How to do Socratic discussion with a 7yo?

[Lori D.]

Just so it won't get lost, and because others may also be interested in this topic, I'm starting a new thread based on Earthmerlin's new questions posted on two older threads on how to do Socratic discussion with a 7yo (hope you will forgive my massive presumption here, Earthmerlin! ? ?from "How Valuable Are Socratic Discussions"

On 9/21/2016 at 4:10 AM, Earthmerlin said:

I'm intrigued by this thread & wonder how to bring it into our home discussions. Any leads for questions that a young 7 year old can access?

and from "What *Is* Critical Thinking?"

On 9/21/2016 at 4:12 AM, Earthmerlin said:

I read the post about Socratic discussions. What kinds of questions would I ask a young 7 year old in order to open up such talks?

I'll just kick off with a quick answer: at that young age, for us, it was following through with some of the already million a day observations made, or questions asked by the naturally curious and observant young elementary-aged child:

"Wow, you're right! Why do you think that happens?"
"Interesting. How do you think that works?"
"What do you think happens next?"
"Do you think there might be a connection between this and that?"
"There might be a pattern going on here. What do you think?"

In our literature reading with elementary ages, discussion was very informal, not pushy, and not overly frequent (don't want to kill the love of reading!!) -- just from time to time, maybe at the end of a chapter or at a natural moment in the story:

"That was exciting! What do you think will happen next?"
"Oh no! The character just did/said this! Why do you think they did/said that?"
"What would you do if you were the main character right now?"
"Hmmm, this seems familiar; where have we seen something like this before in the story?"
"What do you think: how are these two characters/things in the story alike? How are they different?"

Or, only very infrequently, AND when done with reading for that session so you don't drive your kids nuts stopping in the middle of an exciting section -- that NEVER prompts discussion! :tongue_smilie:: "Wow, I can really see that setting (or character) in my mind" -- or -- "I felt really anxious in that scene" -- or, etc....  "Let's re-read that and see if we can figure out why", or "Let's look at the words the author chose to use, or the way the author put together those sentences to see what made that so visual / beautiful / intense / etc."

Finally, JMO, but to have much of any depth with Socratic discussion usually happens with older students because it requires:
1. a body of knowledge and experience to draw on for connections, predicting, extrapolating
2. and development of the logic and abstract thinking areas of the brain required for analyzing and  (this usually starts developing along about age 12-14)

(Of course there are always exceptions -- a young child with a big passion about a specific topic who accrues a huge body of knowledge around that topic; a gifted/accelerated child; a child with unusual brain wiring (for example, as with Aspberger's or autism) that allows a young child to hyper-focus and make unusual leaps and connections; etc.)

Overall, I think the goal in the elementary ages is to follow up with a child's questions and observations, guide them toward making predictions and connections, but also keep alive that wondering why and out of the box thinking by not "forcing" discussions, and not over-leading into a parent's preconceived "box" or specific conclusions.

Just my quick thoughts on the topic! Looking forward to hearing the thoughts and experiences of others! ? Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited November 13, 2018 by Lori D.

[73349]

Hmm... I don't know that our discussions are Socratic at this point, but questions that lead into good discussion with my 8yo are often along the lines of

• "How do you know?" or "Why do you say so?" to elicit citing evidence for his claim or opinion,
• "Was that a good idea?" to ask him to evaluate a decision--leading to "Why?" or "Why not?" and "What else could ___ have done?" or "What would you do?" in reflecting on actions and consequences, or "What if __________ instead?"
• "What would _________ say about that?" for looking from someone else's perspective--This one is very useful with DS because he doesn't think of it on his own, but he can definitely offer a good shot at it if asked--or
• "Does this remind you of something?" if there's an obvious reference to something else we've been thinking about.

 

[Earthmerlin]

Thanks for creating a separate thread on this. I also greatly appreciate the ideas & advice. More are welcome though...

[jgrabuskie]

I do this already, didn't know it had a specific name, LOL.  I would love to see more too.

 

FYI, kids have to be in the mood for it, though, sometimes I get not today Mom.

 

My DS8 has Dysgraphia and this is how we do most subjects. Usually, pose questions like this over projects or looking through books. Then we stop and read something and then question again.

