Shakespeare before High School?

[claire up north]

I am reading a few different threads on this board and it seems like there is a movement to have kids reading Shakespeare before high school. Now, I was a good student and Shakespeare was challenging. There were lots of kids in h.s. that never understood a thing the man wrote!

 

So, I have to know...are you all talking about real Shakespeare, or children's versions of his plays?

 

I was skimming through a Shakespeare for children Usborne book, and even that looked to advanced for my 6th grader. Am I missing something??

 

thanks for helping me know where to set the bar...

[HollyinNNV]

I am reading a few different threads on this board and it seems like there is a movement to have kids reading Shakespeare before high school. Now, I was a good student and Shakespeare was challenging. There were lots of kids in h.s. that never understood a thing the man wrote!

 

So, I have to know...are you all talking about real Shakespeare, or children's versions of his plays?

 

I was skimming through a Shakespeare for children Usborne book, and even that looked to advanced for my 6th grader. Am I missing something??

 

thanks for helping me know where to set the bar...

 

I can only speak for my co-op students. I've supervised my writing classes as they read Julius Caesar. I've done it twice. Both times my students were junior high age. We assign parts and simply read it. It takes about 5-6 class periods. About half-way through students start to "get it." They start making comments about which characters they like and dislike. They start getting the sarcasm and irony. Their comments and laughter at the right times show that they understand.

 

Now, I know they don't get all of it. And frankly, I don't believe that it is important, at this age, to slow down and analyze it. I want them to see that they can understand Shakespeare without understanding every word.

 

I think that this early exposure to Shakespeare is like immersion in a foreign language. You are sitting there following along. You are trying to understand. You begin to get bits and pieces, then chunks and finally the entire plot.

 

The best way to be exposed to Shakespeare at a young age is to go watch a live play. I took ds to see Richard III last summer. He knew who the good guys and bad guys were. He understood that people Richard killed came back as ghosts. He enjoyed the sword fights.

 

If you want to expose your child to Shakespeare early, I'd try attending one of his (more exciting) plays!

Holly

[Maria/ME]

FWIW, here is what we do.

 

Background: My dd loves literature/poetry/drama and history. Right there, that gives me a "leg up" as Shakespeare delighted her.

 

What we do: We read what we can get our hands on in the form of "re-tellings". For example, Lamb's Shakespeare stories, some Scholastic books, and I purchased DK's Essential Shakespeare Handbook for overviews. We've watched a few of the movies, also. We've looked on Youtube for the animated BBC versions, but we've also taken advantage of seeing Shakespeare's live plays in our area (Next Week: King Lear!) We also have listened to Will In The World on audio from the library (among other Shakespeare bios).

 

So, does my dd11 pick up everything? No. Is she enthusiastic? Yes. We discuss and talk about his life and works, we discuss the plays and their plots. This has led us to read together some of the passages from his plays, some of which she has memorized for fun. I appreciate the annotated plays myself (as a help for ME when teaching!). I am considering getting a lit guide via Lightning Lit or another source to help her, but at this point I feel the exposure and joy is a big part of the equation. The analyzing will come later (although, we had a great discussion of Lear's psyche the other day...)in high school.

 

After this weeks Lear, she has requested getting to know some of the more obscure plays and some of his sonnets. I have already noticed that she seems to be copying his style and form of expression when she is creatively writing. Again, that is something she enjoys spontaneously and she just does it for fun. And that helps. If she had less interest in Lit/History/poetry/drama/creative writing....well, then, I'd personally be waiting until she was older and not sweating it too much. We love it, so we throw ourselves into it.

 

Now ask me about Science....:D Throwing ourselves into that is another story!

[King Alfred Academy]

FWIW, here is what we do.

 

Background: My dd loves literature/poetry/drama and history. Right there, that gives me a "leg up" as Shakespeare delighted her.

 

What we do: We read what we can get our hands on in the form of "re-tellings". For example, Lamb's Shakespeare stories, some Scholastic books, and I purchased DK's Essential Shakespeare Handbook for overviews. We've watched a few of the movies, also. We've looked on Youtube for the animated BBC versions, but we've also taken advantage of seeing Shakespeare's live plays in our area (Next Week: King Lear!) We also have listened to Will In The World on audio from the library (among other Shakespeare bios).

