doing biology at home (s/o public schools)

[JennyD]

DS14 will be in 10th grade next year.  He is a very self-motivated student who loves learning and will likely pursue some sort of science (although I doubt it will be bio) in college.   He wants to remain competitive for highly selective schools/programs.  He is unlikely to do much in the way of DE so will not have many outside grades.  I have been assuming that his 'outside validation,' then, will have to mostly come through testing.

I would like to do bio with him next year.  My original plan was for us to to do AP Bio, probably through a combination of textbooks and videos.  But he really does not enjoy online learning or videos, and in any event the thought of just grinding through this material depresses me.

So how can I take advantage of the freedom that homeschooling (theoretically) offers to do something really interesting and challenging for biology, but that I can also document adequately/validate for college application purposes?   Is there a way I can structure a biology class that will prepare him to take the AP test but also allow some different sorts of explorations?  

I should note that I myself do not have much background in biology, although I can hire a grad student pretty easily to check work and answer questions if needed.

Any thoughts for me on what this could look like?  Ideas?  Inspiration?

[8filltheheart]

Is there a reason you are choosing bio as the subject you want to validate? If you are concerned about validating his transcript for admissions, reality is you can accomplish that with a handful of courses. So if bio isnt his thing, you could be creative with your bio credit and then "validate" chem or physics. 

In addition to AP exams, subject test scores "validate" and are actually recommended or required by some schools.

[GoodGrief]

There are a number of test prep books that he could work through to get ready for the exam, along with whatever you chose to do for the course. You could not call the course AP BIo unless you have your syllabus approved, but the testing would still allow for the possibility of credit at schools that offer such. 8 mentioned the option of taking the SAT bio subject test, and that would also be my preference.

FWIW, my daughter took AP Bio through PAH. I've not been one interested in putting together my own courses for the most part. :-)

[JennyD]

8 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

Is there a reason you are choosing bio as the subject you want to validate?

 Good question.  Thinking about it now, I realize that  since he wants to study science in college, I have just been assuming that as many of his science classes as possible need to have some kind of outside component or validation.  But that assumption isn't actually based on any real information, just my own generalized anxiety.  Hmm.  

3 hours ago, GoodGrief1 said:

 8 mentioned the option of taking the SAT bio subject test, and that would also be my preference.

 

I had been wondering about that test. May I ask why you would recommend it?

[MamaSprout]

We are working through an SAT subject test book for Bio along with living books and some interesting labs. I just couldn't bring myself to drag dd through an AP class since she's unlikely to ever need a bio credit and did a basic high school biology class in middle school (you could call it very advanced life science?). She might need a science subject test, though, so this seemed like the best of both worlds.

[lewelma]

My ds only had 2 high-school science courses validated -- Physics and Chemistry.  No one questioned our homegrown Biology, even though I stated quite clearly in the course descriptions, that 1) it was assessed based on research papers and discussion (not tests), and that 2) he did a single large lab rather than numerous smaller labs. And in fact, this 'lab' never included any data collection, as it was a large-scale, statistical-analysis of ecological data that others collected from the rocky intertidal.  His Bio class was not typical at all as he focused on gene manipulation and statistical ecology which is where his interests lay at the time.

[8filltheheart]

I think too many of today's homeschooling parents accept the mantra of needing outsourced "validation" without really understanding the college application process and internalize it to mean that homeschool grades aren't accepted.

My kids do most things at home with me.  I give them their grades.  I generate their transcript.  They take the SAT or ACT.  Some have taken a few subject tests (math 2, chem, Latin). One took 2 APs. A few have DE for a few classes (math and science). Some have taken a handful of outsourced homeschool classes (AoPS math, ChemAdvantage AP, Ms. Denne's Russian, Connie's honors chem).  

No school has questioned their transcripts.  Their transcripts, course descriptions, our school profile, and my counselor letter paint a complete picture of our homeschool and what their educations look like.

Having a few things that validate "at large" is not the same as validating everything with an outside provider or test.

[GoodGrief]

4 hours ago, JennyD said:

 Good question.  Thinking about it now, I realize that  since he wants to study science in college, I have just been assuming that as many of his science classes as possible need to have some kind of outside component or validation.  But that assumption isn't actually based on any real information, just my own generalized anxiety.  Hmm.  

I had been wondering about that test. May I ask why you would recommend it?

It's much easier to schedule than an AP exam, and, as 8 said, there are colleges that require one or two anyway (not all colleges, or even most, but many selective colleges.)

My STEM daughter did SAT subject tests for chemistry and physics, but did do the AP exam for biology because she took the AP course.

[regentrude]

13 hours ago, JennyD said:

 Thinking about it now, I realize that  since he wants to study science in college, I have just been assuming that as many of his science classes as possible need to have some kind of outside component or validation.  But that assumption isn't actually based on any real information, just my own generalized anxiety.  Hmm.  

I had been wondering about that test. May I ask why you would recommend it?

You don't need outside validation for science classes just because he wants to study science in college. Are you looking at an extremely selective college or a state school? In most cases, admissions is admissions to the college and not to the major; they won't scrutinize the transcript differently if you want to major in science vs in history. Also, most schools won't look at your course descriptions and just take the course title on the transcript to check the box.

If you want outside validation because he is planning to apply to a very selective school, it is sufficient to have a few here and there.

SAT2 tests test highschool level; AP tests are - at least in principle - considered college level work. SAT2 tests are easily scheduled through the college board online; AP tests you have to schedule individually through the school, which can be much more difficult. SAT2 tests are required by many selective colleges; they won't accept AP as a substitute.

Another way of outside validation are DE classes. That's what we have chosen; we prefer for them to have the experience in a college classroom and have the credit earned cumulatively over the course of a semester as opposed to all of it resting on the performance on a single high stakes exam.

