ADD

[DawnM]

My middle son has been diagnosed with ADD. He does not have the hyperactivity with it.

We had him tested for Auditory Processing Disorder and he doesn't have that, and now we are going back to the behavioral pediatric office (they see "kids" up to age 26) for a more formal diagnosis and treatment info.

I know she will recommend meds. My husband is pretty adamantly opposed but I honestly think it would help him focus better. But we will see what she says and prescribes.

Wondering what else I should ask/discuss/etc other than about medication....I had to wait 3 months to get him in, so I want to make the best use of my time there.

Those of you with ADD kids........help me out.

Edited December 17, 2016 by DawnM

[Guest]

My middle was dx'd with ADHD Inattentive type this year. At present, we are not going in the medication direction. (No issues with people who make different choices; just don't consider it necessary at present.) personally, I liked the book "The ADHD Advantage," because I appreciate the framing of this as a personality type that has it's perks as well as drawbacks.

 

So far, my son is doing well with external structure supports.

[maize]

One thing I tell myself when weighing the advantages and disadvantages of medication is to be honest about the side effects of not medicating; if a kid (or adult!) is failing to adequately and consistently keep up with the basic demands of their life, that's a pretty significant side effect that is going to counterbalance some of the potential negatives of medication.

Edited December 17, 2016 by maize

[wapiti]

You might also ask on the Learning Challenges forum.  There have been a number of threads discussing pros and cons of meds as well as alternative possibilities.

[DawnM]

I guess I wasn't asking about medication specifically, just asking what questions I need to ask when we go see her......about things other than medication.  Are there things I will miss asking and finding the answers for?

 

Thanks,

[maize]

Our Dr. referred us to an occupational therapist for assessment, partly because sensory processing issues often go along with ADHD and also because he believes an OT assessment is useful in sorting out other issues that may be impacting the kid.

[maize]

It might help if we knew what kinds of struggles your son is having.

[Guest]

I guess I wasn't asking about medication specifically, just asking what questions I need to ask when we go see her......about things other than medication. Are there things I will miss asking and finding the answers for?

 

Thanks,

You could ask about the strengths often exhibited by people with ADD.

 

For myself, so much of what I learned about my son was from understanding *His* particular way of processing info and seeing the world. I learned so much more about how to understand my son and I feel much closer to him now and much better to understand when he does things differently than how I think they should be done. For me, it has been helpful to think about things from a perspective of, "My son thinks like this..." Instead of thinking, "Well, because he has ADHD, he can't do X,Y,Z..."

[MomatHWTK]

I think the key is to ask about what resources are available or recommended. Most of our coping techniques for ADD/ADHD have been ones we've found ourselves. But there may be options available to you or the doctor may direct you to specific books, etc. 

[DawnM]

It might help if we knew what kinds of struggles your son is having.

 

 

It is mostly executive functioning issues.  If you give him 3 sets of instructions, he only remembers one.  He remembers you told him other stuff but he can't remember what it is.

 

School work is an issue.  He will do part of an assignment but not remember the details of it or not remember the 2nd part, or whatever.

 

He simply doesn't catch everything said.

 

That is the reason she tested him for Auditory Processing first.  That, and the fact that he was in speech therapy when he was younger.  He didn't speak until he was over age 3 and then people struggled to understand him.  He now speaks clearly and that isn't an issue.

 

Dawn

[Guest]

This is an oldie moldy goldie that was written by an unschooler, but there is a lot of interesting information about your child's strengths as well as his weaknesses and how to work with him:

 

https://rainshadowfarm.wordpress.com/unschooling-with-addadhd/

 

I used to show this article to ds24's teenaged ADHD friends even when there was zero chance of them ever being able to leave public school. The look on their faces was priceless when they realized that they weren't "bad" or "damaged", just different.

 

I didn't pry about their grades, but I did see marked improvement in their social ability just from reading one simple article. I hope it helps you and your son too.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Guest

[maize]

It is mostly executive functioning issues. If you give him 3 sets of instructions, he only remembers one. He remembers you told him other stuff but he can't remember what it is.

