SpyCar, or anyone who knows about Hasidism

[Ipsey]

I was in the airport the other day and saw a Hasidic couple. . .or so I thought. I could be wrong.

 

The man wore an extremely long black coat, black hat, long curly forelocks, beard, and I caught sight of white talit (I think) tassels when he was picking up his luggage.

 

The woman who was with him. . . I wasn't sure she was with him at first because. . .I thought he should only be traveling with his wife--but she didn't meet my expectations about a Hasidic woman I guess.

 

She wore a bright blue knee-length dress with hose (seam up the back!). Her hair was cut short, maybe to her shoulders, and she wore a tidy little blue hat, reminded me of Jackie O. I think it was her real hair. . . of course, I didn't get close enough to be certain. Perhaps it wasn't. If I recall, she had a wedding ring, so I assumed she was married to the fellow she was with. I thought I heard them conversing in Yiddish.

 

Uh, anyway, I guess I was wondering about dress for women in Hasidic Judaism. When I studied it in college, I had a very different picture of Hasidic women--shaving their hair and wearing a wig over top covered with a pretty scarf. Covered legs. etc. Has it changed, or was this just a very narrow view of Hasidism. . .or, was this couple, perhaps, not Hasidic?

[stripe]

Some observant women wear real hair wigs, for what it's worth (virtually all the hair for these things come from mass shavings at Hindu temples in India, incidentally), but no clue about pantyhose preferences.

[Whereneverever]

It is really hard to tell with a good wig, btw. It's also possible that she was his sister or another female relative, not his wife.

[stripe]

And not every family member matches each other in dress style, from personal observation of both religious people and non.

[BinahYeteirah]

I am Chassidic, although I belong to one of the more "open" groups of Chassidim.

 

That definitely sounds like a Chassidic lady to me. It could have been his wife or another relative. It's impossible to know for sure, but the way you describe her clothing sounds fairly typical of many Chassidic women.

 

I, for example, wear an uncovered wig made of human hair. It looks pretty natural, or so I'm told, although I am not necessarily going for that look. Many women in certain groups wear a wig (human hair or synthetic, depending) with a hat or wide headband on top. The little pillbox hats are very popular and have been for several decades, as far as I know. There a lots of other types of common headcoverings, depending on the particular group, the woman's preference, and the social situation. Again, it's not possible to know for certain, but it's likely her hair was shaved under her wig.

 

The stockings with a seam are often indicative of a more conservative group, like Satmar. In these groups, seamed stockings are not thought of the way most people in the general public think of them (as a sexual article of clothing). The seam is supposed to provide an additional visual clue that the woman's legs are covered by stockings, even if the color of her hosiery is flesh-toned. In other words, seamed stockings are thought of as more modest.

 

As far as skirt length, the general rule is that the knee should be covered in all positions. I personally prefer a somewhat longer, but not too long, skirt. Many Chassidic women, especially younger, trendier ones, wear shorter skirts that just cover the knee.

[Spy Car]

The stockings with a seam are often indicative of a more conservative group, like Satmar. In these groups, seamed stockings are not thought of the way most people in the general public think of them (as a sexual article of clothing). The seam is supposed to provide an additional visual clue that the woman's legs are covered by stockings, even if the color of her hosiery is flesh-toned. In other words, seamed stockings are thought of as more modest.

 

That's what I was thinking, Satmar. This is a Satmar thing, right?

 

I'm a little out of my depth on this one Ipsey but I would have assumed Satmar. But I could be wrong. I don't know if there are any other Chassidic groups that practice this, but it is a Satmar thing.

 

Bill

[Spy Car]

And not every family member matches each other in dress style, from personal observation of both religious people and non.

 

For the record, I have no control over the questions that are thrown my way :D

 

Bill

[justamouse]

Ahhh, that's what the seams are about.

 

I saw a Hassidic couple at IKEA once, she had on a cute, summery peasant skirt with seamed stockings, and I think she was wearing a wig (and a headband!) but the way she walked up to her husband--boom chick boom--

 

I was chuckling. I bet she drove the other women batty. I thought the seams were a part of the outfit, though.

 

I'll never forget it.

 

Thank you for explaining the attire-that's pretty cool!

[Spy Car]

Ahhh, that's what the seams are about.

 

I saw a Hassidic couple at IKEA once, she had on a cute, summery peasant skirt with seamed stockings, and I think she was wearing a wig (and a headband!) but the way she walked up to her husband--boom chick boom--

 

I was chuckling. I bet she drove the other women batty. I thought the seams were a part of the outfit, though.

 

I'll never forget it.

 

Thank you for explaining the attire-that's pretty cool!

 

Satmar and "boom chicka boom" are not two things I've ever associated in my mind :D

 

Bill

[stripe]

For the record, I have no control over the questions that are thrown my way :D

 

;) I guess people think you know a lot about wigs and stockings. :001_huh:

[Spy Car]

;) I guess people think you know a lot about wigs and stockings. :001_huh:

 

I do know that rabbinical authorities have ruled that Indian wigs (with hair taken as part of Hindu ritual) are not kosher.

 

I'm not sure about stockings ;) :D

 

Bill

[stripe]

I do know that rabbinical authorities have ruled that Indian wigs (with hair taken as part of Hindu ritual) are not kosher.

 

Yes. I don't know what took them so long to wonder where all that hair was coming from, or why, but there you are. With descriptions like this, I wonder, where did the idea come from that European hair is better for a wig than Asian hair? I thought Asian hair was the standard, or is that only for black women's wigs? I love the idea of seeking out just the right geographic region for just the right hair. Wonder who cracked the secret of Chinese women with thin hair? Wouldn't you love that job, of searching the globe, one head at a time?