 

So, does my dd11 pick up everything? No. Is she enthusiastic? Yes. We discuss and talk about his life and works, we discuss the plays and their plots. This has led us to read together some of the passages from his plays, some of which she has memorized for fun. I appreciate the annotated plays myself (as a help for ME when teaching!). I am considering getting a lit guide via Lightning Lit or another source to help her, but at this point I feel the exposure and joy is a big part of the equation. The analyzing will come later (although, we had a great discussion of Lear's psyche the other day...)in high school.

 

After this weeks Lear, she has requested getting to know some of the more obscure plays and some of his sonnets. I have already noticed that she seems to be copying his style and form of expression when she is creatively writing. Again, that is something she enjoys spontaneously and she just does it for fun. And that helps. If she had less interest in Lit/History/poetry/drama/creative writing....well, then, I'd personally be waiting until she was older and not sweating it too much. We love it, so we throw ourselves into it.

 

Now ask me about Science....:D Throwing ourselves into that is another story!

 

This post describes my ds8 EXACTLY! He also enjoys listening to his dad read/perform the original. He really gets into the language and enjoys it!

 

This past week I was reading William Shakespeare and the Globe by Aliki. After we finished the book he shouted, "Mom, can we build our own model of the Globe Theatre"? So, the lesson plans went out the window and we acted on his enthusiasm.

 

That is just a bit of insight into our Shakespeare stuff.

[titianmom]

Hi,

 

A very worthwhile DVD on the subject is the story of a very creative ELEMENTARY teacher named Albert Cullum who taught kids from Kindergarten and up *real* Shakespeare. Excellent DVD and very helpful ideas on what you can do to help your student(s) learn the Bard's work. You can pick a copy up on eBay for cheap.

 

Also, you can join Netflix for about $5 a month and watch all the BBC Shakespearean plays you want.

 

What I do is have my daughter read through the text and then view the play and we read along. It helps to view the emotion, etc; makes the play more understandable. My daughter is 12 and we've done 2 plays together over the past couple of years. She got it. We also go the the Shakespeare website and learn the famous quotes and use them.

 

But if you have several students, have them learn the text and put on the play!

 

Kids live up to their potential if you give them the chance. If you send a "signal" that they're too young for Shakespeare, suddenly they don't understand the material. Very interesting.

 

Kim

[Sara in WA]

My dd 8 grabbed Shakespeare off our bookshelf and is keeping it in her room. She's reading Midsummer Night's Dream. I know she doesn't understand half of it, but she does understand some of it (she tells me what's happening) and is enjoying reading it. So, it's her fun reading :)

[King Alfred Academy]

My dd 8 grabbed Shakespeare off our bookshelf and is keeping it in her room. She's reading Midsummer Night's Dream. I know she doesn't understand half of it, but she does understand some of it (she tells me what's happening) and is enjoying reading it. So, it's her fun reading :)

 

Hey Sara...that is Magnus' favorite too! Looks like they will have something to talk about when we come up in June! ;)

[Karenathome]

great storybook versions of several plays. I want to say that Bruce Coville was the author. The kids LOVED Shakespeare's plays. The illustrations were captivating...

 

My goal was to introduce and have a positive experience, so that when we revisited Shakespeare in middle school and high school, they would be familiar with the plays and remember them with fondness.

 

We found many of Coville's books at our library.

[Carmen_and_Company]

Tons of children editions of Shakespeare retellings:

 

Beautiful Stories from Shakespeare by Edith Nesbit--free online

Tales from Shakespeare by Charles & Mary Lamb--free online

Shakespeare Stories vol. I or vol. II by Leon Garfield

Stories from Shakespeare by Margaret Chute (Sp)

 

AO (Amblesideonline.org) offers a Shakespeare pages with tons of resources.

http://amblesideonline.org/ShakespeareSch.shtml

Edited April 14, 2009 by Carmen_and_Company

[Laura Corin]

I use both. We read children's versions aloud, then watch a cartoon version that includes some of the original language. After that, we watch a full original-language version. When we are doing the latter, Calvin has to stay and watch, but Hobbes can wander off if he likes.

 

For comparison: I know that UK schools all are meant to do at least one Shakespeare (original text) in the years before high school.

 

Laura

[Arch at Home]

The others have hit upon it. Exposure is the key. My children started their love affair with Shakespeare when they were just shy of 2, 4, and 6. Our local Shakespeare company puts on a free will offering production each summer. That summer it was Much Ado About Nothing. We got Lois Burdet's version of that play and read through it. Then we borrowed Kenneth Branaugh's movie version. By the time they saw the live play they had a good idea of the story line. During the intermission an elderly woman asked the not quite 4 year old about the play. My child explained that is was about "a good wedding and a bad wedding."