 

School work is an issue. He will do part of an assignment but not remember the details of it or not remember the 2nd part, or whatever.

 

He simply doesn't catch everything said.

 

That is the reason she tested him for Auditory Processing first. That, and the fact that he was in speech therapy when he was younger. He didn't speak until he was over age 3 and then people struggled to understand him. He now speaks clearly and that isn't an issue.

 

Dawn

Processing speed and working memory could be issues.

[kroe1]

My middle son has been diagnosed with ADD. He does not have the hyperactivity with it.

 

We had him tested for Auditory Processing Disorder and he doesn't have that, and now we are going back to the behavioral pediatric office (they see "kids" up to age 26) for a more formal diagnosis and treatment info.

 

I know she will recommend meds. My husband is pretty adamantly opposed but I honestly think it would help him focus better. But we will see what she says and prescribes.

 

Wondering what else I should ask/discuss/etc other than about medication....I had to wait 3 months to get him in, so I want to make the best use of my time there.

 

Those of you with ADD kids........help me out.

I learned more from homeschool moms about how to teach ADD kids than what an average pediatrician could tell me about teaching them. There was no class of medication we would have considered for our DD. We were only interested in finding a better way to teach her. I am so thankful for those on this board and others who gave me that knowledge.

 

But, my main question to a pediatrician would be how to keep my child off of amphetamines at all costs, especially since there are so many other options. In regards to long term effects of amphetamines and some of the other more dangerous classes of medications these kids get placed on, I would more likely talk to an ER physician than a pediatrician. Unfortunately, it is an ER physician who sees many of these kids after they turn into adults, not the pediatrician.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Minniewannabe

[maize]

I learned more from homeschool moms about how to teach ADD kids than what an average pediatrician could tell me about teaching them. There was no class of medication we would have considered for our DD. We were only interested in finding a better way to teach her. I am so thankful for those on this board and others who gave me that knowledge.

 

But, my main question to a pediatrician would be how to keep my child off of amphetamines at all costs, especially since there are so many other options. In regards to long term effects of amphetamines and some of the other more dangerous classes of medications these kids get placed on, I would more likely talk to an ER physician than a pediatrician. Unfortunately, it is an ER physician who sees many of these kids after they turn into adults, not the pediatrician.

 

 

I would turn to peer-reviewed research studies vs. anecdotal experience from a physician.

 

The research I have seen tends to indicate improved outcomes on average for children who received pharmacological treatment than for those who did not. There is unfortunately less information regarding outcomes for children receiving non-pharmacological interventions; hopefully this research gap will be closed in the future as some non-pharmacological treatments have shown promise.

 

http://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1741-7015-10-99

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306460313002608

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924977X12001988

[DawnM]

This is an oldie moldy goldie that was written by an unschooler, but there is a lot of interesting information about your child's strengths as well as his weaknesses and how to work with him:

 

https://rainshadowfarm.wordpress.com/unschooling-with-addadhd/

 

I used to show this article to ds24's teenaged ADHD friends even when there was zero chance of them ever being able to leave public school. The look on their faces was priceless when they realized that they weren't "bad" or "damaged", just different.

 

I didn't pry about their grades, but I did see marked improvement in their social ability just from reading one simple article. I hope it helps you and your son too.

He can leave PS, he is choosing not to. He has a high GPA so I know he doesn't feel like he is bad or damaged. He is actually praised for being a great kid by pretty much everyone who knows him. He is honest, kind, and very trustworthy.

 

But again, he doesn't have the hyperactivity component so that may be a factor.

[DawnM]

I learned more from homeschool moms about how to teach ADD kids than what an average pediatrician could tell me about teaching them. There was no class of medication we would have considered for our DD. We were only interested in finding a better way to teach her. I am so thankful for those on this board and others who gave me that knowledge.