Edited September 21, 2016 by jgrabuskie

[knitgrl]

 

FYI, kids have to be in the mood for it, though, sometimes I get not today Mom.

 

This is true at our house about 90% of the time. My daughter hates to be questioned about anything if she doesn't have THE ANSWER. This can make BFSU a challenge at times. Perhaps part of it is because she is not yet 7 and will grow out of it, maybe? (I am hoping!)

[jgrabuskie]

So true about not wanting question if they don't have the answer. It's hard, my DS will not answer questions on paper or orally if he does have the answer in his head. It has to be some form of OCD.

 

[Rosie_0801]

This is true at our house about 90% of the time. My daughter hates to be questioned about anything if she doesn't have THE ANSWER. This can make BFSU a challenge at times. Perhaps part of it is because she is not yet 7 and will grow out of it, maybe? (I am hoping!)

 

Have you worked on estimating in maths?

[knitgrl]

Have you worked on estimating in maths?

Huh. I was planning on introducing that this week. I hadn't connected it with this particular issue, but it sounds like a great idea. :001_smile:

[fralala]

This is true at our house about 90% of the time. My daughter hates to be questioned about anything if she doesn't have THE ANSWER. This can make BFSU a challenge at times. Perhaps part of it is because she is not yet 7 and will grow out of it, maybe? (I am hoping!)

 

Hey, I have this issue, too!

 

Is it that our kids hate the feeling that we are pretending to act curious about their ideas when really we are trying to lead them to a specific Right Answer that we already know and MUST teach them now?

 

Because, although I hate that I'm so ignorant about so many things, my kids come up with the greatest answers when I genuinely don't know about something and we're all wondering together.

 

In BFSU, if I'm remembering correctly it frequently says "Lead the child to say..." There is a right answer that the teacher must guide the student to that is based upon the child's observations of the world. I notice that we have really good discussions when I read the chapter, understand what we're going to be learning, and then just find ways to incorporate those observations in our daily activities over the course of the week or weeks.If I want to have a good discussion, I have to present my child with opportunities to observe a lot or to get the necessary background knowledge/experiences-- the worst curricula I've found are those who ask the child to come up with predictions or lead them to answers when they don't have the knowledge or experience (or interest!) to come up with anything other than a wild guess.

[deerforest]

Honestly, we do socratic discussions in 7th grade because DD wouldn't accept any other type of learning. She's a social learner who has thrived on discussions since she could talk. I agree with Lori that the best way to develop this skill is to just keep asking questions about their observations. Pretty sure her interest in paleoanthropology started around age 2-3 when at bedtime she asked "who was the first person" (note: we are not religious) and I took the opportunity to really probe what she was asking and we had this amazing discussion that I wouldn't have predicted that she was ready for at that age. So, I think you can start this at any age, and you might be surprised and impressed by what happens!

[Earthmerlin]

Yes, I REALLY need to learn to let my kiddo talk more about her feelings & thoughts. I DO ask questions & while I listen to her answers, I do not always have the leisure time to meander through her responses, if that makes sense. I ought to slow down the pace so I can fully enjoy her internal goings-on. Thanks, I thoroughly enjoy these question starters.

[knitgrl]

In BFSU, if I'm remembering correctly it frequently says "Lead the child to say..." There is a right answer that the teacher must guide the student to that is based upon the child's observations of the world. I notice that we have really good discussions when I read the chapter, understand what we're going to be learning, and then just find ways to incorporate those observations in our daily activities over the course of the week or weeks.If I want to have a good discussion, I have to present my child with opportunities to observe a lot or to get the necessary background knowledge/experiences-- the worst curricula I've found are those who ask the child to come up with predictions or lead them to answers when they don't have the knowledge or experience (or interest!) to come up with anything other than a wild guess.

 

An accurate assessment. You seem to have a good way of approaching it, I will have to see what I can do about trying it out. Of course, we also have the same sorts of issues when I try to start discussion about read alouds, too. Although, there has been two times this week when I asked her a question about something and she did not shut down. Maybe she is starting to grow out of it. :D

 

[daijobu]

Thanks, Lori.  I don't do this nearly enough.  I wish I had read this 10 years ago!