 

The same local Shakespeare company puts on Saturday class during the school year and summer camps in which the kids delve deeper into the world of Shakespeare and complete the class or camp with a production of one of the plays. With tThe first class my oldest took when she was about 7 1/2, I put considerable amount of effort working through the text with her to help her to understand what she was reciting. Two years later I rarely have the paraphrase anything and her younger sister has no problem either.

 

I can't imagine us currently tackling reading a full play at home but excerpts or severely pruned version would be no problem.

[alegnab]

Dc#2 started participating in a Shakespeare class taught by another homeschool mom (who may chime in on this post) when he was in 7th grade or maybe 6th. A few days before class, the teacher sends an email with role assignments, questions to answer, and things she wants the kids to look for (like literary devices), so that they're prepared to discuss. During the class, the students read the full play, one act per week, and then they discuss it. On the day of the reading of the last act, they also watch the play on DVD. Dc has enjoyed the classes for the most part.

 

Dc#1 *loves* Shakespeare. He first got exposed to it through my friend's class during his 8th grade or earlier. He begged me to let him take Dr. McMenomy's Summer Shakespeare class through Scholars Online the summer before 9th grade. He loved it, so he also took Summer Shakespeare II the next summer. He took Dr. M's English Lit class in 10th grade and studied more Shakespeare. He has read all of Shakespeare's plays. He has seen quite a few of the BBC Shakespeare plays. We have gone to productions of Shakespeare's plays during our local Shakespeare festivals. If he had not been exposed to Shakespeare by my friend, perhaps he wouldn't love it so much.

[Jenny in Florida]

So, I have to know...are you all talking about real Shakespeare, or children's versions of his plays?

 

I was skimming through a Shakespeare for children Usborne book, and even that looked to advanced for my 6th grader. Am I missing something??

 

thanks for helping me know where to set the bar...

 

Well, for us, it means the real thing. But I have to say that my kids have been seeing and hearing Shakespearean language since they were toddlers. (My daughter attended her first "in the park" performnce in a stroller. My son's favorite movie when he was three was "A Midsummer Night's Dream"; he called Bottom "Donkey Boy." Each of them has had her/his own season ticket to the local Shakespeare theatre since age eight.)

 

I've always thought that Elizabethan English is pretty much like a foreign language, and it's much easier to learn if you start young. It's just something that's always been "in the air" in our home.

 

I have horrible, vivid memories of high school English classes, sitting there listening to my classmates butcher "Romeo and Juliet" and "Julius Caesar." They didn't get it, hadn't a clue. And, because they'd been told their whole lives how tough this was and that they wouldn't be ready for it until they were in high school, they were intimidated. I--having seen the Zeferelli "Romeo and Juliet" a couple of years before--had already fallen in love with Shakespeare and was reading plays for fun with my friends. Even then, I didn't understand why it was so hard.

 

We started by seeing the plays, either live or on film. Then, I read some aloud to them, and we discussed it. My daughter read "Midsummer Night's Dream" on her own when she was eight. My son will be reading his first plays independently next year, at age 11.

 

But, honestly, it's not like sixth grade is "late." I'd guess in most public schools, students still aren't assigned any Shakespeare before high school. I believe the biggest thing is to not make it a big thing. Shakespeare is fun. It's wonderful. The comedies are funny. There's blood and gore and guts for the guys. It's great stuff. You just have to adjust your ears a bit to get it.

 

I'm a big fan of seeing plays before reaading them. They were meant to be seen, after all. For a first-timer, it can be useful to read a synopsis of the story, then go see a good production. Once your ears get attuned to the language, jumping to reading just isn't that difficult.

 

Good luck!

[RhondaM.]

This post describes my ds8 EXACTLY! He also enjoys listening to his dad read/perform the original. He really gets into the language and enjoys it!

 

This past week I was reading William Shakespeare and the Globe by Aliki. After we finished the book he shouted, "Mom, can we build our own model of the Globe Theatre"? So, the lesson plans went out the window and we acted on his enthusiasm.

 

That is just a bit of insight into our Shakespeare stuff.

 

Brittney, did you guys really build your own model? I was looking for a way to do this very thing. I couldn't find any helps on Amazon except for a pop up model. Not what I was looking for.