 

From Fortune Wigs:

The secret to it's European-like fineness is due to the geographical location we source it from, a small area of China bordering on Europe. Because the hair is naturally fine and silky, we do not have to put it through heavy chemical processing like most other wig brands. The result, is a stunningly naturally wig that looks like virgin European hair- at a fraction of the cost!

[Spy Car]

Yes. I don't know what took them so long to wonder where all that hair was coming from, or why, but there you are. With descriptions like this, I wonder, where did the idea come from that European hair is better for a wig than Asian hair? I thought Asian hair was the standard, or is that only for black women's wigs? I love the idea of seeking out just the right geographic region for just the right hair. Wonder who cracked the secret of Chinese women with thin hair? Wouldn't you love that job, of searching the globe, one head at a time?

 

From Fortune Wigs:

The secret to it's European-like fineness is due to the geographical location we source it from, a small area of China bordering on Europe. Because the hair is naturally fine and silky, we do not have to put it through heavy chemical processing like most other wig brands. The result, is a stunningly naturally wig that looks like virgin European hair- at a fraction of the cost!

 

That's called: Salesmanship! :D

 

Bill

[YaelAldrich]

I'm putting my vote for Satmar as well. Seamed stockings, short wig, pillbox hat on top, conservative dress.

 

:)

[staceyobu]

There are women that shave their heads and then wear wigs? Would someone please explain this to me?

[Melissa in Australia]

There are women that shave their heads and then wear wigs? Would someone please explain this to me?

 

I could be wrong, but I think the practice originated in Russia, and was designed to make the women look not attractive, ( no hair) so non Jews would not be interested in them. ( got that from the Mitchener book The Source)

[BinahYeteirah]

There are women that shave their heads and then wear wigs? Would someone please explain this to me?

 

Yep, and I'm one of them. It's actually the custom in my particular community for married women to cut their hair short, but not shave, but for a number of reasons, I choose to shave.

 

Observant Jewish married women follow a set of laws often referred to as "family purity". These laws involve a husband and wife abstaining from physical contact during the wife's period (or other uterine bleeding) and for a number of days afterward. At the end of this period apart, the wife prepares herself and immerses in a ritual pool of water, known as a "mikvah". Part of the preparations involve washing the hair and making certain there are no knots or tangles before entering the mikvah. Tangles or knots could potentially invalidate the woman's immersion, so some consider short or shaved hair an advantage, since it is much less likely to tangle or knot. Married women shaving their heads is a strong custom in certain groups for this reason.

 

Many (most?) observant Jewish married women cover their heads/hair in some way for religious modesty purposes. There are many different customs and opinions on the best way to accomplish this headcovering. There are about a million options from not covering at all, to covering most of the hair with a hat or scarf, to shaving it all off and covering with an austere plain black kerchief. One custom is to wear a wig over one's natural hair (or shaved head).

 

This is the preferred custom in my community. There are many reasons for this. One reason given is that even though the wig looks like hair (or *is* hair), the woman's own hair is still covered and kept private. Even if the wig looks better than the woman's natural hair might, it is still not a natural part of her with the same sensual quality that her own hair has; she and most people with whom she interacts know it is not her real hair. The point of headcovering, according to this view, is not to diminish the woman's looks, but to adhere to the law and keep the hair of a married woman private. Another reason given in my community for this practice is that some women may be ashamed of covering their hair in certain social situations (e.g. professional workplaces or around non-religious people), so the wig allows them to go out into the world without any temptation to remove their headcovering. Another reason I hear in my community is that women who cover only with a scarf of hat often allow some hair to peek out from their headcovering. Since it is better, according to the view of my community, to cover every hair, full wigs are preferred, since women do not generally let them slip back or let a lot of hair hang out.

[Ipsey]

I am Chassidic, although I belong to one of the more "open" groups of Chassidim.

 

That definitely sounds like a Chassidic lady to me. It could have been his wife or another relative. It's impossible to know for sure, but the way you describe her clothing sounds fairly typical of many Chassidic women.

 

I, for example, wear an uncovered wig made of human hair. It looks pretty natural, or so I'm told, although I am not necessarily going for that look. Many women in certain groups wear a wig (human hair or synthetic, depending) with a hat or wide headband on top. The little pillbox hats are very popular and have been for several decades, as far as I know. There a lots of other types of common headcoverings, depending on the particular group, the woman's preference, and the social situation. Again, it's not possible to know for certain, but it's likely her hair was shaved under her wig.

 

The stockings with a seam are often indicative of a more conservative group, like Satmar. In these groups, seamed stockings are not thought of the way most people in the general public think of them (as a sexual article of clothing). The seam is supposed to provide an additional visual clue that the woman's legs are covered by stockings, even if the color of her hosiery is flesh-toned. In other words, seamed stockings are thought of as more modest.

 

As far as skirt length, the general rule is that the knee should be covered in all positions. I personally prefer a somewhat longer, but not too long, skirt. Many Chassidic women, especially younger, trendier ones, wear shorter skirts that just cover the knee.

 

Thanks so much for your response and for the detailed explanation :) I appreciate your sharing with me (and all of us, of course)! :)

[Ipsey]

For the record, I have no control over the questions that are thrown my way :D

 

Bill

 

Well, really, you bring them on yourself when you intimate that you've splashed about in an Hassidic Mikvah, SpyCar! :lol: