there was, maybe some other arrangements can be made - Mom can volunteer a bit with the group for reduced fees or something?

 

 

 

I know you can't judge a book by its cover, but if they are having financial problems, they are very good at hiding it. They live in a beautiful house in a golf course community in a very nice part of town. I would estimate the value of the house to be about $800,000, and there's a clubhouse with a pool, so probably monthly maintenance fees.

 

Also, just to give a bit more info, the girl in question is 16, so she's not a little kid or anything. If she had to sit on the bench, the other girls would probably assume it was her monthly cycle or something. The three older girls (my dd included) are quite good friends. I'm undecided about the "sit on the bench" consequence, and would want feedback from the previous head coach. Also, we're on summer break, so there isn't actually any pool time until September.

 

Lori

[Renee in NC]

Sure. But if you do that,it should be done *before* the deadline. Not afterwards. If the girl comes to swim after the deadline, and the account is still not clear, she should sit out.

 

By letting the girl swim after any deadline, her mother gets the message that she can do what she wants.

 

That's what I was thinking - before, not after, but in such a way that the girl knows, too, so it isn't a big shock when she can't swim anymore.

 

If it really is a money issue and not a flakiness issue, could the *girl* earn part of her own fees someway? It may be that she babysits, has money saved, etc. that would allow her to pay her own fees if it meant that much to her.

[Spy Car]

I know you can't judge a book by its cover, but if they are having financial problems, they are very good at hiding it. They live in a beautiful house in a golf course community in a very nice part of town. I would estimate the value of the house to be about $800,000, and there's a clubhouse with a pool, so probably monthly maintenance fees.

 

Also, just to give a bit more info, the girl in question is 16, so she's not a little kid or anything. If she had to sit on the bench, the other girls would probably assume it was her monthly cycle or something. The three older girls (my dd included) are quite good friends. I'm undecided about the "sit on the bench" consequence, and would want feedback from the previous head coach. Also, we're on summer break, so there isn't actually any pool time until September.

 

Lori

 

Word tends to get around. Even if it doesn't the girl would know and she would have to sit there feeling ashamed? What a position to put an innocent girl in. I'd never dream of doing such a thing.

 

Your issue is with her mother. This should be a "grown-up" affair and one handled in private.

 

I can't believe the advice you are getting to the contrary. To shame the girl would be detestable and cruel.

 

Bill

[Hillary in KS]

That's what I was thinking - before, not after, but in such a way that the girl knows, too, so it isn't a big shock when she can't swim anymore.

 

If it really is a money issue and not a flakiness issue, could the *girl* earn part of her own fees someway? It may be that she babysits, has money saved, etc. that would allow her to pay her own fees if it meant that much to her.

 

:iagree:

[LBC]

Word tends to get around. Even if it doesn't the girl would know and she would have to sit there feeling ashamed? What a position to put an innocent girl in. I'd never dream of doing such a thing.

 

Your issue is with her mother. This should be a "grown-up" affair and one handled in private.

 

I can't believe the advice you are getting to the contrary. To shame the girl would be detestable and cruel.

 

Bill

 

Yes, and I'm really not the detestable, cruel, girl shaming type.:D

 

Seriously, what makes me sad about all of this is that the poor girl has probably already clued in that something is not quite right. If this is going on with synchro, it's probably going on at school, too. I feel sorry for her. She's probably already having to deal with some of the fallout from the dysfunction of the adults in her world. I have no intention of humiliating her. I would probably let her know ahead of time that she needs to make sure her mom pays before she returns to swimming. I think she's old enough to handle that, and then she would just not show up for practice without her mom and the payment. Does that sound better?

 

Lori

[LBC]

And one final comment. You need more help. DO NOT be the president and the treasurer. This is the way that groups get into trouble, either because some one is careless or because someone gets desperate for the money or because someone else gets annoyed and starts throwing around accusations. Get others on the board, share the load and have more than one set of eyes on the money. I know too many groups where everyone was friends and trusted each other only to have bad things happen later on.

 

I know! This kind of snuck up on me. I've encouraged the exiting couch to get a meeting together very soon. I have no intention of doing this all on my own. I was at the bank today, having the account signed over to me, and I felt quite odd about it. I'm as honest as the day is long, and I do the bookkeeping for dh's business, and dd's dance studio, but I think it's so important to be "above suspicion" with these sorts of things.

