My turn: help needed for dealing with rebellious teen

[Night Elf]

I've always had such a great relationship with my dd16 but we're running into some serious issues now. It boils down to her wanting to be treated like an adult but refusing to take on responsibilities and dropping the ball on the few responsibilities she does have.

 

I know the first few things to do in limitations but I need some good resources on more advice. Books, websites, etc.

 

I can't believe I'm one of those naive parents who thought this kind of attitude would never happen in my home. Ugh!!!

[LBC]

Books, websites, etc.

 

 

 

Well, my oldest is only 15, so I'm not able to offer much advice. The book I recommend for every parenting issue is Hold on to Your Kids by Dr. Gordon Neufeld.

 

Here's a link to the author's website http://www.gordonneufeld.com/ but you can get it through Amazon.

 

It's a great book, and isn't all about "rules", or "how to" advice. He talks about relationship being the key to parenting.

 

Time for me to read it again.:tongue_smilie:

 

Lori

[Pamela H in Texas]

you might try http://www.empoweringparents.com The programs he has are wonderful (though pricey). But there are a lot of articles to help ya out in the meantime.

 

Another option would be to share specific concerns and see what the Hive can come up with :)

[Night Elf]

Another option would be to share specific concerns and see what the Hive can come up with :)

 

Yeah, I thought about that. But it's hard to actually put it in writing, you know?

 

Claire has been in private and public schools until this school year. She lived most of those years with her dad and stepmom, public school teachers, who parent completely differently than I do. They believe in making all the decisions for the child right through college and have already done so with one child. (BTW, that child now lives out of state intentionally, happily living her married life without the influence of her parents.)

 

Claire moved in with me the summer before high school began. It was quite a transition because leaving her dad's house was really, really hard. She has a major love/hate relationship with him. Until that time, she spent most weekends and all major school holidays with me so we weren't unfamiliar with how we interacted. She began public school 9th grade near our home and the school district redistricted her to a new high school for 10th grade. Her 10th grade year was rough, full of anxiety issues that had gotten worse over the years. She was put on anxiety medication and still takes it today.

 

This school year, she found the courage to leave school against her dad's wishes and homeschool the rest of her diploma. She's watched me homeschool her brother and sister for over 6 years. I'm relaxed and believe in helping my children make choices and decisions. I'm totally okay with her going either the accredited or nonaccredited route, just so long as she does the required work to meet a high school education's standard. She chose to use Keystone and insisted, beyond my judgement, to enroll in 6 courses because she was trying to mimic public high school. I paid $2000 for those courses. Of the 6 courses, she's halfway through 2 of them, a quarter of the way through 2 others, and hasn't touched the final 2. The course deadlines end in August 2009.

 

She got a part-time job working in a gelato and chocolate shop because of her love of making desserts. Her plan has been to get a culinary degree specializing in pastry baking. She's getting annoyed with her job because the owner has put more responsibility on her and has asked her to work more. She's up to 15 hrs. per week. She doesn't know if she wants to go to college so she doesn't want to work on a college preparatory plan. She feels she's done enough school even if she can't get into college. Her problem solving is to sweep the problem under the rug and expect it to go away. Her dad is just like this and it was one of the major reasons we divorced. I'm not very good at going through life on a daily basis with no goals at all.

 

The main problem? She's become friends with a group of people on World of Warcraft, including a 16 yr. old boy she is falling in love with. She has an IRL friend who is encouraging her to go out of state to meet this boy. I quit my job 2 weeks ago in response to the craziness that's been going on. We've tried to work out plans but really, she doesn't hold her end of the bargain on any of them. She plays the 'oh poor me' card frequently. She's obviously not ready for the responsibility of being a young adult. I need to step in and make some major decisions because she's beginning to be really rude and disrespectful. She has cussed me out a couple of times and that has really taken me by surprise!

 

I'm cancelling her World of Warcraft account. She's also refusing to do any of her schoolwork and gets mad when she's scheduled to work. All she wants to do is talk to her online friends by computer IM'ing, being in game, and even texting with her cell phone. I'm probably going to cancel the phone as well. These are really tough decisions for me because I'm being pushed out of my comfortable parenting boundaries. But I'm ready to do them because I am the parent and I will not be treated this way by anyone, especially a child of mine. I'm trying to help her learn responsibility but she's taking advantage of me. As Dr. Phil would say, How's that working for you? It's not working at all. It's time for change.

[Blueridge]

You might get her a copy of Do Hard Things by the Harris brothers. It comes highly recommended by my 15dd.

Ginger

[LBC]

You might get her a copy of Do Hard Things by the Harris brothers. It comes highly recommended by my 15dd.

Ginger

 

Yes, my dd (15) really enjoyed this. She made some very positive changes in her life after reading this book. I started reading it out loud, and she took it to bed that night and devoured the rest of the book.

 

It's written from a Christian POV, but there's plenty of great content that would resonate with those having different belief systems.

 

Lori

[Joanne]

I have no advice.

 

I just want to say that, as a divorced mom involved in coparenting issues, I admire you.

 

It sounds like you are absolutely on track with the changes that need to happen in response to her current behavior and perspective.

 

It might help to read up on addiction if you aren't already familiar: WoW addiction can be a very real, very insidious, awful thing.

[Night Elf]

Lori: I've ordered the book you recommended. It isn't at my library or my local B&N store. It looks good though. Thanks!

 

Ginger: I bought Do Hard Things at my local B&N this evening. Claire was put off by the fact the book was Christian but agreed to give it a try if I would read it aloud with her.

 

Joanne: Thank you for the post. Truthfully, I don't think the addiction is with WoW itself, but with her desire to have friends. She'll spend hours on the game talking to her friends and not even actually playing. She's had several disasters with real life friends and I think she finds the online community easier to navigate without getting personally invested. I'm working on that and plan to talk to her therapist about it at her next visit coming up.

[Peela]

I think it sounds like you are on the right track, myself.

I sat my two teens down yesterday and had a talk with them. An "attitude" has been showing up aroudn here lately- they want lots of freedom, yet they dont keep up their responsibilities. My 14yo loves to go to bed late and sleep in- but it means she doesnt do her chores till lunchtime and will likely not do them at all because she knows no one will notice till the evenings. Meanwhile animals starve, the kitchen is a mess, etc

 

So the talk was gentle and loving and firm- you are not yet an adult, you are living under our roof, you live by our rules, and its time to give back. As a kid, mostly things get done for you. As you grow up, you learn to take your part in helping the family system function- you pull your weight. In return, your parents slowly hand out more freedom as we deem you capable of managing it. If you stop pulling your weight and become a burden on the family system, you lose your freedoms until you show you are responsible enough to correct your side of things. They both saw what I was getting at. I also told them that if they really felt we were being unreasonable, we were ready to listen and negotiate.

But I am trying to nip this in the bud- it has become an issue but its not too bad yet.

 

Does your daughter have many friends? Mine has many but on days she is not with them- and being with them usually involves me driving her somewhere- she is on the computer talking to them, too. I limit it, and I keep her in the main part of the house so I can glance over her shoulder. At one point it was getting too secretive.

We just dont do online games. I have heard bad things about World of Warcraft by adults who told me not to let my son play it.

 

I dont think your daughter is too young to impose your rules upon, but I do agree its about relationship, and working on that.

I was a nightmare 16yo- I have compassion for the age :) My poor mother. She actually kicked me out. I didnt deserve it, but she just didnt know how to handle it. In retrospect, some firm rules and guidance and less freedom was probably the answer, but also lots of respect and love. She was too distracted with a relationship to manage me.

[Catherine]

It sounds like your daughter needs a lot of structure. It is what she has been accustomed to until recently. I have a child like this, and it's hard enough without the challenge of parenting from two different households. He is not a bad kid, and has goals, but is utterly unable to see them through without a lot of direction and handholding from someone (me). I still oversee his schoolwork every day and he even sometimes wants me to just point him in the right direction of where to work next. So I don't think you should assume she can manage the six classes without some outside help with setting up schedules, laying out short term goals, etc. Can you offer her some help with that, or have you already done it? Some kids simply aren't very self-directed-or even if they are, still need guidance with some tasks. I know that my ds has not learned the right lessons from his previous failures and so I'm wary of simply turning him loose on a big project that I know he cannot totally manage on his own.

 

As an aside, my ds went back to school last year for ninth grade, and he flew through. He organized himself, kept track of assignments, without any help from me. So he is capable of it, but not without some help here at home, where there is much less structure built into our day.

 

I totally agree with the recommendation about Hold Onto You Kids-it's about how children absolutely need us, and our love and acceptance, and will attach to peers (usually with disastrous results) when we don't keep track of them. It helped me to see beyond behavior and work on our relationship in stead-which in turn helped improve (gradually) the behavior.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Beth,

 

I have some mixed thoughts.

 

First, I think you're doing fine in many ways and ARE addressing things. Don't forget to give yourself credit!