[JennyD]

15 hours ago, lewelma said:

) he did a single large lab rather than numerous smaller labs. 

 

Something along these lines is what I've been thinking.  I don't have much training in biology, however, so I need to do some reading and think more deeply about what this all might look like.  I do not have a good sense of what the end goal of a high school biology course should be.

14 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

I think too many of today's homeschooling parents accept the mantra of needing outsourced "validation" without really understanding the college application process and internalize it to mean that homeschool grades aren't accepted.

 

Ding ding ding!  I'm just now realizing that this is how I've been thinking as well.  Boy, despite reading along here for years I am really flying blind with this whole high school thing. 

11 hours ago, GoodGrief1 said:

It's much easier to schedule than an AP exam

 

This is very useful to know.  

2 hours ago, regentrude said:

If you want outside validation because he is planning to apply to a very selective school, it is sufficient to have a few here and there.

Another way of outside validation are DE classes. That's what we have chosen; we prefer for them to have the experience in a college classroom and have the credit earned cumulatively over the course of a semester as opposed to all of it resting on the performance on a single high stakes exam.

Yes on the very selective schools, very helpful to think about outside validation in this way.  It makes a lot of sense, now that I'm thinking about it more.

I agree that DE classes would be a better option.  Unfortunately we do not have a good setup for that.  It may be possible for him to take one or two classes at the university near where we live, but they won't be science classes.

It won't be possible to validate both Chem and Physics, since one of those will have to be done during senior year.  But I like the idea of doing some sort of homegrown bio class, then taking the SAT2 for that, and then either AP Chem or AP Physics for 11th grade.

One thing that has made this all a little more complicated is that we are currently spending the semester in a foreign country and DS is going to high school here for 6 months.  It's his first time in B&M school and then of course all the schooling is in a foreign language, but he's learning an unbelievable amount and just generally having an amazing experience.  We wouldn't trade it for anything but it does push his science/math progression further into high school than it would have been otherwise.  

I will say, however, that his experience here is totally validating our rather unschooly approach to middle school science.  Even with the language barrier, he has been been doing great in his science class.  I don't even know when and how he learned some of this stuff, but apparently he picked it up along the way.  

This is a super helpful conversation, thanks to all who replied.

 

Edited February 20, 2020 by JennyD

[regentrude]

2 hours ago, JennyD said:

Yes on the very selective schools, very helpful to think about outside validation in this way.  It makes a lot of sense, now that I'm thinking about it more.

I agree that DE classes would be a better option.  Unfortunately we do not have a good setup for that.  It may be possible for him to take one or two classes at the university near where we live, but they won't be science classes.

It won't be possible to validate both Chem and Physics, since one of those will have to be done during senior year.  But I like the idea of doing some sort of homegrown bio class, then taking the SAT2 for that, and then either AP Chem or AP Physics for 11th grade.

One thing that has made this all a little more complicated is that we are currently spending the semester in a foreign country and DS is going to high school here for 6 months.  It's his first time in B&M school and then of course all the schooling is in a foreign language, but he's learning an unbelievable amount and just generally having an amazing experience.  We wouldn't trade it for anything but it does push his science/math progression further into high school than it would have been otherwise.  

The bolded: this is such a fantastic experience and you need to highlight this in your counselor letter. It is much more valuable than a bunch of standardized tests.

As for the senior year course: having on the list of senior year courses a university class or AP course demonstrates the level of his work, even if the grade or exam score won't be available until the end of the year.

[8filltheheart]

Agree 100% with Regentrude.  That experience is invaluable in so many ways.  He is learning a different culture, a different language, how to persevere under unusual conditions and thriving, etc.   That will not be seen as any sort of set back.  It will be viewed as enriching the collegiate community with a unique perspective that far outweighs additional AP courses.

Sr courses count.  Don't dismiss what they are taking sr yr.  Admissions is always contingent on receiving a final transcript.  (they won't care about the AP score, though, just the transcript.)

Admissions to highly selective schools takes more than a transcript.  The transcript/GPA/test scores are the gatekeepers that determine whether or not the rest of the application is reviewed.  Validate a handful of courses across subjects (math 2, a science, a foreign language, and maybe 1). And then, admissions is really going to come down to what is known as the "other." If you have the "other" that they are looking for great.  If not, well.....

[GoodGrief]

My oldest was an exchange student to Turkey for a year, and I do think the experience opened up some college doors. It's not a huge hook (because there are obviously many international students that don't get in everywhere), but it is useful, especially when written about thoughtfully.

My kids have done dual enrollment, but it is not my preference. The grades follow the student all the way through college, unlike high school grades,so you do want to proceed with caution there.

[JennyD]

Thanks for the encouragement.  DS14 is certainly having a remarkable experience here.  It is extremely challenging but he is just throwing himself into it all full-tilt. 

5 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

Admissions to highly selective schools takes more than a transcript.  The transcript/GPA/test scores are the gatekeepers that determine whether or not the rest of the application is reviewed.  Validate a handful of courses across subjects (math 2, a science, a foreign language, and maybe 1). And then, admissions is really going to come down to what is known as the "other." If you have the "other" that they are looking for great.  If not, well.....

This makes a lot of sense.

 

[2_girls_mommy]

On 2/19/2020 at 1:45 PM, JennyD said:

 Good question.  Thinking about it now, I realize that  since he wants to study science in college, I have just been assuming that as many of his science classes as possible need to have some kind of outside component or validation.  But that assumption isn't actually based on any real information, just my own generalized anxiety.  Hmm.  

I had been wondering about that test. May I ask why you would recommend it?

If he is looking into selective schools, many request 2 SAT subject tests, and if he is planning on a science major, one will need to be a science and or math test.