 

I'm excited about getting into Shakespeare this year. When my middle ds was 10 or 11 we sat down and listened to ArkAngel's dramatized unabridged audio of Hamlet. We followed along with the Folgers book. Before each scene we'd read what it was going to be about. He had read the children's version before so was familiar with the story. We listened to it over several days and just really enjoyed it.

 

This year I SPLURGED and bought a big box of 38 Arkangel CDs!!!! I am so excited about it. I have a couple of children's versions of the plays (Nesbits and Lambs I think) so we will read those...I've ordered (for my 8 yr old dd) a child's coloring book of plays and paperdolls too! I know there are lots of picture books of the plays as well. So once a week we are going to have a Shakespeare day.

 

It is funny because while listening to a play ds will occasionally hear a quote that he is familiar with and his eyes just light up as he realizes that it originated from Shakespeare. I love it!

 

I want my kids to hear Shakespeare so much that it is never anything they feel they cannot understand. I don't want them ot be like me and listen to their first Shakespeare play when they are grown. When I listened to Hamlet with my son that was my first Shakespeare experience. I didn't know what I'd been missing!

 

Rhonda

[laylamcb]

This year I read several of Lamb's retellings to my 6yo. Then she listened to an audiobook of Nesbit's retellings. I gave her coloring pages and paper dolls to use alongside. Periodically throughout the year I stand up and recite/act out a famous soliloquy from one of the plays (this week was Antony's "friends, Romans"); the kids LOVE that! I also frequently read them the sonnets. We've checked out some Shakespeare picture books (Coville's Midsummer Night's Dream is beautifully illustrated) as well as Stanley's Bard of Avon and Aliki's book about the Globe.

 

My daughter didn't have any qualms about the themes or the language because she doesn't have any hangups about Shakespeare yet. How refreshing! ;)

 

She also calls her 4yo brother Puck. Ha!

[choirfarm]

Brittney, did you guys really build your own model? I was looking for a way to do this very thing. I couldn't find any helps on Amazon except for a pop up model. Not what I was looking for.

 

 

Rhonda

 

 

http://www.papertoys.com/globe.htm

 

 

Hve fun!

[choirfarm]

This reminds me of my first year of teaching when we moved to Oklahoma. A teacher died in September and I was hired for his classes and so I followed what the department chair did. She did Julius Caesar for an entire 9 weeks!!!!!!!! Oh, my goodness. You want to talk about killing the love for something. I did it in 2 the next year. Listening to those records... BORING!! Analyzing every single word. BORING!!!

 

What I did with my children when we studied Rome is used a cartoon version I had and let them read it to get the overall story. Then we watched the Marlon Brando version together with my stopping every now and then to talk about famous lines (That's Greek to me!) or important plot points. It worked very well.

 

This year we actually did a unit on Shakespeare. The boys are 6th and 8th. I either let them read or read aloud an easier Shakespeare version of the play. Some TOG recommended. Some I found at the library. Then we watched a real version of the play. They enjoyed it. We have a Shakespeare festival every summer here and now the boys can't wait to go.

 

Christine

[RhondaM.]

http://www.papertoys.com/globe.htm

 

 

Hve fun!

 

Hey thanks. I've book marked it.

Rhonda

[KarenNC]

For us there's a difference between enjoying the plays and "studying" them the way one would do in high school or college. We're not doing literary analysis or any of that sort of thing. We've listened to or read a few of the storylines (Jim Weiss audio cd and an animated/puppet version of some of them), and then we've watched the movies together so that I can help explain any terms that are obscure. Her favorite is Midsummer Night's Dream with Kevin Klein (beginning at about age 6?), but she also likes the version of Taming of the Shrew with John Cleese. We've watched a couple of others as well. So far we stick to the comedies for the full-length movies, though she is aware of the basic story line for some of the others. She will have a different level of understanding of it when we do study it later on, but now it is as they were meant to be---entertainment.

 

We've never been ones to shy away from complex language, either in what we read to her, books we listen to or in the way we speak with her. We've been enjoying Patrick Stewart's recording of "A Christmas Carol" since she was 5. One thing I like to do with the dvds of Shakespeare is to turn on the subtitles, as I find that helps as well. Of course we do that with all movies so that we don't have to turn up the sound as loud----we got in the habit watching foreign films and/or watching them after she went to bed and we didn't want them loud to wake her up.

[laylamcb]

For us there's a difference between enjoying the plays and "studying" them the way one would do in high school or college. We're not doing literary analysis or any of that sort of thing.

 

...

 

We've never been ones to shy away from complex language, either in what we read to her, books we listen to or in the way we speak with her.

 

:iagree::iagree:

 

I forgot to mention also the BBC animated Shakespeare, which is a favorite:

http://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-Animated-Tales-Alec-McCowen/dp/B0002CHJS2

 

You can check some (maybe all?) of these out on YouTube. :001_smile:

[KarenNC]

:iagree::iagree:

 

I forgot to mention also the BBC animated Shakespeare, which is a favorite:

http://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-Animated-Tales-Alec-McCowen/dp/B0002CHJS2

 

You can check some (maybe all?) of these out on YouTube. :001_smile:

 

Yes, these are the ones we did. I do have to admit I was a bit surprised at the love scene (between animated characters) in the Romeo and Juliet, however. A fair bit more explicit than I would have expected from a series aimed at children. It's after they are married, but she is shown nude from the back, he not as obviously nude, while they kiss and caress. It was more than I would have planned to show to my then 6 year old, so you may want to preview that particular one. On the first one that comes up on youtube, it's in the second part of three (at 4:33 into the video).

[King Alfred Academy]

:iagree::iagree:

 

I forgot to mention also the BBC animated Shakespeare, which is a favorite:

http://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-Animated-Tales-Alec-McCowen/dp/B0002CHJS2

 

You can check some (maybe all?) of these out on YouTube. :001_smile:

 

 

Here is the link I used...

http://www.squidoo.com/shakespeare-animated-tales

They are listed all in one place.

 

Midsummers Night's Dream, As You Like It, and Twelfth Night are okay for littles to watch. And I am VERY particular about what my boys watch. Glad I did not have them watch Romeo And Juliet by the way Karen NC described it!

[abbeyej]

All of the above! We often begin with retellings before reading or watching the "real thing"... We have a variety of children's retellings available, and the Animated Shakespeare series (which feature some really wonderful actors!)... And we have a number of film adaptations available on dvd. And we go and see live productions of Shakespeare plays pretty regularly.

 

My ds had gone to "Shakespeare camp" at a local professional Shakespeare company a couple of times, so when they needed two young boys to be the princes in Richard III, they called him up to audition. He got the part of the younger prince, which was a fantastic experience. He turned 8 during rehearsals. Richard III probably wasn't a play that I would have picked to do with my young children, but they both enjoyed getting to know the play intimately.

 

Yes, reading about, reading, seeing, even performing in a Shakespeare play will be different for a 6 or 8 or 10 year old than it is for a high school student. It'll be different for a high school student than it is for an adult... But that doesn't mean it isn't worth doing. In some ways coming back to a play that you loved at 8 and seeing it again in a whole new light adds another layer of richness!

 

Not to mention that the kids who enjoy Shakespeare at 6 or 8 or 10 aren't intimidated when they approach Shakespeare as teens. He's an old friend!

 

I don't see it as "pushing" my kids to do something earlier than others to make them seem smarter or anything like that -- I do it because I think enjoying and appreciating art and theater and poetry at a young age adds to their lives. Even if their understand and appreciation is different now than it will be at some later point. Even if some things go completely over their heads!

 

That, and I just think it's hilarious watching my young children act out scenes from the plays!!! ;)

[SquirrellyMama]

So far I've read storybook versions to my kids and then explained it to them. We read "As you Like It" in 8th grade and I understood NONE of it. We read more in hs and again I didn't understand much. I loved "The Taming of the Shrew".

[claire up north]

Thank you all for your help and insights! I'm off to track down some of the resources you mentioned and to pull out my big "Complete Works of Shakespeare" books.

 

Thanks again!

[KarenNC]

So far I've read storybook versions to my kids and then explained it to them. We read "As you Like It" in 8th grade and I understood NONE of it. We read more in hs and again I didn't understand much. I loved "The Taming of the Shrew".

 

Personally, I didn't "get" Shakespeare until I finally saw it performed. Watching the performances transcended the differences in modern and older language that were a barrier to reading (even though I had a really good vocabulary and was widely read for my age). They made it "come alive" and helped me connect with the characters (and particularly finally experience the comedies as actually funny :001_smile:). I think I may have been in high school when I first saw one of his plays performed. I wanted my daughter's first experiences with Shakespeare to be as entertainment.