 

Thanks for the reminder.:001_smile:

 

Lori

[Spy Car]

Yes, and I'm really not the detestable, cruel, girl shaming type.:D

 

Clearly :001_smile:

 

Seriously, what makes me sad about all of this is that the poor girl has probably already clued in that something is not quite right. If this is going on with synchro, it's probably going on at school, too. I feel sorry for her. She's probably already having to deal with some of the fallout from the dysfunction of the adults in her world. I have no intention of humiliating her. I would probably let her know ahead of time that she needs to make sure her mom pays before she returns to swimming. I think she's old enough to handle that, and then she would just not show up for practice without her mom and the payment. Does that sound better?

 

Lori

 

Much better. My preference would still be to deal with her mother. But if the woman is dodging you, I could see the possibility of needing a "Plan B". If it were me, I'd make a very concerted effort not to involve the girl and to deal with the mom directly.

 

I understand you're in a tough position. And I guess you daughter will be out a sychro partner?

 

Best wishes with this.

 

Bill

[Kathy in MD]

If the girl is 16, and wants to stay in syncro, she can get a job to pay for the sport. If she is paying, she will probably need a payment plan. She also needs to be notified ASAP, so she can start saving for the sport. The girl can also apply pressure to her dm to pay the bill. The second doesn't always work, but it's worth a try.

 

Finally, if the girl is not allowed back on the team next year for non-payment, she's learned an important lesson her dm isn't teaching her -- you have to pay your bills.

[LMA]

I didn't finish reading all the replies, but I would send the mother a certified letter signed from the entire board of the club. I would include in the letter that her daughter could not attend any practice until she was up to date on her debt. Then you don't have to deal with the daughter during practice. The non-paying mother should not be bringing her daughter to practice after you inform her in writing. Why would you let the daughter attend if the mother didn't pay in full? Around here the baseball and hockey leagues and karate businesses bench the child if the child shows up and the parent is not up to the bill. While it seems insensitive to bench the girl, it's unfair and more insensitive to those parents who paid their bills.

[SquirrellyMama]

If the girl is 16, and wants to stay in syncro, she can get a job to pay for the sport. If she is paying, she will probably need a payment plan. She also needs to be notified ASAP, so she can start saving for the sport. The girl can also apply pressure to her dm to pay the bill. The second doesn't always work, but it's worth a try.

 

Finally, if the girl is not allowed back on the team next year for non-payment, she's learned an important lesson her dm isn't teaching her -- you have to pay your bills.

 

I don't think this is a bad idea. If she wants to be in it and her parents cannot pay then she could pay herself.

 

I understand some of this situation. My parents were horrible with money so I took over buying my clothing, school supplies and extras. I even lent my parents money at times before I graduated hs.

 

Sure. But if you do that,it should be done *before* the deadline. Not afterwards. If the girl comes to swim after the deadline, and the account is still not clear, she should sit out.

 

By letting the girl swim after any deadline, her mother gets the message that she can do what she wants.

 

Maybe talk to them a week before the deadline to remind them and so the girl isn't shocked when she can't swim.

Your issue is with her mother. This should be a "grown-up" affair and one handled in private.

 

I can't believe the advice you are getting to the contrary. To shame the girl would be detestable and cruel.

 

 

I remember being humiliated by a creditor who called our house when I was 16. There are times I'm still mad about it due to my sin of lack of forgiveness BUT I can say it formed my sense of money. I have always tried hard to be good with my money because of my parents foolishness.

 

Humiliation while hard at the time helps to refine us and make us into stronger people. Instead of looking at it as a curse we need to see what we can learn from it.

[katilac]

Word tends to get around. Even if it doesn't the girl would know and she would have to sit there feeling ashamed? What a position to put an innocent girl in. I'd never dream of doing such a thing.

 

Your issue is with her mother. This should be a "grown-up" affair and one handled in private.

 

I can't believe the advice you are getting to the contrary. To shame the girl would be detestable and cruel.

 

Bill

 

If word is going to get around that mom is not paying the bills, it's going to get around whether the dd swims or sits the bench.

 

I have to say that I don't think that having the girl sit out a practice is shaming her, but I would probably go with the plan of telling her that she can swim today and tomorrow, but not after that until her account is paid.

 

Why involve her? Well, the mom has proven herself hard to get in touch with, and the dd is the one who is actually participating. She's not 6, she's 16, and I think it's reasonable enough to tactfully let her know that her bill must be paid.

 

At some point, it will become impossible for the club to ignore this or eat the fees. It is much kinder, imo, to alert the girl now, rather than letting it drag on to the point where she might prepare for, but be unable to compete in, a competition.