 

But, my main question to a pediatrician would be how to keep my child off of amphetamines at all costs, especially since there are so many other options. In regards to long term effects of amphetamines and some of the other more dangerous classes of medications these kids get placed on, I would more likely talk to an ER physician than a pediatrician. Unfortunately, it is an ER physician who sees many of these kids after they turn into adults, not the pediatrician.

This is a specific type of doctor for kids on the spectrum, ADD, ADHD, etc.....not a regular pediatrician.

 

And I don't need to know how to teach him. He has been in school for 2 years so far and is doing pretty well and wants to stay.

[DawnM]

You could ask about the strengths often exhibited by people with ADD.

 

For myself, so much of what I learned about my son was from understanding *His* particular way of processing info and seeing the world. I learned so much more about how to understand my son and I feel much closer to him now and much better to understand when he does things differently than how I think they should be done. For me, it has been helpful to think about things from a perspective of, "My son thinks like this..." Instead of thinking, "Well, because he has ADHD, he can't do X,Y,Z..."

Right. And when we were homeschooling, I could make it a certain way......write things down, give him tasks in sequence.....Do task A and then come back and I will tell you what to do next. The schools don't work that way.

[Guest]

This is a specific type of doctor for kids on the spectrum, ADD, ADHD, etc.....not a regular pediatrician.

 

And I don't need to know how to teach him. He has been in school for 2 years so far and is doing pretty well and wants to stay.

In that case, I'd ask open ended questions.

 

"What do you think I need to know, in light of the fact that we won't be using meds?"the

[kroe1]

I would turn to peer-reviewed research studies vs. anecdotal experience from a physician.

 

The research I have seen tends to indicate improved outcomes on average for children who received pharmacological treatment than for those who did not. There is unfortunately less information regarding outcomes for children receiving non-pharmacological interventions; hopefully this research gap will be closed in the future as some non-pharmacological treatments have shown promise.

 

http://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1741-7015-10-99

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306460313002608

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924977X12001988

You nailed it. The problem with current studies is nothing is comparing meds verse specialized teaching methods. And I laughed at a recent study showing kids on meds were less likely to abuse drugs. But, they were getting amphetamines and many on benzodiazepines as adults. So of course, they were not abusing drugs, they were getting drugs of abuse prescribed by physicians! When one considered need to be on benzodiazepines as adults, the untreated group fares much better. Long term amphetamine use is associated with anxiety type disorders, after all.

 

Instead, teaching these kids how to think with that super rapid brain they have seems like the logical hypothesis. Unfortunately, this is where the data is lacking.

 

Off topic, but I met a teacher last night. We were briefly chit chatting, she asked where my kids went to school, and I replied homeschooling. Discussion led to my ADD child, and she immediately assumed that we must not have tried meds, otherwise, my child would have gone to public school. While this was just one discussion between two people, I hoped that public school teachers do not feel the only way to get ADD kids through school is on medication. In addition, she mentioned that really now all children are ADD to some extent, at least much more than twenty years ago. She thought this was from heavy electronic use.

[maize]

You nailed it. The problem with current studies is nothing is comparing meds verse specialized teaching methods. And I laughed at a recent study showing kids on meds were less likely to abuse drugs. But, they were getting amphetamines and many on benzodiazepines as adults. So of course, they were not abusing drugs, they were getting drugs of abuse prescribed by physicians! When one considered need to be on benzodiazepines as adults, the untreated group fares much better. Long term amphetamine use is associated with anxiety type disorders, after all.

 

Instead, teaching these kids how to think with that super rapid brain they have seems like the logical hypothesis. Unfortunately, this is where the data is lacking.

 

Off topic, but I met a teacher last night. We were briefly chit chatting, she asked where my kids went to school, and I replied homeschooling. Discussion led to my ADD child, and she immediately assumed that we must not have tried meds, otherwise, my child would have gone to public school. While this was just one discussion between two people, I hoped that public school teachers do not feel the only way to get ADD kids through school is on medication. In addition, she mentioned that really now all children are ADD to some extent, at least much more than twenty years ago. She thought this was from heavy electronic use.

 

I think the flexibility of homeschooling can be a huge advantage for ADHD kids. This is how we have managed so far with 4 ADHD kids in the house, and is a big reason I homeschool because the school environment was such a terrible mis-match for me as an ADHD child. School for my 11 year old would be a disaster. 

 

Having tried medication briefly myself I do think there is a place for it, it really helped to bring the world into better focus and settle the chaos of my brain. 

 

I would like to see more targeted behavioral therapies and supports. Those are so much more intensive in terms of man-hours required though that I think pharmaceuticals will continue to be the go-to treatment.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

 

 

Questions to ask.

 

Along with education, what other support structures can be out in place to help the child to succeed?

 

What are the common side effects to the medication being recommended?

 

 

I am a strong proponent in behavioral support and medication. It is a lot easier to learn new behaviors and strategies while the medication is active. Once mastered, they are more likely to carry over to when medication has worn off or is unavailable.

[Storygirl]

Dawn, have you talked to the school about a 504? A 504 can include accommodations such as receiving all assignments in writing, so that he doesn't miss instructions given orally. If he has trouble taking notes in class, an accommodation can be to receive copies of the teacher's notes or copies of another student's notes.

 

I would be sure to ask the doctor if they recommend a 504 and for them to give you a written list of suggested accommodations to share with the school.

[Guest]

Right. And when we were homeschooling, I could make it a certain way......write things down, give him tasks in sequence.....Do task A and then come back and I will tell you what to do next. The schools don't work that way.

Yeah, I know it. My son is no longer hsed also. He is in a private school, though, and I *think* they are better about working with him/me than a public school may be. But it's great that your son is doing well academically. This has been hard for my son. He is also weak in executive function, but without hyperactivity.

[DawnM]

Dawn, have you talked to the school about a 504? A 504 can include accommodations such as receiving all assignments in writing, so that he doesn't miss instructions given orally. If he has trouble taking notes in class, an accommodation can be to receive copies of the teacher's notes or copies of another student's notes.

 

I would be sure to ask the doctor if they recommend a 504 and for them to give you a written list of suggested accommodations to share with the school.

Yes, I have already discussed it with them.

[PeterPan]

Well the ped *will* offer you the scrip, so it's only whether you fill it or not. Personally, I don't advise letting your dh decide that. Like I get the whole man leads the house, he's a parent too, blah blah. One, he's not the only parent, and two HE doesn't live with the consequences. The person living with the consequences is your ds.

 

Did they do language testing during the psych testing? Because I agree, that's concerning that he seems to not be responding or understanding or something. I would want a CELF or CASL to make sure he doesn't need some intervention.

 

I'm also not sure where someone is coming from saying keep up with their really fast brains. Really all over the place, yes. Widely-spaced mini-columns and lots of connections, yes. Fast, well look at your IQ scores and decide for yourself. ;)

 

This is not an argument you can win. It's not like you choose and go oh yeah, no consequences, only good, so glad, cured my kid. You're not curing your kid or fixing them. You're deciding whether or not to give them the patch. It's like do you put gas in a leaking car? Well maybe you decide to throw the car away, but we don't throw kids away. Maybe you decide to fill gas faster and take shorter trips. That can be a valid choice! Or maybe you decide to throw in one of those cans of stuff, fill in the crack, and it sorta slows down the leaks. It's artificial, and it clogs the engine and then you're like dang that had consequences. No joke. But it was a choice, just a choice.

 

The bump that meds can give can totally alter the outcome for your child. Only you, as parents, have the authority, responsibility, and prerogative to make that choice. There are plenty of really happy adults sans meds. They find paths and make it work. But there are definitely paths that close and squish to not attainable without the meds. Does that MATTER for your kid? Does he WANT the paths that are closed to him right now? Is he HAPPY on the path he's on? 

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Edited December 18, 2016 by OhElizabeth