 

Second, I would set up some general discipline. It isn't her fault, due to her past living experience, but she just doesn't have the skills, tools, discipline, etc to be as free as you would like her to be. It makes sense that she would take advantage, use less than ideal coping skills, even given up having gone from extreme controlling to very little (which is why I have such an issue with people that control teens and then wonder why they go bonkers sometime between 16 and 21). It would be kinder to her if you gave her babysteps to work her way up to the responsibility level you want to see from her. Make it where she can succeed each step of the way and rapidly work her way up. And back up a little if it's too rapid.

[Garga]

I was signing on to recommend Hold on to Your Kids by Dr. Gordon Neufeld, but Lori beat me to it! Oo, I especially recommend it after reading about her desire to have friends in WoW. The book is about how people form attachments and what to do when your kids form attachments to their peers at the exclusion of their attachment to you.

[Night Elf]

Does your daughter have many friends?

 

Thanks Peela. I understand and agree with everything you told your kids. I said many of the same things last night when talking with Claire. Unfortunately, she does not have a lot of friends. She has 2 girlfriends, both homeschooling. Both are kind of a mess to be honest. One of them is very religious and has been pushing Claire into going to church. I feel she's undone the work I've done over the past few years with Claire regarding religion. She's made Claire hate the very mention of God or Christianity which is why she freaked when I gave her the Do Hard Things book. The other friend is footloose and fancy free with no rules and a messed up home life. She's the one who is encouraging Claire to be more like herself.

 

I've tried to get Claire involved in other activities. Nothing has clicked yet.

[Night Elf]

It sounds like your daughter needs a lot of structure. It is what she has been accustomed to until recently.

 

Yes, I agree. I helped her set up a homeschooling plan when we first got her materials. But a week later, I took a job outside the home. I thought I was keeping up with her but apparently not well enough. I quit my job a couple of weeks ago so I can focus solely on my family. Everyone was out of sorts with my working outside the home. We're getting back on track now. :)

[Night Elf]

Second, I would set up some general discipline. It isn't her fault, due to her past living experience, but she just doesn't have the skills, tools, discipline, etc to be as free as you would like her to be.

 

I know. See my response above this one. I made a huge mistake trying to work outside the home and thinking Claire could do so much on her own. That's changing now. :)

 

It's 9:30am and I've made everyone wake up. Time to start our day!!

[Chris in VA]

Beth, I really admire you for quitting work and being with your family. I just want to give you lots of "atta girl" support because I have experienced working outside the home this year, and it is very hard to manage--and I'm no longer homeschooling.

 

One little thing--and this is said gently--I noticed your siggy, about WoW. Could you stop playing also, and just take it out of your home for now? I have an analogy that probably doesn't fit very well, but I'll offer it, anyway; I've decided to stop drinking any alcohol, to support my son, who is an alcoholic. Perhaps you could support your dd's need to get back to reality by letting WoW go for a season. I'm sure it will be there when she leaves the house. It might give you insight into her feelings if you are experiencing a little loss yourself (I could be wrong here--are you thinking of pulling the WoW plug on her?...).

 

I think you are brave to admit you misjudged her ability to handle freedom, and even braver for trying to find solutions instead of hiding under the bed, so to speak. Thanks for being an example of good, proactive, caring parenting.

[Wildiris]

Dear Night Elf,

 

I wish I could offer up a simple solution, but every solution I've tried has not worked with either of my DSs. The level of frustration is overwhelming when dealing with teens addicted not to drugs but friends visited through media devices. My younger Ds text messages as a way to "stay in contact" even thought he goes to public school and sees these kids every day. Unlike the premise in Do Hard Things, my DH and I have very high expectations, encourage setting goals, clean the backpack for homework and yes, take privileges away such as the text plan. You would think my DS would be a paragon of excellence; you would think that because someone cared enough to see that the homework was done, drove to events for social interaction and arrainged for getting a driver's licence that there would be an inkling of responsibility floating around. There isn't.

 

I do not think that there is an easy solution to the problem. For a long time I wanted to point the finger at public education, yet I think the problem lays not with peer presure or school, rather these kids have internalized and are mirroring our society at large. Take a look at our current economic situation and how little personal responsibility is being taken by CEOs of companies for their actions. Look at Califonia's governement and their lawmaker's inability to solve Califonia's budget crisis. Look at the level of personal debt in this country and the lack of personal responsibility and self restraint many exhibit. As a whole our society does not set an example of taking personal resonsibility. We want someone to bale us out just like the banks or the auto industry, and our kids want us to bale them out too.

 

Obviously all of this is my opinion, but I think that when teens see this kind of behavior it validates their lack of responsibility. Not enough people "Walk the Talk" or Practice what they preach" for teens to see a reason for altering their behavior. This makes my job as a parent harder. :tongue_smilie: